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  • #1,821
  • Jun 14, 2015 12:39am Jun 14, 2015 12:39am
Wow! I should have checked in here earlier. I have seen tremendous activity on my feed with this thread, but I am not a harmonics traders, so I did not look in until I could no longer resist that a large chuck of my FF buddies were posting here. Great thread Scott!

Chris, congrats on the gig.
If you are good at something, never do it for free--Joker
  • #1,822
  • Jun 14, 2015 5:27am Jun 14, 2015 5:27am
Quoting Davit
I am going to post my Christmas tree template and my thinking behind my shorts Price is still under my wave on H4 which is my main trading TF RSI is in the middle showing great deal of hesitation to push higher. fractals showing road blocks and there are nothing but behavioral change in market usually extreme impulse move hence long tails. And finally looks like typical 123 pattern often happening in harmonics Trades are 25% invested however I reserved 75 trading power to add to my shorts should price reach 24+ My goal is 500pips gain from multiple...
Davit,

You may find this article interesting as it resembles your strategy closely with, BB, Fib Extensions, Price action and MACD.

Link
  • #1,823
  • Jun 14, 2015 5:30am Jun 14, 2015 5:30am
Good article for those wanting to learn Fib Extensions.

Link
  • #1,824
  • Jun 14, 2015 6:07am Jun 14, 2015 6:07am
I find the below a lot around FF. Some traders are able to identify a pattern in replacement of the indicators (through screen time) while others are less so. I think the biggest issue for traders for establishing a position is to understand the greatest level of probability for where the liquidity will reside based on previous areas, understand that the market needs liquidity to move and will run from liquidity pool to liquidity pool, understand when a liquidity has been used and failed. I think then use which ever tool suites your purpose around these areas to establish your strategy around price patterns or indicators for entries and profit.

Ignorant, narrow-minded and indicator-cursing
Traders are super ignorant and when it comes to indicators, traders found their public enemy number 1. Traders see indicators as inferior and lagging, while praise price action as the magic bullet without ever thinking about what they actually are.

Yes, indicators are based on calculations of past price, but what is a candle or price pattern? Anything that is left from current price is history and shows the past which makes candle patterns or price formations lagging as well.

However, this ignorant behavior just serves as a metaphor for the general narrow-minded approach traders bring to the table, or their trading charts. It doesnt matter whether you trade price action, candle formations, indicators or trade purely fundamental money can be made many ways. But walking around like an ignorant jerk is a sign of a pure amateur trader.
  • #1,825
  • Jun 14, 2015 6:11am Jun 14, 2015 6:11am
Another truism for Sunday

Cutting losing trades when they come back to 0
Research shows that traders cut winners, while hold losing trades – the opposite what common sense would tell you what to do. But to top it all off, many traders will hold losing trades and exit the trade as soon as it comes back to their entry. If you see yourself managing your trades this way, you are not trading anymore, but hoping and gambling.
  • #1,826
  • Jun 14, 2015 6:12am Jun 14, 2015 6:12am
Thats my Sunday rant. Sorry Scott
  • #1,827
  • Jun 14, 2015 6:20am Jun 14, 2015 6:20am
Quoting jmn5611
Wow! I should have checked in here earlier. I have seen tremendous activity on my feed with this thread, but I am not a harmonics traders, so I did not look in until I could no longer resist that a large chuck of my FF buddies were posting here. Great thread Scott! Chris, congrats on the gig.
It's mostly just me getting drunk and rocking out but welcome...

Although, people do post some cool charts here once in a while.

Thanks and feel free to post as the point is that the market is harmonic(whatever word you want to use), so any chart has to be harmonic...
The world you desire can be won. It exists.. it is real.. it is possible..
  • #1,828
  • Edited 6:49am Jun 14, 2015 6:35am | Edited 6:49am
Quoting squawk
I find the below a lot around FF. Some traders are able to identify a pattern in replacement of the indicators (through screen time) while others are less so. I think the biggest issue for traders for establishing a position is to understand the greatest level of probability for where the liquidity will reside based on previous areas, understand that the market needs liquidity to move and will run from liquidity pool to liquidity pool, understand when a liquidity has been used and failed. I think then use which ever tool suites your purpose around...
Yeah fishing thread!

It's why I started my own thread. Mostly an attitude thing around here but also a quality thing....

Not big on indicators and like to focus on price and pa but point taken that some indicators in particular can and are used in harmonic trading approaches. And of course, we are trading a probable future based on the past so whatever works....Hmmm...lot more to be said on this topic, but not really prepared to delve into it....But feel free to share.

My problem with indicators and ff is mostly this: You can post a chart that shows where you are interested in buying or selling or even a live trade here, and seems mostly no one cares. You know why? Because it's hard work. You need to figure it out for yourself. Most people here would rather a signal to buy or sell with no chart(or really any reason other than they said so), or some system with lots of indicators that tells them where to buy or sell. You know why? Because it's easy. Doesn't matter if it works or if it makes sense, it's easy. And they can't blame themselves when it doesn't work. Win-win. Or is it lose-lose?

Edit: My favorite ff method and I almost forgot! Talk a big game, never post a chart or make any sense, but randomly enter a trend and keep posting results until.......
Attached Image
The world you desire can be won. It exists.. it is real.. it is possible..
  • #1,829
  • Jun 14, 2015 7:12am Jun 14, 2015 7:12am
Quoting Mr. Scott
{quote} Yeah fishing thread! It's why I started my own thread. Mostly an attitude thing around here but also a quality thing.... Not big on indicators and like to focus on price and pa but point taken that some indicators in particular can and are used in harmonic trading approaches. And of course, we are trading a probable future based on the past so whatever works....Hmmm...lot more to be said on this topic, but not really prepared to delve into it....But feel free to share. My problem with indicators and ff is mostly this: You can...
I totally agree Scott. I think no one cares that much because I believe when it is our own Analysis we are more closely aligned with what we are thinking and the whole thought process that has gone into the idea. For instance when evaluating a level and potential position a whole lot of thought process goes behind that thinking, the risk, the likely hood that the pricing below also represents a pattern of return, inter-market analysis and price pattern reaction to the level etc. So that becomes very personal and although we have gone through all the thought process around the analysis of the position the chart tells a fraction of our story behind the process when we post our idea. With an indicator is used it's very clear what the trader is thinking and all becomes very if then else which is easy for the brain to process from someone who has not come up with the idea.

So any idea just becomes the random distribution of the probability of your trade setup with PA or indicator. For instance the last Kiwi pattern setup I know from a probability standpoint has a very strong probability of continuation with the pattern instead of returning of the mean. Of course the trade success will still be dependent on many things and the timing of that pattern in relation to a possible dollar reversal may have a big effect so just becomes a random distribution for the success of the idea. But the point I am making is personal as I have done lots of data collecting on particular setups so its a more personable chart setup and the indicator will not identify the pattern just the average.

Another Rant

I haven't used indicators on a regular basis for many years but may bring one up one now and then as a stop confirmation such as ATR which at the end of the day is just a range reversal. Other people trade indicators well as they get to understand the intricacies that represent the price action below and allow clear rules for entries and exits which can be a good thing for risk management.

At the end of the day we all need to trade just the great setups and leave the shit behind.
  • #1,830
  • Jun 14, 2015 7:14am Jun 14, 2015 7:14am
Quoting Mr. Scott
{quote} Edit: My favorite ff method and I almost forgot! Talk a big game, never post a chart or make any sense, but randomly enter a trend and keep posting results until....... {image}
This paragraph taken from some where else is true. Everyone likes to sound intelligent in finance.

When you listen to traders talking they throw around technical terms and sound really smart: VIX, implied volatility, DJIA Fractal match, XLV Call Ratio Spread, Adverse Excursion, intermarket analysis, Asset Swapped Convertible Option Transaction, Risk-Adjusted Return On Capital

But when it comes to actual trading, traders dont walk their talk. Even worse, it seems that traders forget to use their common sense and lose all sanity as soon as they start their trading platform. We summarized the 9 biggest common sense trading fails for you.
  • #1,831
  • Jun 14, 2015 7:26am Jun 14, 2015 7:26am
Quoting squawk
{quote} This paragraph taken from some where else is true. Everyone likes to sound intelligent in finance. When you listen to traders talking they throw around technical terms and sound really smart: VIX, implied volatility, DJIA Fractal match, XLV Call Ratio Spread, Adverse Excursion, intermarket analysis, Asset Swapped Convertible Option Transaction, Risk-Adjusted Return On Capital But when it comes to actual trading, traders dont walk their talk. Even worse, it seems that traders forget to use their common sense and lose all sanity as soon as...
Drives me bananas! Soon as I hear jargon, I tune out....Figure they are posing or trying to hide something...

My response was always, that's great, now tell me why I want to buy or sell.....

Great posts! No gold star but you get:

Inserted Video
The world you desire can be won. It exists.. it is real.. it is possible..
  • #1,832
  • Jun 14, 2015 7:35am Jun 14, 2015 7:35am
Quoting Mr. Scott
{quote} Drives me bananas! Soon as I hear jargon, I tune out....Figure they are posing or trying to hide something... My response was always, that's great, now tell me why I want to buy or sell..... Great posts! No gold star but you get: https://youtu.be/gcZPWkNY6x8
Got to go see you Scott but will leave you with this, agree or disagree at the end of the day FIB is just an indicator with probabilities.
  • #1,833
  • Jun 14, 2015 9:02am Jun 14, 2015 9:02am
Quoting rythmrig
{quote} Sure here you go mate. Make sure the indicators are loaded into the downloads folder of MT4 or the template won't show the indicator loaded multiple times. {file} {file} {file} {file} {file}
thanQ
"You Never Know.....Until You Find Out."
  • #1,834
  • Jun 14, 2015 11:56am Jun 14, 2015 11:56am
Quoting squawk
{quote} Davit, You may find this article interesting as it resembles your strategy closely with, BB, Fib Extensions, Price action and MACD. Link
Thanks Squawk
Interesting method.My BB method is mix of Kathy Lien and Raghee Horner's 34EMA method.
I specially like Raghee style of trading.She has many videos on youtube.On trading even taking above 200MA buy below Sell is profitable.Problem is for most people is discipline to apply and same for many systems even Vegas tunnel is profitable.
Regards
In trading, you have to be defensive and aggressive at the same time
  • #1,835
  • Edited 12:27pm Jun 14, 2015 12:02pm | Edited 12:27pm
Quoting squawk
{quote} Got to go see you Scott but will leave you with this, agree or disagree at the end of the day FIB is just an indicator with probabilities.
Agree! In strong fundamentally driven trend like Euro fall from 1.39 to 105 without much correction.Had someone waited I am sure would of blown many accounts.
I may be minority in this but do think keeping with fundamentals is important part of trading.People who say "Everything is on the chart" forget simple truth that everything is true at that second but may change in 5min!! Example NZD interest rate drop and GN shoot up 700pips!! Please don't tell me that Charts predicted the IR cut prior of release!Simply incorrect.Charts are by product of past PA.That's the simple truth.
In trading, you have to be defensive and aggressive at the same time
  • #1,836
  • Jun 14, 2015 1:41pm Jun 14, 2015 1:41pm
Quoting Davit
....Charts are by product of past PA.That's the simple truth.
So what do you use as a present information to trade if past PA is not good for you? All what you have on your charts, such as indicators: RSI, BB..., is based on past PA. You have no control of market makers interpretation of fundamental data and timing when they are going to apply their interpretation....they might delay, ignore for time being, whatever...your interpretation of fundamental data might be correct in right or wrong time...

Help me to understand what you wanted to say exactly.
There is a winner and a loser, nothing in between.
  • #1,837
  • Jun 14, 2015 2:02pm Jun 14, 2015 2:02pm
Quoting buytosell
{quote} So what do you use as a present information to trade if past PA is not good for you? All what you have on your charts, such as indicators: RSI, BB..., is based on past PA. You have no control of market makers interpretation of fundamental data and timing when they are going to apply their interpretation....they might delay, ignore for time being, whatever...your interpretation of fundamental data might be correct in right or wrong time... Help me to understand what you wanted to say exactly.
Hi
I think you misunderstood my post.I use indicators obviously but also keep up with fundamentals.One does not necessarily exclude the other.Its important to see the market whole NEWS,EVENTS dictates most daily range fundamentals weekly monthly mostly.
My argument is mostly against pure tech traders who say everything is on the chart and refuse even to read news events.That's simply not smart.Had you shorted GN prior of interest rate cut you would of been 700+pips in a hole!Think about that....before responding
In trading, you have to be defensive and aggressive at the same time
  • #1,838
  • Jun 14, 2015 2:30pm Jun 14, 2015 2:30pm
Quoting Davit
{quote} Hi I think you misunderstood my post.I use indicators obviously but also keep up with fundamentals.One does not necessarily exclude the other.Its important to see the market whole NEWS,EVENTS dictates most daily range fundamentals weekly monthly mostly. My argument is mostly against pure tech traders who say everything is on the chart and refuse even to read news events.That's simply not smart.Had you shorted GN prior of interest rate cut you would of been 700+pips in a hole!Think about that....before responding
I actually agree with you Davit but charts do seem to predict the news quite a lot

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Free speech is an oxymoron
  • #1,839
  • Edited 4:58pm Jun 14, 2015 4:48pm | Edited 4:58pm
Quoting Tom_D_Trader
{quote} MS brutalpaint analysis again. This is about how I imagine the move. Hope it works edit: + EU {image} {image}
Quoting Tom_D_Trader
{quote} Yeh, charts very broken, unloading all intraday trades in loss.. holding just micro gold and GU. So I call it a week. Have a nice weekend, T
Hi guys, was actually lying, as holding also some EUs, but only a few and loaded up here so. Regarding my summer plan, this is the third chart. Think I wont be trading that much now as made some cash and intraday very exhausting. Just need those runner targets hit and am ok. Regarding those Xau stops on chart, may move them below that yellow weekly down there for market overshoot, but hoping it wont be necessarry. Good luck this week,

edit: Sry, thats intraweek target. Runner target for summer is 1244, will post chart.
edit: Yes, am very concerned by that LL, but consider it monthly 1166 test and hold. There was a very strong rejection down there, so could be valid monthly move starting and continue to test 1244.

T
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"I know one thing, that I know nothing." Sokrates
  • #1,840
  • Jun 14, 2015 5:06pm Jun 14, 2015 5:06pm
Quoting Banzaisky
{quote} I actually agree with you Davit but charts do seem to predict the news quite a lot {image} {image}
Hi Banzaisky
If we take this strictly as business and people who are serious about trading do take it as such then wouldn't you want to know information (news,impact events) regarding the very product you are trading?
That's just common sense.Yes Charts do often go with direction of news events but do also go opposite as well.In my opinion anything that can influence Price is relevant.
Anyway don't want to get carried away about this.People who understand this understand its significance.
regards
In trading, you have to be defensive and aggressive at the same time
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