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EUR/CHF

  • #14,041
  • Jan 17, 2015 2:52am Jan 17, 2015 2:52am
Quoting zoran22
{quote} dont give them anything
Oh, i understood him wrong, sure pay them nothin, ignore emails and calls. Saxo says anythin about negative balances in contract?
  • #14,042
  • Jan 17, 2015 2:56am Jan 17, 2015 2:56am
Quoting jmn5611
{quote} Harris, there are people who made money on the drop, but they are not millionaires. I made 400% on the drop. But because I am a conservative trader I was able to smile at my participation, but I will not be retiring on it. It could have gone the other way. I was on the wrong side of the weakening a few years back. The reason I can still post is that when I was on the wrong side of the trade, it cost about 12% of my account. That would take me some months to make it back, but I did. I am with Oanda, and, yet again, they are showing that they...
Good to read that u recovered from few years back wrong side trade. What matters at end is how much u stay trading in this market, regardless of the pitfalls time to time, accumulating your profits and withdrawing, that leaves ur deposits way less than any future losses.
  • #14,043
  • Jan 17, 2015 3:16am Jan 17, 2015 3:16am
Quoting sidhujag
{quote} hehe and this is exactly why 1.2 will fall through look at http://fxtrade.oanda.ca/analysis/historical-positions ppl holding longs.


Took awhile but my predictions alwys do end up coming true.. it was like taking candy from a baby that move was easy to see
  • #14,044
  • Jan 17, 2015 3:23am Jan 17, 2015 3:23am
Quoting jmn5611
{quote} Harris, there are people who made money on the drop, but they are not millionaires. I made 400% on the drop. But because I am a conservative trader I was able to smile at my participation, but I will not be retiring on it. It could have gone the other way. I was on the wrong side of the weakening a few years back. The reason I can still post is that when I was on the wrong side of the trade, it cost about 12% of my account. That would take me some months to make it back, but I did. I am with Oanda, and, yet again, they are showing that they...
No need to compliment Oanda, have no problem with them, other accounts running smoothly and withdrawals too, but they can not just come out and announce they recovered clients negative balances to zero, instead of giving an explanation how stop out % and margin requirement were not respected, if it was, we want money from them, not their favor!
  • #14,045
  • Jan 17, 2015 3:28am Jan 17, 2015 3:28am
now the fallout I think eeryone is finally realizing the weapon that central bankers posses and thus the eason that a centralized monetary policy will never work.. The workd is shifting to decentralization and the blockhain.. Check out bitshares and bitcoin
  • #14,046
  • Edited 4:21am Jan 17, 2015 3:38am | Edited 4:21am
For me I can't see how the big losses were not caused by their systems not being able to keep up (In conjunction with overleverage, that is).

This and this says to me that some companies systems were able to see market prices that others were not.

How can they be showing prices around 1.1750 and 1.1500 for a small period of time (which looks like 10 mins a time on thodie's Kosmo chart and more graduated on the Pepperstone 1 min chart) and our own brokers not have stopped some of us out until disaster situation.

The graph from Pepperstone looks like there was buying into this on the way down.

My FXCM graphs now show that in 1 minute the price sank all the way down to 1.03798 (Which is not what I experienced watching it at the time). I certainly was not able to close until it was at 1.03592, despite sitting there for 15 mins trying to get the order closed.
  • #14,047
  • Jan 17, 2015 3:38am Jan 17, 2015 3:38am
Quoting Harris27
{quote} Oh, i understood him wrong, sure pay them nothin, ignore emails and calls. Saxo says anythin about negative balances in contract?
in risk disclaimer they say yes that it is possible, and that can ask for negative balance to be paid off, but nothin more about procedure in case of default

but i had only OTC trasactins with them as market makers, so they must provide liquidity for necessary margin call stop out, without negative balance, i think this is pure scam on client damage, what do you think?

and what do you think will they charge me or i should charge them for anticilent transactions?
  • #14,048
  • Jan 17, 2015 3:49am Jan 17, 2015 3:49am
Quoting J.Clinton
Keep it here EC bears idiots, you are helping us a lot without knowing,
YES
  • #14,049
  • Jan 17, 2015 4:00am Jan 17, 2015 4:00am
Quoting zoran22
{quote} in risk disclaimer they say yes that it is possible, and that can ask for negative balance to be paid off, but nothin more about procedure in case of default but i had only OTC trasactins with them as market makers, so they must provide liquidity for necessary margin call stop out, without negative balance, i think this is pure scam on client damage, what do you think? and what do you think will they charge me or i should charge them for anticilent transactions?
"they must provide liquidity for necessary margin call stop out"

This is right. Calculate at what amount ur account must had been stopped out. This is what u want from them. Send them an email about that, if they call u tell them u want money not the opposite.

Brokers can not take the account into negative balance without a margin call and stopping out orders on margin necessities, orders closed, money left in balance.
  • #14,050
  • Jan 17, 2015 5:04am Jan 17, 2015 5:04am
Quoting Harris27
can offer the amount u like but tell us more why? what price orders must had been closed at, stop out % ?
Eurchf otc in 300k where out at around .86-.87 / 10 min after the announcment
2 Rf contracts where out around 1.015 / after the market halt
Acc value was around 50k.
Saxo say "you can lose more than what u have" & "you need to cover for neg balance"
Obviously .86 is an extrem price that they enjoyed filling client at. Rf contract have traded for a minute above 1.19 and then have traded for 4 minutes between 1.16 and 1.17 with a huge volume. Rf contracts should have benn out at a higher price and no comment on otc fill. But again they have an argument of black swan force majeur.
If only cme had done their job properly they would have asked more than 1300 chf to hold an rf contract, and would have prevented mass retail investor defaults and lawsuits etc
Looking at it now it seemed obvious that it would happen, even in the past in this forum i mentioned the possibility. But it is outrageous how a central bank can lie so much and create mass default. The euro crisis put more pressure on the cap. They could simply have lowered to 1.15 and dropped rates if they really felt chf was overvalued. But they probably knew that they would have lost credibility. Think of all the people that trusted them and had loans in chf, they now have to payback 30% more.
  • #14,051
  • Jan 17, 2015 5:10am Jan 17, 2015 5:10am
Quoting Caa
{quote} Eurchf otc in 300k where out at around .86-.87 / 10 min after the announcment 2 Rf contracts where out around 1.015 / after the market halt Acc value was around 50k. Saxo say "you can lose more than what u have" & "you need to cover for neg balance" Obviously .86 is an extrem price that they enjoyed filling client at. Rf contract have traded for a minute above 1.19 and then have traded for 4 minutes between 1.16 and 1.17 with a huge volume. Rf contracts should have benn out at a higher price and no comment on otc fill. But again they have...
what do you think, how will law siut go from saxobank to clients who wont pay for negative balance?
  • #14,052
  • Jan 17, 2015 5:48am Jan 17, 2015 5:48am
Quoting zoran22
{quote} what do you think, how will law siut go from saxobank to clients who wont pay for negative balance?
Not sure at the mom, already contacted my lawyer. But they will be very serious in getting the funds. What do u plan to do?i m hapy when i see members here confident that they are not gonna pay 1$, but i feel it s a bit naif. Its not because they are online brokers and you never met anyone from their companies that they wont be serious. But if its the case i ll be very happy.
  • #14,053
  • Jan 17, 2015 5:54am Jan 17, 2015 5:54am
Quoting zoran22
{quote} what do you think, how will law siut go from saxobank to clients who wont pay for negative balance?
I would advise everyone to remain calm. This obviously is a special situation, and brokers will at the moment push with everything they have at their disposal to get negative balance from their customers. They might even have ultra secure formulations in their contracts to enable them to do just that. But recieving the money is something very different. As far as I understand, a lot of people who have negative balance simply don't have that much money. It's their own fault, of course, read the contract before you sign anything! There was always in this special case the risk that the peg wouldn't hold (I didn't believe it, and so went EChf long, cost me dearly), and always (ALWAYS) there is a risk of freak movement and a margin call. And the faint possibility of shifting the account into a negative balance. When you trade forex, unregulated as it is, it is possible.

Nevertheless: in this special case remain calm because in the first instance it is the broker who has the problem. They will have some hundred or thousand clients with negative balance now, and only because one special occasion. So they will try to bluff, scream and shout, but in the end you should wait them out and let yourself be dragged to court. There they will have to show second by second how they executed, where the stops were, when margin calls where issued, when they were executed, etc. So they have to prove they were dilligent, that their processes were first class, that they have taken every concievable step to prevent a catastrophe like that for themselves and their customers.

I wouldn't be very optimistic that people with negative balances will not pay anything. After all they knew or should have known the risk. But if you remain calm, maybe organize yourselves into action groups per broker and pay for some legal advice (maybe some kind of bad faith or fraud can be shown), there is - I think - a very good chance to get out of this mess intact.
Fail better.
  • #14,054
  • Jan 17, 2015 5:57am Jan 17, 2015 5:57am
Guys, I think this is getting ridiculous now. I say just get over it, take it on the chin and stop with the whining. Are you not aware that 95% of traders fail? Not all of you can be part of the 5%.
0% FEAR 100% GREED
  • #14,055
  • Jan 17, 2015 6:11am Jan 17, 2015 6:11am
Quoting Caa
{quote} Not sure at the mom, already contacted my lawyer. But they will be very serious in getting the funds. What do u plan to do?i m hapy when i see members here confident that they are not gonna pay 1$, but i feel it s a bit naif. Its not because they are online brokers and you never met anyone from their companies that they wont be serious. But if its the case i ll be very happy.
i think for OTC transactions that means fx spot and fx options, they are responsable for margin call stop out as they are market makers they must provide liquidity, these transacitons are not traceable, they is between you and your broker

for RF contracts is more difficult as they are exchange trades, but also here margin call could be used as argument
  • #14,056
  • Jan 17, 2015 6:13am Jan 17, 2015 6:13am
Quoting AlwaysWinnin
Guys, I think this is getting ridiculous now. I say just get over it, take it on the chin and stop with the whining. Are you not aware that 95% of traders fail? Not all of you can be part of the 5%.
it is not bad that i lost my investment but that loses are 30 times more than i had turnes into negative balance with, that kind of money i dont have and for sure dont mean to pay them
  • #14,057
  • Jan 17, 2015 6:51am Jan 17, 2015 6:51am
There is a lesson behind this: only free floating instruments should be available to the public on trading platforms
  • #14,058
  • Edited 10:46am Jan 17, 2015 6:55am | Edited 10:46am
Quoting Caa
-82k usd with saxo. They filled below .88 eurchf I m thinking of offering to pay 41k usd.. What do you think?
i simly cant get Quite, if i cant trade against saxo, because i switch broker years ago, i Will try to trade against them without account, by advising to thos who have negative balance to not pay them anything . If you have XYK negative balance, consider this as a trade, risk XK to lawyer (if you would need it at all) and your profit is XYK (your negative account at them), why not take that trade???....i simply dont understand why not. evrybody saying you should pay, are either brokers people or stupid, and dont know how stuff like that goes ..P
Meanwhile do not tell them u have anything, but evrything you have give to the person u trust as a legal GIFT. Unistall software, ignore e-mails, maybe 1 more that you pay them nothing, and that you Will suit them, if they Will continue to demand something they profit out of you, because they traded aginst you etc,...Also here TIME is evrything, if you hurry up, and they cant get it before you have nothing, they get nothing thats for sure.
its just money
  • #14,059
  • Jan 17, 2015 7:07am Jan 17, 2015 7:07am
Wondering what to do here, have a negative balance, CMC closed me out on the day below my stop but was ok with the level, then sent me a mail hours later saying they would adjust.

So the information on my account was wrong for the day, if they had given the real level I was stopped out at it would have changed my actions and placed trades to try and make back some of the loss, is there a case here to not pay?

It seems their systems were not able for this event, and I attribute the scale of my loss to this system failure.
  • #14,060
  • Jan 17, 2015 7:11am Jan 17, 2015 7:11am
Quoting hornsant
There is a lesson behind this: only free floating instruments should be available to the public on trading platforms
So which country still have the guts to peg their currency?

edit: found my answers... apparently there's still 4 country peg their currency: Bulgaria, Bermuda, Denmark and Brunei.
Denmark especially peg their currency to EUR the same as CHF and it's peg at 7.46
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