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  • #616,401
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:37pm Mar 27, 2012 2:37pm
Quoting TraderBoyFF
Let me ask you this.

If i have the power to create money out of my paper towel rolls, would you keep accepting it as payment?
China is printing more money then the US. Do you not remember Obama and Hillary Clinton calling China out on this a couple of weeks and months ago.

As a Chinese investor, I would rather buy USD that has a 2.9% inflation rate than own Chinese Yuans that have a 4.5% (and growing). Why do you think US bonds are the safe haven, not Chinese bonds.
  • #616,402
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:38pm Mar 27, 2012 2:38pm
Quoting Kowalczyk
The Chinese can not get enough of USD. Europes debt is just as bad as the US (10 Tril Euro's, I believe). Inflation (printing money) makes it a lot easier to pay off the debts. Its the media that has the public against it. And, before you complain about the US printing money, look at what China is doing. Our Sec. of State had to call China out because they were devaluing there currency (ie. printing money). Look at China's inflation rate compared to the US.
I humbly disagree.

If they can't get enough of USD, why do they now have a mandate to gradually decrease their dollar reserves?

And you say Europe's debt is just as bad as the US? They decided not to follow the US's mandate of quantitative easing (printing money), instead opting for longer term loans. That means they did not print money.
And you're still telling me Europe's debt is just as bad?
Learn to see what's there, not what you want to see.
  • #616,403
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:39pm Mar 27, 2012 2:39pm
Quoting gsbotes
lol the TV is waaaaaay easier to control than the internet
True, but the point is that information was distributed well in the 1970's unlike what TraderBoyFF said.
  • #616,404
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:39pm Mar 27, 2012 2:39pm
Quoting pkimnyc
doubt it.
to late in the day
Trade What You See Not What You Want To See
  • #616,405
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:39pm Mar 27, 2012 2:39pm
Quoting Kowalczyk
China is printing more money then the US. Do you not remember Obama and Hillary Clinton calling China out on this a couple of weeks and months ago.

As a Chinese investor, I would rather buy USD that has a 2.9% inflation rate than own Chinese Yuans that have a 4.5% (and growing). Why do you think US bonds are the safe haven, not Chinese bonds.
that same "safe haven" that started this mess
  • #616,406
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:41pm Mar 27, 2012 2:41pm
Quoting pipsallday
to late in the day
think we might see a slight and slow uptrend during the Asian session
  • #616,407
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:41pm Mar 27, 2012 2:41pm
Quoting TraderBoyFF
Let me ask you this.

If i have the power to create money out of my paper towel rolls, would you keep accepting it as payment?
depends.... What are you producing that i can in turn give you back your rolls for goods that I need?

money is just the vehicle of exchange
wealth is the production of goods and services of an entire economy

money transfers wealth to allocate resources.
AVT INVENIAM VIAM AVT FACIAM
  • #616,408
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:41pm Mar 27, 2012 2:41pm
Quoting TraderBoyFF
I humbly disagree.

If they can't get enough of USD, why do they now have a mandate to gradually decrease their dollar reserves?

And you say Europe's debt is just as bad as the US? They decided not to follow the US's mandate of quantitative easing (printing money), instead opting for longer term loans. That means they did not print money.
And you're still telling me Europe's debt is just as bad?
Learn to see what's there, not what you want to see. Look at the facts and stop repeating what the media is saying.
The Chinese government may be decreasing reserves (for a number of reasons) but the Chinese investors aren't. All I can say to you is, look at all the facts and then make up your own decision.
  • #616,409
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:44pm Mar 27, 2012 2:44pm
Quoting Kowalczyk
China is printing more money then the US. Do you not remember Obama and Hillary Clinton calling China out on this a couple of weeks and months ago.

As a Chinese investor, I would rather buy USD that has a 2.9% inflation rate than own Chinese Yuans that have a 4.5% (and growing). Why do you think US bonds are the safe haven, not Chinese bonds.
Which economy is growing and which economy is contracting?

If you have a growing economy, you have to print more money to adjust equilibrium. A growing economy, just like if you had 10 ppl before, but now you have 100, will need naturally more money to circulate. This is China's scenario, it's natural for them.

An economy that isn't growing, such as the US, does not need to print more money, yet it still continues to do so.
Learn to see what's there, not what you want to see.
  • #616,410
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:44pm Mar 27, 2012 2:44pm
Quoting Kowalczyk
The Chinese can not get enough of USD. Europes debt is just as bad as the US (10 Tril Euro's, I believe). Inflation (printing money) makes it a lot easier to pay off the debts. Its the media that has the public against it. And, before you complain about the US printing money, look at what China is doing. Our Sec. of State had to call China out because they were devaluing there currency (ie. printing money). Look at China's inflation rate compared to the US.
@Kowalczyk:

€10.3tn: that is the total amount owed by the 27 governments of the European Union.

Of that debt, €8.2tn is owed by governments in the eurozone (17 countries)
  • #616,411
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:46pm Mar 27, 2012 2:46pm
Quoting gsbotes
think we might see a slight and slow uptrend during the Asian session
im short at 41
20 pips would be nice to end the day
Trade What You See Not What You Want To See
  • #616,412
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:49pm Mar 27, 2012 2:49pm
Quoting the redlion
money is just the vehicle of exchange
wealth is the production of goods and services of an entire economy

.
EXACTLY! printing more money that has NO value = screwing the system and balances "cooking the books" lol
  • #616,413
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:49pm Mar 27, 2012 2:49pm
Quoting gsbotes
that same "safe haven" that started this mess
I am talking about US bonds.

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The yield goes down, which means people (including China) are buying bonds. The bond yields are at an all time low which means investors can't get enough. To be fair, our Gov has been buying these bonds too but it alone can't bring it down that much.

The point is, even if we print money, it still has value. It is not as simple as FOX and CNBC say it is.

I am done arguing with you guys on this topic. I guess we will have to agree to disagree.
  • #616,414
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:49pm Mar 27, 2012 2:49pm
Quoting the redlion
depends.... What are you producing that i can in turn give you back your rolls for goods that I need?

money is just the vehicle of exchange
wealth is the production of goods and services of an entire economy

money transfers wealth to allocate resources.
You tell me, because as far as anyone can tell, most of these goods are produced in China.

I have to say, these conversations are quite lively. We haven't had these in a while. All thanks to dead price action. lol
Learn to see what's there, not what you want to see.
  • #616,415
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:50pm Mar 27, 2012 2:50pm
Quoting TraderBoyFF
Which economy is growing and which economy is contracting?

If you have a growing economy, you have to print more money to adjust equilibrium. A growing economy, just like if you had 10 ppl before, but now you have 100, will need naturally more money to circulate. This is China's scenario, it's natural for them.

An economy that isn't growing, such as the US, does not need to print more money, yet it still continues to do so.
the US needs to print money (according to Keneysian economics)

Because the economy is contracting which leads to liquidation
as the economy liquidates excesses, you get less consumption= less profits for corporations= laying off of people= less consumption= less profits= more laying off of workers= less consumption,

wages come down, goods and services are worth less, farmers and anyone else with mortgages, any other type of credit line cannot deleverage as their salaries are low yet their loans are the same= default in loans = credit crunch= drying up of credit market= less growth

so print print print
AVT INVENIAM VIAM AVT FACIAM
  • #616,416
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:50pm Mar 27, 2012 2:50pm
Quoting pipsallday
im short at 41
20 pips would be nice to end the day
think you might reach that..Nice!
  • #616,417
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:53pm Mar 27, 2012 2:53pm
Quoting gsbotes
think you might reach that..Nice!
getting there
Trade What You See Not What You Want To See
  • #616,418
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:53pm Mar 27, 2012 2:53pm
Watch action in zones
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  • #616,419
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:54pm Mar 27, 2012 2:54pm
the point of easing monetary policy is not TO FIX the economy is to sort of hold the fort till growth picks up........assuming we will have growth and this ressession is part of the normal business cycle.

now if you believe the US has stopped FUNDAMENTALLY being the world's superpower then yup, we are screwed and no printing can fix that, just delay the inevitable poverty that comes with a less competitive economy + the inflation that comes from confetti paper circulating
AVT INVENIAM VIAM AVT FACIAM
  • #616,420
  • Mar 27, 2012 2:55pm Mar 27, 2012 2:55pm
Quoting Hda
@Kowalczyk:

€10.3tn: that is the total amount owed by the 27 governments of the European Union.

Of that debt, €8.2tn is owed by governments in the eurozone (17 countries)
Yes, $14 Trill is the amount owed by the Fed gov. This includes all cash outstanding (cash in you bank account/wallet), all money owed to State governments, the treasury/federal reserve (they basically buy their own bonds), and does not include all of the assets the the Federal government .

Now I am done. Agreeing to disagree.
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