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Genesis Matrix Trading

  • #21,081
  • Jan 13, 2014 5:45pm Jan 13, 2014 5:45pm
Quoting Martyfish
{quote} But I am !!
You're in good company Marty!

Thanks for a quick overview of your career.......I love ready about people's path to FX.

I actually started trading shares in Grade 8 at school, using my Mum's account, in the roaring 80's. Using the school public telephone to call the broker........no online trading then!

PM1
  • #21,082
  • Jan 13, 2014 8:25pm Jan 13, 2014 8:25pm
Quoting Martyfish
{quote} But I am !!
I find that older traders tend to have better discipline. Not in such big of a rush to make money (anymore).

I like how Marty sticks to his two pairs and gets better at them, as opposed to trading the pair of the month.
  • #21,083
  • Jan 13, 2014 8:36pm Jan 13, 2014 8:36pm
Quoting spyderman
{quote} I'll do that. Have to make sure I take off all the controversial stuff... I'll post my next trade...win, lose or draw. I you're not the only one who's long in the tooth.
Can I give some suggestions?

Try to get really good at Genesis first, and then add the other stuff. Speaking from my own experience. I always like to try new indicators out, but what I've found is I needed to have a system that I've traded on and know inside out, and then gradually add the other indicators. Other wise it can be confusing and counterproductive. How long does it take to know a system inside out? It depends. Some people are fast, I'm probably on the slow side (haha). And I didn't have much experience before coming across Genesis.

And I can't think of a better 'core' system than Genesis + Moving Averages.

So perhaps it is better that you know Genesis so well so that when you add or try out each new indicator you can pretty quickly gauge whether this indicator adds to Genesis or not. And 'how' it adds. MTF Stochs, Genesis/ASCTrend tapes and MTF Moving Averages are the core of my entries. If these don't line up properly, I won't trade. However, nowadays I've added a few other indicators to help me filter these trades for even better win-loss ratio. But these took a lot of time and don't work unless my core entry signal is correct.

Regarding moving averages, I think they help straight away. Helps you gauge trend, and you'd want to trade on the right side of trend until you get really good at Genesis. Whereas RJ doesn't need moving averages because he's had so much chart time and is such a great trader, I think most traders could do with some form of MA to filter CounterTrend trades (at least until they get really good).
  • #21,084
  • Jan 13, 2014 9:27pm Jan 13, 2014 9:27pm
Quoting RainyDay1
{quote} Can I give some suggestions? Try to get really good at Genesis first, and then add the other stuff. Speaking from my own experience. I always like to try new indicators out, but what I've found is I needed to have a system that I've traded on and know inside out, and then gradually add the other indicators. Other wise it can be confusing and counterproductive. How long does it take to know a system inside out? It depends. Some people are fast, I'm probably on the slow side (haha). And I didn't have much experience before coming across Genesis....
Well said RD1.

PM1
  • #21,085
  • Jan 13, 2014 10:36pm Jan 13, 2014 10:36pm
Quoting RainyDay1
{quote} Can I give some suggestions? Try to get really good at Genesis first, and then add the other stuff ....
I feel like now is a good time to repost a post that I consider "gold" from back in the early days of the thread ... done by OlivierForex who is no longer on the thread but has some great posts if you're ever digging around the thread ... basically it covers how he figures out whether adding a new indicator actually makes him any better off or worse off ... I'm copying and pasting rather than quoting as quoting would cut it off.

Original post is here : http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...9&#post6016049

##########################

That is so true....The 'problem' with people's perception of Genesis is that its graphical & visual simplicity hides the complexity behind it.

I'm sure that most people look at the matrix and count it as 1 indicator (4 dots either blue or red - easy) when in fact it is none of that.
If I'm correct, bar the CCI line, the 3 other matrix lines (TVI/GHL/T3) are 'made' of at least 2 indicators (if not more) running in the background.
So at a stroke you already have a minimum of 7 'decision makers', add the Stox (5 & 15) + the Yellow MA + the Arrow & the odd Pivot line & you are talking about at least 12 different indicators all needing to be pointing in the same direction to give you valid signal.
How many more do you really need?

But having said that, yes you can add more indicators as extra 'filters' and for sure they will stop you entering some Genesis bad trades but the flipside of that is they will also keep you out & make you miss some good trades. It's a balancing act and I decide to include something extra in my trading only by doing a lot of backtesting and this is my method:
.on the M5 TF I will mark down on my chart all the Genesis trades for a minimum of 1 month.
.for each of these trades I will write down what my Potential New Filter (PNF) was telling me and you have 4 possible scenarios:
1) PNF agrees with a Genesis good trade: that will be marked as +0 (the PNF didn't add anything).
2) PNF agrees with a Genesis bad trade & that trade would have been a 20 pips loss: that will be marked also as +0 (the PNF didn't add anything).
3) PNF disagrees with a Genesis good trade and it would have stopped me from entering a good/valid trade: if that trade 'showed' me a 'realistic' 30 pips, I mark this as -30.
4) PNF disagrees with a Genesis bad trade and that trade would have been a 20 pips loss: that will become +20 (the PNF stopped me from entering a bad trade).
I then add it all up and if:
.it is a negative (-) total or very close to zero then the PNF gets discarded as it hasn't added anything of value: it's only taking some of my attention away from the other stuff.
.it is a big positive number & I will include it in my forward live trading for a month and see if the backtesting results match the live difference in outcome.
It's only then that I decide to keep it or not.

So if you have anything 'new' to add to Genesis' core rules and you have done some proper (and I really mean proper lol) backtesting to backup your claims then I'll happily listen.

##########################
1 pip at a time ... if the entries are strong, the rest will follow ...
  • #21,086
  • Jan 13, 2014 10:44pm Jan 13, 2014 10:44pm
Quoting antantnz
{quote} I feel like now is a good time to repost a post that I consider "gold" from back in the early days of the thread ... done by OlivierForex who is no longer on the thread but has some great posts if you're ever digging around the thread ... basically it covers how he figures out whether adding a new indicator actually makes him any better off or worse off ... I'm copying and pasting rather than quoting as quoting would cut it off. Original post is here : http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...9&#post6016049 ##########################...
Thanks antantnz. I remember this post well. Should've adhered to it earlier and it would've saved me months in working in new indicators.
  • #21,087
  • Jan 13, 2014 10:56pm Jan 13, 2014 10:56pm
Quoting antantnz
{quote} I feel like now is a good time to repost a post that I consider "gold" from back in the early days of the thread ... done by OlivierForex who is no longer on the thread but has some great posts if you're ever digging around the thread ... basically it covers how he figures out whether adding a new indicator actually makes him any better off or worse off ... I'm copying and pasting rather than quoting as quoting would cut it off. Original post is here : http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...9&#post6016049 ##########################...

at least 12 different indicators

the very reason I dont use any other indicators

J
Winning isnt everything but coming second sucks (Charlie Brown)
  • #21,088
  • Jan 13, 2014 11:01pm Jan 13, 2014 11:01pm
Quoting jjre65
{quote} at least 12 different indicators the very reason I dont use any other indicators J
Not to argue, just to say that even RJ has said he uses other indicators on top of Genesis. OlivierForex also did.

But of course, everyone can decide for themselves what works best for them. An indicator added on top of Genesis may work well for my mentality, but not for you. That's why I said Genesis is the best core system I've seen. You can add to it to make it suit you better, but Genesis alone suffice.
  • #21,089
  • Jan 13, 2014 11:05pm Jan 13, 2014 11:05pm
Quick GJ short.

http://content.screencast.com/users/...01-14_0852.png

+15

Of course it can go lower but pretty big move of GJ already took place today so I don't expect much from it during the rest of Tokyo...
The single most important factor is having control of your own life.
  • #21,090
  • Jan 13, 2014 11:40pm Jan 13, 2014 11:40pm
I took EJ Long 25 min after Tokyo open. Enter at 142.05, exit at 142.25 , so +20! I need to work the process of putting my SL more often to BE +X, and not exiting randomly. The only reason I exited was because the price was standing still, but matrix and arrows was still full LONG at the time. I guess I was being impatient.

P-S - Ok, here is the stupid question of the day : How do you guys draw those little line from your entry to your exit? I still draw some messy green line to keep in my journal :/

Malouin
Slowly, but surely...
  • #21,091
  • Jan 13, 2014 11:41pm Jan 13, 2014 11:41pm
Quoting Mikkk01
Quick GJ short. {image} +15 Of course it can go lower but pretty big move of GJ already took place today so I don't expect much from it during the rest of Tokyo...
Excellent trade my friend!
Slowly, but surely...
  • #21,092
  • Edited 11:59pm Jan 13, 2014 11:49pm | Edited 11:59pm
Quoting Malouin
I took EJ Long 25 min after Tokyo open. Enter at 142.05, exit at 142.25 , so +20! I need to work the process of putting my SL more often to BE +X, and not exiting randomly. The only reason I exited was because the price was standing still, but matrix and arrows was still full LONG at the time.
Yep, BE is a good rule and working on exits will surely improve your performance but even if they're are not top-notch Genesis gives awesome entries - so there's some leeway there!
Quoting Malouin
Ok, here is the stupid question of the day : How do you guys draw those little line from your entry to your exit? I still draw some messy green line to keep in my journal :/ Malouin
If you mean this:
http://content.screencast.com/users/...01-14_0943.png

Just drag a trade from acc. history to the chart!
The single most important factor is having control of your own life.
  • #21,093
  • Jan 13, 2014 11:55pm Jan 13, 2014 11:55pm
Quoting Malouin
{quote} Excellent trade my friend!
The single most important factor is having control of your own life.
  • #21,094
  • Jan 14, 2014 12:03am Jan 14, 2014 12:03am
Quoting Mikkk01
{quote} Yep, BE is a good rule and working on exits will surely improve your performance but even if they're are not top-notch Genesis gives awesome entries - so there's some leeway there! {quote} If you mean this: {image} Just drag a trade from acc. history to the chart!
Hi,

May i ask how you guys determine when to move your SL to BE+X?
Thanks
  • #21,095
  • Jan 14, 2014 12:16am Jan 14, 2014 12:16am
Quoting Raymond00
{quote} Hi, May i ask how you guys determine when to move your SL to BE+X? Thanks
Oh, that's pretty much the same thing as when to exit - everybody has their own criteria.

General rules are: it's good to protect your profit [SL to BE] instead of just exiting when you wanna make sure you lose nothing but there's still good chance of price woving in your favour. As for BE+x - you gotta decide how much is enough for price to move against you to confirm the reversal.
The single most important factor is having control of your own life.
  • #21,096
  • Jan 14, 2014 12:47am Jan 14, 2014 12:47am
Quoting jjre65
{quote} at least 12 different indicators the very reason I dont use any other indicators J
and to be fair, despite the enormous number of indicators, they fall into 3 categories,volume, trend and momentum indicators.

Genesis had those 3 covered
I am a fallible imperfect person; so I must be a fallible imperfect trader.
  • #21,097
  • Jan 14, 2014 2:44am Jan 14, 2014 2:44am
  •  Jamz
  • | Joined May 2012 | Status: Tops and bottoms are for bikinis | 798 Posts
Here's a nice GA trade......+52.....even I can't quite believe how good this looks! Really only exited because I was happy.......can I bend that into a trading rule?
Just to add, I have done all sorts of trading but I have deleted all of those memories, cleared my mind of it all and adapted to Genesis. Options, shares, emini futures....they have no relevance to forex IMHO. Genesis may work on them though. It hasn't been easy just genesising it after "knowing" so much. The below trade is exactly what I've been trying to achieve.......
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: ga tuesday.png Size: 147 KB
  • #21,098
  • Jan 14, 2014 3:08am Jan 14, 2014 3:08am
Quoting Jamz
Here's a nice GA trade......+52.....even I can't quite believe how good this looks! Really only exited because I was happy.......can I bend that into a trading rule? Just to add, I have done all sorts of trading but I have deleted all of those memories, cleared my mind of it all and adapted to Genesis. Options, shares, emini futures....they have no relevance to forex IMHO. Genesis may work on them though. It hasn't been easy just genesising it after "knowing" so much. The below trade is exactly what I've been trying to achieve....... {image}
Very nice............

I grabbed some of that action as well until it was dinner time. I left 1/2 the trade open but it came back and I was taken out whilst I was eating.

Now the GA is motoring on without me.............. why does the family have to eat???

PM1
  • #21,099
  • Jan 14, 2014 3:18am Jan 14, 2014 3:18am
Closed EJ +47 pips

Entered on open 8:15 candle

Closing just shy of R1
I am a fallible imperfect person; so I must be a fallible imperfect trader.
  • #21,100
  • Jan 14, 2014 3:46am Jan 14, 2014 3:46am
Quoting Martyfish
Closed EJ +47 pips Entered on open 8:15 candle Closing just shy of R1
Same result here - EJ 47 - although from an earlier entry at around 7:40 your time (i.e. 20 mins before LO).

I wouldn't call my entry a great entry as I normally prefer stronger looking stochs, but, trend seemed strong.

Was keen to let it keep running, but it was a good profit level so after 3 bars in a row stalling there, was time to exit.

Quoting Jamz
Here's a nice GA trade......+52.....even I can't quite believe how good this looks!
Great to see you having an impressive trade Jamz.
1 pip at a time ... if the entries are strong, the rest will follow ...
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