Attachments: Sonic R. System

Sonic R. System

#41,821
Dec 5, 2012 4:03pm Dec 5, 2012 4:03pm

Shooter150
| Joined Mar 2011 | Status: Trader | 385 Posts

Quoting Shooter150

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GbpUsd entered short

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GbpUsd .. i m out on break even ..

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" Support/Resistance is your friend .. and TREND your girlfriend .. "

#41,822
Edited 4:31pm Dec 5, 2012 4:07pm | Edited 4:31pm

traderathome
Joined Mar 2008 | Status: PVSRA with Traderathome | 23,552 Posts

FXCM (NYC) Broker Comment:

An interesting thing just happened. The FXCM spread on EU went from 2+ pips to over 5 pips, then suddenly over 10 pips as the price spiked down. Now, was that FXCM spiking down the price simply by increasing the spread so it could run stops on longs and maybe trigger short pending orders, so it could take a long position? Waiting to see what PA follows. If PA goes up, then I will believe this was the situation. If price goes down, then I'll have to cogitate more on this to try and understand why that peculiar set of events happened. If the price goes down, then maybe FXCM increased it's spread momentarily to get the price lower to take the short side of lower long pending orders.

I checked the "market price" with some other (US) brokers: Alpari (US) and FXDD. Neither register prices as low as with FXCM.

This makes me wonder if FXCM is in habit of "creating" market swings that otherwise don't exist in the market outside the realm of FXCM, and for the purpose of building it's own positions at the expense of its client's open positions and/or pending orders. And it is interesting that this happened shortly after the new forex day got underway (very early in the first M15 TF - see time stamp for original posting).

(Worldfreedom might want to comment on this last point of interest.)

#41,823
Dec 5, 2012 6:47pm Dec 5, 2012 6:47pm

Jason Rogers
Joined Jun 2009 | Status: FXCM Representative | 5,808 Posts

Quoting traderathome

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FXCM (NYC) Broker Comment:

An interesting thing just happened. The FXCM spread on EU went from 2+ pips to over 5 pips, then suddenly over 10 pips as the price spiked down. Now, was that FXCM spiking down the price simply by increasing the spread so it could run stops on longs and maybe trigger short pending orders, so it could take a long position? Waiting to see what PA follows. If PA goes up, then I will believe this was the situation. If price goes down, then I'll have to cogitate more on this to try and understand why that peculiar set of...

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HI Traderathome,

Thanks for your comment. It's important to note that on our No Dealing Desk forex execution, FXCM doesn't determine the prices our clients trade on, and we don't make money from client losses. Our liquidity providers send us prices. We simply pass the best bid and ask onto our clients, and add a pip markup for our profit.

In regards to the price spike you saw, I notice your post was made right after 5pm New York time today. That's when trade rollover occurs. At 5pm every weekday trades are rolled from one trading day to the next and rollover interest is applied to open trades. The banks that provide us with liquidity will often briefly widen their spreads at this time as they refresh their servers.

Sorry to everyone, I didn't mean to hijack this thread. I've posted a more detailed response about this topic in the FXCM thread in the past. Feel free to hit me up there, if you have any follow up questions.

Jason

#41,824
Edited 10:25pm Dec 5, 2012 7:40pm | Edited 10:25pm

traderathome
Joined Mar 2008 | Status: PVSRA with Traderathome | 23,552 Posts

Quoting Jason Rogers

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HI Traderathome,

Thanks for your comment. It's important to note that on our No Dealing Desk forex execution, FXCM doesn't determine the prices our clients trade on, and we don't make money from client losses. Our liquidity providers send us prices. We simply pass the best bid and ask onto our clients, and add a pip markup for our profit.

In regards to the price spike you saw, I notice your post was made right after 5pm New York time today. That's when trade rollover occurs. At 5pm every weekday trades are rolled from one trading day to the...

Ignored

FXCM (NYC) Broker Comment:

Hi Jason,

Thank you for your reply. I took your link ride but ended up still with these questions. The spike down in question was not high volume, so why the sudden spread rise to over 10 pips in an "inactive" market where your spreads are typical, as they were before and after this sudden occurrance? This was not just a matter of a liquidity provider widening spreads for an "instant" of "computing rollover interest and adjusting accounts accordingly", because there were actual trades being executed during the moments of this event! And why is the FXCM price in that first time frame of the new day still exhibiting a lower low as a result of that event trading, than the other NYC forex brokers exhibit for the same time frame? These fundamental questions remain unanswered.

And you do function as a dealing desk broker. The following being taken from a footnote at the FXCM website (http://www.fxcm.com/advantages/forex...0000000MXcNAAW).....
"In the dealing desk model, FXCM acts as a market marker, setting the prices and spreads on which you trade. In this execution model, FXCM is on the other side of your trades. We can see your stops and limits and we profit from your trading losses."

And therefore, Jason, the question remains as to if FXCM intentionally increases spreads to reach prices they want to reach, in order to trigger pending client orders so FXCM can take positions on the opposite side, and/or in order to hit client stops on existing opposite side trades so FXCM can use that liquidity to get even more such positions. In all fairness to FXCM, maybe it does not actually increase the spread. Maybe the liquidity providing bank does, during rollover accounting, as you intimated. Maybe FXCM, knowing when this happens, just stands ready like a vulture to take advantage of the suddenly increased spread to trade as mentioned against it's client accounts during those brief moments. Either way, this would suggest an intent by FXCM to actively go after client money, rather than passively benefitting from client trading.

-tah

(Sonicers, I have posted this verbatum on the FXCM Discussion thread.)

#41,825
Dec 5, 2012 11:19pm Dec 5, 2012 11:19pm

Davidbeckham
| Joined Oct 2012 | Status: L.A Galaxy #23 | 110 Posts

beatifull wave at GU

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DB#23

#41,826
Dec 6, 2012 12:38am Dec 6, 2012 12:38am

SCopier
Joined Sep 2012 | Status: Trader | 953 Posts

EU open SELL

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#41,827
Dec 6, 2012 12:59am Dec 6, 2012 12:59am

SCopier
Joined Sep 2012 | Status: Trader | 953 Posts

Quoting SCopier

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EU open SELL

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Found this too

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#41,828
Edited 2:12am Dec 6, 2012 1:36am | Edited 2:12am

traderathome
Joined Mar 2008 | Status: PVSRA with Traderathome | 23,552 Posts

Quoting traderathome

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EU: Entered EU short. Late US session entry. Risk is that even if this is to drop more, it might run out of steam now. Then the upcoming asian session might put it higher again, before the move down resumes.

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EU: Going to let this ride to get more mileage out of it. Set TP2.

Edit: Maybe I should have taken profit. LS might pull this up now for a while. We'll see. Anyway, pic. #2 is my map for this for today. Of course I'd like to see price drop to TP3, but if this starts to look like a roller coaster day, I might "TP" before TP3, look for a pull up to re-enter. Revised TP2 seems a logical place for a dropping price to pause for a pull up. Now, to see what the market decides.

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#41,829
Dec 6, 2012 2:49am Dec 6, 2012 2:49am

traderathome
Joined Mar 2008 | Status: PVSRA with Traderathome | 23,552 Posts

AU Comment:

Sonicers, after getting the pump Tuesday, it sold off Wednesday. Asian session pumped it again today and then sold it off. Now the London boys are pumping it, presumably to also sell it off (Pump & Dump). Maybe today this will break the Trend and start down for real. But maybe not, because tomorrow (Friday) is a big day for high impact releases. So, with all the Pumps and Dumps on this one lately, that says the Market is building short positions, why would the Market be in any hurry today to start the drive down. Seems tomorrow, at the earliest, would be a better candidate for the day the Market pulls the rug on this one to start the profit making drive down.

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#41,830
Dec 6, 2012 2:58am Dec 6, 2012 2:58am

traderathome
Joined Mar 2008 | Status: PVSRA with Traderathome | 23,552 Posts

Market Comment:

Sonicers, today the London Market is knocking itself out "pumping" AU, EU, GU and "torpedoing" UCad, UChf. Tomorrow is a very key day for USD releases. You get the picture?

I'd not be looking for anything substantial today, as it seems the market is just posturing prices so it can load up for what is to come. Tomorrow, at the earliest is the more likely day for breakouts. And maybe not until next week.

As always, abide by the Dragon and PA, but with tomorrow being what it is and the current price manipulation being what it is, trading today might not be all that great. Just a thought.

-traderathome

#41,831
Dec 6, 2012 3:24am Dec 6, 2012 3:24am

Shooter150
| Joined Mar 2011 | Status: Trader | 385 Posts

UsdJpy entered long

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" Support/Resistance is your friend .. and TREND your girlfriend .. "

#41,832
Dec 6, 2012 3:44am Dec 6, 2012 3:44am

mihulea
| Joined Jun 2012 | Status: Trader | 66 Posts

So which is the latest system? And does it still work?
sonic I have a question in the attachment from post 14 why you didnt go short on the 14 October at 15:00 I would have but that would be a mistake how did you spot not to trade low?

#41,833
Dec 6, 2012 5:23am Dec 6, 2012 5:23am

ArtfulDodger
| Joined Jan 2010 | Status: Trader | 623 Posts

Quoting mihulea

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So which is the latest system? And does it still work?
sonic I have a question in the attachment from post 14 why you didnt go short on the 14 October at 15:00 I would have but that would be a mistake how did you spot not to trade low?

Ignored

In my opinion, a thread doesn't become the most viewed, most commented on thread on Forex Factory
unless it's effective. But it's more than "does it work," it's the application of the method by each and
every individual. It works - for those that "get it." It doesn't work for those that don't follow the rules.

You will find the latest templates and info on post #1.

#41,834
Dec 6, 2012 5:34am Dec 6, 2012 5:34am

Shooter150
| Joined Mar 2011 | Status: Trader | 385 Posts

Quoting ArtfulDodger

Disliked

In my opinion, a thread doesn't become the most viewed, most commented on thread on Forex Factory
unless it's effective. But it's more than "does it work," it's the application of the method by each and
every individual. It works - for those that "get it." It doesn't work for those that don't follow the rules.

You will find the latest templates and info on post #1.

Ignored