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At What Point Do You Give Up On Forex

  • #181
  • Jun 27, 2012 12:28am Jun 27, 2012 12:28am
You are a very remarkable person to express and explain that you are at a point where the cost/benefit of working for trading profitability is not worth it.

This leads me to reflect on the steps that lead people to give up.

1) step1 : losing money. If a trader makes more money, than losing money, the idea of giving up is out of the window
2) step2: starting to see the negative aspects of trading, and these negative aspects weighting more and more heavily ( "learning trader's lifestyle")
3) step3 : a better option shows up. In your case , investing in a business and the compound interest makes it more rewarding than the losses in trading
4) step4: coming with good enough reasons for you ( here not everybody can succeed in trading - I'd disagree ) to feel emotionally OK with the decision of giving up.
5) Your Ego is now Ok with being part of the "failed at trading"

I am kind of stunned also as you seem like the ideal profile of someone who should be successful at trading :
- former athlete, with financial means, positive mindset...
I really would love to pour through your trading blotter and have the list of the main mistakes you make when trading.
  • #182
  • Jun 27, 2012 4:37am Jun 27, 2012 4:37am
never give up under no circumstances, surrending is no option. no matter what always stand up once more than falling down. its possible keep pushing.
consistency wins
  • #183
  • Jun 27, 2012 5:01am Jun 27, 2012 5:01am
As with most challenging endeavours, when you can honestly say you've given it your best shot, to the best of your ability, and yet you still can't achieve the desired results then maybe it's time to accept defeat gracefully.

The persistence and obstinacy of 'never give up regardless' would seem a little foolhardy and pigheaded to be honest!
  • #184
  • Jun 27, 2012 7:04am Jun 27, 2012 7:04am
Forex is not for everybody.
It never gets easier, you just get better
  • #185
  • Jun 27, 2012 9:25am Jun 27, 2012 9:25am
I give up for a while only when the account is empty :-(
  • #186
  • Jun 27, 2012 9:33am Jun 27, 2012 9:33am
GIVE UP? this is my response:

Inserted Video

(there is sound of snapping vertebrae, so, be careful)

here is another one:

Inserted Video
" It may mean something. It may mean nothing at all "
  • #187
  • Jun 27, 2012 9:57am Jun 27, 2012 9:57am
Quoting pipmutt
As with most challenging endeavours, when you can honestly say you've given it your best shot, to the best of your ability, and yet you still can't achieve the desired results then maybe it's time to accept defeat gracefully.

The persistence and obstinacy of 'never give up regardless' would seem a little foolhardy and pigheaded to be honest!
Agreed. So the hard task becomes trying to fathom the point at which you've given in your best shot for the appropriate amount of time. That's not as easy to do as it is to say.

I'll be frank, I have had many head in hands "I just can't do this, i'm kidding myself here" moments when I was learning the business and gave myself extended breaks from trading more than once. Each time I thought I might be starting to make progress, I regressed again and the doubt would surface.

Developing a PMA is of absolute paramount importance. Some people have it tought to them as kids, others like me have had to develop it themselves. As soon as I was willing to accept that the path was going to be tough, that one failure will not make or break my career and once I accepted the fact that a lot of people already do this for a living so there's no reason why I can't/shouldn't one day then I got over these capitulations and moved on.

People have spoken about introvert vs extrovert characteristics but I think the perfect trader fits somewhere in the middle. Not so extrovert that the flit around looking for the next big thing all the time. Not so introverted that the over-analyse ever setup, every trade and every scenario to the point of being frozen in time. It's a happy blend of being calm and measured enough to do the necessary homework but brave and bold enough to grab hold of your danglers and get on with making money.

I suspect that people purely having the wrong genetic makeup/developed characteristics is a large reason why some people can trade and some people cannot.

Sorry, bit of a waffle there
  • #188
  • Jun 27, 2012 10:58am Jun 27, 2012 10:58am
Yeah I agree with the above - why give up when there is such a challenge.

I struggled for years and then things started to fall into place, luckily before I blew any account!

Get a good mindset and a good strategy and that's all you need. How to get those is up to you... (Mark Douglas and Bullpips a couple of ideas)
  • #189
  • Jun 27, 2012 2:10pm Jun 27, 2012 2:10pm
Quoting Trotty

I have had many head in hands "I just can't do this, i'm kidding myself here" moments when I was learning the business
I think we've probably all had some of those! I think moments like that make us sit up and say hold on, let's look at this whole thing objectively, seriously what am I doing here. A reality check can be useful!


Quoting Trotty

Developing a PMA is of absolute paramount importance.....
I think it helps but can psychology overcome what for some people are insurmountable hurdles? Even with the best will in the world some things are just too hard, beyond our capability or our capacity to learn.


Quoting Trotty

and once I accepted the fact that a lot of people already do this for a living so there's no reason why I can't/shouldn't one day.

I suspect that people purely having the wrong genetic makeup/developed characteristics is a large reason why some people can trade and some people cannot.
So what convinced you that your genetic makeup and character were suitable and that it was worth persevering?
  • #190
  • Jun 27, 2012 3:44pm Jun 27, 2012 3:44pm
Quoting Trotty
Agreed. So the hard task becomes trying to fathom the point at which you've given in your best shot for the appropriate amount of time. That's not as easy to do as it is to say.

I'll be frank, I have had many head in hands "I just can't do this, i'm kidding myself here" moments when I was learning the business and gave myself extended breaks from trading more than once. Each time I thought I might be starting to make progress, I regressed again and the doubt would surface.

Developing a PMA is of absolute paramount importance. Some people...
Although I've been on this for 7 or 8 years, with kids to look after ( not even mine ), work, friends, mountain bikes it is hard to fit in time to trade, if I condensed it does to solid time trading it would likely come to just a few months, there are years when I barely made any trades at all like literally 4 trades.

I should have the perfect make up, I'm an overly logical, fearless risk taking computer programmer who doesn't really care about money, but put me in a trade with real money going up and down and until recently I totally screw it up.

But still the only realistic chance of getting rich so must plod on.

Most people are of average intelligence, hence the term average and in this game, average won't cut it sadly.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #191
  • Jun 28, 2012 12:51am Jun 28, 2012 12:51am
I think it helps but can psychology overcome what for some people are insurmountable hurdles? Even with the best will in the world some things are just too hard, beyond our capability or our capacity to learn.


Ari Kiev :
In his book, "A Strategy for Daily Living," trading expert Dr. Ari Kiev notes, "A successful life does not result from chance, fate, or good fortune, but from a succession of successful days lived in pursuit of a worthy pursuit." Dr. Kiev points out that you can work toward your goal every day, day after day, and eventually even the most elusive goal can be achieved. Perhaps you will make more progress on some days than others, but what is most important is that you never give up and spend every day working toward your goal.

http://www.mypivots.com/board/topic/...-life-ari-kiev
  • #192
  • Jun 28, 2012 1:51am Jun 28, 2012 1:51am
Quoting logo
[b]Ari Kiev :
In his book, "A Strategy for Daily Living," trading expert Dr. Ari Kiev notes, "A successful life does not result from chance, fate, or good fortune, but from a succession of successful days lived in pursuit of a worthy pursuit." Dr. Kiev points out that you can work toward your goal every day, day after day, and eventually even the most elusive goal can be achieved. Perhaps you will make more progress on some days than others, but what is most important is that you never give up and spend every day working toward your...
Elusive doesn't mean unrealistic though, our goals and ambitions still need to be realistically within our capabilities.
  • #193
  • Jun 28, 2012 2:13am Jun 28, 2012 2:13am
Quoting pipmutt
Elusive doesn't mean unrealistic though, our goals and ambitions still need to be realistically within our capabilities.

This can be a gray area.
What does it mean to see records broken, the impossible realised ?
That may be sometimes, our main limitations is within our own mind,
psychology.

For trading, I always ask, how many REAL screen time HOURS have you put over all these years.
This already elimites a good 80% of traders.
  • #194
  • Jun 28, 2012 2:15am Jun 28, 2012 2:15am
Quoting pipmutt
Elusive doesn't mean unrealistic though, our goals and ambitions still need to be realistically within our capabilities.
Of course that's true. How do YOU define "realistically within our capabilities"?

When Mark Zuckerburg was 20 and still in college would you have imagined that he could be worth 100 billion or so by the time he was 28?

So, what exactly is "realistically within our capabilities" ?
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #195
  • Jun 28, 2012 2:27am Jun 28, 2012 2:27am
"Elusive doesn't mean unrealistic though, our goals and ambitions still need to be realistically within our capabilities."

Further, back in the day was it "realistically within our capabilities" to land a man on the moon, to have a PC in the home that's more powerful than the one used then and now a phone..... That could go on and on.

You or I don't know what is "realistically within our capabilities" because mankind forever stretches the limits and the limits have not yet been reached.

If you want to speak only for yourself......

then maybe you've reached your limits.
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #196
  • Jun 28, 2012 2:38am Jun 28, 2012 2:38am
Quoting Slim Buffett

So, what exactly is "realistically within our capabilities" ?
How about an IQ test as a determinant?

http://www.evancarmichael.com/Entrep...h-Part-II.html

Abstract:
This study analyzes the role that innate intelligence plays in investors‘ behavior and equity trading performance. Equity trading data are combined with data from an intelligence test administered to every Finnish male in the mandatory military service. We document two channels through which intelligence affects equity trading performance: high IQ investors exhibit superior stock-picking skills relative to low IQ investors and low IQ investors display poor trade execution: they pay too much for immediacy and poorly monitor their limit orders which generates excessive adverse selection costs. Innate intelligence remains a significant determinant of behavior and performance even after controlling for investors‘ trading activity.
  • #197
  • Jun 28, 2012 2:46am Jun 28, 2012 2:46am
Quoting Aldente
How about an IQ test as a determinant?

http://www.evancarmichael.com/Entrep...h-Part-II.html

Abstract:
This study analyzes the role that innate intelligence plays in investors‘ behavior and equity trading performance. Equity trading data are combined with data from an intelligence test administered to every Finnish male in the mandatory military service. We document two channels through which intelligence affects equity trading performance: high IQ investors exhibit superior stock-picking...
First, why do you single me out?

Second, why don't you pay attention to the test I've already taken and posted.

If you had any sense you would do one of the above but perhaps not both.
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #198
  • Jun 28, 2012 2:49am Jun 28, 2012 2:49am
Next, I could rant on about how many smart people fail and about how many not so "high IQ" people make millions$

So what's your point?
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #199
  • Jun 28, 2012 2:51am Jun 28, 2012 2:51am
Do you REALLY think IQ to be a sole determinant?
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #200
  • Jun 28, 2012 2:54am Jun 28, 2012 2:54am
Quoting Slim Buffett
and about how many not so "high IQ" people make millions$
As traders?
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