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Sonic R. System

  • #68,641
  • Apr 10, 2014 12:02pm Apr 10, 2014 12:02pm
I would like to show you my entries on EJ. MM drove prices up with low volume. In the area of resistance and half number we can notice higher activity and here MM got liquidity for his shorts. After NY opening we can notice that MM pumped and dumped . After green candle I took my scout with SL above last high.
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After "dump process" on M15 charts everything looks good for classic entry. We have PA and dragon angle down.
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any comments for my way of thinking?
  • #68,642
  • Edited 12:20pm Apr 10, 2014 12:07pm | Edited 12:20pm
Quoting sherdog
I would like to show you my entries on EJ. MM drove prices up with low volume. In the area of resistance and half number we can notice higher activity and here MM got liquidity for his shorts. After NY opening we can notice that MM pumped and dumped . After green candle I took my scout with SL above last high. {image} After "dump process" on M15 charts everything looks good for classic entry. We have PA and dragon angle down. {image} any comments for my way of thinking?
sherdog,

You might want to drop down and take a look at the 1M, as well before taking that classic. That may or may not give you more confidence in your trade. If you do take a trade it helps in getting a better price/entry.

Also 4hr supply/resistance zone and RDL.
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Keep It Simple
  • #68,643
  • Apr 10, 2014 12:15pm Apr 10, 2014 12:15pm
Quoting sherdog
I would like to show you my entries on EJ. MM drove prices up with low volume. In the area of resistance and half number we can notice higher activity and here MM got liquidity for his shorts. After NY opening we can notice that MM pumped and dumped . After green candle I took my scout with SL above last high. {image} After "dump process" on M15 charts everything looks good for classic entry. We have PA and dragon angle down. {image} any comments for my way of thinking?
By your charts, there is high volume at the lows-, which might indicate an established support line [for now.]

Even with the LL ahead of it, it could be a risky move.; and with it being after hours I would imagine a lot of ranging.

Perhaps wait for clear direction later on--see if it revisits the highs or lows again--I personally think it is going to go up before it goes down--but that's just me looking at my charts.
  • #68,644
  • Apr 10, 2014 12:33pm Apr 10, 2014 12:33pm
USD/JPY, good example of MM's slowly running price up from demand/support zone and then comes the dump;
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Keep It Simple
  • #68,645
  • Apr 10, 2014 12:34pm Apr 10, 2014 12:34pm
Quoting ElectroGypsy
{quote} I agree with Cigarguy on this. What bothers me more is you still haven't answered my question of why you stopped posting your PVSRA results every week. If you plot your results into chart form, the overall profitability of this concept you're teaching doesn't really show profitability. It shows you initially did well, hit a huge winning streak, lost EVERY CENT of profits you made, had another decent upwards slope, and then started moving south. I would not be surprised if you are actually in the negative after the DD from your GJ trades...
"JRissa only posts wins."

That's because I always win

Now seriously... I have evolved and using hedging frequently, so I make profit even when building position. I have demonstraded before how I hedge during building and I stopped showing all trades and all phases of trades simply because it's time consuming. I feel I have given much already helping others and still giving heads ups, guiding, teaching and simply sharing thoughts when I have free time. System works, so does PVSRA. I'm adding little something to mix these days and that something gives me my edge. It's shared also in this thread and linked by me yesterday last time

Live trade by me with this "something" added is posted yesterday in GU trade. Watch, read and learn
I know the secret...
  • #68,646
  • Apr 10, 2014 12:41pm Apr 10, 2014 12:41pm
Quoting JRissa
{quote} "JRissa only posts wins." That's because I always win Now seriously... I have evolved and using hedging frequently, so I make profit even when building position. I have demonstraded before how I hedge during building and I stopped showing all trades and all phases of trades simply because it's time consuming. I feel I have given much already helping others and still giving heads ups, guiding, teatching and simply sharing thoughts when I have free time. System works, so does PVSRA. I'm adding little something to mix these days and...
JRissa,

Yes indeed you have and are a great contributor. BTW, thanks again for that heads up on GU a few posts back. Scalped a quick +28 standard account, I'm just not a mega pips guy like you. I milk a few at a time.....
Keep It Simple
  • #68,647
  • Apr 10, 2014 2:21pm Apr 10, 2014 2:21pm
Hi JRissa

im curious lol

looking thru the past posts to find the added extra you had... the edge

can you tell us?

Caring is sharing lol

i do see your using supdom as in supply and demand which links in with pvsra
also i noticed one half of a pattern...could this be it?
  • #68,648
  • Edited 3:26pm Apr 10, 2014 2:23pm | Edited 3:26pm
Quoting JRissa
{quote} "JRissa only posts wins." That's because I always win Now seriously... I have evolved and using hedging frequently, so I make profit even when building position. I have demonstraded before how I hedge during building and I stopped showing all trades and all phases of trades simply because it's time consuming. I feel I have given much already helping others and still giving heads ups, guiding, teaching and simply sharing thoughts when I have free time. System works, so does PVSRA. I'm adding little something to mix these days and...
Congrats mate. I'm not trying to instigate a witch hunt or anything, but I think this thread just needs some truth is all. There's a lot of posturing that goes on here.

I've been in this market for a while now and run a few strategies. All these strategies are rather mechanical, which work well if you can determine profitability over a long period of time. This is easy with mechanical strategies...I simply use testing software, get good data, and test it from 1970-present. If it has made money over that entire time, then chances are it will continue to make money. I can fortunately say so far that has been the case. After I know these strategies work, I try and find new ones to further increase my bottom line. PVSRA is my second stab at a discretionary trading strategy.

Here's the problem I have with systems like PVSRA: they may work now, but can we prove they work? Of course what we consider a proven system is open to interpretation, but let me ask...how long have you been making consistent profits from the market? 6 months? A year? (You don't have to answer that question by the way ) There's a lot of probability theory and distribution theory I could launch into now. I don't think here is the place to do that, but I recommend looking into this stuff to anyone who is seriously interested in trading. In short, even bad systems have winning streaks.

You say that you added something recent that gives you your edge. That recent development inherently means it hasn't been well tested (unless you've managed to go back a long ways using testing software and have traded it forward). It's also evidence that PVSRA alone isn't enough.

Please remember this: when we read threads, at best we can only see how well people were performing in the market at that one specific time. There are plenty of "win and then bust" trading stories in this thread. Some of them leave great evidence of their failures (active -99% trade explorers, the occasional post of "wow I blew my account"). Most do not, however, but we think they were successful because they have a bunch of followers, and at that time posted a lot of big pip wins (the real reason most unsuccessful traders visit threads), etc. Not one of all these traders, who at one point were in their prime, have kept their winning streak and still post on this thread.

TAH is the only Sonic R trader in my book. He's the only one that documents his progress: wins and failures both. When people read his posts, they can get realistic expectations for this system, and see if it holds water after years of trading. I think we are starting to see however, that this current system isn't holding water. I said it before and will say it again: why would Sonic ever think of offering forex services for sale if his own system were making profits? That's a huge conflict of interests. It's like a failed hedge fund manager teaching a trading class (many of them do that by the way.)

So JRissa, if you make good money and still are years from now, at least don't leave FF without telling us that you no longer need this website. If you end up blowing your account a month from now, please don't vanish without first telling us that it didn't work out for you. Otherwise everyone just assumes it did. And then the "lemming effect" continues, and the most popular thread on FF continues to throw traders over the cliffs.

PVSRA didn't work out for me. I entered recent AU trades on my own accord, and then saw that others like loiel and later TAH did as well. My current DD from this system is incredible, and in retrospect, PVSRA is making me defy everything I have learned about successful, proven trading. Maybe I didn't give this system the time it deserved, but I do question its underlying principles and proof of success. This thread is from 2008. It's had 8 years to generate some sort of data. It hasn't shown anything conclusive.

Best of luck to everyone! It's time for me to move on.
I'm a dog chasing cars.
  • #68,649
  • Apr 10, 2014 2:29pm Apr 10, 2014 2:29pm
Quoting devontrader
Hi JRissa im curious lol looking thru the past posts to find the added extra you had... the edge can you tell us? Caring is sharing lol i do see your using supdom as in supply and demand which links in with pvsra also i noticed one half of a pattern...could this be it?
Candlesize/volume/open/close = Work amount/result = current activity

Market structure = sl'l/pending orders/liquidity = think like a zillion dollar trader that needs liquidity for his orders to get filled = know where price is needed to be pushed and from where orders get filled = rewersal points

All documented in near history of my posts.
I know the secret...
  • #68,650
  • Apr 10, 2014 2:30pm Apr 10, 2014 2:30pm
Quoting traderathome
{quote} GBPJPY Short Trade Update: Added shorts #15-16, Scouts. {image}
GBPJPY Short Trade Closed:

Manually closed trade for 2,125.6 pips gain. Additions to the trade were made since the last posting. I have closed the trade to take profits and increase account liquidity for tomorrow.
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  • #68,651
  • Apr 10, 2014 2:39pm Apr 10, 2014 2:39pm
Jrissa

my hat goes off to you sir.

looking forward to future posts examples showing what you mean on charts.

and TAH my hat again off to you,,,great trades
  • #68,652
  • Apr 10, 2014 2:47pm Apr 10, 2014 2:47pm
Quoting TaDaDa
{quote} Hi Prof TAH, when you say being behind enemy lines, do you mean stacking the scouts as PA goes against you?
TaDaDa,

Yes, precisely.

The proliferation of additions to a trade where the MMs are moving the price against you - even if their status is the same as per our trade - is a bad habit to form. The direction the MMs are moving the price should take precedence over the status of the MMs (bulls or bears?) because we cannot know how the price will be moved. It could continue to move in the opposite direction of our trade to the point of creating large draw downs that threaten essential account liquidity.

So, I repeat, this is exactly why Master Sonicdeejay prefers Sonicers to not add to a trade while the direction of price movement is opposite the trade.

-tah
  • #68,653
  • Apr 10, 2014 2:58pm Apr 10, 2014 2:58pm
Quoting traderathome
{quote} TaDaDa, Yes, precisely. The proliferation of additions to a trade where the MMs are moving the price against you - even if their status is the same as per our trade - is a bad habit to form. The direction the MMs are moving the price should take precedence over the status of the MMs (bulls or bears?) because we cannot know how the price will be moved. It could continue to move in the opposite direction of our trade to the point of creating large draw downs that threaten essential account liquidity. So, I repeat, this is exactly why Master...
Sorry Tah.. but how do you do that? Do you know where price is gonna move? No.. no one knows... How do I add 20-30 scouts? Donīt we split our trades in micro-lots so we can add when price goes against our initial entries? Of course we can add when it starts to look like going our way, but we never know when itīs really going our way...

I think thereīs a big conflict between Scout rules and Sonic Classic rules or even Sonic way of trading... we should think about it, because you making beginners confuse.. itīs also confusing how MMīs change from bears to bulls after 50-100 pips... but thats another discussion.
Dificult things take longer, Imposible ones just take a bit more
  • #68,654
  • Apr 10, 2014 3:30pm Apr 10, 2014 3:30pm
drawme

i have to say as a newbie to this yes to a point i guess i agree with acouple of your points.

im trying to learn the pvsra and scouting and now getting ??????

so a suggestion,,,maybe someone post 2 or 3 pdf as attachments to make it clear what each is and the method etc so anyone reading to this point has a pdf attached to the posting at this point in the thread so that they can be clear!
  • #68,655
  • Apr 10, 2014 3:34pm Apr 10, 2014 3:34pm
TAH

Can i ask,,,the pivot slide rule that gives us the rdl and pvt levels,,,,can it be moved to the right side of the chart next to the price levels rather then in the middle of the chart---gets in the way

if so,,,how pls
  • #68,656
  • Apr 10, 2014 3:34pm Apr 10, 2014 3:34pm
Quoting oapalaciop
{quote} Traderathome I would like to ask you a question, that such works SonicR the Heiken Ashi indicator? thanks
Quoting cigarguy
{quote} TAH, I realize that understanding PVSRA gives the trader a significant edge but it sounds like your getting back to basic trend trading with a bit of volume and identifying classic setups for entries thrown in. Similar to the method we traded back on the THV thread but replacing the kumo with the dragon, candles in lieu of HA's and identifying key S/R areas but coupled with the strength of PVSRA. I may be misinterpreting your post, but your experience and dedication in sharing with others has always been admired and held in the highest esteem...
Sonicers,

I am not attempting to deviate from the Sonic R. System by posting with HA candles and a simple volume histogram. A price action display (any form) and "a bit of volume" - to quote Master Sonicdeejay - are both part of the essentials for the Sonic R. System, which remains the analysis of price action, volume and S&R, and that entails the use of the Dragon angle and Trend with price action waves to find trade entry.

I, and others, have used HA candles before. They are not the best choice to use in conjunction with our colored PVA Candles and Volumes indicators, which are designed to help us spot places of notable volumes when we are engaged in the analysis of price action and volume with S&R. On the other hand, HA candles do a fine job of displaying price action waves.

So, with the task complete of releasing of our upgraded and reworked for MT4 Builds 600+ indicators/templates, and with Master Sonicdeejay's resurgent urging to not proliferate position building by adding Scouts while price moves in the wrong direction, I thought I might take some time to re-explore the use of HA candles with standard volume. It doesn't mean a departure from PVSRA. It means giving up the PVA (price-volume analysis) convenience in doing PVSRA, in order to use candles that might help with focus on price action direction and wave forms.

In past posts I have spoken out against others for not using the Dragon for entry (not trading Classics, which is the core of this thread), for using a variety of other price derivative indicators (all of which are not a part of the Sonic R. System because PA, Volume and S&R are the fundamental "technicals" and the only ones we use apart from the Dragon-Trend), and for attempting to "introduce" their own brand of wave analysis. To users of HA candles I have only remarked that they are less suited to the use of PVA (our convenient color coded price-volume analysis method of denoting notable volumes).

Whether or not HA candles will have enough merit to be an alternative to the convenience of PVA, only time will tell. I intend to take some time to explore what effect it has on my own trading, to explore if it will help in any way to assist traders like myself to keep price action direction and wave forms a proper priority.

-tah
  • #68,657
  • Apr 10, 2014 3:43pm Apr 10, 2014 3:43pm
We're out of time in London, then this we are not a Classic. But looks like.
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Check your emotions. How are you?
  • #68,658
  • Apr 10, 2014 3:52pm Apr 10, 2014 3:52pm
Quoting traderathome
{quote} {quote} Sonicers, I am not attempting to deviate from the Sonic R. System by posting with HA candles and a simple volume histogram. A price action display (any form) and "a bit of volume" - to quote Master Sonicdeejay - are both part of the essentials for the Sonic R. System, which remains the analysis of price action, volume and S&R, and that entails the use of the Dragon angle and Trend with price action waves to find trade entry. I, and others, have used HA candles before. They are not the best choice to use in conjunction with our colored...
traderathome,
I am very much on the same page with this post of yours as I am wishing to give classic entries just as much as an opportunity I have been with my scout entries. For the sake of others here wishing to try out HA candles as well (such as myself), I ask if you would mind posting your HA candles indicator?
  • #68,659
  • Apr 10, 2014 3:57pm Apr 10, 2014 3:57pm
TAH

just an observation from past postings ive read

could candles be coloured red and green for bullish and bearish price movement.

also

with regards to pvsra ,,, could a row of arrows or a single big red or green arrow be displayed to identify bullish or bearish MM once identified by the system?

would this easy indication take away a lot of the newbies struggling to learn pvsra.
or maybe make it easier for them to understand over time
  • #68,660
  • Edited 4:09pm Apr 10, 2014 3:59pm | Edited 4:09pm
Quoting ElectroGypsy
{quote} I agree with Cigarguy on this. What bothers me more is you still haven't answered my question of why you stopped posting your PVSRA results every week. If you plot your results into chart form, the overall profitability of this concept you're teaching doesn't really show profitability. It shows you initially did well, hit a huge winning streak, lost EVERY CENT of profits you made, had another decent upwards slope, and then started moving south. I would not be surprised if you are actually in the negative after the DD from your GJ trades...
ElectroGypsy,

Okey, if you think my full year reveal of trading while PVSRA was an "in-work" experimental project does not show profitability, then you post for a full year. Let's see if you can net as much as 1,463 pips per week average!

I cannot believe you put so little thought into your accusation! How much better is it to net out with such profit after absorbing such huge losses during the experiment! And furthermore, now that the year of reveal is complete, last week I posted 2,767 pips gained and this week I have banked 2,527 pips gained, including the close of my GJ trade.

"No one has yet to show profitability with this system even though it is old enough to provide solid data." - ElectroGypsy

This statement of yours is totally off-base, contrary to the posted facts, fallacious and irresponsible! Please, read well this thread and think well, before you talk like this again!

-tah
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