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Trading Without a StopLoss

  • #2,741
  • Jan 1, 2017 12:10pm Jan 1, 2017 12:10pm
Hi, I trade with XM.com, I am hoping to use a leverage of 888:1,
I have been trading 2 years, profitable for the last 6 months, I use an extreme tight stop loss with a high risk reward.

My question is I am starting out with 20 EUR, hoping to catch 4-5 winners and turn my 20 into a lot
trading without stop loss for the first 3.
20 - 150
120 - 1k
1k - 6k
6k - 50k
50k - 250k

I shall use 15 pip stop loss, hoping to catch 200+ pips, only looking for 4-5 trades this year

I trade using major support+resistance with a harmonic pattern d leg forming on these levels.

Big goal?
  • #2,742
  • Jan 3, 2017 7:38am Jan 3, 2017 7:38am
Quoting seanocon
Hi, I trade with XM.com, I am hoping to use a leverage of 888:1
From my past experience a long time ago , i made a lot with the 25 bonus and they refused to pay.
I would suggest to deposit by yourself instead of taking the bonus. Because if you end by making a good amount you will regret it when they pull out some excuse to not pay.
  • #2,743
  • Jan 3, 2017 1:50pm Jan 3, 2017 1:50pm
Quoting RicardoDS
{quote} From my past experience a long time ago , i made a lot with the 25 bonus and they refused to pay. I would suggest to deposit by yourself instead of taking the bonus. Because if you end by making a good amount you will regret it when they pull out some excuse to not pay.
Hi not trading the bonus, been trading with xm almost 3 years, using my own capital just using 20 eur equivalent in a trade and compounding the profits, process will repeat until target goal is hit so 0.10-0.13 in units while keeping the same ratio in trades as profits increase
  • #2,744
  • Jan 5, 2017 9:14am Jan 5, 2017 9:14am
I think that it all depends on your own trading decisions to trade or not trade with a stop loss. But there are quite some benefits when you trade with it. For me, it is to prevent a HUGE loss from an unexpected news event or market conditions.
  • #2,745
  • Jan 5, 2017 10:51am Jan 5, 2017 10:51am
Quoting seanocon
{quote} Hi not trading the bonus, been trading with xm almost 3 years, using my own capital just using 20 eur equivalent in a trade and compounding the profits, process will repeat until target goal is hit so 0.10-0.13 in units while keeping the same ratio in trades as profits increase
Ohh , i see. I thought you had take the stupid bonus.
Well , your 4-5 trades plan is very hard because of the high risk reward and the fact you risk 100% per trade, but if you really got the discipline and some luck you may make it, the fact you use Harmonics+Major SR is very good , but still....I would recommend risking 10% per trade (do it with money you dont care/need) and double it a couple of times.
I had tons of accounts for that purpose (All or nothing) and went to 0 in a lot of them , but the profit made when it went right was much bigger. 90% of the blowups happened with that kind of big risk reward plan, if you stay disciplined and wait for the setups i think you will do better with the 10% risk. At least it worked better in my case and i was also using Harmonics and a line chart strategy for extra confirmation. You should be fine with harmonics+SR
Good luck , hope you make it
  • #2,746
  • Jan 5, 2017 11:24am Jan 5, 2017 11:24am
Many traders I've seen lost much due to the fact that didn't put a stoploss. There were different reasons and they are justified. For example, a large volatility... But my opinion is that you'd try to protect yourself. Sometimes it's possible to hope for own nerves and sit in front of a computer.
Surrealist
  • #2,747
  • Jan 13, 2017 2:20am Jan 13, 2017 2:20am
[quote=seanocon;9394897]Hi, I trade with XM.com, I am hoping to use a leverage of 888:1, I have been trading 2 years, profitable for the last 6 months, I use an extreme tight stop loss .....

I thought this thread was for those NOT using a stop loss .....
  • #2,748
  • Jan 13, 2017 3:56am Jan 13, 2017 3:56am
Quoting SalvatoreD
Many traders I've seen lost much due to the fact that didn't put a stoploss. There were different reasons and they are justified. For example, a large volatility... But my opinion is that you'd try to protect yourself. Sometimes it's possible to hope for own nerves and sit in front of a computer.
Sure, it is very dangerous to trade with out a stop loss IF you use a large lot size and do not have a large account size. It is all money management, but that has been well and truly discussed in the 130+ pages up to here.
It is very easy to calculate potential drawdowns using a spreadsheet for each trade, and do not forget to include the swap !
  • #2,749
  • Mar 7, 2017 7:00pm Mar 7, 2017 7:00pm
Show me a trader that consistently uses stop loss and I'll show you a trader that consistently loses. HA!
  • #2,750
  • Mar 8, 2017 2:01am Mar 8, 2017 2:01am
Quoting SalvatoreD
Many traders I've seen lost much due to the fact that didn't put a stoploss. There were different reasons and they are justified. For example, a large volatility... But my opinion is that you'd try to protect yourself. Sometimes it's possible to hope for own nerves and sit in front of a computer.
Absolutely! During the hours of high volatility, prices move one way than another. Stop loss give some sense of protection to the trader and helps to reduce emotions from trading.
  • #2,751
  • Mar 8, 2017 9:22pm Mar 8, 2017 9:22pm
Quoting wattsema
{quote} Absolutely! During the hours of high volatility, prices move one way than another. Stop loss give some sense of protection to the trader and helps to reduce emotions from trading.
Sure but it's a totally false sense of protection that never works. Let me put it this way: If you need to use a stop loss, you should not be trading real money because it means you have no idea how to trade successfully.
  • #2,752
  • Mar 9, 2017 2:53am Mar 9, 2017 2:53am
Quoting GoodOlJoe
{quote} Sure but it's a totally false sense of protection that never works. Let me put it this way: If you need to use a stop loss, you should not be trading real money because it means you have no idea how to trade successfully.

Lol i really don't know where you got this absurd opinion. So, anyone who uses a stop loss has no idea how to trade? Thats a pretty bold statement.

do you think every one has the time to sit at their computers and nurse a single trade for hours?
you can not expect every one to trade the same way you do because you don't know the parameters that surround another person's trading method, system and style.
A wise and risk cautious trader would always determine the risk of taking a particular trade before even pulling the trigger. How else can you limit the risk of exposure in the market?
say you a have an EURUSD short and all of a sudden, Trump drops an unforseen twitter bomb that begins to tank the dollar in seconds..... a person with a fixed stop loss would be stopped out for a small loss (which he comfortably set and accepted before hand) .... while the person without the stop loss may be replying a quick comment on FF at the time..... only to open the charts and see the price has gone so far against them before they had the chance to manually close the position... and note that, the price may not always come back ... no real trader should count on that.


people that complain about stop losses are those who don't actually know how to use it ..... those who think that using tight SL like 3 pips or 5 pips is the best way to minimize risk (mostly because they are over leveraging their positions)


either ways, i think News traders would be the ones to favour the idea of not using a stop loss, due to broker manipulations like spread widening or one of those other theories being tossed around...

to each his own ....
  • #2,753
  • Mar 9, 2017 2:58am Mar 9, 2017 2:58am
I also do not use physical stops but I have a mental stop like when market gets here I trim down or exit.

Trading without stop-loss even a mental one will not work long term. Or are you really willing to bet your wealth on a single trade? You have to have deep trust in your crystal ball then
  • #2,754
  • Mar 9, 2017 3:10am Mar 9, 2017 3:10am
Quoting realclout
I tend to trade without a stop loss. generally I am monitoring my trades as they happen so i'm not worried about having a stop loss, if a trade goes against me I am working on cutting it as soon as possible. In situations where I am not monitoring my trades I want to start implementing a stop loss just in case to protect my funds. my problem with stop losses is that you can get stopped out & they trade can go your way so you end up losing money even though you were right & possibly having to re-enter due to having a stop loss
Yes, thats what I meant. Intraday fluctuations can be costly when fixed physical stop order is used but you have to be able to distinguish whether it is market crashing or just normal rotation
  • #2,755
  • Edited 4:27am Mar 9, 2017 3:46am | Edited 4:27am
Most traders in hedge funds use stop losses. I know that because I found some very effective stop hunting strategies.
  • #2,756
  • Mar 9, 2017 4:11am Mar 9, 2017 4:11am
Definitely always use a stop loss.
  • #2,757
  • Mar 9, 2017 5:23am Mar 9, 2017 5:23am
Quoting GoodOlJoe
{quote} Sure but it's a totally false sense of protection that never works. Let me put it this way: If you need to use a stop loss, you should not be trading real money because it means you have no idea how to trade successfully.
Well I feel that’s your way of seeing things. I use stop loss with a different perspective. I believe there’s no harm if try to manage my risk by using stop loss. I agree that stop loss doesn’t guarantee profits but it makes me feel confident.
I hope you are doing well without using stop loss. Good luck for your trading!
  • #2,758
  • Mar 9, 2017 5:37am Mar 9, 2017 5:37am
For me, it’s quite impossible to trade in Forex market without using this poplar trading tool! Because, I am a scalper and usually I use my TP positions for 20-30 pips, so for these short trading targets I can’t take 100% risk of my trading capital! Even, I always try to use logical stop loss trade position in my trading! Trading without stop loss trading tool is too much risky!
  • #2,759
  • Mar 9, 2017 6:08am Mar 9, 2017 6:08am
Stop loss doesn’t matter at all if we already have good money management in order, it matters only when we aren’t having good levels of money management. So, it’s our pick whether we go with right level of money management or stop loss, as one of these are absolutely necessary, and it’s not possible to succeed without it. I don’t use stop loss but higher level of money management.
  • #2,760
  • Mar 18, 2017 6:42am Mar 18, 2017 6:42am
Stop loss is not made for balancing a bad money management.
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