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Trapping System: Grid

  • #3,021
  • Jan 21, 2016 12:33am Jan 21, 2016 12:33am
Quoting tiagooliv
{quote} Yes, reeeeealy thanks. lets see the movement on Thursday. if the movement is too large can be safe whait retraction before starting the EA
OK, I just want to share a simple measurement. I'm still observing this anyway, so please bear with me if it is a false signal.

To start or not to start the EA, after a news released in less than 3 hours before EA started, usually I look for a sharp movement about 1 hour before EA started. It can be a sharp movement up or down in the chart, then the price settles down over there, or it can be a retracement.
If I see those, that means the price is reacting to the news, and will ease soon. So, it is safe to start the EA.
If I don't see those, I'm getting suspicious whether the news impact is reflected after EA started.

Because, when a news (high impact one) is released, the impact to the price can be immediate, or it can be a few minutes to hours later. Once I see a movement, I'm sure it'll ease down very soon, then EA can start.
Unless you're facing FOMC Statement + Interest Rate change, or NFP, you'll be dead anyway.

Just my 2 cents.
If you ask me to code/fix your EA... it's probably not for free...
  • #3,022
  • Jan 21, 2016 2:59am Jan 21, 2016 2:59am
Nice
We are proud to be most consistent signal provider in entire industry.
  • #3,023
  • Jan 21, 2016 10:17am Jan 21, 2016 10:17am
What do you think about this kind of strategy using limit orders?

Start: the system places buy and sell limits as usual.

Now lets suppose a bullish trend.

1st : if the first sell is hit, then the system places a new buy limit at central price (the price when the cycle started).

2nd: if the second sell is hit, then the system places another buy limit at first sell limit level.

3rd: if the third sell is hit, then the system places another buy limit at second sell limit level.

And so on.

Ok, in this way, we will not be able to take profit if the bullish trend revert, but we will be able to sustain the bullish trend, if the price makes small retracements.

Whats your opinion about?
  • #3,024
  • Jan 21, 2016 10:31am Jan 21, 2016 10:31am
Alberto, I was trying to run that scenario through my mind. It actually seems like a good plan.
Certainly worth a try.
  • #3,025
  • Edited 3:38pm Jan 21, 2016 3:27pm | Edited 3:38pm
We can not predict the market. Bankers will always first try to grab money out of the market, and then ...maybe think about "some kind of economy". It is widely known that European banks hold more than 65% of Foreign exchange market - but on EUR / USD in 70% of cases are High and Low (bankers TP and new counter-Entry) outside the European trading time.
Why? - because they trade 24/5 day ...and they have the power to run the market at any time when it suits their interests ...
Seek for some time "when the market is calm" or avoid "red news" makes here little sense.
radityo.ardi your RdzGridTraps is a master work - fast, precise and doesn't need to be hidden in an After-hours party.
I'd like to see your perfect code - with the Entry (and Out) logic of well-known EA viper (maybe in combination with some of your ideas from post 2925), . I think viper has logic but it is known that there are errors in the code. (sometimes hundreds of open orders)
On the other hand your RdzGridTraps has 95% of what is in the viper always missed -Start-Stop Time, UseLineStartStop, MaxCycle, Next Stop Cycle, Start Manually ...

Regards S.O.S
Attached File(s)
File Type: mq4 ViperGridEA_Version2.6.3.mq4   72 KB | 409 downloads
File Type: ex4 ViperGridEA_Version2.6.3.ex4   110 KB | 336 downloads
File Type: mqh OrderReliable_v0_2_5.mqh   26 KB | 316 downloads
perhaps my English is not perfect - but I know the Jungle
  • #3,026
  • Jan 21, 2016 11:47pm Jan 21, 2016 11:47pm
Hi, I am running this EA on vps with a gap of 50 points in euro/usd with dynamic auto expand by 1 .
some times due to sudden spike the upper or lower trade will not execute (because there is no pending order , EA suppose to plce order but due to sudden spike it wont).
in this situation the EA stopped to place any further order and grid become useless and i have to book loss and force close all.

Is there any way to avoid this situation as i am running it on stop mode with one buy and one sell at a time then auto expand.
  • #3,027
  • Jan 22, 2016 4:13am Jan 22, 2016 4:13am
Quoting manish1971
Hi, I am running this EA on vps with a gap of 50 points in euro/usd with dynamic auto expand by 1 . some times due to sudden spike the upper or lower trade will not execute (because there is no pending order , EA suppose to plce order but due to sudden spike it wont). in this situation the EA stopped to place any further order and grid become useless and i have to book loss and force close all. Is there any way to avoid this situation as i am running it on stop mode with one buy and one sell at a time then auto expand.
If im am wrong please tell me but i think in this case the correct is dynamic auto expand by Threshold.
dynamic auto expand (all orders) will opened new orders only if ALL orders are oppened (all buy and sell).
  • #3,028
  • Jan 22, 2016 4:29am Jan 22, 2016 4:29am
Quoting radityo.ardi
{quote} OK, I just want to share a simple measurement. I'm still observing this anyway, so please bear with me if it is a false signal. To start or not to start the EA, after a news released in less than 3 hours before EA started, usually I look for a sharp movement about 1 hour before EA started. It can be a sharp movement up or down in the chart, then the price settles down over there, or it can be a retracement. If I see those, that means the price is reacting to the news, and will ease soon. So, it is safe to start the EA. If I don't see those,...
Good radityo. thanks. i agree.
write in english is very difficult to me so i aways simplificy the ideas to few (and poor) words. im learning

The general idea is wait to the market waves is short and calm, right?. Once after news is commom few anger waves, its safer wait the usual retraction or price settles down like you said.
  • #3,029
  • Jan 22, 2016 6:05am Jan 22, 2016 6:05am
Quoting manish1971
Hi, I am running this EA on vps with a gap of 50 points in euro/usd with dynamic auto expand by 1 . some times due to sudden spike the upper or lower trade will not execute (because there is no pending order , EA suppose to plce order but due to sudden spike it wont). in this situation the EA stopped to place any further order and grid become useless and i have to book loss and force close all. Is there any way to avoid this situation as i am running it on stop mode with one buy and one sell at a time then auto expand.
Hi Manish,
my suggestion for you is to put at least 5 orders initially, and then auto-expand by 5.

Just imagine, you only have 1 order per side and gap of 50 points. Now, when the price suddenly strikes up, naturally EA will place the order in the 2nd level. But let us say that the price moves 100 points up. EA can't place the order already, since the price is on the same level as its pending order. You can't put pending order on the same level as the current price. Some broker may have a variable tolerance such as 20 points, some with 30 points from the current price, but there is broker which also put tolerance for 50 points. Which means you can't put pending order within 50 points up and 50 points down from the current price.
There's fix for this issue, by placing direct BUY/SELL order. But to maintain that would be troublesome, and not worth to do it.

So, the simplest way is to put order count per side not too small, but also not too big. My suggestion would be like 5-10 with auto-expand by 5 if you have gap of 50 points. If you expecting NFP or Interest change event, I suggest you to put 10 orders per side, as both sometimes causes a big move.
If you ask me to code/fix your EA... it's probably not for free...
  • #3,030
  • Jan 22, 2016 6:25am Jan 22, 2016 6:25am
Quoting tiagooliv
{quote} Good radityo. thanks. i agree. write in english is very difficult to me so i aways simplificy the ideas to few (and poor) words. im learning The general idea is wait to the market waves is short and calm, right?. Once after news is commom few anger waves, its safer wait the usual retraction or price settles down like you said.
No, the otherwise.

The idea is to wait for large movement. If you see that after news released, then you can be at least 90% sure market will be much more calmer when the EA starts its cycle.
Your threshold be like at least 1 hour or 30 minutes before EA starts, you must see a large movement.

For example, in my time SGT. EA runs at 01:00am, and there's large high impact news released on 11:00 pm which is 2 hours before. You need to check chart whether there's large movement after news is released. IF you don't see it, you might want to stop EA to run for the day. Or (basically I never do this, but still OK to do) you may want to switch EA to run at 02:00am.
Then another day for example, there's large high impact news released at 03:00am, and it's a ECB Interest rate change. If I see this, before even EA starts, I stop it for the day.

So far observation for the whole 2015 year, the largest impact to the strategy is NFP (we never touch NFP since typically is at 08:30pm SGT), Interest Change (sometimes scheduled at 10:00pm, or sometimes 03:00am).
Out of that, if you see only 1 or 2 large impact news but not both NFP or Interest Rate change, that still fine to run with LOWRISK_A. Last time I ran when FOMC statement out, it was running OK since that's the only large impact news. But of course I never recommend to run the strategy when there's high impact news in between.

This is the only disadvantages of using this strategy so far. The big picture is, you are good to go with the EA when:
- No high impact news 3 hours before EA starts
- No high impact during EA runtime
- There is/are high impact news 3 hours before EA starts (max is 1 hour before), but need to confirm that large movement has been reflected on the chart before EA runtime starts.
If you ask me to code/fix your EA... it's probably not for free...
  • #3,031
  • Jan 22, 2016 6:29am Jan 22, 2016 6:29am
Quoting SickOfScam
We can not predict the market. Bankers will always first try to grab money out of the market, and then ...maybe think about "some kind of economy". It is widely known that European banks hold more than 65% of Foreign exchange market - but on EUR / USD in 70% of cases are High and Low (bankers TP and new counter-Entry) outside the European trading time. Why? - because they trade 24/5 day ...and they have the power to run the market at any time when it suits their interests ... Seek for some time "when the market is calm" or avoid "red news" makes...
Somewhere I saw this EA's name but couldn't remember the name.
There are another also like Expanding Grid (this is like STOP strategy combined with Tunnel Martingale).

Thanks, good to note!
Yes, starting time and stop time will be very crucial (for me). I know that you can't just apply one strategy the whole time. You'll face NFP, you'll face large trending, but you'll face ranging market in minutes or even daily TF, even weeks like what is happening now with EURUSD. So, we need to choose when to run the EA.
If you ask me to code/fix your EA... it's probably not for free...
  • #3,032
  • Jan 22, 2016 6:38am Jan 22, 2016 6:38am
Quoting Alberto_Jazz
What do you think about this kind of strategy using limit orders? Start: the system places buy and sell limits as usual. Now lets suppose a bullish trend. 1st : if the first sell is hit, then the system places a new buy limit at central price (the price when the cycle started). 2nd: if the second sell is hit, then the system places another buy limit at first sell limit level. 3rd: if the third sell is hit, then the system places another buy limit at second sell limit level. And so on. Ok, in this way, we will not be able to take profit if the bullish...
Hmmm....

Now my question is, will it worth to try?
We need to think down for every possible scenario.
What if then the price retracts back which will give your LIMIT orders a profit? The "overlapping" grid will have a loss. What if it retracts back and then keep trending all the way down?

I've created another EA (this is why my v2.0 is still not released), which basically same like LIMIT strategy in RdzGridTraps, different since each side is handled separately and martingale concept is involved over there. It might (little bit) have the same idea what you've described above, where there's possibility that BUY and SELL grid will overlap each other.



Anyway, I'll post my findings about v2.0 sometime later. It turns out the "holy grail" was quite a failure, and am going to suspend that and release it another version later.
If you ask me to code/fix your EA... it's probably not for free...
  • #3,033
  • Jan 22, 2016 8:39am Jan 22, 2016 8:39am
Quoting radityo.ardi
{quote} Hi Manish, my suggestion for you is to put at least 5 orders initially, and then auto-expand by 5. Just imagine, you only have 1 order per side and gap of 50 points. Now, when the price suddenly strikes up, naturally EA will place the order in the 2nd level. But let us say that the price moves 100 points up. EA can't place the order already, since the price is on the same level as its pending order. You can't put pending order on the same level as the current price. Some broker may have a variable tolerance such as 20 points, some with 30...
But Radityo , one each side then auto expand is the safest way to survive in stop mode and quit profitable.
can you please make some system that even on higher price it will buy (or sell) but not miss any order .
It could be very profitable because every time it only buy one trade or sell one trade so in case of reversal losses are quit small , even though it will take time to make trade profitable as only one winning position is there every time but the losses of grid is quit small so that trade will take you out.
  • #3,034
  • Edited 2:24pm Jan 22, 2016 11:56am | Edited 2:24pm
Quoting manish1971
{quote} But Radityo , one each side then auto expand is the safest way to survive in stop mode and quit profitable.
Both ways, whether you put initial 5 orders then auto-expand by 5, doesn't have any difference if you put 1 order initially then auto-expand by 1 order. So I doubt that one is safer than the other. I doubt that one is profitable than the others.
Both are totally the same thing. Why?
Because you only need to change the number of orders when a cycle started, and when auto-expand happen. Logically if we do this change only, nothing is changed in your strategy. Hence, it will never be more profitable / safer than the other, since both are same.

Unless I tell you change on grid step, or target profit, or how it will be closed, then yours arguably profitable / safer than mine.

UPDATE:
I'm quite curious of what you are doing.
I'm quoting your comment below.
Quoting manish1971
It could be very profitable because every time it only buy one trade or sell one trade so in case of reversal losses are quit small , even though it will take time to make trade profitable as only one winning position is there every time but the losses of grid is quit small so that trade will take you out.
If you notice the quoted text above on bold, and got another questions.

So, you are trying to implement a strategy where it place only 1 buy stop and 1 buy sell ONLY, am I right?
Because you said:
Quoting manish1971
in case of reversal losses are quit small
I'm totally confused. It seems like you've implemented a fixed Open Type, instead of Auto-Expand. That means, wherever the price moves, your order (both pending and open) will always be 1 on both side (buy and sell). But you said, you're doing Auto-Expand.

I hope you understand how auto-expand works.
Auto-expand supposedly to place additional orders on the outer grid BEFORE the price touches it. As I've conveyed earlier, setting down Auto-Expand will help you in terms of the EA's performance when closing orders and opening new of cycle. There's no impact on the profitability or the safety, it's still same.
If you notice, earlier I've released GTL_EU2 set file, which is totally SAME as GTLIMITEURUSD2. GTL_EU2 doesn't have a fixed Open Type, it uses Auto-Expand instead.

IF I put:
Case A ► Grid Order Count = 1, then Dynamic Auto-Expand (any of the All Orders or Threshold), and Grid Auto-Expand Count = 1,
what is the difference if I set:
Case B ► Grid Order Count = 2000, then I set no Auto-Expand at all (Fixed)?
And another Case C ► Grid Order Count = 5, then Dynamic Auto-Expand (any of the All Orders or Threshold), and Grid Auto-Expand Count = 5,

What if the price touches the 10th BUY order? Will your profit be different if you set Case A? All three are same.
What if the price touches the 1000th BUY order? Your profit will always be the same, Case A, Case B and C. Yet you are having the same risk if the price is retracting to the middle grid.
Nothing is safer / profitable than the others.

But if you put:
Case D ► Grid Order Count = 1, Dynamic Auto-Expand Threshold, Grid Auto-Expand Count = 1
Then, between case A and Case D, it will have a different result.

Want to proof it? Do a backtest.
If you ask me to code/fix your EA... it's probably not for free...
  • #3,035
  • Edited 10:11pm Jan 22, 2016 9:59pm | Edited 10:11pm
Quoting radityo.ardi
{quote} Both ways, whether you put initial 5 orders then auto-expand by 5, doesn't have any difference if you put 1 order initially then auto-expand by 1 order. So I doubt that one is safer than the other. I doubt that one is profitable than the others. Both are totally the same thing. Why? Because you only need to change the number of orders when a cycle started, and when auto-expand happen. Logically if we do this change only, nothing is changed in your strategy. Hence, it will never be more profitable / safer than the other, since both are same....
Hi Radityo , the only point in my system is , in stop mode if price once touches the lower sales then come back to north and touches first buy then auto expand open one more buy and sell in bothside right.
Then there are two situations
A. price moves more up took second buy and that second buy travel as much distance to take the grid out in profit.
B. price touches the lower sales also , system opened one more buy and sell and third sale travel the distance to take gird out in profit.

But if there is 5 buy and five sales and price touches first sale and then 3 buy and retraced back and touches 3rd sale and then revert , in this situation my losses are quit high.

in both the cases the price travel the same distance in same manner but losses of first system is quit low then second one because in one reversal it take only one position .

I dont know i am able to explain what i want to say .

I am running in auto expand all mode , where if all orders are open then EA will put new orders .(not on threshold mode)

my setting is Grid order count 1 and then auto expand by 1 (if there is no pending order)
  • #3,036
  • Jan 23, 2016 2:41am Jan 23, 2016 2:41am
Quoting radityo.ardi
{quote} I'm totally confused.
Quoting manish1971
{quote} the only point in my system is , in stop mode .... price moves more up took second buy )
This is not the system. I think manish 1971 is trying to say that he considered the trade - as he says: stop mode (OrderOperation = STOP orders) is safer than with LIMIT orders.
I agree but I would say - with one EA is safer to trade in the direction of flow than against it. Manually I trade almost always against and looking for the Turnpoint - of course with the SL.
That is why I mentioned in a previous post EA viper. This EA trades with stop orders in the direction of flow ( for example - buy) but if the market turned then multiplies the counter - sell stop orders .... and so on ... There is, of course a certain risk - with multipliar, or with the "Death trade" - but that's part of this game.
Every forex trader needs to find his own style - and, most importantly, he needs to know what is his STOP LIMIT for each cycle ..
... also a trader needs to know how many cycles can be traded ...
And now comes the nice part - that's all (or at least 95%) already incorporated into RdzGridTraps
radityo.ardi please give a chance to EA viper in your STester - and who knows maybe it inspires you for the next step !!!

Regards
S:O:S
perhaps my English is not perfect - but I know the Jungle
  • #3,037
  • Jan 23, 2016 10:51am Jan 23, 2016 10:51am
Can we code Hedge function on price spikes over or under the grid limit.
  • #3,038
  • Edited 8:40pm Jan 23, 2016 7:54pm | Edited 8:40pm
I think manish1971 wants is, Auto-expand when all orders are hit. You don't want to auto expand when only one side is hit. Is that right, Manish?

If so, look at this situation. This is your strategy, it took long time to reach its profit target. What if it didn't move up? Cycle will take more time than usual and we don't want that to happen.
Attached Image

In normal gridtrap, we quickly reach the target profit and escape the cycle.
Attached Image


Actually this is my first post and thanks to radityo for this great EA.
  • #3,039
  • Jan 24, 2016 6:45am Jan 24, 2016 6:45am
Quoting cal0yzki
I think manish1971 wants is, Auto-expand when all orders are hit. You don't want to auto expand when only one side is hit. Is that right, Manish? If so, look at this situation. This is your strategy, it took long time to reach its profit target. What if it didn't move up? Cycle will take more time than usual and we don't want that to happen. {image} In normal gridtrap, we quickly reach the target profit and escape the cycle. {image} Actually this is my first post and thanks to radityo for this great EA.
Exactly this.
it will take long to out but at the same time our losses in the grid is also less so there is grater possibility to take you out.
  • #3,040
  • Jan 24, 2016 7:31pm Jan 24, 2016 7:31pm
Quoting manish1971
{quote} Hi Radityo , the only point in my system is , in stop mode if price once touches the lower sales then come back to north and touches first buy then auto expand open one more buy and sell in bothside right. Then there are two situations A. price moves more up took second buy and that second buy travel as much distance to take the grid out in profit. B. price touches the lower sales also , system opened one more buy and sell and third sale travel the distance to take gird out in profit. But if there is 5 buy and five sales and price touches...
OK, I understand your point here.
In that case, can you share your setfile over here, and let me know your version you are using?
I suppose your gridstep is too short which resulting in certain error and order failed to place.

What I can do is,
if the order placement returned with a specific error message (i.e: when the price is already reaching that level), I'll put direct buy / sell rather than pending order.
But we must be specific with the error message.
Can you at least dump the error message / let me know when that happened, what was the error message in "Experts" or "Journal" tab?
Was that "Invalid price"?
If you ask me to code/fix your EA... it's probably not for free...
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