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Sonic R. System

  • #77,541
  • Nov 14, 2014 1:37pm Nov 14, 2014 1:37pm
Quoting forexTN14
{quote} Dont close, just let it till next week. For sure it will goin down.
The situation is the worst indeed but I don`t think "for sure" can be used in this market because we can never know and now that they started moving big we can know the least.
Rather stick to the classic the use of trailing stops may be a good idea but if the price goes directly in the red no stop will be put so one stop loss at the wanted risk would be a good idea.
Everything happens for a reason...
  • #77,542
  • Nov 14, 2014 1:51pm Nov 14, 2014 1:51pm
EURUSD and Market Comment: Stop Loss

I was not around to see the "second stage" ignite and put things into orbit. I have been reading comments about SLs. SLs are not my strong point. Maybe they should be. But don't forget that even a SL might cost you a lot more than you bargained for. Why? When price moves fast, like it did during the first stage "blast off" the price can "skip" your SL and "land" somewhere many/dozens/hundreds of pips beyond. In some situations, the "landing" price may be so atrocious that your entire account is wiped out at that instant of "landing".

Of course, in a situation like that, having a SL is no worse than not having one. The point is, that having a SL might not prevent something worse than you bargained for. Certainly most of the time this outrageous price manipulation does not occur. But, when big profits are at hand, it can. And it shows that big profits or small, the Robber Banks are in control. Market pricing is not based on "supply and demand" except for the fact that it refers to the necessity for a supply of traders that can be robbed and a demand by those Robber Banks controlling market prices to be able to legally steal from them. A "free" market? Yep. A market where the Robber Banks/MMs are free to steal to their hearts delight.

-tah
  • #77,543
  • Nov 14, 2014 2:44pm Nov 14, 2014 2:44pm
Quoting traderathome
In other words, prices really have not gone anywhere. These Robber Banks/MMs have simply manipulated them for the sake of their own "close of week" profits. And maybe they will leave prices where it will be easy for them to start anew next week making profits.
so we are looking for a week opening with a huge "sell out"..correct?
  • #77,544
  • Nov 14, 2014 3:33pm Nov 14, 2014 3:33pm
Quoting KecoaKecil
{quote} Well i got it right, but I DID NOT CUT @NY OPEN BECAUSE I TAKE SOME FLU MEDICINE AND SLEEP. And now i got trapped on the most greedy US robber bank dirty scheme! F#@*!% {image}
What about the idea to set a TP near the last low then you can sleep. I used also a break even EA.
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  • #77,545
  • Nov 14, 2014 3:35pm Nov 14, 2014 3:35pm
Quoting Bernhard
{quote} What about the idea to set a TP near the last low then you can sleep. I used also a break even EA.
i agree..ive come to realize one of the worst things we can do as traders is think the price will come back to us.
many times it doesn't, and wipes you out.
YOUR MOTHERS ASS
  • #77,546
  • Nov 15, 2014 2:21am Nov 15, 2014 2:21am
hai TAH.. i have a question... if we enter the market or make a position.. i must stay at the monitor or im make TP & SL and leave the monitor.. its make me confuse.. because im entry use m15.. easy to change the trend.. thx for your answer...

AT
  • #77,547
  • Nov 15, 2014 1:06pm Nov 15, 2014 1:06pm
Just landed on the forum a few days ago and I'm just doing my "homework". I'm yet far away to completely finishing it, then to completely understand it. However, I believe I'm making some progress, therefore I'd like to express my gratitude to all the folks contributing to the creation and improvement of SonicR system as well as gathering all the essential information in easy to read, well documented guides. And I don't want to forget all of you who keep this thread alive.
  • #77,548
  • Edited Nov 16, 2014 8:49am Nov 15, 2014 9:27pm | Edited Nov 16, 2014 8:49am
How the Market Really Works!....Thieves Manipulate the Prices!....How to Trade it!

Sonicers,

I post this picture again, a little revised, with the hope that the "lesson" will sink in.

We cannot know how the price will move next. Why? It is because the Robber Banks/MMs have control of the price. They have all the money needed and the will to use it whenever there are great opportunities for them to rob others. Deviations from anticipated PA (price action), as shown in the picture, represent to one degree or another what can happen at any time, with any setup.

No indicator, amount of indicators or combinations of indicators is sufficient to handle such price manipulation for profit by the Robber Banks/MMs, which can happen at any time, with any setup, to some degree or another. This bears repeating and remembering!

So, how do we trade? As I see it we do these following things:

1. Only trade proper setups.

Two decisions traders make that are foolish and costly are: A) believing they know how price will move next, and B) betting "the farm" on it either right away, or by adding "in the red" while still believing they know how price will move next. Stick to trading only proper setups.


2. Set Initial Stop Loss Reasonably.

Initially, set a SL based on the PA wave being traded or based on an obvious local S&R area that is within, or close to the PA wave. Whether you "hard" set it (pending order) or have it as a mental SL is up to you. If you have it as a mental SL, then obey it!


3. Set Initial Target Reasonably.

Initially, set the TP at a prominent S&R level that is within the Day range. Never mind how many or how few pips away it is, just so long as the pips are sufficient to warrant the trade.


4. Manage the SL

Move the SL to BE+ (Break Even or more) once PA breaks and then retraces to a local S&R that seemingly holds the price from retracing further. Then, with each successive move thru another local S&R that successfully holds the price, move the SL to just before the previous S&R. Let me also comment that I cannot see the value in using a "Trailing Stop" because it will be out of sync with where the real S&R areas are.


5. Manage the TP.

If price becomes sluggish to reach your intended TP, then take profit sooner. If PA advancement becomes sluggish it might be because the MMs are controlling the price to allow more time for traders to enter the trade, so they can then reverse the price and stop hunt them! In other words, if PA becomes sluggigh do not "let your winners ride" just because your trade is green, has performed well up to now, and because you believe you know how the price will move next. It is better to take profit and then re-enter if price later continues the trade because you will likely give up fewer pips on re-entry than you will lose if price reverses to your SL.



As a final remark, let me add that I have never found a stop loss to be "user friendly". I have seldom used them. However, the more I witness how "user unfriendly" the market is, due to the thieving by the Robber Banks/MMs, I realize that it is not the SL's fault! In the balance of things, especially when we witness such unabashed thieving as shown in the attached picture and realize these thieves are in control of market pricing for all of our setups, maybe we can utilize the SL to our overall success. It is my observation that tight SLs work superbly well with great setups. The less great a setup is, the more likely it becomes that a tight SL will be hit. It is another reason to seek out - be patient and await - only the best setups to trade.

http://www.marctomarket.com/2014/11/...-bull-run.html

Comments Welcomed,
-tah
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  • #77,549
  • Nov 15, 2014 10:55pm Nov 15, 2014 10:55pm
Quoting traderathome
How the Market Really Works!....Thieves Manipulate the Prices!....How to Trade it! Sonicers, I post this picture again, a little revised, with the hope that the "lesson" will sink in. We cannot know how the price will move next. Why? It is because the Robber Banks/MMs have control of the price. They have all the money needed and the will to use it whenever there are great opportunities for them to rob others. Deviations from anticipated PA (price action), as shown in the picture, represent to one degree or another what can happen at any time, with...
PVRSA In this chart was bullish in the botton on this chart , with buy signals . check all these bars in the botton closing in the midle with high volume in this Support Zone. If you were short, you should be very carefull with that.
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Trading 24/h
  • #77,550
  • Nov 15, 2014 11:28pm Nov 15, 2014 11:28pm
Quoting traderathome
{quote} GBPUSD: iy3uuu, This is not a setup. The Dragon is flat and the PA wave you drew encompasses too much time. The PA wave needs to be local, well defined and smooth. There is no such thing currently. Moreover, there are important USD releases coming, which you would know if you were using the template as provided. In conjunction with those releases the MMs can turn price on a dime and drive it hard. It is no time to be recently entered into a trade! It is better to wait, watch and see how things go, right up to the moments of the release(s)....
Hi tah,Thank you for the comment. I was thinking about the usd news release too. I think i should go back and read somemore. Thanks Iy3uuu
  • #77,551
  • Edited 8:50am Nov 16, 2014 12:32am | Edited 8:50am
Quoting FxAndres
{quote} PVRSA In this chart was bullish in the botton on this chart , with buy signals . check all these bars in the botton closing in the midle with high volume in this Support Zone. If you were short, you should be very carefull with that. {image}
FxAndres,

From your chart you can see that once price made the low, until it started upwards again, the volume was nothing spectacular. To me, this is an indication that the MMs were laying back and letting everyone else do the trading - shorts vs longs - and their only interaction was probably to hold the price down below the 1/4 level to keep things looking bearish so there were be a lot more shorting by others, and to take the long side of short orders (closing their shorts and opening new longs). When the time came that the MMs saw sufficient shorting had been made - a lot of shorts to stop hunt - and it was their time to make their play, they started ramming the price back up. And as they ran the price back up, as others began to jump in long, they had the opportunity to close their longs and start shorting again. This is typical price manipulation. It got the price higher for resumption of shorting and the MMs made profits on the longs they invested in the pump up. Consider this: http://www.marctomarket.com/2014/11/...-bull-run.html

Now, the point I made was that if a trader is in a trade (example: short) and price movement down stalls out, as it did for shorters in this situation, then it is time to close the trade. If it was to continue down later, the trade could be resumed, and probably with giving up fewer pips gain due to re-entry as the price moves lower, than pips that would have been lost due to staying in and then having the trade reverse and go back up to a SL.

It is very easy to look back, see what there is to see, and then think to yourself that various things "obviously" pointed to what then later happened. But in real time, it isn't obvious. And anytime a trader thinks they know how the price will move next - when they can't - they are a step closer to real trouble. It is a matter of trading while accepting that we cannot know how the price will move next. And so I submitted some steps to take under that premise.

-tah
  • #77,552
  • Nov 16, 2014 1:20am Nov 16, 2014 1:20am
Quoting traderathome
{quote} FxAndres, From your chart you can see that once price made the low, until it started upwards again, the volume was nothing spectacular. To me, this is an indication that the MMs were laying back and letting everyone else do the trading - shorts vs longs - and their only interaction was probably to hold the price down below the 1/4 level to keep things looking bearish so there were be a lot more shorting by others, and to take the long side of short orders (closing their shorts and opening new longs). When the time came that the MMs saw sufficient...

Yes it is very complex to analyse in real time, but just the practice and the intuition of trader ill help to make decisions.

Trader life is a complex
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  • #77,553
  • Nov 16, 2014 11:19am Nov 16, 2014 11:19am
Quoting traderathome
Comments Welcomed, -tah {image}
My comments on the chart.

As a personal comment only take entries that appears and come from the edges of the two zones
in the chart either from demand or from supply. In between these 2 zones is the kill zone.

The marked Classic short was a short straight into demand. A big NO NO

H
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"The future is already written in the past"
  • #77,554
  • Edited 2:14pm Nov 16, 2014 1:23pm | Edited 2:14pm
Quoting hansma
{quote} My comments on the chart. As a personal comment only take entries that appears and come from the edges of the two zones in the chart either from demand or from supply. In between these 2 zones is the kill zone. The marked Classic short was a short straight into demand. A big NO NO H {image} {image}
hansma,

Your charting of "SC" is nonsense. You keep saying "SC" (Supply Consumed), but then you keep showing more Supply Consumed! Then you finally decide (and what basis for this is totally unknown) that now - now for sure - all "intermediate" supply is consumed and therefore price is going back to the top, where magically there is still some supply left there? How do we know that all "intermediate" supply was consumed? After saying six times that supply was consumed, how do we know that price might not need to waffle six more times to consume more "intermediate" supply? This is all nonsense based on looking at a chart AFTERWARDS. Even as the price is on this most recent move up there is no way to know at what level it will stop. We can't know that it has stopped going up! There are "supply" levels even higher, which are the "source" of a bigger move down that started earlier than your chart shows. How do we know that price might not proceed on up there? So, in that light, how do we know which "source" levels are those from only which we should take our trades? This is all nonsense! It is all half baked nonsense derived from looking at a chart AFTER THE FACT.

The simple truth is the MMs move price back and forth between historic S&R levels, however they damn well feel like based on where they see the greatest profits for themselves. There might or might not be demand when price returns to what you call a demand zone. There might not be supply when price returns to what you call a supply zone. And it really doesn't make any difference because though price moves back and forth between historic S&R levels, we can't ever know which direction price will be headed next, nor at what distant S&R area in that direction the price will land. What we can do is trade and manage proper setups as the Sonic R. System defines them.

For you to say "....only take entries that appears and come from the edges of.......demand or supply....(sources)...." is ridiculous! In the time span covered by your chat there were no less than ten Sonic R. opportunities! Ten! Not all starting in the LS, but nevertheless ranging from a minimum of almost 40 pips to over 100 pips!

I am still waiting for you to post your trades real time instead of posting stuff like this.

-tah
Attached Image
  • #77,555
  • Nov 16, 2014 4:20pm Nov 16, 2014 4:20pm
Hy, just like to share some of my notes of last friday... have a nice week trading.

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If you don't know how to earn money, don't loose it.
  • #77,556
  • Nov 16, 2014 6:14pm Nov 16, 2014 6:14pm
MMs sure are lively early in the morning - will be interesting to see what happened

GJ 10 minutes 60 pips up than 100 pips down UJ similar +40 -60
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Everything happens for a reason...
  • #77,557
  • Nov 16, 2014 6:20pm Nov 16, 2014 6:20pm
Quoting Bernhard
{quote} What about the idea to set a TP near the last low then you can sleep. I used also a break even EA.
Thank you for your suggestion, and it is the right one. However, from my experience (imho), you hardly can determine the "right" TP and SL lever for these MMs, but you can be sure they play the rate then take small profit every friday. Every 2nd week or 1st week of the month they take small-modest profit too. Yearly they take big profit every june-july, and november-december. I believe in timing (my opinion only, i can not give you proof). So in situation i got caught up, i either can 1) wait it up till next week, 2) fold. 3) Hedge with AUDUSD, or NZDUSD pair to counter negative swap. All in all the account still in the safe side. Give me time to do the calculation/simulation. Still, this leave a BITTER TASTE in my stomach.
Don't blame the tools. Blame the carpenter.
  • #77,558
  • Edited Nov 17, 2014 2:43am Nov 16, 2014 10:35pm | Edited Nov 17, 2014 2:43am
USDCAD Short Trade Open:

M15 Classic re-entry.

The M15 thru H4 trend is down. While it is not so clear on M15, M5-M1 show the AS MMs moved the price up on light activity, followed by higher activity at highs and coming down off of highs, indicating selling. Should this trade start to run, and stall before the TP, I am prepared to exit then, especially if this happens before the LS, because any pre-LS downside could be followed by a retrace manipulationo, so the LS MMs can also begin the week selling in the same price area (or higher than) where the AS MMs are selling right now.
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Edit:

Stopped out for loss of 16.5 pips average, 33 pips total.
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  • #77,559
  • Edited 3:47am Nov 17, 2014 2:57am | Edited 3:47am
USDCAD Long Trade Open:

M15 Classic entry.

Bad on me for trying an AS trade out of the gate in a new week. Okay, if this wants to go up, let's try for it that way.
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Edit: Moved SL up.....
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  • #77,560
  • Nov 17, 2014 3:01am Nov 17, 2014 3:01am
Quoting traderathome
USDCAD Long Trade Open: M15 Classic entry. Bad on me for trying an AS trade out of the gate in a new week. Okay, if this wants to go up, let's try for it that way. {image}
I am more confident now since you opened too the same position !

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