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  • #974,441
  • Mar 26, 2015 3:58pm Mar 26, 2015 3:58pm
Quoting Zappa
{quote} Well, no, my version of "all in" is slightly different than yours.
Ya all in should never be more than 10% that's for sure, think Livermoore outlined that, and he had experience as a big swinger that's for sure hahaha. Aggressive trader as well who sometimes lost the battle to the greedy demon inside
  • #974,442
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:01pm Mar 26, 2015 4:01pm
Quoting Ck87
{quote} Ya all in should never be more than 10% that's for sure, think Livermoore outlined that, and he had experience as a big swinger that's for sure hahaha. Aggressive trader as well who sometimes lost the battle to the greedy demon inside
All in for me is risking 4%. That is the max. 10% is still crazy, IMO.
  • #974,443
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:03pm Mar 26, 2015 4:03pm
Quoting Zappa
{quote} I know its not big, but it seems to be big for this website where everyone is playing with 500$ accounts or demos (lol). I start out small and add size as trade moves in my way, ONLY when I can move the stop closer. This has worked very well for me. And 20 lots is HUGE compared to what I used to trade with!
$500 accts and demos one and the same thing since both orders don't see light of the day ... and agree on opinions from someone trading big lots carries more weight than nano-lots.
Hear the music before the song is over ...
  • #974,444
  • Edited 6:02pm Mar 26, 2015 4:05pm | Edited 6:02pm
Quoting Zappa
{quote} All in for me is risking 4%. That is the max. 10% is still crazy, IMO.
5%-10% is more accepted for smaller bankrolls, but around 5% should be the max for most trades and traders , agree.

But you know this also depends, if the trade is just your average once a week once a month trade, fine. But personally, on a big long term move, say like someone who was bearish on the euro at 1.37-1.4 levels and was planning to see way lower than 1.3 long term, that guy risking 10% on that if the risk reward is 4:1 if the person has 70-80% win rate, he will do very well.
  • #974,445
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:05pm Mar 26, 2015 4:05pm
Quoting gatorinla
{quote} 0832 has still not been touched.. so while 0832 is untouched and a bounce happens a new chance to get in may develop.. 0942/53 may come back in asia {image}
many post the drawbacks of low liquidity in asian session and even franky . the beauty of them for me is the retrace can give a better price. i just think different right or wrong.. if i sell 40/50 pips higher in asia than london.. it seems better to me.
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #974,446
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:05pm Mar 26, 2015 4:05pm
Quoting GlobalMacro
{quote} $500 accts and demos one and the same thing since both orders don't see light of the day ... and agree on opinions from someone trading big lots carries more weight than nano-lots.
So you think someone trading big would lose time here...
  • #974,447
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:06pm Mar 26, 2015 4:06pm
Quoting GlobalMacro
{quote} $500 accts and demos one and the same thing since both orders don't see light of the day ... and agree on opinions from someone trading big lots carries more weight than nano-lots.
I was shorting the euro with 300 a point at 1.39 (with a big long term move in mind) and gbp at 1.7, NZD at 86-88 area, etc etc but my account was too small at the time and I got hit hard instead of making a fortune. Greedy demon defeated me on the big move from those levels, big mistake, but that's part of the journey.
With the Euro I was bearish 1.37+ and so I made tons of mistakes while they propped it higher
  • #974,448
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:09pm Mar 26, 2015 4:09pm
Quoting kenfen69
{quote} Mistakes made are the key to knowledge...particularly if they're your own. We make them until we die...but hopefully not the same ones! Well played, sir...keep it up!
pictures of sheep in the pm
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #974,449
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:11pm Mar 26, 2015 4:11pm
Quoting GlobalMacro
{quote} Agree with the premise of what you're saying Ken ... but size definitely matters , it affects execution and other things so it won't be the same ...
Execution...indeed! Which is why I said...if yer broker can handle 1000 lots. Meaning...execution shouldn't be a problem.

Other things? Well...again. If you play percentages...it removes the psychological impact of...fak...I'm 4k (whatever amount) in the hole just after spread!

I still struggle with the psychological part. I will only EVER do this for myself...no pressure of other people's money. But sometimes I lose my shit when looking at one of my larger accounts and see how much money is being played with RIGHT after entering a trade. Losses...not so much these days. If I've placed a loser...I'll be tripped out off of DD protections I have.

Winners...those I continue to struggle with! I'll see 5k (example) profit...and then I can freak out! Peach of an entry...but just cash it in, you greedy bastard! If I stuck to my plan...5 may have become 25.

Anyway...life goes on. We live...we love...we learn

Sorry...got lost there. I often do.
  • #974,450
  • Edited 6:05pm Mar 26, 2015 4:11pm | Edited 6:05pm
Quoting Zappa
{quote} WHat are you playing with (respectfully)?
I could tell you that but then I'd have to .... lol ...

No ... all I can say is this ... the dealing system I'm trading on isn't based on lots ... fair enough?
Hear the music before the song is over ...
  • #974,451
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:14pm Mar 26, 2015 4:14pm
Quoting gatorinla
{quote} many post the drawbacks of low liquidity in asian session and even franky . the beauty of them for me is the retrace can give a better price. i just think different right or wrong.. if i sell 40/50 pips higher in asia than london.. it seems better to me.
'

I am one of the proponents of not trading in liliquid times like NZD/AU session or Asia unless vol is above average on a monthly basis. But, I can see your point about markets drift and hit key reversal points or covering comes in like it did with USD/GBP a few weeks ago after that major sell off. I personally only look to London session to US close for my trades but you're right to each his own.
  • #974,452
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:16pm Mar 26, 2015 4:16pm
Quoting GlobalMacro
{quote} $500 accts and demos one and the same thing since both orders don't see light of the day ... and agree on opinions from someone trading big lots carries more weight than nano-lots.
We've seen an expected bounce from the lows in Crude, luckily for those who are bearish, it's back up in the low 50s..... this one is going to be a nice ride to 35..... these charts can speak for me Daily volume is bearish, get ready for the sell off to come...... I say high % trade to downside, but don't listen to me I'm a fool
Still think a spike higher can come, to around 53-54 area, no shot that can be out ruled and it's probably more likely than a direct fall from up here, but I think both are possible.
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  • #974,453
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:18pm Mar 26, 2015 4:18pm
Quoting GlobalMacro
{quote} I could tell that you but then I'd have to .... lol ... No ... all I can say is this ... the dealing system I'm trading on isn't based on lots ... fair enough?
haha great answer. I trade currency futures exclusively and I can say something similar in terms of size. I think though there are several traders here who have 7 digit sized accounts just in currency asset class. But as for bias towards who's opinions are important I rarely look at trading size. Simply because I have seen many guys build a huge account on a wild swing move that was sheer luck only to give it back slowly when true trading prowess comes into play during non trending months and terrible RR management.
  • #974,454
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:19pm Mar 26, 2015 4:19pm
Quoting GlobalMacro
{quote} I could tell that you but then I'd have to .... lol ... No ... all I can say is this ... the dealing system I'm trading on isn't based on lots ... fair enough?
Not to mention in the Daily cloud, Love using the cloud in my analysis these days
  • #974,455
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:22pm Mar 26, 2015 4:22pm
Quoting jplazard
{quote} ' I am one of the proponents of not trading in liliquid times like NZD/AU session or Asia unless vol is above average on a monthly basis. But, I can see your point about markets drift and hit key reversal points or covering comes in like it did with USD/GBP a few weeks ago after that major sell off. I personally only look to London session to US close for my trades but you're right to each his own.
if i get the level price i want, the time of day dont matter. even the spread is less a concern.. for instance at 0879 atm.. if asia prints a 0953.. its a better place for london to resume where it and u.s. left off.
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #974,456
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:24pm Mar 26, 2015 4:24pm
Quoting kenfen69
{quote} Execution...indeed! Which is why I said...if yer broker can handle 1000 lots. Meaning...execution shouldn't be a problem. Other things? Well...again. If you play percentages...it removes the psychological impact of...fak...I'm 4k (whatever amount) in the hole just after spread! I still struggle with the psychological part. I will only EVER do this for myself...no pressure of other people's money. But sometimes I lose my shit when looking at one of my larger accounts and see how much money is being played with RIGHT after entering a trade....
Riding them out longer is another tough battle for me as well. Like with oil now I plan for $35, I want to ride it out from up here, bad money management and trading too large makes that even worse. But my sell orders in coming days on Oil will have a Tp of $35 , will I be able to keep them till there if I'm right? We'll see haha.
  • #974,457
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:24pm Mar 26, 2015 4:24pm
Quoting Ck87
{quote} Definitely, and if you have a really big edge (say 60%-80% accuracy, which is clearly not easy as we know, there's nothing wrong with 5% drawdown in a well planned, bigger swing trade, with way higher risk reward).. I mean if you're going to be right 50% of the time on a 3:1 R/R , you're going to do pretty well And of course, you're not always limited to that, you can have 10:1 or more, and also add to positions if it's a big move, but gotta make sure that's managed properly well. It's an interesting debate though on what the max risk...
Yeah man...really well said!

Love it when people get it...even if some people don't understand the picture they paint...agree with why/how they paint it. Good for you, mate! You get it...

I get you!
  • #974,458
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:26pm Mar 26, 2015 4:26pm
Understandable. When I was exclusively shorting AUD a a few years back I only shifted to AU/US sessions for entry points. Now that I mainly focus on USD i only do US session usually.

I can tell though you have been around the block. For new traders I can see them getting unnerved by choppyness in these sessions where they will switch sides multiple times and rack up commissions.
  • #974,459
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:26pm Mar 26, 2015 4:26pm
Quoting kenfen69
{quote} Execution...indeed! Which is why I said...if yer broker can handle 1000 lots. Meaning...execution shouldn't be a problem. Other things? Well...again. If you play percentages...it removes the psychological impact of...fak...I'm 4k (whatever amount) in Winners...those I continue to struggle with! I'll see 5k (example) profit...and then I can freak out! Peach of an entry...but just cash it in, you greedy bastard! If I stuck to my plan...5 may have become 25.....
Exactly , managing winners is a lot more difficult and more important than managing losing trades ... especially if it's an outsized profit and you don't plan to cash it out or you have to continue trading ... that's a challenge right there that shouldn't be underestimated.
Hear the music before the song is over ...
  • #974,460
  • Mar 26, 2015 4:30pm Mar 26, 2015 4:30pm
Quoting jplazard
Understandable. When I was exclusively shorting AUD a a few years back I only shifted to AU/US sessions for entry points. Now that I mainly focus on USD i only do US session usually. I can tell though you have been around the block. For new traders I can see them getting unnerved by choppyness in these sessions where they will switch sides multiple times and rack up commissions.
and asia is the king of retrace with less chance of a new high/low. on retrace with trend some bargains can be found
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
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