Symphonie Trader System | Page 730 | Forex Factory

Options

Go to
Permalinks
Print Thread

Similar Threads

Ci/symphonie extreme similarity explained! 144 replies

Symphonie/Cobra Hybrid System 4 replies

Symphonie trader or Genesis matrix 1 reply

Symphonie Trader System EA 73 replies

Yet another set of Symphonie Indicators 241 replies

Attachments: Symphonie Trader System
Exit Attachments

Symphonie Trader System

  • #14,581
  • Jul 13, 2012 6:31am Jul 13, 2012 6:31am
Quoting olivierforex
Hey RJ,
You're right: for every 'fundamental' situations I can usually find as many reasons why any piece of news should be long or short and I can find as many commentators/pundits/experts on both sides of the argument so I generally dismiss most of it. For a new trader, incorporating news events/data releases in your trading will only confuse you more every time you're about to pull the trigger to enter a trade.

Also, most of these commentators/experts/pundits can have a 'hidden' agenda: let's say that you are Long Euro (or your wife/friend)...

It is interesting you are mentioning longer timeframes...I am testing a more strategic approach on Symphonie using daily and monthly as confirmation on direction. However, I expect these trades will last months and my stoploss level are still in the process of determining.

I imagine that it will take me 2 years to get any good statistics to bring forth any conclusions but the trades will last in the 1000s of pip ranges...

Theoretically, Symphonie should work in just about every timeframe as the fundemental drivers of the markt works in all timeframes...The fun part is the turns and order entry...

Evaluator.:nerd:
  • #14,582
  • Jul 13, 2012 6:34am Jul 13, 2012 6:34am
Quoting Leokira
Evaluator

On which time frame should we wait for 4th bar to change, say we use 60-5, will it be bar 4 on 5m or 1h.

I am sorry you are not posting news any more, just like with trading you have much more experience as what to look for in news events. Also fundamentals are the drivers of the market, sadly silly politicians etc make us lose unexpectingly.

It really depends on your comfort level....Symphonie 60-5 is an hourly strategy where you watch the 60 min charts and execute your orders in the 5 min so you exit signals should appear in the 60 min. Atleast that is the way I play the 60-5 game.

Evaluator.:nerd:

P.S. funny you use 'silly'' for the adjektive for politicians....I would use another ''s'' word to discribe them but I would most likely be banned...
  • #14,583
  • Jul 13, 2012 6:41am Jul 13, 2012 6:41am
Thanks Eval

Here in Africa silly is actually high praise for politicians, fortunately they have little influence on world politics
Vandag is die dag.....
  • #14,584
  • Jul 13, 2012 6:45am Jul 13, 2012 6:45am
Quoting Evaluator
Excellent Candlestar!!!

10 pips a day consistantly is all one needs to make it ....it is the low stress way to success....

Evaluator.:nerd:
Yes Eval, I have read your weekly growth plan of 5% p.w.

BTW your plan gives me more confidence than my own earlier plan of gathering 3% p.d. to become a millionaire within just one year. It was a good plan, but it was wrecking my poor nerves. Maybe later -
  • #14,585
  • Jul 13, 2012 7:06am Jul 13, 2012 7:06am
Here is an excellent example of several different points of view that see the same picture all saying the same thing. DO you see it??


Technical....Break of uptrendline (type 2) below the Daily pivot on a downward direktion..

Elliott.......Typical 5 point corrective wave pattern...Bearisch Ascending Triangle

Symphonie....Sell Signal below the 60 SMA.

So, which ever form of added Technicals you want to use (for me Elliott and Symphonie) Symphonie should be your overriding and confirmation of direktion of the price action movement.

My bias is down....why.. because the Technicals, Elliott, Symphonie, and markt fundementals say so!!!

Again....Pattern recognition and Symphonie signals a very powerful team.

Evaluator.:nerd:
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Symphonie Screenshot 329.jpg Size: 132 KB
  • #14,586
  • Jul 13, 2012 7:09am Jul 13, 2012 7:09am
Quoting Evaluator
It is interesting you are mentioning longer timeframes...I am testing a more strategic approach on Symphonie using daily and monthly as confirmation on direction. However, I expect these trades will last months and my stoploss level are still in the process of determining.
I imagine that it will take me 2 years to get any good statistics to bring forth any conclusions but the trades will last in the 1000s of pip ranges...

Evaluator.:nerd:
Hey Eval,

1) if I understand properly, and sorry for using the dreaded 'R' word in advance lol, but most people seem to agree that on the longer timeframe, there is little Repainting on the Matrix (probably even less with Xaphod's matrix - RJ, yes/no?).
So when you look back at the charts on Daily/Weekly/Monthly you should see what was there at the time and backtesting manually should be quite quick (I might do some of my own at the weekend and we can always compare results).

2) i have said it before, someone in here has posted a MT4 'Trade Simulator' where you can 'replay' the whole day/week, & i can't emphasize how good it is for:
a) practice being in a live scenario to replay trades or trade an FX pair that you haven't had the time/chance to study during the week
b) you can also use it to find out exactly how the matrix was at any particular time berfore any subsequent repainting.
For new traders mainly, it is an unbelievable tool but anyone wanting to do in-depth work will find it usefull. Do a search in here but if anyone can't find it I can post all the files necessary.

3) Is moving to Daily/Weekly/Monthly not the opposite of what Symphonie was designed to be in the first place (ie., a fast-paced entries indicator for quick in-out of trades with a high level of accuracy); I would think that the S/L levels for trading Symphonie on anything above H4 will be enormous?

Oli
  • #14,587
  • Edited 7:42am Jul 13, 2012 7:18am | Edited 7:42am
Quoting olivierforex
Hey Eval,

1) if I understand properly, and sorry for using the dreaded 'R' word in advance lol, but most people seem to agree that on the longer timeframe, there is little Repainting on the Matrix (probably even less with Xaphod's matrix - RJ, yes/no?).
So when you look back at the charts on Daily/Weekly/Monthly you should see what was there at the time and backtesting manually should be quite quick (I might do some of my own at the weekend and we can always compare results).

2) i have said it before, someone in here has posted a MT4 'Trade...

olivierforex,

ABSOLUTELY NOT!!! Symphonie is not designed to be only a small timeframe system...Symphonie is designed to watch and guage markt driving forces of Extreme, Trend, Emotion, and Sentiment of markt price action regardless of timeframe or currency pair.

FEAR and GREED drive all markts and those two drivers are reactions to the markt elements of Extreme, Trend, Emotion, and Sentimen. Symphonie is looking for identifiable markt patterns to indentify markt tops and bottoms and provide one with an efficent entry point on the backside of a markt movement....so you enter at the optimal time that the direktion change is established. Symphonie is not designed as a short term top or bottom picker... it is designed to catch trends and give one entry points to catch those trends.

Agian Symphonie should work in all timeframes but since Weekly and Monthly charts can take years to develop; I have never used them so those timeframes are totally untested. But the principle of Symphonie remains the same and should work regardless.

Quote
) Is moving to Daily/Weekly/Monthly not the opposite of what Symphonie was designed to be in the first place (ie., a fast-paced entries indicator for quick in-out of trades with a high level of accuracy); I would think that the S/L levels for trading Symphonie on anything above H4 will be enormous?

Yes... I am currently testing a 10k account trading only 0.10 lotsize to prevent losses of a huge scale.


Evaluator.:nerd:
  • #14,588
  • Jul 13, 2012 7:20am Jul 13, 2012 7:20am
Quoting olivierforex
there is little Repainting on the Matrix (probably even less with Xaphod's matrix - RJ, yes/no?).
The Matrix of Xaphod only has one line that repaints. Plus there is no need to run the autorefresh indi because the Matrix updates 'on the fly'. Once the current candle closes, the there is no repainting.
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #14,589
  • Jul 13, 2012 7:43am Jul 13, 2012 7:43am
Quoting olivierforex
Hey Eval,

1) if I understand properly, and sorry for using the dreaded 'R' word in advance lol, but most people seem to agree that on the longer timeframe, there is little Repainting on the Matrix (probably even less with Xaphod's matrix - RJ, yes/no?).
So when you look back at the charts on Daily/Weekly/Monthly you should see what was there at the time and backtesting manually should be quite quick (I might do some of my own at the weekend and we can always compare results).

2) i have said it before, someone in here has posted a MT4 'Trade...
can u please post the link to he MT4 Trade Simulator please badly need it
  • #14,590
  • Jul 13, 2012 7:45am Jul 13, 2012 7:45am
Quoting realjumper
The interesting thing about fundamental analysis is that a great many professional analysts who have sources of information that NO ONE on FF has access to, all present compelling sounding analysis to support their *bias* of what's going to happen next. For every analyst that says we are on the brink of the cliff and we are headed down big time, I'll find you another who can present a case equally compelling as to why a reversal is imminent. It's all bollocks.
I agree. I will not go as far as to say it is all bollocks but anyway i agree to the point you are making.
Quoting realjumper
What you see on your chart is REAL........trade it.
I agree to this also.
But i want to add something because i have seen there have been some talk here in the thread lately about Elliot and patterns like head and shoulders and so on.
Some years ago some trading friends and myself was talking about the same thing. We was asking does it work or not? So we did look in to it but just very briefly (some of us also had some experience from trading it so we already had some knowledge about it)
We did some brief research like google and so on and found some sites where other people had done some deep research on it already so there was a lot of numbers and statistics out there already. I am sure it is still out there so if you google you will probably find it. Maybe even more now than back then.
I don't remember everything but to make a very long story short we did not find anything to prove it works but we found a lot of pointers and conclusions that say it do not work.
One thing i remember very well from this is that we downloaded a "random candlestick chart generator" that we where playing around with a lot and that was sort of a eye opener for me because on a total random chart made in excel (so it have nothing to do with the markets) you will find all the well known patterns like "head and shoulders", triangles, Elliot waves and so on. You will even find what some people will say is undisputable and very clear support and resistance. But how can it be S/R on random number charts? The answer is of course it can not be.
You will find generators like that if you google it and i just did a search here on the forum and it is even a short thread about it here: http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=298216
I did not read the thread or tested the random generator posted there so i don't know if it works like the ones i have tested before.
Random generators like that comes in a lot of different types. Some are simple excel charts and some are stand alone software. I think i have even seen some online on websites. But i have only tested one in excel.

I am not saying patterns and EW do not work or that you can not use it to make money because i know some people do make money using it. I am just sharing some of what we found when looking it to it a little bit and i like to add that i have a totally different view on a lot of this things after looking in to it the way i did back then.
I think people that are making money trading the classical chart patterns are successful because of a combination of experience and money management and they would probably be able to make profit with almost any style of trading even if they do not agree to that if you ask them.

Last i want to thank those of you that have been helping other traders here in the thread. There are many so i will not name all of you but there is one i want to name and that is Realjumper. Thank you for all your work here man!

But most of all i like to thank Evaluator for sharing his system and knowledge and for the enormous amount of work he have put in to this. It is a very good thread. I have been reading all of it. I can not say how good the system is because i have not been trading it but maybe i will test it some day.
I know i have been writing that i do not think many of the well known chart patterns really work but that is absolutely not a attack at Evaluator so i hope you do not take it personally because i know you use them.
It is not personally in any way because i like and respect what you have been doing in this thread. I take my hat of for you and one more time, thank you for your work.

Arctic4x

PS: I hope people understand my writing. English is not my language.
  • #14,591
  • Jul 13, 2012 7:48am Jul 13, 2012 7:48am
Quoting Evaluator
ABSOLUTELY NOT!!! Symphonie is not designed to be only a small timeframe system...Symphonie is designed to watch and guage markt driving forces of Extreme, Trend, Emotion, and Sentiment of markt price action regardless of timeframe or currency pair.
Evaluator.:nerd:
It was a question, not a statement...
3) Is moving to Daily/Weekly/Monthly not the opposite of what Symphonie was designed to be in the first place (ie., a fast-paced entries indicator for quick in-out of trades with a high level of accuracy); I would think that the S/L levels for trading Symphonie on anything above H4 will be enormous ?
Glad you cleared that up
  • #14,592
  • Jul 13, 2012 7:59am Jul 13, 2012 7:59am
Quoting Arctic4x
I agree. I will not go as far as to say it is all bollocks but anyway i agree to the point you are making.
I agree to this also.
But i want to add something because i have seen there have been some talk here in the thread lately about Elliot and patterns like head and shoulders and so on.
Some years ago some trading friends and myself was talking about the same thing. We was asking does it work or not? So we did look in to it but just very briefly (some of us also had some experience from trading it so we already had some knowledge about it)
We...
Arctic4x,

No offense taken. I have no ego to bruise here because I am comfortable in my method and Symphonie. Symphonie System has proven itself to be reliable time and time again.

One must trade the way one feels most comfortable and you ,the trader, can/must find way that suits you. Comfort is a major asset to have when trading and if one method more comfortable than others then trade what you want.

As to your comments on Elliott...I obviously disagree. I think it is an excellent tool and the patterns do repeat...because it too is proven itself since it was created in the 1920s. Just like Fibonacci levels and extentions points and the ''golden ratio'' from Egyptian mathimaticians. There are constant repeating patterns that are found in nature and they have been repeating since the beginning of time.

HOWEVER; Elliott waves are (like Symphonie) complex and because there are many different interpretations many do get it wrong. However, I find it interesting to see that once I make an assessment of a pattern and pull out the take profit points others who are well respected and knowledged arrive at the exact same levels as I do..

I am not talking about other Elliott waving people I mean hardcore techincal people who only use PA and charts....We see the same thing but get their in different methods. Why? Because patterns of price action repeat over and over and over and over again.

Evaluator.
  • #14,593
  • Jul 13, 2012 8:01am Jul 13, 2012 8:01am
Quoting olivierforex
It was a question, not a statement...
3) Is moving to Daily/Weekly/Monthly not the opposite of what Symphonie was designed to be in the first place (ie., a fast-paced entries indicator for quick in-out of trades with a high level of accuracy); I would think that the S/L levels for trading Symphonie on anything above H4 will be enormous ?
Glad you cleared that up
I understand....I was just being dramatic....
  • #14,594
  • Jul 13, 2012 8:04am Jul 13, 2012 8:04am
Quoting Arctic4x
I agree. I will not go as far as to say it is all bollocks but anyway i agree to the point you are making.
I agree to this also.
But i want to add something because i have seen there have been some talk here in the thread lately about Elliot and patterns like head and shoulders and so on.
Some years ago some trading friends and myself was talking about the same thing. We was asking does it work or not? So we did look in to it but just very briefly (some of us also had some experience from trading it so we already had some knowledge about it)
We...
Your English is excellent, and you make some very valid points.

Randomly generated charts will produce these patterns because there are so many patterns that the balance of probability says that one will turn up sooner or later. Also, the reason a lot of these patterns seem to work is because we....ie traders.....make them work. Just the same as PA will suddenly halt at a Fib number, or support line. It is what we expect to happen, so we make it happen......and then are amazed that it does happen!!! It's a self fulfilling prophesy!!

There are very few patterns that I will entertain trading, simply because I have seen them fail as much as I have seen them succeed......the infamous Head and Shoulders pattern is once such example.

Also, much of the time we see these various patterns drawn incorrectly because the drawer sees what he wants to see, and draws the pattern accordingly. You can see this very often in the way people mix and match candle wicks and candle bodies. The 'rules' say that if you are going to draw lines, then they MUST be wick to wick, OR body to body, but not a combination of both.

Just as fundamental analysis can be interpreted the way the user wishes to interpret it, so can pattern recognition.....and as I said before, you'll get 5 different Elliot wave counts from 5 different exponents because at best, it is a subjective art, not a system or method.

Still....to each his own.....the best we can hope for is to keep an open mind and go wherever the PA takes us, without bias.
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #14,595
  • Jul 13, 2012 8:09am Jul 13, 2012 8:09am
Post #14571 +40 pips and counting down....

I LOVE trendline breaks on major resistance and support levels...!
  • #14,596
  • Jul 13, 2012 8:33am Jul 13, 2012 8:33am
Quoting onojiwizard
can u please post the link to he MT4 Trade Simulator please badly need it
Hey Onoji,
I can't find the link but here are all the files (the PDF explains how to install it and how to use it).
Good luck
Attached File(s)
File Type: zip Trade Simulator.zip   492 KB | 621 downloads
  • #14,597
  • Jul 13, 2012 8:40am Jul 13, 2012 8:40am
Anyone who was short euro and got their stop clipped can blame it on her: she's pretty but deadly for traders lol

http://www.forexlive.com/blog/2012/0...uty-pm-speaks/
  • #14,598
  • Jul 13, 2012 8:40am Jul 13, 2012 8:40am
simulator might be good for testing larger time frames
  • #14,599
  • Jul 13, 2012 8:44am Jul 13, 2012 8:44am
Quoting olivierforex
Anyone who was short euro and got their stop clipped can blame it on her: she's pretty but deadly for traders lol

http://www.forexlive.com/blog/2012/0...uty-pm-speaks/
Nice reversal.......

Russia goes nuclear on EUR/USD
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #14,600
  • Jul 13, 2012 8:46am Jul 13, 2012 8:46am
Quoting olivierforex
Hey Onoji,
I can't find the link but here are all the files (the PDF explains how to install it and how to use it).
Good luck
thanks, i appreciate
10 traders viewing now, 1 is registered:
ricosuaveiii