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At What Point Do You Give Up On Forex

  • #201
  • Edited 3:06am Jun 28, 2012 2:55am | Edited 3:06am
Quoting Slim Buffett

When Mark Zuckerburg was 20 and still in college would you have imagined that he could be worth 100 billion or so by the time he was 28?
Good example, majoring in computer science and sociology he obviously had the aptitude, capability, and opportunity. The end result was unexpected but not beyond the realms of possibility.


Quoting Slim Buffett

Further, back in the day was it "realistically within our capabilities" to land a man on the moon
No, that was a team effort and developed over generations, not one man who woke up one morning and suddenly decided he'd try flying to the moon! If it had been physically impossible no amount of working toward a goal would have changed that reality.


Quoting Slim Buffett

maybe you've reached your limits
Maybe. The question is how much time, effort, and money does one put into attempting to achieve something that despite our best efforts has been unachievable? We have a limited time, maybe it would be better spent pursuing goals for which we have the aptitude and are likely to be within our capability and which we have a chance of achieving a degree of success. Mark Zuckerburg is a good example. Could he have flown to the moon? Perhaps, but instead he excelled in his own area of expertise for which he had aptitude and capability. Makes sense, no?
  • #202
  • Jun 28, 2012 3:00am Jun 28, 2012 3:00am
Quoting Aldente
As traders?
As anything.
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #203
  • Jun 28, 2012 3:04am Jun 28, 2012 3:04am
Quoting pipmutt
Good example, majoring in computer science and sociology he obviously had the aptitude, capability, and opportunity. The end result was unexpected but not beyond the realms of possibility.




No, that was a team effort and developed over generations, not one man who woke up one morning and suddenly decided he'd try flying to the moon! If it had been physically impossible no amount of working toward a goal would have changed that reality.




Maybe. The question is how much time, effort, and money does one put into attempting to achieve something...

So I'm asking you. What is the limit? Is it what you can do? Is it what's commonly been done? Is "the limit" a stretch of the imagination?

How about a solid answer? Or does that seem out of limits?
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #204
  • Jun 28, 2012 3:05am Jun 28, 2012 3:05am
Quoting Slim Buffett
Do you REALLY think IQ to be a sole determinant?
Not a SOLE determinant, but yeah I think it is a significant one. Sure, there are plenty of extremely intelligent people who still couldn't make it as 'traders' or 'investors'(I think Sir Isaac Newton is one of them), but can someone as dumb as a rock still be a successful trader? I'm not sure it works the other way around

Mark Zuckerberg was an outlier and no one could have predicted what happened to him, but still, he was a student at Harvard and clearly above average in intelligence.
  • #205
  • Jun 28, 2012 3:11am Jun 28, 2012 3:11am
Quoting Slim Buffett

How about a solid answer? Or does that seem out of limits?
No, but reading and comprehending my reply seems to be for you.
  • #206
  • Jun 28, 2012 3:19am Jun 28, 2012 3:19am
Quoting Aldente
Not a SOLE determinant, but yeah I think it is a significant one. Sure, there are plenty of extremely intelligent people who still couldn't make it as 'traders' or 'investors'(I think Sir Isaac Newton is one of them), but can someone as dumb as a rock still be a successful trader? I'm not sure it works the other way around

Mark Zuckerberg was an outlier and no one could have predicted what happened to him, but still, he was a student at Harvard and clearly above average in intelligence.
OK. Let's get hung up on ONE example. Or not.

Like you said plenty of smart people don't cut it as traders. Could that logically mean that plenty of people of average intelligence CAN cut it? You decide.

For that matter, there are different "forms" of intelligence. Street smart. Book smart. Einstein. Kennedy. JB Hunt. Obama. etc,

Take your pick. If you don't know what it means, look it up.
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #207
  • Jun 28, 2012 3:22am Jun 28, 2012 3:22am
Quoting pipmutt
No, but reading and comprehending my reply seems to be for you.
So your reply to a request for a "solid answer" is that I can comprehend your reply ?? !!

OK.
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #208
  • Jun 28, 2012 3:28am Jun 28, 2012 3:28am
Quoting pipmutt
I think we've probably all had some of those! I think moments like that make us sit up and say hold on, let's look at this whole thing objectively, seriously what am I doing here. A reality check can be useful!
Yep, but perhaps not all of us do it. I recoil at some of the stories I read, they flabbergast me. People talk of great months of epic growth, wiped out in the last few days of the month "in a few trades". Crazy stuff. The lack of discipline and self control in some folk is astonishing and to me anyway, suggests that they may never properly wake up to their self-harming instincts.

Those that properly do, can prosper.

Quoting pipmutt
I think it helps but can psychology overcome what for some people are insurmountable hurdles? Even with the best will in the world some things are just too hard, beyond our capability or our capacity to learn.
Yep, i'm in absolute agreement. It isn't an arrogant viewpoint either (i'm better than you, you'll never do this) I just happen to think that there are a whole melting pot of character traits which make some people perfectly suited to trading and some people diametrically unsuited to trading, regardless of how much they want the rewards. The people who aren't are doubtless much better at other pursuits than the people who are.

However, there are a whole bunch of folk in the middle and many of them can be helped by developing a mindset that they previously never possessed. I'm a fundamental advocate of mind reprogramming. How our minds behave today is partly nature but predominantly nurture. We have developed our mindsets through experience, repetition and self-fulfilment. There is little that cannot be undone and there is little that cannot be programmed in if the desire is strong enough. The changes alone though are certainly not enough, as we can probably all accept.



Quoting pipmutt
So what convinced you that your genetic makeup and character were suitable and that it was worth persevering?
Good question and i'm not actually sure. Strangely, i'm even not sure I ever self-assessed in that way which may seem rather contradictory to how I view our attitudes to ourselves. Maybe it was just an innate feeling. I've always had a terrific aptitude for mind games, puzzles and logic based questions (trading to me is just like a big puzzle that you need to work out an answer to). I've also always been money hungry to a degree and had a belief that money can make more money. I'm also a decisive sort of person and very, very determined. I somehow knew it was right for me without actually ever having spent the time thinking about why.

Of course, then the markets mercilessly told me otherwise! They chewed me up, spat me out and laughed at my naivety. They humbled me, made me feel a fool and even made me question the very courage of my own convictions - countless times.

So it's then hard to truly decipher whether what kept me coming back was the certain knowledge that I could still do this and that it was right for me - regardless of what the markets were currently telling me - or whether it was just pig-headed resilience and a unshakeable will to turn my fortunes around.

I guess a little bit of both, all things considered.
  • #209
  • Jun 28, 2012 3:38am Jun 28, 2012 3:38am
Quoting Slim Buffett

Like you said plenty of smart people don't cut it as traders. Could that logically mean that plenty of people of average intelligence CAN cut it? You decide.
Well, no, not necessarily, and I'm not sure. I think trading skill is comprised of many different components. Lets just say innate intelligence is one of those components. Lets go further and say that innate intelligence is a pre-requisite, meaning you could have different combinations of components but innate intelligence is a requirement. But you still need some of the other components to complete the skillset. You could have the IQ necessary, but if you lack all of the other components, you still wouldnt make it.

But a low intelligence person would never make it, because they lack the essential component, even if they have ALL of the other components in abundance, does that make sense?

BTW I wasn't trying to single you out and I'm not trying to single you out, just trying to answer the question you asked "How does one determine what the limit of their capabilities are?"
  • #210
  • Jun 28, 2012 3:44am Jun 28, 2012 3:44am
never give up till your bankrupt and homeless
  • #211
  • Jun 28, 2012 4:03am Jun 28, 2012 4:03am
Vote!
  • #212
  • Jun 28, 2012 4:17am Jun 28, 2012 4:17am
Quoting Turveyd
I'm an overly logical, fearless risk taking computer programmer
This made me spit coffee all over my computer.

My guess is that people rarely admit to themselves that they can't make it. There probably isn't a defining moment where they realise their short comings.

Humans have this inbuilt defence mechanism which makes it too difficult accept we aren't good enough. Instead we'll make excuses such as I haven't got time to trade this week or I'll take some time out from trading and start again in the new year or this games rigged etc. etc.

The sensible point to give up is when you can't achieve the goals that you have set for yourself, within a predetermined period of time, but most people don't bother setting any goals!
  • #213
  • Jun 28, 2012 4:23am Jun 28, 2012 4:23am
I vote and chose the variant "depends On How Much Money I Lose".
  • #214
  • Jun 28, 2012 4:25am Jun 28, 2012 4:25am
Quoting -nate-dogg-
This made me spit coffee all over my computer.

My guess is that people rarely admit to themselves that they can't make it. There probably isn't a defining moment where they realise their short comings.

Humans have this inbuilt defence mechanism which makes it too difficult accept we aren't good enough. Instead we'll make excuses such as I haven't got time to trade this week or I'll take some time out from trading and start again in the new year or this games rigged etc. etc.

The sensible point to give up is when you can't achieve the...
  • #215
  • Jun 28, 2012 4:26am Jun 28, 2012 4:26am
Quoting -nate-dogg-
This made me spit coffee all over my computer.

My guess is that people rarely admit to themselves that they can't make it. There probably isn't a defining moment where they realise their short comings.

Humans have this inbuilt defence mechanism which makes it too difficult accept we aren't good enough. Instead we'll make excuses such as I haven't got time to trade this week or I'll take some time out from trading and start again in the new year or this games rigged etc. etc.

The sensible point to give up is when you can't achieve the goals...
It's true though, I think nothing of dangling of a mountain.

Most people blame it on there brokers SLing them LOL

Loops I know who used to trade and post here, IQ 152 uber intelligent so much so she couldn't take a loss ever, but with higher IQ comes generally more madness she is certainly no exception.

My IQ tested a few times was 136 22years back, likely 12 these days.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #216
  • Jun 28, 2012 4:29am Jun 28, 2012 4:29am
Quoting Turveyd
It's true though, I think nothing of dangling of a mountain.

Most people blame it on there brokers SLing them LOL

Loops I know who used to trade and post here, IQ 152 uber intelligent so much so she couldn't take a loss ever, but with higher IQ comes generally more madness she is certainly no exception.

My IQ tested a few times was 136 22years back, likely 12 these days.
I never tested my IQ(
  • #217
  • Jun 28, 2012 4:32am Jun 28, 2012 4:32am
Quoting Turveyd

Most people blame it on there brokers SLing them LOL.
People are done that way that we can't admit our mistakes. It's much more easier to blame others.
  • #218
  • Jun 28, 2012 4:39am Jun 28, 2012 4:39am
Quoting leopard31
I never tested my IQ(
Don't bother.

I love IQ style tests and am blessed with a reasonably high one according to the tests i've sat but strangely, the IQ level rose the more tests I sat. You can actually learn how to get good at this style of testing, with practice, believe it or not.

I don't really believe that a simple IQ test is a reliable measure of intellect. I can find an IQ test pretty easy but cannot remember people's faces or put names to faces with any reliable degree of ease. Go figure?
  • #219
  • Jun 28, 2012 4:43am Jun 28, 2012 4:43am
Quoting Trotty
Don't bother.

I love IQ style tests and am blessed with a reasonably high one according to the tests i've sat but strangely, the IQ level rose the more tests I sat. You can actually learn how to get good at this style of testing, with practice, believe it or not.

I don't really believe that a simple IQ test is a reliable measure of intellect. I can find an IQ test pretty easy but cannot remember people's faces or put names to faces with any reliable degree of ease. Go figure?

IQ is just the ability to solve problems, does not require spelling ability obviously, so yes you can improve at solving IQ test problems.

Imperfect world, imperfect solutions.

High IQ generally has other draw backs, pretty much everyone if you test everything will come back to an average.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #220
  • Jun 28, 2012 4:44am Jun 28, 2012 4:44am
fx trading is not just like spoon feeding. you need to learn from your mistakes. you have to experience it so that you can handle the pressure. For me, 'there are no failures, it's just experiences and your reactions to them'. 'Life's real failure is when you don't realize how close you were to success when you gave up'.
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