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  • #773,481
  • Mar 18, 2013 1:49pm Mar 18, 2013 1:49pm
Quoting Firstboss
The ratings dealing with "business conditions" and "ease of doing business" are usually compiled based on polling the top managers in the respective countries - and those are based in the respective countries
Yeah. I realized my argument might not be very convincing and edited it. Looks like you caught it pre-edit. Actually looks like I made a duplicate
  • #773,482
  • Mar 18, 2013 1:51pm Mar 18, 2013 1:51pm
Quoting fx-analyst
I decided to exit Euro long positions as market lacks momentum.
Most probably Euro will test rising trendline.
Profit is 33 and 34 pip.

Analyst
I drew same TL also, watching closely.
Disclaimer: I'm still new to forex
  • #773,483
  • Mar 18, 2013 1:52pm Mar 18, 2013 1:52pm
Quoting SpacyTrader
Bottom line they're still at the top of the list and the only thing dragging them down is the tax system which can be circumvented as I said. See the ranking for business freedom, monetary freedom and investment freedom
this may be the problem.. broaden the mind with the less biased. or as someone famous said.. know your enemy.. there is some truth in both views.
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #773,484
  • Mar 18, 2013 1:53pm Mar 18, 2013 1:53pm
Quoting gatorinla
that was dirty using ones on research to discredit.
Meh. Even in the general rankings that was not strictly true. Denmark was higher than the US. And as I said my argument was about the ease of doing business in which the Scandinavian countries rank better. Theyre being dragged down by the tax system which a multinational has ways to avoid. Naturally if you're a domestic-only business you're a somewhat easier target (if anything they're handicapping their domestic entrepreneurs).

For ex France gives big tax credits to R&D operations. Therefore all the multinationals that sell to France have major R&D operations in France. Easiest way ever to avoid paying tax on their french operations in an otherwise heavily oppressive jurisdiction.
  • #773,485
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:00pm Mar 18, 2013 2:00pm
Quoting SpacyTrader
Theyre being dragged down by the tax system which a multinational has ways to avoid. Naturally if you're a domestic-only business you're a somewhat easier target (if anything they're handicapping their domestic entrepreneurs).
This is true. Unfortunately, everyone gets harmed by this, as multinational corporations avoid taxes everywhere. It is only possible because of WTO loopholes that allow shifting the whole profit of, say, google, to a fake office with a monkey and a fax machine. With the help of countries like Cyprus.

The multinational companies privatize profits, exploit government resources to push their global interests, socialize losses, and if left unregulated, create burdening societal costs.
"Luxury is one of the basic needs", (c), Don Corleone
  • #773,486
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:02pm Mar 18, 2013 2:02pm
I think EJ will Down now... How about you..???
  • #773,487
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:03pm Mar 18, 2013 2:03pm
Quoting Firstboss
This is true. Unfortunately, everyone gets harmed by this, as multinational corporations avoid taxes everywhere. It is only possible because of WTO loopholes that allow shifting the whole profit of, say, google, to a fake office with a monkey and a fax machine. With the help of countries like Cyprus.

The multinational companies privatize profits, exploit government resources to push their global interests, socialize losses, and if left unregulated, create burdening societal costs.
Obviously I agree with your premise but not your conclusions. The only losses being privatized are the banks and automakers- done for purely selfish reasons on the part of the governments. Banks buy their worthless debt and finance deficits while automakers hire lots of drone (lots of votes to buy).
  • #773,488
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:04pm Mar 18, 2013 2:04pm
Quoting SpacyTrader
Bottom line they're still at the top of the list and the only thing dragging them down is the tax system which can be circumvented as I said. See the ranking for business freedom, monetary freedom and investment freedom
They're below the US in every single one of those categories while outperforming the US in most categories that count (education, healthcare, etc.)...and if you bothered to read up about taxes you'd realise they aren't any higher than in the US. Again...facts matter.
  • #773,489
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:07pm Mar 18, 2013 2:07pm
Quoting Firstboss
This is true. Unfortunately, everyone gets harmed by this, as multinational corporations avoid taxes everywhere. It is only possible because of WTO loopholes that allow shifting the whole profit of, say, google, to a fake office with a monkey and a fax machine. With the help of countries like Cyprus.

The multinational companies privatize profits, exploit government resources to push their global interests, socialize losses, and if left unregulated, create burdening societal costs.
they use the roads, the brain pools, the military and dont want to pay for it.. good work when you can find it.. the guys who wrap themselves in a flag dont see this as a free lunch or unpatriotic, by paying nothing. look at G.E.... i paid more then them in 2011 i think....
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #773,490
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:08pm Mar 18, 2013 2:08pm
I'm off. Thank you all for several good comments.
Enter Signature
  • #773,491
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:16pm Mar 18, 2013 2:16pm
Quoting 4exNinja
They're below the US in every single one of those categories while outperforming the US in most categories that count (education, healthcare, etc.)...and if you bothered to read up about taxes you'd realise they aren't any higher than in the US. Again...facts matter.
They're WAY - hugely above the US in every single one of those categories. And all those good bits you mention a company doesnt give a shit except education where in the end they can import the labor they need to the right jurisdiction.

Taxes: what you know. The socialists have competitive corporate taxes now. Still except Norway the personal income tax is appaling. Not to mention the bulk of the theft is done with VAT. So I dont see how you hurt my argument: the people end up paying the taxes. The bulk of tax collection has to be done by VAT- consumption tax applied to ordinary peoples' income to pay for all those socialist benefits. See ? You helped prove my point further that its not the rich that end up with the bill after all.
  • #773,492
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:16pm Mar 18, 2013 2:16pm
Quoting SpacyTrader
Obviously I agree with your premise but not your conclusions. The only losses being privatized are the banks and automakers- done for purely selfish reasons on the part of the governments. Banks buy their worthless debt and finance deficits while automakers hire lots of drone (lots of votes to buy).
yeah,, this is what gets me.. these guys wrapped in a flag would rather ship plants overseas.. then when we fight China r whoever in the next war.

we have no skill/trained workforce to build the bombs trucks planes etc. so we will buy the crap from China or the lowest bidder.. yeah we got some patriotic guys in congress. deploy the military, then crash the system. and blame it on whoever. and now if they have their way, Toyota will build the war machine.. in their southern district of course.
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #773,493
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:17pm Mar 18, 2013 2:17pm
Quoting SpacyTrader
Obviously I agree with your premise but not your conclusions. The only losses being privatized are the banks and automakers- done for purely selfish reasons on the part of the governments. Banks buy their worthless debt and finance deficits while automakers hire lots of drone (lots of votes to buy).
Not just them. Airlines and insurance companies get rescued/protected by various governments all the time.
Military corporations get preferential treatment.

Friendly corporations get unfair advantage through politicians they own. For example, in complete disregard of the public opinion, Las Vegas casino owners quietly pushed gambling prohibition through only 2 Republican senators who attached that provision to Port Security Act.

Apart from socializing the losses the societal costs are much more significant. When employers are not required to treat employees with dignity (i.e., restrictions on working hours, enough sick days, adequate vacations, retirement contributions, etc.) the societal burden includes:
the accumulated stress in society (=more crime and more expenses on police and prisons),
chronic diseases, emergency healthcare costs,
retirement support,
and having to deal with children that didn't have any parenting, since their parents worked 2 crappy shifts every day.

Meanwhile, multinationals like Google, Facebook, Dell, Microsoft, Starbucks, GE, Apple - all the "symbols" of the US economy massively avoid taxes (effectively paying between 0 and 5%) on huge profits they make.
"Luxury is one of the basic needs", (c), Don Corleone
  • #773,494
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:18pm Mar 18, 2013 2:18pm
they lack support to pass the levy... nice..
  • #773,495
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:19pm Mar 18, 2013 2:19pm
Quoting gatorinla
they use the roads, the brain pools, the military and dont want to pay for it.. good work when you can find it.. the guys who wrap themselves in a flag dont see this as a free lunch or unpatriotic, by paying nothing. look at G.E.... i paid more then them in 2011 i think....
You should save your nerves and not get mad over nothing. You'd pay for it either way. If they managed to get GM and all its competitors to pay 100% the price of a car for every car in either sales tax or income tax or whatever else they'll just send the bill to you at the end of the day. And if any one of their competitors isnt taxed to the same level they go under. See how silly the tax argument is ?
  • #773,496
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:22pm Mar 18, 2013 2:22pm
Quoting attila
they lack support to pass the levy... nice..
does this mean we are going to visit 2790 for now?
  • #773,497
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:24pm Mar 18, 2013 2:24pm
Quoting Firstboss
Not just them. Airlines and insurance companies get rescued/protected by various governments all the time.
Military corporations get preferential treatment.

Friendly corporations get unfair advantage through politicians they own. For example, in complete disregard of the public opinion, Las Vegas casino owners quietly pushed gambling prohibition through only 2 Republican senators who attached that provision to Port Security Act.

Apart from socializing the losses the societal costs are much more significant. When employers are not required to treat...
100% with you on government support for crony capitalists. They're made a burden on everybody, just like the socialists would have liked to keep people employed making horse drawn carriages at public expense since car cmpanies kill jobs. And how they still want to overpay workers like thats not gonna end up in the end product price- same difference.
  • #773,498
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:24pm Mar 18, 2013 2:24pm
Quoting PIP.Scalper
does this mean we are going to visit 2790 for now?
no idea... I see it dropping on the back of that.. other than that, watch the PA. I'm done for the day anyway, for a mere 60 pips.
  • #773,499
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:27pm Mar 18, 2013 2:27pm
Quoting PIP.Scalper
does this mean we are going to visit 2790 for now?
Doubtful. The greek debacle wasnt easy to pass either. In the end they relented and here we are today with greek unemployment at 25% and the government still in place despite all the propaganda about the power of the people and how the government needs to placate the plebs with bread and circus or else they'll be sent to the guillotines. Turns out the cowards can't actually overthrow any government with their bare hands against armed goons when they dont have the CIA at their backs bribing the army and police to stand down.
  • #773,500
  • Mar 18, 2013 2:28pm Mar 18, 2013 2:28pm
Quoting SpacyTrader
You should save your nerves and not get mad over nothing. You'd pay for it either way. If they managed to get GM and all its competitors to pay 100% the price of a car for every car in either sales tax or income tax or whatever else they'll just send the bill to you at the end of the day. And if any one of their competitors isnt taxed to the same level they go under. See how silly the tax argument is ?
GM is a bad example for your argument - it is actually a success story.
First of all, former stockholders lost everything - which means, that bad investment decision resulted in a loss as it should.

Second, in the heat of the crisis the loan money simply wasn't available. The societal effect of GM going under destroying even more manufacturing jobs would've been a lot costlier. Consider it as investment in the national interests.

The only wrong part of the bailout of Citibank and GM is selling the government-owned stock before it recovered to offset the federal money invested.
"Luxury is one of the basic needs", (c), Don Corleone
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