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  • #3,441
  • Edited 4:07pm Jan 30, 2015 1:55pm | Edited 4:07pm
Quoting ssnetwork
Totally agree with this, I am a professional coder They already have the database, portal and withdrawal functions already built on the alpari website. if they want to edit it and call it kpmg portal its up to them, but there is no way it should take several weeks to complete. maximum 3 days And client money should not be used to pay for it. and the cost???? they already have the bloody data, website files etc.... so should not cost anything. A lot of unhappy people here. {quote}

u just phone them and bloody tell them this..they want 60k to do something u can do for a fraction of the cost..in theory
  • #3,442
  • Jan 30, 2015 1:56pm Jan 30, 2015 1:56pm
Anyways, if someone in the future is pulpiteering about segregated accounts and regulated brokers then I'll simply laugh in his/her face before I tell him/her where to plug these two...

These "top notch safety measures" are just making to lose you money in a more complex way. If you didn't lose while on the chart and would not lose at winding up process of the broker where your account was held, then a horde of government appointed clowns will take your assets as "cost of website developments" and ridicuously high "fees" and the remainder will be mixed with other "professional's" pool of money (which is in the negative now, that's why it needs yours).

Thanks, but I prefer losing it on the chart or by the simply disappearing broker. I have better things to do instead of waiting for 8-10 weeks before I get my 2 pennies from my pound.

Vive la Cyprus!
  • #3,443
  • Jan 30, 2015 2:00pm Jan 30, 2015 2:00pm
Thanks for that Cobra,

Looks like the only way to be heard is to complain to

https://www.gov.uk/government/organi...lvency-service

[email protected]
  • #3,444
  • Jan 30, 2015 2:07pm Jan 30, 2015 2:07pm
Quoting magicpips
I am literally appalled with this recent document that was published.So we're actually looking at 6-8 weeks may be 10 weeks,mother F..ERS
​Well, as I understand 6-8 weeks is only for setting up automated claims system. Since the estimate that they have about 60 thousand accounts with some money left and 22 thousands were actively trading last year, it will take a little longer to collect all the claims. Then they are going to deal with the negative balances to recover the missing funds. Since it is not very likely that many clients pay willingly KPMG will have to take them to court and seize their assets. It will also take time. I really hope you guys will get your money fast, but I have seen quite a few broker collapses and it took many months before the first pay out was made.
KPMG is trying to sell the business, but frankly in the current state Alpari UK is not a very great buy. Out of $99m $36m is lost on 15th. Prospective buyer needs to invest $30m which will be very difficult to recover. I think some sort of sale will be agreed in the process but only after all necessary haircuts to clients and creditors are applied.
Wookey
  • #3,445
  • Jan 30, 2015 2:26pm Jan 30, 2015 2:26pm
Quoting DonJoee
Anyways, if someone in the future is pulpiteering about segregated accounts and regulated brokers then I'll simply laugh in his/her face before I tell him/her where to plug these two... These "top notch safety measures" are just making to lose you money in a more complex way. If you didn't lose while on the chart and would not lose at winding up process of the broker where your account was held, then a horde of government appointed clowns will take your assets as "cost of website developments" and ridicuously high "fees" and the remainder will be...
​Segregated accounts protect you from broker's own problems. If a claim is made against your broker you know that the broker cannot use your money to pay it. It is forbidden to use this money for anything else except execution of your orders. Before segregation there used to be a lot of cases when brokers just spent clients money on their own needs and disappeared segregation mostly put an end to this in regulated markets. The last case I remember was PFG in the USA. But that was completely criminal activity from the management including falsified bank statements.
However, segregation does not protect you from losses incurred by other clients. If a client looses more than he has and refuses to pay back the burden falls on the broker, but if the broker does not have money it becomes insolvent and standard procedure of bankruptcy commence. Alpari has a hole of $36m on client accounts, but they have only about $13m of cash on their own account. So the total hole is about $23m which will increase after KPMG applies its fees. How much of this amount KPMG will be able to recover is difficult to say.
In any case unlike collapse of a Cyprus broker here all the retail clients will get their money back and even if KPMG cannot recover a penny the insurance will cover absolute majority of the haircut for all retail clients. The only question is time.
Wookey
  • #3,446
  • Jan 30, 2015 2:32pm Jan 30, 2015 2:32pm
Quoting wookey
{quote} ​Segregated accounts protect you from broker's own problems. If a claim is made against your broker you know that the broker cannot use your money to pay it. It is forbidden to use this money for anything else except execution of your orders. Before segregation there used to be a lot of cases when brokers just spent clients money on their own needs and disappeared segregation mostly put an end to this in regulated markets. The last case I remember was PFG in the USA. But that was completely criminal activity from the management including...
Well explained.
Never Ever Give Up!
  • #3,447
  • Jan 30, 2015 2:58pm Jan 30, 2015 2:58pm
Quoting wookey
​Segregated accounts protect you from broker's own problems.
I know what segregated account means. At least I thought I know. But I didn't know that I am liable for other client's losses, too. In my dictionary "segregated" means: none of anybody else's business. I allow the broker to deduct my losses and add my profits, but that's all.
  • #3,448
  • Jan 30, 2015 3:08pm Jan 30, 2015 3:08pm
http://leaprate.com/2015/01/leaprate...ned-in-detail/
  • #3,449
  • Jan 30, 2015 5:26pm Jan 30, 2015 5:26pm
gosh.several weeks just to complete setting up a claims portal. alpari UK should have all the clients accounts balances database in place .withdrawal procedures for those with closed positions and with positive balances as of 16 january should have started by now. are we living in 1995 .
the British accountancy system are recognized as the best there is and i still believe so ,maybe KPMG are exercising too much care here down to the last penny and clients dead or alive.in the end i still have hope those with positive balances will recover their monies back but just dont let them wait too long
  • #3,450
  • Jan 30, 2015 7:49pm Jan 30, 2015 7:49pm
Quoting DonJoee
{quote}I didn't know that I am liable for other client's losses
You are not. The broker assumes the negative balances if clients who are required to pay don't.
  • #3,451
  • Jan 30, 2015 9:56pm Jan 30, 2015 9:56pm
what i dont understand is something of a common sense....

the company cannot be sold as an whole... none would buy alpari as a whole... because actually what you buy is clients* + operational structure and licenses + brand ... and if you are an interesting party from within the industry you dont give a damn for a brand thats not only heavily negative but also can have royalties with it (i am almost sure the alpari brand name is not owned by them).... also the operational structure and licenses are of no concern because if you are already a broker you have them in place or you can work it out in order to have them in place on yourself (and at a lesser cost)...


SO the only meaningful thing to do is to sell the client base... for which i know and we are told that there are many interested parties... why this is not taking place????

has anyone talked with the administrators and asked that? i would be glad to hear why this is not their priority as it will make their life easier and more profitable





*incl. in that alpari japan which is the most sought asset (more than the rest of us....just in case you didnt know)
  • #3,452
  • Jan 30, 2015 11:14pm Jan 30, 2015 11:14pm
​I believe eventually it will be done. Essentially what you are suggesting is a breaking up the company and selling its assets. It is a good deal for you, but not so good deal for other creditors and shareholders. KPMG has to get their and the court agreement first. I am not a lawyer so can be mistaken, but I think normally the administrator has to try to save the company as a whole first before breaking it up. If Alpari did not fall into special administration the deal could have been negotiated pretty quickly between a buyer and current shareholders. In bankruptcy the whole process is slowed down by creditors many of whom want to have all their money back and think that they deserve to be the first in the queue. It may result in lengthy legal battle with eventually court decision which does not satisfy anyone.

Second thought is that it may not be so easy to sell the client's base in its current state. The Leaprate article is rightly pointing out that currently Alpari the buyer has to come up with $30m investments to cover the hole to resume operations. Considering the clients have about $90m and very likely at least half of them if not more is going to bail at the first opportunity it seems like a pretty raw deal for a potential buyer.

Saying that the client base is a very attractive piece for many brokers wanting to expand. But, my prediction is that it will be sold but only after most liabilities are written off or recovered in bankruptcy procedure.
Wookey
  • #3,453
  • Jan 31, 2015 12:09am Jan 31, 2015 12:09am
After going through different stages of grief I have finally arrived at the stage of acceptance. There is not much that can be done to speed up the process. If I do not get the entire amount of my account then I am not sure being a foreign citizdn if I can even get compensation from fsca. I guess it is time to move on and either quit or start from scratch. Either way it will be a step forward rather than just coming to a standstill.
  • #3,454
  • Jan 31, 2015 12:25am Jan 31, 2015 12:25am
Quoting wookey
​I believe eventually it will be done. Essentially what you are suggesting is a breaking up the company and selling its assets. It is a good deal for you, but not so good deal for other creditors and shareholders. KPMG has to get their and the court agreement first. I am not a lawyer so can be mistaken, but I think normally the administrator has to try to save the company as a whole first before breaking it up.
because we are talking of a company in a sector with no real tangible assets...we can assume fairly that the only "tangible" assets of the company is that of the client base who are in positive area.

so 99% (leaving 1% just out of a good will gesture) chances are that if the company is broken and sold in that way the "commission" for each client sold will make a good deal for the creditors and others on the line to get a good deal out of their debts.

especially if you take in the account that there are clients in negative and the majority of the loses are with a few of them then the process could be made a lot easier for all of us owed by the company (let it be clients, creditors etc)....

the issue i feel KPMG is now facing is that they dont have (still) a clear picture of whats going on with the company on the client side, and also because their first task is to sell the company as a whole before starting to explore break and sell "opportunities"...

on the other hand all the "vulture" brokers on the line dont want to mess with all the company, just want to get what makes sense for them and of course its the client.

especially in a market where REAL customer acquisition costs are extremely high...this actually for them is an opportunity...instead of paying high costs in getting someone to sign up for them go through their demo and at the end if they are lucky get him actually trading... they have a pool of "active/actual customers/traders" ready to enter "the game" and for them to milk them/earn out of them...

but as i mentioned above i believe KPMG is still evaluating the company, want (as per standard usual process) exploring how to sell the whole company and earn its big fat check (which is not unfair)... but also this means that timewise is a lengthy process
  • #3,455
  • Jan 31, 2015 1:03am Jan 31, 2015 1:03am
I read somewhere in an article that Alpari UK made a profit of US 750 000-00 last month.

If this is true then why not ask for a loan to get the business going. Surely any profitable business have the ability to re pay a loan.
Up to now nothing has been said regarding that. Why would you just give up ?
Never Ever Give Up!
  • #3,456
  • Jan 31, 2015 1:40am Jan 31, 2015 1:40am
after all the waiting and depression.. i think im ok with it if they decided to pay back 80% of my positive account
ill get it back in few trading days.. but not 50% for sure!
  • #3,457
  • Jan 31, 2015 1:54am Jan 31, 2015 1:54am
Quoting Mroue26
after all the waiting and depression.. i think im ok with it if they decided to pay back 80% of my positive account ill get it back in few trading days.. but not 50% for sure!
maybe ok with you not with me or others , why we need to accept that from them we need to ask for interest because they hold our money for that long also some compensation for some her on the thread is suffering because the trading is main income for them. please keep your idea for your self and if they offer to you this kind of offer you accept or reject this up to u
  • #3,458
  • Jan 31, 2015 2:12am Jan 31, 2015 2:12am
Quoting msu1
{quote} maybe ok with you not with me or others , why we need to accept that from them we need to ask for interest because they hold our money for that long also some compensation for some her on the thread is suffering because the trading is main income for them. please keep your idea for your self and if they offer to you this kind of offer you accept or reject this up to u
im 100% sure that our funds will not be paid in full..
we will wait and wait and keep waiting untill they settle everything up and after they will take the BILL of getting our money from OUR accounts...
  • #3,459
  • Jan 31, 2015 2:32am Jan 31, 2015 2:32am
Quoting ssnetwork
Totally agree with this, I am a professional coder They already have the database, portal and withdrawal functions already built on the alpari website. if they want to edit it and call it kpmg portal its up to them, but there is no way it should take several weeks to complete. maximum 3 days And client money should not be used to pay for it. and the cost???? they already have the bloody data, website files etc.... so should not cost anything. A lot of unhappy people here. {quote}
If it really is the case(portal can be built within short time)

should we ask them for the design details and the costs involved, so to protect our interests?
  • #3,460
  • Jan 31, 2015 2:52am Jan 31, 2015 2:52am
I think that just a few people still have positive balance.
They don't give a shit.
You are at bottom of the list (I hope...)
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