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EurAnalysis Kindergarten 24 replies

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  • #50,021
  • Aug 24, 2012 9:59am Aug 24, 2012 9:59am
Quoting halkins
:-) no, no...
but IMO changing trend has mostly 7 stages, (just simple way):
1. Support/resistance touched, loosing momentum...
2. Price action confirms changing the trend, bars, SMA etc...
3. Retails traders see it, they buy or sell moving the market, market sentiment changed
4. NOW... Really BIG BOYS come to game with their big orders above or below existing price
5. They move the market in oposite direction (ratail traders are in shock, why?)
6. Big BOYS orders are triggered and they jump into the market
7. Markets goes exactely...
I always have the impression from here that retail traders even collectively will have no influence on the price?
  • #50,022
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:04am Aug 24, 2012 10:04am
Ok now let's say I'm a BIG BOY and I want to short Biiiiiiiiggg. And I want an average price around let's say 1.25500. How do I operate ?

Quoting halkins
Like for now I am prepared that the price may reverse and my last point to trigger another short is 1.26150.
There could be a BIG BOY (don't know how else to name them) on MONDAY, let's say BANK OF CHINA and if they want to go short and will place $1.000.000.000 order to sell at 1.2615 the market will definitely go there, and there's nothing you and me can do about it...
Inflation in things we need, Deflation in things we want.
  • #50,023
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:09am Aug 24, 2012 10:09am
Quoting halkins
Like for now I am prepared that the price may reverse and my last point to trigger another short is 1.26150.
There could be a BIG BOY (don't know how else to name them) on MONDAY, let's say BANK OF CHINA and if they want to go short and will place $1.000.000.000 order to sell at 1.2615 the market will definitely go there, and there's nothing you and me can do about it...
Well if the PBOC wants to sell at 1.2615, that would be wonderful because that is exactly where I placed my sell limit order this morning.


Quoting PipTrapper
Mine was also missed by 2 pips.
I'm not going to chase price. In fact I feel that if price retests the high, it will probably overshoot a bit to test the 1.2615/20 resistance. As such, I have moved my sell limit from 1.2592 to 1.2615
Those who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it
  • #50,024
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:10am Aug 24, 2012 10:10am
Quoting Thijs
Ok now let's say I'm a BIG BOY and I want to short Biiiiiiiiggg. And I want an average price around let's say 1.25500. How do I operate ?
I want to know this too. I don't have billions of hard cash but definitely want to understand the craft.
  • #50,025
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:11am Aug 24, 2012 10:11am
Quoting halkins
They risk, as everybody else.
But they NEVER EVER buy or sell at spot price.
They don't use MT4 and have access to informations we can only dream about.
They are MARKET MAKERS, we are MARKET followers.
Even a simple broker can see millions of information that we don't have an access to, let alone a bank or hedge fund.
i dont truly beleive it,1,retail market is only a small part of the fx.2,as u go up the ladder those boy have equal knowledge and information which cancel out everything and they feed on each other as well just like cannibals 3,these big boys are not in the business of hunting stops and what we call stop hunting is nothing more than the activity of different time frames 4,big boys are there to hedge and not for profits 5.if u have smaller position and bigger time frame for entry and spread our ur position one rarely experience any loss and even one has to take loss it will be so small that the profit one take out of the market is bigger than the loss like i took 100 pips loss on g/u but the profit i manage to squeeze out is much bigger and consistent 6,if i correctly understand big hedge funds distribute the money to each trader individually and leave him alone to squeeze the profit out of the market by using his method and style otherwise u wont see rogue traders one tend to see in the market 7.LTCM consider to be big boys with all the technology and information at their hand and despite that they went under,who are the trader on opposite end and squeezing them hard 8,lehman brother went down despite all the information and what of about bear stearn and merry lynch,
my point is one need skills and those skills depend on many factors including time frame and leverage one is using.if lemmings suffer its not becos of market makers or big hedge fund has better information but becos of thier greed and fear and not having enuff emotional control and capitalisation.
Allah has permitted trade and has forbidden interest [koran]
  • #50,026
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:11am Aug 24, 2012 10:11am
Quoting Ken A
I always have the impression from here that retail traders even collectively will have no influence on the price?
Oh, retail traders do have an influance.
We all make so called "noise" on 1M chart

"Retail" traders are traders who use real money orders...
Don't know exactly but it is called I think STP (Straight Through Processing)
So they place orders to the market, not broker...
A small bank in Kazahstan is retail broker too
Read Charts - Not Papers
  • #50,027
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:13am Aug 24, 2012 10:13am
Quoting Thijs
Ok now let's say I'm a BIG BOY and I want to short Biiiiiiiiggg. And I want an average price around let's say 1.25500. How do I operate ?
Nothing more then you do now, except you must have "REAL CASH MONEY"
You place order and ...wait.
Read Charts - Not Papers
  • #50,028
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:14am Aug 24, 2012 10:14am
Quoting halkins
Oh, retail traders do have an influance.
We all make so called "noise" on 1M chart

"Retail" traders are traders who use real money orders...
Don't know exactly but it is called I think STP (Straight Through Processing)
So they place orders to the market, not broker...
A small bank in Kazahstan is retail broker too
So what is the minimum requirement to make it to the so called STP?
  • #50,029
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:17am Aug 24, 2012 10:17am
Quoting Ken A
So what is the minimum requirement to make it to the so called STP?
Hehe...
On EURPLN it is 50mil, but on EURUSD it must be a cluster of few BIG BOYS meeting at one level... billions
Read Charts - Not Papers
  • #50,030
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:19am Aug 24, 2012 10:19am
Too much to talk...
check this out maybe

Inserted Video
Read Charts - Not Papers
  • #50,031
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:20am Aug 24, 2012 10:20am
This is important to understand how is the price made!
Check out YouTube on "Market Makers Forex"
Here's another one...

Inserted Video
Read Charts - Not Papers
  • #50,032
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:21am Aug 24, 2012 10:21am
Quoting halkins
Hehe...
On EURPLN it is 50mil, but on EURUSD it must be a cluster of few BIG BOYS meeting at one level... billions
Ah more or less like the old days before the internet is widely available and nothing has changed.

You have my virtual Vouch.
  • #50,033
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:26am Aug 24, 2012 10:26am
Quoting Ken A
Ah more or less like the old days before the internet is widely available and nothing has changed.

You have my virtual Vouch.
There's one film on YouTube how so called "FLOOR TRADERS" suffer depression because they have to sit in front of 20 computer screens all day, while they were all trained to trade live on Wall Street
They all miss "the real action, noise, ambience"
Read Charts - Not Papers
  • #50,034
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:28am Aug 24, 2012 10:28am
Quoting PipTrapper
Well if the PBOC wants to sell at 1.2615, that would be wonderful because that is exactly where I placed my sell limit order this morning.
Mine was there yesterday!
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  • #50,035
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:29am Aug 24, 2012 10:29am
Quoting drzakir123
(...)
my point is one need skills and those skills depend on many factors including time frame and leverage one is using.if lemmings suffer its not becos of market makers or big hedge fund has better information but becos of thier greed and fear and not having enuff emotional control and capitalisation.
Market Makers do not use leverage...
They work exactly the same way as you buy stocks or bonds.
-
Read Charts - Not Papers
  • #50,036
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:49am Aug 24, 2012 10:49am
Quoting halkins
Market Makers do not use leverage...
They work exactly the same way as you buy stocks or bonds.
-
Of course. Leverage doesn't move markets. Real money does.

Thanks for those videos by the way. Cleared up a question I had about how liquidity is always available. I thought it was just a phenomenon of the markets through "trader" volume, when it fact it is a requirement for "market makers" to provide it 24/5
Those who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it
  • #50,037
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:54am Aug 24, 2012 10:54am
Quoting halkins
Market Makers do not use leverage...
They work exactly the same way as you buy stocks or bonds.
-
off course they dont use leverage and one need to understand that fact to the depth of thier bones,holy grail of making money in the market is:



proper capitalization +negative leverage +big time frame = profits

and i dont use stop loss with the above formula and i decide when to take the loss and profit and market dont give me the loss or profit and thats why i am in control of the whole process.
Allah has permitted trade and has forbidden interest [koran]
  • #50,038
  • Aug 24, 2012 10:59am Aug 24, 2012 10:59am
Quoting halkins
There's one film on YouTube how so called "FLOOR TRADERS" suffer depression because they have to sit in front of 20 computer screens all day, while they were all trained to trade live on Wall Street
They all miss "the real action, noise, ambience"
I know few people with the capacity you mentioned for EUR/USD that work thru brokers. Is there any particular reasons for them to do so instead of direct to counter?

My pride was too high to ask them this question also it could be a sensitive issue.
  • #50,039
  • Aug 24, 2012 11:01am Aug 24, 2012 11:01am
Quoting drzakir123
off course they dont use leverage and one need to understand that fact to the depth of thier bones,holy grail of making money in the market is:



proper capitalization +negative leverage +big time frame = profits

and i dont use stop loss with the above formula and i decide when to take the loss and profit and market dont give me the loss or profit and thats why i am in control of the whole process.
Doc,
Please explain what you mean by negative leverage?
I think it may be issue of different languages of understanding what is meant.Thanks.
  • #50,040
  • Aug 24, 2012 11:02am Aug 24, 2012 11:02am
Quoting halkins
There's one film on YouTube how so called "FLOOR TRADERS" suffer depression because they have to sit in front of 20 computer screens all day, while they were all trained to trade live on Wall Street
They all miss "the real action, noise, ambience"
Ah yeah I saw that movie recently.

Now they don't know how to trade because they can't read the other guys emotions or facial expressions to hit a middle price. Some of them can't adjust. You can't read emotion or gauge at what price someone wants to sell that over a chart,.. or can you?

Most of them seemed like real gamblers to me though.
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