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Genesis Matrix Trading

  • #10,761
  • Mar 13, 2013 11:31am Mar 13, 2013 11:31am
Quoting lastingwell
Even in a re-entry I never go against the M15 stoc its a matter of wanting the higher probability trades and at the point you have to decide you have no idea if the trend is going to carry on or if it is going to turn around so I like everything on my side. I no longer look for the actual cross but at the time of that trade (trade number 1) I would wait for the M15 stoc to actually turn down which it hadnt yet it was still climbing. Since martys posts about Xaphods stoc indicator I put that on there and its far better and quicker at letting you...
I agree. One can never be too careful selecting the trades (probably not my strongest point yet). However, what I wrote was based on what I could see on my chart at the moment of the signal, i.e. M5 stoch coming down, M15 stoch clearly crossed down and coming back down, plus H1 stoch still coming down since the very beginning of the whole move. All that, plus the fact that the 60ema held the small retrace nicely (I know it's not part of the system, but it helps me see the bigger picture), was in favour of taking the trade as re-entry.

I might give Xaphod's stoch another go as all his tools are brilliant, but I feel very comfortable using the classic two-line version.
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mind over matter
  • #10,762
  • Mar 13, 2013 12:44pm Mar 13, 2013 12:44pm
Quoting kwissy
Hi all, I'm a fan of this thread and thanks for RJ coming up with this great system and the team Wiz3003, Ohammond, Cody, Oliverforex, Xaphod for putting up together with this system.

I've been following this thread for a few weeks and has re-read the 5-15 Genesis Strategy and Genesis Summary which is put together by Wiz3003.

I've have just a few questions to clarify regarding this strategy's Entry 2 criteria on this recent EJ chart. As per attached is yesterday's EJ chart and the points of entry starts from London open until 1st half of NY...
Hi kwissy below my answers:

Quoting kwissy
I did enter a short here but during that time, m15 stoch is still rising until a stronger down PA pushes this m15 stoch to cross and fall eventually. On that rule 2, it didnt say anything about m15 stoch but only mentioned m15 arrow appear and take the signal in the m15 arrow's direction.
1) Stoch isn't an on/off indicator, you have to put it in the price contest (in a bearish trend an oversold stoch is a strong confirmation signal - in a range the same it is a warning). Look @ post 1 for deeper analysis plus recent RJ's video.

2) Exactly. Rule 2 doesn't take into account M15 stoch.

Quoting kwissy
At point 2,
a)is the higher low correctly spotted?
m5 Stoch is risen from below and made a higher low as well.
b) Sometimes spotting higher low and lower high can be confusing just for example, if at point 1 entry that it turned up instead of down, it can become...
a) Yes after BO of the previous LH. In this case also TL BO.
b) The only way to be sure market reversed is waiting for the next candles.

Quoting kwissy
Ar point 3,
a) can this entry be regarded to entry rule 2 above?
b) I am suspecting whether for entry rule 2 to be valid, should the m5 stoch in this case fall into OS zone then rise up again rather than in the middle of the halfway drop, it turned up?
a) YES because you have M5 Genesis signal in the same direction as M15 arrow. Obiously any time you have to analyse the quality of the signal to evaluate potential risks.
b) It depends on the strenght of the trend and your attitude to the risk. Look @ post 1 for deeper analysis plus recent RJ's video.

Quoting kwissy
At point 4,
Will anyone take this trade since there's no lower high and m15 stoch although is crossed but still has not fallen from OB zone yet cos stoch when it rises, in trend it can be staying in the OB zone for a long time until it falls down out of OS zone?
It has no retest to DP upon this fall and news coming in 20min later.
No comment. Always simple in hindsight.

Quoting kwissy
Of these 4 points, which one has the highest probability trade and whether point 1 is the exact entry rule 2 that can apply without much regards to m15 stoch cos it has m15 arrow as a filter while m5 stoch is a valid entry criteria?

many thanks if RJ and the team can enlighten me for these queries.
You control how you trade; the market controls how and when you'll get paid
  • #10,763
  • Mar 13, 2013 2:44pm Mar 13, 2013 2:44pm
Quoting kosmo
I agree. One can never be too careful selecting the trades (probably not my strongest point yet). However, what I wrote was based on what I could see on my chart at the moment of the signal, i.e. M5 stoch coming down, M15 stoch clearly crossed down and coming back down, plus H1 stoch still coming down since the very beginning of the whole move. All that, plus the fact that the 60ema held the small retrace nicely (I know it's not part of the system, but it helps me see the bigger picture), was in favour of taking the trade as re-entry.

I might give...
Xaphods is still a 2 line version but as he pointed out the mtf stoc that I had and you still have on your chart shows in hindsight the cross wrongly. You must remember that it doesnt show the last few bars when you take the trade it doesnt fill that in until the 15m bar has ended so you wouldnt have seen at the time what you are seeing now. You would have seen this at the close of the bar when you needed to make the decision:
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  • #10,764
  • Mar 13, 2013 3:33pm Mar 13, 2013 3:33pm
Quoting lastingwell
Xaphods is still a 2 line version but as he pointed out the mtf stoc that I had and you still have on your chart shows in hindsight the cross wrongly. You must remember that it doesnt show the last few bars when you take the trade it doesnt fill that in until the 15m bar has ended so you wouldnt have seen at the time what you are seeing now. You would have seen this at the close of the bar when you needed to make the decision:
Thanks, lastingwell. I'll experiment with it.
mind over matter
  • #10,765
  • Mar 14, 2013 12:29am Mar 14, 2013 12:29am
Thank you wiz3003 for your detailed answers.

At point 1, initially i thought it would be a HPT because m15 arrow appeared previously when the trend started and then pullback happened which trigger a buy signal before point 1 entry but m15 stoch is not at right position. I noticed for trending movements like this which happened in the asian session already, there's always a buy signal where an up arrow appears which normally i dun want to go against trading that, but rather i waited for about 3-6 bars where an opposite arrow in the same direction of m15 arrow to appear and short it. Usually when conditions like this happen where opposite arrow appear within 3-6 bars plus genesis signal excluding m15 stoch, its a trend continuation provided that there's a trend happened previously. And upon entering this signal, pips making will always be faster and quicker than the previous trend which is why i very interested in understanding more of the entry criteria 2.

It is resemblance to elliot wave where wave 1 is trending, 2 is pullback, 3 is fastest and largest pip making wave etc. But that's not the point of wave analysis here and I don't want to wave count the trend because market is dynamic and true enough, its better to stick with trading what we see rather what we think to anticipate the move.

The current MTF m15 stoch is good enough to gauge the direction, however there are times when the stoch is heading up for the 1st 2 m5 bar then when the 3rd m5 bar which has a strong reverse turn, MTF m15 stoch will turn or shrink to weaken the direction. Then when 3rd m5 bar closes, m15 stoch is turning, hence strong PA is always leading than indicators and this is also not the point in trading this system here as it is not PA alone that create the HPT setup, its a total package setup that matters.

Lastly my DP on EJ that day was 125.52 and entry at point 1 is below my broker's DP, tat's why I shorted too... So far i think my broker's PA react to its DP quite ok.

Btw, what does the abbreviations BO and TL means?

Quoting wiz3003
Hi kwissy below my answers:



1) Stoch isn't an on/off indicator, you have to put it in the price contest (in a bearish trend an oversold stoch is a strong confirmation signal - in a range the same it is a warning). Look @ post 1 for deeper analysis plus recent RJ's video.

2) Exactly. Rule 2 doesn't take into account M15 stoch.



[color=blue]a) Yes after BO of the previous...
  • #10,766
  • Mar 14, 2013 3:48am Mar 14, 2013 3:48am
Morning everyone,

Missed the bull run on EJ, but +40 on UJ is good enough before breakfast
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mind over matter
  • #10,767
  • Mar 14, 2013 3:51am Mar 14, 2013 3:51am
Quoting kosmo
Morning everyone,

Missed the bull run on EJ, but +40 on UJ is good enough before breakfast
Morning Jo.....you can't really get too many pips before breakfast in case you get indigestion
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #10,768
  • Mar 14, 2013 3:52am Mar 14, 2013 3:52am
Quoting kosmo
Morning everyone,

Missed the bull run on EJ, but +40 on UJ is good enough before breakfast
Nice one Jo !!

Dont usually take Frankie open trades, but EJ was just too strong !!

Took +61 and a further +12 on DP bounce.

That is me done for the day
I am a fallible imperfect person; so I must be a fallible imperfect trader.
  • #10,769
  • Mar 14, 2013 4:00am Mar 14, 2013 4:00am
Quoting realjumper
Morning Jo.....you can't really get too many pips before breakfast in case you get indigestion
Haha, yes I'll stick to my 5-a-day in small portions
mind over matter
  • #10,770
  • Mar 14, 2013 4:00am Mar 14, 2013 4:00am
Quoting Martyfish
Nice one Jo !!

Dont usually take Frankie open trades, but EJ was just too strong !!

Took +61 and a further +12 on DP bounce.

That is me done for the day
Just perfect, Marty! Enjoy your day off
mind over matter
  • #10,771
  • Edited 5:25am Mar 14, 2013 4:18am | Edited 5:25am
Hi, good job to you guys, I came here at london open and most JPY crosses had already completed their rallies, so I sat on my hands.
I found an entry on EJ and EU, so I'm short on two positions... Going to be very careful with EJ because it's a counter-trend trade but it seemed good what with the 125.00 level and the DR1 that got rejected and the genesis signals.

*edit* : got rid of my EJ position at b/e because h1 was showing bullish signals (even though countertrend), EU is still running

*edit2*: EU locked at B/E
  • #10,772
  • Edited 8:57am Mar 14, 2013 8:45am | Edited 8:57am
Quoting WDays
Hi, good job to you guys, I came here at london open and most JPY crosses had already completed their rallies, so I sat on my hands.
I found an entry on EJ and EU, so I'm short on two positions... Going to be very careful with EJ because it's a counter-trend trade but it seemed good what with the 125.00 level and the DR1 that got rejected and the genesis signals.

*edit* : got rid of my EJ position at b/e because h1 was showing bullish signals (even though countertrend), EU is still running

*edit2*: EU locked at B/E
Update: my EU got stopped out after price bounced from WS1, had locked 20 pips... my GJ trade that I opened at the breach of DR1 following a long signal, touched TP for 26 pips...

Totaling 46 pips for the day, I'm done for the day.
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  • #10,773
  • Mar 14, 2013 8:58am Mar 14, 2013 8:58am
bah out for a few hours and gbp ignited rockets already :S DAMN!
  • #10,774
  • Mar 14, 2013 9:32am Mar 14, 2013 9:32am
Quoting WDays
Update: my EU got stopped out after price bounced from WS1, had locked 20 pips... my GJ trade that I opened at the breach of DR1 following a long signal, touched TP for 26 pips...

Totaling 46 pips for the day, I'm done for the day.
good trades
  • #10,775
  • Mar 14, 2013 10:40am Mar 14, 2013 10:40am
Hope the party isn't over.
Well done everyone for your green pips
.... laughing all the way to the bank
  • #10,776
  • Edited 11:26am Mar 14, 2013 10:46am | Edited 11:26am
I have been following this thread from just about the beginning. At the beginning, it was easy to read this thing over and over, but that does not seem to be the case anymore, lol. This is the best thread that I have ever come across. The team and all of the other contributors along with the ideas are amazing! I find the traders within this thread to be very humble and generous, which is awesome! I started off trading this system on a demo account and have now moved to trading live. Even though the account is small, I wanted to trade live so I could experience everything from that standpoint. My main goal for now is to be disciplined and consistent and then grow from there. To be perfectly honest, at the beginning, I cannot tell you how many times out of frustration I walked away because of not seeing what some of the other great traders within this thread were seeing. But by nature, I am a very persistent and it has been that trait that has finally paid off. RJ would refer to it as the Eureka Moment! So all I can say to anyone that might be frustrated, please stick with this system and continue to learn and practice. I promise it will eventually make sense. The things that you did not see before will become obvious . You will have the Eureka Moment! I have a long way to go, but thanks to RJ, Olivia, Cody, Oliver, Marty and all of the other contributors, I am getting there. I would like to give a special shout out to RJ. RJ, thanks for your knowledge and continuous generosity along with your efforts to keep this thread moving in the right direction. I cannot tell you what you and the other contributors have done for me. I am hoping Olivia makes her way back because her input was just amazing! I am also grateful to Marty for all of his contributions. With that being said, I am definitely in the mix every night and look forward to contributing. I just need a little more time to get situated and comfortable during the trading hours.

I almost forgot to mention, where would we be without the Stochastic? That indicator is a true gift. When I see that thing through the roof or floor, I get psyched! At that point, I am looking and hoping for a serious run in the same direction. I am definitely not looking to go in the opposite direction. To those who do not understand or appreciate the Stochastic, please do yourself a favor and learn all you can about it. Another thank you for that one RJ.
  • #10,777
  • Edited Mar 15, 2013 1:24am Mar 14, 2013 11:04am | Edited Mar 15, 2013 1:24am
When you use multiple monitors, MT4 Floating Charts may be useful. See more details in Google or Youtube search.

http://www.floatingcharts.com/welcome.php
Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication - Leonardo da Vinci
  • #10,778
  • Mar 14, 2013 11:10am Mar 14, 2013 11:10am
I read something very useful the other day from a poster called Islander (extremely good trader) and he was saying that because EJ is a synthetic pair (cross) if EU and UJ are moving in different directions he trades EU because it will be smoother, EJ will be choppy and if EU and UJ are moving in the same direction he trades EJ because it will be smooth and usually moves further. Ill see if I can find the post.

Here is one of them: http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...59#post6484159
  • #10,779
  • Mar 14, 2013 11:15am Mar 14, 2013 11:15am
Quoting heispark
When you use multiple monitors, MT4 Floating Charts may be useful. See more details in Google or Youtube search. It looks FXPro doesn't support it at this time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=eGQ7eF7QuOY

It is useful for sure.
A search on google will also allow you to have split screens on more than one monitor, though they would not have all the functionalities of the floating charts.
The split screens is cumbersome but it works.
.... laughing all the way to the bank
  • #10,780
  • Mar 14, 2013 11:34am Mar 14, 2013 11:34am
Quoting lastingwell
I read something very useful the other day from a poster called Islander (extremely good trader) and he was saying that because EJ is a synthetic pair (cross) if EU and UJ are moving in different directions he trades EU because it will be smoother, EJ will be choppy and if EU and UJ are moving in the same direction he trades EJ because it will be smooth and usually moves further. Ill see if I can find the post.

Here is one of them: http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...59#post6484159

I've just figured out why -but it would be a lengthy explanation lol
.... laughing all the way to the bank
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