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Genesis Matrix Trading

  • #1,241
  • Jul 28, 2012 6:49pm Jul 28, 2012 6:49pm
I personally believe that if one is utilizing indicators in trading they should never turn a blind eye to PA. On friday there were many good examples of how a trader using Genesis (let alone any other indicator) should also keep his/her eyes peeled for PA. There were a couple of signals that occurred even with the stochastic's pointing in the correct way, to someone following the matrix without looking at the PA they would have thought that those were great signals but upon further inspection you could see that either the candle that caused the signal was really volatile and large and waiting for price to pullback to get a better entry was in order. Another is that when sometimes a signals occurs you have to look at how far price has traveled already and if this will make the SL too large. Maybe wait for a pullback and if the genesis signal is still valid take it and if the pullback doesn't occur well then off to the next trade.

There are some very good traders on this thread and it would be wise of others to watch what they do and kind of build your own style based on that.

M70
  • #1,242
  • Edited 7:18pm Jul 28, 2012 7:02pm | Edited 7:18pm
Quoting frontline141
It's because I won't open more than 1 trade per time. The margin won't let me do actually
Hi,

One question I have to ask ...

Are you currently trading using real money? (That's the only reason I can think that your margin won't let you).

(1) If you are currently using real money and losing, as you appear to be, switch back to demo and don't go back to real money until you're consistently making a profit on demo.

(2) Regardless of real or demo, if you are risking so much per trade that you can only place one trade at a time, I'd suggest that you need to decrease your risk per trade. Most people only risk 1 - 2% per trade, although some here risk more I think.

Of course, if it's just that you've set your trading plan to be no more than 1 trade at a time, that's different - but there is the risk that you may miss out on good trades because a bad trade is still running.

Just my 2c.
1 pip at a time ... if the entries are strong, the rest will follow ...
  • #1,243
  • Jul 29, 2012 12:46am Jul 29, 2012 12:46am
Quoting slim410
Hey sorry but whats that yellow line on your M15 Stochs, seems quite useful.
The yellow line is the 15min stoch with one of the colours of it set to none so it shows just one line.
  • #1,244
  • Edited 9:08am Jul 29, 2012 2:40am | Edited 9:08am
Quoting EaglePip
Post mortems are great!
After missing out on the good moves following the "whatever it takes" speech it was time to get a piece of the action.
However, in the heat of battle and being swayed by daily open, pivots, round numbers, S/R etc, the result was a stupid trade (see circle on attached).
So decided to get rid of all the distractions and just look at the Matrix.
On Friday, there were 16 Matrix GO traffic lights. In hindsight only 9 would have been profitable.
Now, going by RJ's affinity for Stochs, the profitable entries were all when the...
That is mainly what we do anyway, the 5 and 15m stochs, and the matrix. Looking at the matrix would have stopped you going into that trade you circled. This is how I looked at the trades on Friday, I don't know if it helps but this is what I was thinking on each trade while including the pivots.

1. I didn't take this trade, stochs weren't in the best place and Frankfurt was about to open, but if you had taken this trade it moved 20 pips.

2. London had just opened, stochs had come down from 80 18 pips away from the weekly resistance line, took that trade, moved to BE +1 when it reached it, waited to see if it could reach the daily pivot which it did, took it out when it failed to close below the daily pivot and then the next candle looked bullish.

3. Only 9 pips away from the daily pivot and a re-entry, also M15 stoch was moving up so didn't take it.

4. Stop loss was far too big if I'd taken that trade where it signalled so waited to see if there was a pull back which there was, waited to see if it could get back above the pivot which it did, stochs started moving back up so took it at 5 which you can see here: http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...79#post5881979.

6. Stochs were still moving up it was a re-entry so looking to scalp it to Thursdays high line 18 pips away which it reached, if it had started to come backwards before reaching it I would have taken it at BE or close to it.

7. Too large a stop loss and only 14 pips from the pivot it had managed to break through a bit earlier, didn't take it.

8. Stop loss too large and failed to close above Thursdays high waited to see if it could close back above, by the time it did the stop loss was too large again so missed out on that one on EU but was making pips on AU anyway.

9 and 10. Rejection of pivot above, but 15m wasn't dropping and hadn't yet come below 80, no trade.

London close I stop trading.

Edit: Sorry forgot to mention number 5 I took out when there was a hanging man right on the high Frankfurt made earlier for +34.
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  • #1,245
  • Jul 29, 2012 3:38am Jul 29, 2012 3:38am
Quoting ohammond
That is mainly what we do anyway, the 5 and 15m stochs, and the matrix. Looking at the matrix would have stopped you going into that trade you circled. .......
Thanks, Olivia, for the recap of your trades. Its reassuring to know I'm on the right track.
I also have greater appreciation of the significance of the Stochastic after reading up on it, following recent posts.
One aspect that has not been mentioned is how they are calculated and is worth repeating.

"is a momentum indicator that shows the location of the close relative to the high-low range over a set number of periods"

The circled trade was utter stupidity on my part. Just got caught up in all the excitement of the daily open, pivots, round numbers etc.

In future will be trying to use the Matrix to identify slowing momentum and based on the Stochs take earlier entry when 1 or 2 of the matrix lights begin to flicker.
EP
  • #1,246
  • Jul 29, 2012 3:49am Jul 29, 2012 3:49am
Quoting ohammond
That is mainly what we do anyway, the 5 and 15m stochs, and the matrix. Looking at the matrix would have stopped you going into that trade you circled. This is how I looked at the trades on Friday, I don't know if it helps but this is what I was thinking on each trade while including the pivots.

1. I didn't take this trade, stochs weren't in the best place and Frankfurt was about to open, but if you had taken this trade it moved 20 pips.

2. London had just opened, stochs had come down from 80 18 pips away from the weekly resistance line,...
Excellent.
Thanks for explanation.
Thanks again.

Giancarlo
  • #1,247
  • Jul 29, 2012 4:05am Jul 29, 2012 4:05am
[quote=ohammond;5884880]That is mainly what we do anyway, the 5 and 15m stochs, and the matrix. Looking at the matrix would have stopped you going into that trade you circled. This is how I looked at the trades on Friday, I don't know if it helps but this is what I was thinking on each trade while including the pivots.

Thank You Olivia,

If I may be so bold as to suggest to RJ to find a spot on page 1 of this thread for this post and this won't be intruding into RJ's very effective teachings at all, just adding to it.
I am grateful to all who have been involved in the teaching on this 5+ star thread!! Absolutely the best.

Pete
  • #1,248
  • Jul 29, 2012 5:23am Jul 29, 2012 5:23am
The following is an old thread but worth studying on how Stochastic alone can be a trading system on MTFs:

http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=119483
禠孠Victor V
  • #1,249
  • Jul 29, 2012 5:59am Jul 29, 2012 5:59am
[quote=ohammond;5884577]

Trade 1: 25 pip stop loss reaches 50 pip take profit. Profit: +50
Trade 2: 40 pip stop loss gets hit Profit now: +10
Trade 3: 30 pip stop loss hit Profit now: -20

Do you see what I'm getting at, all the while there is a variable stop loss, the maths don't add up.


Hi Olivia,

I have the greatest respect for you, but you aren't grasping what I'm saying.

In your example above, I wouldn't be interested in pips. TBH, anyone who still counts success in pips has a LOT to learn in this business.

I would count % return. That's all that matters.

In your example above, let's say I had a $1000 account.

First trade - risk 2%. It's a winner [4%], so, account stands at £1,040.

Second trade. Risk 2%. Lose 2%. Account stands at £1,019.20.

Third trade: Risk 2%. Lose 2%. Account stands at £998.81.

So even though over the sequence of 3 trades, you have a total loss of 20 pips, you are down less than 1%.

Monetary risk is exactly the same, no matter how big the SL. This is babypips stuff tbh!

It's very important this guys and I really do hope at least SOMEONE takes on board what I'm saying.

I won't talk about it again because I don't want to detract from the strategy.
  • #1,250
  • Edited 6:27am Jul 29, 2012 6:14am | Edited 6:27am
Quoting Gt3rs
Quoting ohammond

Trade 1: 25 pip stop loss reaches 50 pip take profit. Profit: +50
Trade 2: 40 pip stop loss gets hit Profit now: +10
Trade 3: 30 pip stop loss hit Profit now: -20

Do you see what I'm getting at, all the while there is a variable stop loss, the maths don't add up.

Hi Olivia,

I have the greatest respect for you, but you aren't grasping what I'm saying.

In your example above, I wouldn't be interested in pips. TBH, anyone who still counts success in pips has a LOT to learn in this business.

I would count % return....
Yes I do grasp what you're saying, but when you say: "Monetary risk is exactly the same, no matter how big the SL" what I'm saying is I don't trade like that, I do not change the lot size, because its too difficult to work it out at the time I'm placing a trade what the lot size should be. So tell me, whats the difference if I come onto the thread and say, I took this trade, risk was 25 pips gain was 50. That should be the same thing no?
  • #1,251
  • Jul 29, 2012 6:43am Jul 29, 2012 6:43am
I will explain why the lot sizing (in my case and I'm sure many others) is difficult if I was to just plain risk 2% per trade and try to vary the lot size to keep the risk at that level. I have a GBP account, lot size value is worked out in USD but paid in my account in GBP, I look at different currencies, if I trade ***/JPY it is worth quite a lot more per pip on the account than ***/USD, it varies if I trade ***/CHF and it varies if I trade ***/GBP so if I wanted to (as in your example above) just risk 2% on each trade it would have to be worked out first. Do you see the difficulty with that?
  • #1,252
  • Jul 29, 2012 7:14am Jul 29, 2012 7:14am
Ohammond

I wish I was as good a trader as you are, pips,%, pounds, dollars,yen, or whatever.
You're great in any currency,keep posting these outstanding posts.
Cheers
  • #1,253
  • Jul 29, 2012 7:44am Jul 29, 2012 7:44am
Quoting ohammond
( 2012 07 27 eu Genesis signal analysis )
This post is just pure Genesis gold! Thank you, Olivia. Study it, folks.
  • #1,254
  • Jul 29, 2012 9:09am Jul 29, 2012 9:09am
Glad its useful to some, I added an edit because I just realised I forgot to say what happened to number 5.
  • #1,255
  • Jul 29, 2012 9:17am Jul 29, 2012 9:17am
Hello Olivia,

I am seeing that you talk a lot about London Open and Close. Do you also look at other Open and Close lines throughout the day? Also is there an indicator that helps here?

And for the real newbies it might even be helpful to know when the different sessions open and close, say in GMT time.

Thank you and have a nice Sunday,
Dan
  • #1,256
  • Jul 29, 2012 9:31am Jul 29, 2012 9:31am
Quoting dakuki
Hello Olivia,

I am seeing that you talk a lot about London Open and Close. Do you also look at other Open and Close lines throughout the day? Also is there an indicator that helps here?

And for the real newbies it might even be helpful to know when the different sessions open and close, say in GMT time.

Thank you and have a nice Sunday,
Dan
Unless I see a really good signal I will very rarely go in on a signal right at the time any of the main markets open, because their volume can push it any way they want to, so I usually wait for it to settle down. If I see a really good signal before it I will take it though. At London close volume can drop and I have had enough by then so I stop trading. I think RJ put an indicator on the thread because someone asked so if you look through the attachments it will be there somewhere, I have to go out now so haven't got time to look. The best place to check the open times in relation to you is here: http://www.forexfactory.com/market.php at the bottom of that page if you hover over the market names it will tell you when it opens, then you can adjust it to match your broker.
  • #1,257
  • Jul 29, 2012 9:33am Jul 29, 2012 9:33am
Hi,
That's great to see RJ has opened a new very successful thread based on the Symphonie system.
I have downloaded the indis and tp FROM POST #1 but my stocks is a simple 11,3,3 and do not shows M15 stocks on it.
And would you mind Olivia, to share your colorful perfect set of pivots which shows daily, weekly & ... supports and resistances?

Thanks to all who made all the effort and let the others use this great system.
  • #1,258
  • Jul 29, 2012 9:46am Jul 29, 2012 9:46am
Quoting ohammond
I think RJ put an indicator on the thread because someone asked so if you look through the attachments it will be there somewhere. The best place to check the open times in relation to you is here: http://www.forexfactory.com/market.php at the bottom of that page if you hover over the market names it will tell you when it opens, then you can adjust it to match your broker.
The market open indicator is here. Adjust the times in the inputs to match the open times you find at that forex factory link in Olivia's post.
  • #1,259
  • Jul 29, 2012 9:51am Jul 29, 2012 9:51am
Quoting Mini Trader
Hi,
That's great to see RJ has opened a new very successful thread based on the Symphonie system.
I have downloaded the indis and tp FROM POST #1 but my stocks is a simple 11,3,3 and do not shows M15 stocks on it.
And would you mind Olivia, to share your colorful perfect set of pivots which shows daily, weekly & ... supports and resistances?

Thanks to all who made all the effort and let the others use this great system.
Trader,
You can download the MTF Stochastic indi from the link on page 1. How to attach it to your chart is explained here.
  • #1,260
  • Jul 29, 2012 10:14am Jul 29, 2012 10:14am
Quoting Cody_R
Trader,
You can download the MTF Stochastic indi from the link on page 1. How to attach it to your chart is explained here.
Thanks Cody.
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