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Genesis Matrix Trading

  • #7,341
  • Nov 13, 2012 5:40pm Nov 13, 2012 5:40pm
Quoting realjumper
The Frankie and early part of London sessions were difficult to trade, there's no denying that....I showed at the time that I too had my SL hit in the AU trade, but I recovered in the later PA.

You are exactly correct about the M5 charts.....that is the precise reason that I use HA candles....they smooth out much of the noise. Also, that is the reason I want to see clean charts, not charts cluttered with all sorts of extra stuff!! If you find that working off the M15 or any other TF works better for you, then go ahead, use those TF's that you prefer....
Well I used to trade mainly H1 and higher tf.
I am finding Genesis excellent when spotting a possible set-up in a higher tf and then dropping 1 lower to find the entry.
I am very pleased with the way that this has worked with gold. Seeing a possible set up in H1 and entering with M15 charts.
I'm noting more evidence that even entering on M5 Gold may be possible. This was once inconcievable to me because of the 5 point spread.
Please Do Not PM Me With Coding Enquiries
  • #7,342
  • Nov 13, 2012 5:48pm Nov 13, 2012 5:48pm
Quoting Gumrai
Well I used to trade mainly H1 and higher tf.
I am finding Genesis excellent when spotting a possible set-up in a higher tf and then dropping 1 lower to find the entry.
I am very pleased with the way that this has worked with gold. Seeing a possible set up in H1 and entering with M15 charts.
I'm noting more evidence that even entering on M5 Gold may be possible. This was once inconcievable to me because of the 5 point spread.
Yes, the spread in gold is an issue for me too, and to be honest, I find that the currency pairs I monitor give enough opportunities without me needing to try my hand with gold/silver/oil etc. I know they can be hugely profitable, but for some reason I find it easier to be 'in tune' with the currency pairs than I do with the others. I love seeing other people trading these instruments though, so never be shy to show us how it goes
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #7,343
  • Nov 13, 2012 5:59pm Nov 13, 2012 5:59pm
[quote=Gumrai;6191815]I have to admit that I am really not very good at reading M5 charts. I find it difficult to discern between market noise and reliable S/R.
At the time of this trade, I looked at the M15 chart and read PA as
Downmove
retracement stopped at S1
Lower low with breach of S2
Lower high that once again tests S1 as resistance.
Bearish M15 arrow
M15 stoch turned down
Good M5 stoch

Hi Gumrai,

I too look to the 15m chart for trade entries before I contemplate taking entry on 5m (dependant on what PA is doing), most of the time I look to trade the 15m signal as I find it more reliable than 5m and as you mentioned, it cuts out alot of noise.

The reasons for me not taking this particular trade were:-

1. As you mentioned, PA broke the daily low but retraced rapidly to close on S2.

2. 15m stoch had previously dipped below the 20 level but did not make it much above the 50 level on the retracement, now this does not make it a no-go trade on its own but does make me wary of any further downward momentum.

3. I always look at the 1H stoch when trading on 15m TF. At the time the 1H stoch had been steadily rising for some considerable time. This made the trade a no-no for me.

Just my 2cent worth.
A MOUSE THAT ROARS IS STILL NOTHING MORE THAN A MOUSE!
  • #7,344
  • Nov 13, 2012 6:04pm Nov 13, 2012 6:04pm
Quoting realjumper
What part of "show your charts" do you not understand????

Do you really expect anyone to go through this list and try and find what you say on their charts??? Get real!!!

Either produce the charts or be quiet.
Geez, read your own signature line... I joined and posted to help turn a somewhat subjective system into a purely objective one - along with an EA. It took me 20 mins to put that list together for the week - to look at the trade times and visually check entry validity should take no more than 5 mins. Then perhaps we could move on to identifying and testing other objective filters to allow for a profitable 100% rule-based system. You already use these filters every day trading subjectively, and you have a feel for which ones are more important than others. I could do this alone, but it would be faster and benefit a lot more people if done together. Do you want help or would you prefer I go away?
  • #7,345
  • Nov 13, 2012 6:10pm Nov 13, 2012 6:10pm
Quoting Barbaresco
Geez, read your own signature line... I joined and posted to help turn a somewhat subjective system into a purely objective one - along with an EA. It took me 20 mins to put that list together for the week - to look at the trade times and visually check entry validity should take no more than 5 mins. Then perhaps we could move on to identifying and testing other objective filters to allow for a profitable 100% rule-based system. You already use these filters every day trading subjectively, and you have a feel for which ones are more important...
How many times to I have to say "POST YOUR CHARTS?????????"
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #7,346
  • Nov 13, 2012 6:46pm Nov 13, 2012 6:46pm
Quoting realjumper
Yes, the spread in gold is an issue for me too, and to be honest, I find that the currency pairs I monitor give enough opportunities without me needing to try my hand with gold/silver/oil etc. I know they can be hugely profitable, but for some reason I find it easier to be 'in tune' with the currency pairs than I do with the others. I love seeing other people trading these instruments though, so never be shy to show us how it goes
I don't even bother to look at silver. It's a 4 point spread with my broker and as high as 8 with others I believe.As a % a 4 point spread on silver would equate to a 16 pip spread on EU and who would trade with a spread like that?

Unfortunately there has not been any action for me with Gold for some time. Good set-ups haven't happened while I've been at my computer and I haven't traded Gold for over a week now.

Missed a beautiful text book range break-out and test of the range low. When I see set-ups like this I almost start to drool M15 chart posted
Going down to the M5 chart there were 2 possible entries after the test of the range low. The first one was a continuation signal, wasn't so great, but still went about 28 points (minus spread) in profit
The 2nd entry looked much better and if able to hold during the ranging period after US close, went over 70 points.
Note that there was no Genesis reversal signal given on the M15 chart any time during this period.
I was sound asleep while these set-ups occured, but just thought that I would like to post the charts of how I like to trade and how I am seeing that there may well be opportunities for me to trade Gold in M5 when conditions look good
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: gold.gif Size: 30 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: gold m5.gif Size: 25 KB
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  • #7,347
  • Nov 13, 2012 6:50pm Nov 13, 2012 6:50pm
Quoting realjumper
How many times to I have to say "POST YOUR CHARTS?????????"
Sunday and part of Monday attached. Signals noted by vertical lines - entry on the next bar. Green for Long and Red for Short. SL is the previous #3 Semafor. Just looking to perfect the entry at this point. Thinking to add S/R, Daily Range, and Time for filters... to get rid of the false break entries. I mentioned in a previous post - adding a higher TF as a filter may also be beneficial, but can act as a proxy for directional bias, which may need to be toggled on and off based on other factors like the ones mentioned above...
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: EUChart.jpg Size: 123 KB
  • #7,348
  • Edited 7:24pm Nov 13, 2012 7:10pm | Edited 7:24pm
In my chart posted here, I really only see one really good set-up and that is number 3.
It is in the direction of the main move and everything looks good on M5
Number 8 would have worked well, but I would not have taken it as I can't get hold of a hindsight indicator
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: eu.gif Size: 35 KB
Please Do Not PM Me With Coding Enquiries
  • #7,349
  • Edited 8:17pm Nov 13, 2012 7:19pm | Edited 8:17pm
Quoting Barbaresco
Sunday and part of Monday attached. Signals noted by vertical lines - entry on the next bar. Green for Long and Red for Short. SL is the previous #3 Semafor. Just looking to perfect the entry at this point. Thinking to add S/R, Daily Range, and Time for filters... to get rid of the false break entries. I mentioned in a previous post - adding a higher TF as a filter may also be beneficial, but can act as a proxy for directional bias, which may need to be toggled on and off based on other factors like the ones mentioned above...
Ok...now.....can you repost the chart with the Frankfurt open time marked, as we all do here. Any trades before Frankfurt open will be disregarded

Also, I don't see any pivots on your charts or stochastic, and get rid of the repainting Semafor indicator, and add the arrow indicator as per Post #1

Come on.......If you want to pick holes in the system that's ok with me....but I am not going to entertain anything you say unless you are going to trade this as per the setups posted from Post #1

Your getting very close to being ejected from this thread......post the charts as specified in the Genesis System set ups and as everyone else posts their charts.
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #7,350
  • Nov 13, 2012 10:49pm Nov 13, 2012 10:49pm
Quoting realjumper
Ok...now.....can you repost the chart with the Frankfurt open time marked, as we all do here. Any trades before Frankfurt open will be disregarded

Also, I don't see any pivots on your charts or stochastic, and get rid of the repainting Semafor indicator, and add the arrow indicator as per Post #1

Come on.......If you want to pick holes in the system that's ok with me....but I am not going to entertain anything you say unless you are going to trade this as per the setups posted from Post #1

Your getting very close to being ejected from this...
I guess I may be ejected - I don't want to discuss charts as it is a waste of time - it is very clear what the basic rules are from posts 1 and 2. Instead, I want to discuss all of the subjective criteria involved in taking and exiting trades, their respective order of importance, and which subjective considerations supercede an otherwise valid Gen signal. This may be gleaned from the thread, but I am here instead to collaborate, and thought it might be helpful for others to have an EA for Genesis. If you don't want to discuss this or believe it a waste of time, just write that, rather than telling me to post charts, and I will gladly leave. If you will give input, however, I will gladly code the extra filters and run the stats.
  • #7,351
  • Nov 13, 2012 11:01pm Nov 13, 2012 11:01pm
  •  Jamz
  • | Joined May 2012 | Status: Tops and bottoms are for bikinis | 798 Posts
Quote
Barbaresco I want to discuss all of the subjective criteria involved in taking and exiting trades,

I would suggest that to do this there would be nothing better than a good chart of what criteria you would like to discuss. Put up one chart with one entry and let's discuss it....otherwise it sounds pedantic -- we need pictures which make things obvious.
  • #7,352
  • Nov 13, 2012 11:23pm Nov 13, 2012 11:23pm
Quoting Barbaresco
I guess I may be ejected - I don't want to discuss charts as it is a waste of time - it is very clear what the basic rules are from posts 1 and 2. Instead, I want to discuss all of the subjective criteria involved in taking and exiting trades, their respective order of importance, and which subjective considerations supercede an otherwise valid Gen signal. This may be gleaned from the thread, but I am here instead to collaborate, and thought it might be helpful for others to have an EA for Genesis. If you don't want to discuss this or believe...
Discussing which subjective considerations supercede an otherwise valid Gen signal is very good and useful.
The problem is that different traders have different ideas of what is important and we all have our own trading styles.
Genesis seems to be working for me because I am using it to pipoint a nice entry point when trading using my own criteria as to what constitutes a good set up.

You will see many charts posted in the thread that you may well think that only a fool would enter there, ie when the market is obviously ranging or a short in strong uptrend.
I would think that if you applied everybody's different filters, you would probably never enter a trade
Please Do Not PM Me With Coding Enquiries
  • #7,353
  • Nov 13, 2012 11:29pm Nov 13, 2012 11:29pm
Quoting Barbaresco
I guess I may be ejected - I don't want to discuss charts as it is a waste of time - it is very clear what the basic rules are from posts 1 and 2. Instead, I want to discuss all of the subjective criteria involved in taking and exiting trades, their respective order of importance, and which subjective considerations supercede an otherwise valid Gen signal. This may be gleaned from the thread, but I am here instead to collaborate, and thought it might be helpful for others to have an EA for Genesis. If you don't want to discuss this or believe...
You came to this thread and stated that "bad Genesis signals outweigh the good signals"......I have been trying and trying and trying to get you to back that statement up by showing us the charts that support your claim.

Not only have you not produced the charts to support your claim, you have shown us a single chart that is not the Genesis system and does not follow the Genesis recommendations.

So......I ask you for the LAST TIME......produce the charts to support your claim that Genesis System produces more bad signals than good one.
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #7,354
  • Nov 14, 2012 12:18am Nov 14, 2012 12:18am
Seems at least a few people want to go through the subjective criteria. In the AM (US), I will post a chart as requested so as not to get booted from the thread, and hopefully we can start the discussion.

Gumrai - yes, different trading styles - more opportunity to find the optimum set of filters. We can test all the different combinations and make subjective become objective.

Jamz - understood - will do
  • #7,355
  • Nov 14, 2012 12:25am Nov 14, 2012 12:25am
  •  Jamz
  • | Joined May 2012 | Status: Tops and bottoms are for bikinis | 798 Posts
Quote
realjumper So......I ask you for the LAST TIME......produce the charts

Wow! You've said this 9000 times now!
  • #7,356
  • Nov 14, 2012 12:30am Nov 14, 2012 12:30am
Quoting Barbaresco
Seems at least a few people want to go through the subjective criteria. In the AM (US), I will post a chart as requested so as not to get booted from the thread, and hopefully we can start the discussion.

Gumrai - yes, different trading styles - more opportunity to find the optimum set of filters. We can test all the different combinations and make subjective become objective.

Jamz - understood - will do
No. Let me stop you right there. You have not read the thread, that is very obvious. There won't be a discussion as we are not looking for any extra 'sets of filters' and we are not looking for an EA. We have a team here and the team test rigorously any new idea or indicators before we release them to the thread. We don't do discussions on the thread about development, we trade the Genesis System as supplied, and we help new traders learn to be profitable by using the system. Any new indicators or ideas are to be brought to any one of the team members who will bring the indicator/idea to the rest of the team and we will evaluate it over a considerable period and in all market conditions. That's the way we do it here.

No body asked you to do anything here.....you came here and stated that after lots of tests you have decided that Genesis produces more bad signals than good ones and you cannot or will not back up your assertion.

Stick to the rules of the thread and you will be fine. Do not attempt to come here, make wild claims that you cannot back up and then try to steer the thread in a direction that *you personally* would like it go. It doesn't work that way.

You are walking on very thin ice now......
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #7,357
  • Nov 14, 2012 12:32am Nov 14, 2012 12:32am
Quoting Jamz
Wow! You've said this 9000 times now!
LOL...the BRN!!
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #7,358
  • Nov 14, 2012 12:51am Nov 14, 2012 12:51am
I am trying to learn this trading.... wish me luck!
  • #7,359
  • Nov 14, 2012 1:27am Nov 14, 2012 1:27am
Quoting markgrejaldo
I am trying to learn this trading.... wish me luck!
If you are a newbie trader. first thing that you have to learn is that "luck" should not be necessary
There are successful traders
There are un-successful traders
And there are unsuccessul traders that think that they are unlucky and also believe that the successful traders are lucky.

Can't remember who said it, but it is very apt
"The harder I work, the luckier I get"

Please Do Not PM Me With Coding Enquiries
  • #7,360
  • Nov 14, 2012 1:36am Nov 14, 2012 1:36am
Quoting Gumrai
If you are a newbie trader. first thing that you have to learn is that "luck" should not be necessary
There are successful traders
There are un-successful traders
And there are unsuccessul traders that think that they are unlucky and also believe that the successful traders are lucky.

Can't remember who said it, but it is very apt
"The harder I work, the luckier I get"

Hey Gumrai,

I've been trading for about a year, so I guess I'm not that new lol. But I'm new with this system, so I guess I'm but a newbie here in the thread if you would call it lol.

Thanks for the welcome and many pips to you today! I'm hoping to post my charts soon.
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