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Sonic R. System

  • #38,261
  • Edited 5:03am Aug 2, 2012 4:43am | Edited 5:03am
Quoting traderathome
page1, post1, links to TAH indys and templates, and to the Sonic R. System Manual (brief form). Suggest you read all of post1, and all of the material linked in post1. And read Sonics posts. Read, read, read.
really thanks traderathome.
your template is interesting. i will read everything. thanks again

sorry for disturb!!!!
  • #38,262
  • Edited 6:24am Aug 2, 2012 5:09am | Edited 6:24am
Quoting Domas4
You have no evidence to believe that "RIGHT NOW IT SEEMS THAT BIG BOYS ARE BUILDING THEIR POSITIONS, therefore I move my stoploss." How do you know that? You don't, you just speculate. That's all you do. Right when you open a position and market starts moving against you you think "oooohhh, that's the BigBoys hitting all the orders and getting ready to reverse." Well done TAH. Alternative way of explaining what is happening - demand and supply. That's it, that's all you need. Excellent thinking. I'm done with this thread....
Fine, throw out some pat terms and then run off and avoid any attempt at more expicitly explaining how suddenly, in the midst of a move up, the price suddenly spikes down many pips and just as suddenly moves back up again. If you don't like my explanation, fine. Don't accept it. You say I have no evidence to support my explanation. Neither do you have evidence to refute my explanation. I was talking about SLs, and you got into making an issue of this. It is no issue. These spikes are a fact of life in the maket, no matter what the explanation for them is, and that is the true issue, that and how to deal with them when it comes to deciding on where to place a SL. That was the point of my original post. And you, not me, went into a tirade over this aside.

Leave if you want to, my friend (and you still are so far as I am concerned). You have left before. Just don't use me as an excuse for lack of commitment to this thread. I have been hammered on by many. In fact, I am likely the most hammered on person that has ever posted on this thread. So, if anyone has an excuse to leave, it is me. I stay here because I want to be a better trader and because I am commited to this thread. Beliefs, if mistaken, will eventually change. Trading performance, if poor, can eventually improve. I believe these things. And, I believe in the Sonic R. System. I did not come here having everything right. I still don't have everything right. But I continue the effort to improve. You take issue with something I believe. I asked you for information to help me believe otherwise. You decided to leave. How is that response of any value to this thread, Domas4? It would have been better for this thread if you had simply posted a "Tsk, tsk." to my original post, stayed positive, and remained a valuable contributor. I have endured far worse than this little aside is for you, yet I am still here.
  • #38,263
  • Aug 2, 2012 5:26am Aug 2, 2012 5:26am
Quoting traderathome
In the early asian session on Wednesday there were spikes down on AU. I, and another trader were watching them on M1. Three different brokers had them, and all were dissimilar! Different spikes from different brokers. And all occurred soon before the price reversed and went back up 30+ pips. So, what is your point?
TAH, before your editing post you did list all three quotes, you did declare a discrepancy of 17 pips. If this is really true it is unbelieveable.
Quoting alexbs
17pips different on 5digits broker is still reasonable..


17digit different on 4digits broker is just nonsense..
I did check my own quotes of 3 different brokers (2 MT4 and one none MT4) and all quotes are within a 2 pips range.

Quoting traderathome
The low of one broker was 17 pips lower than that of the broker with the highest low. It doesn't bother me. I don't need to change brokers.[..]
Sure it doesn't bother you because they are not your brokers, but it would help for declaring what brokers these are.
  • #38,264
  • Edited 6:15am Aug 2, 2012 5:44am | Edited 6:15am
This is not the only way but keep it simple:

EuroUsd TF M15
TP 28 pips with SL 18 pips
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 2 august 2012.GIF Size: 20 KB
fooled by randomness in art
Meditation All Time Return: 8.9%
  • #38,265
  • Aug 2, 2012 6:00am Aug 2, 2012 6:00am
Quoting futurespeter
TAH, before your editing post you did list all three quotes, you did declare a discrepancy of 17 pips. If this is really true it is unbelieveable. I did check my own quotes of 3 different brokers (2 MT4 and one none MT4) and all quotes are within a 2 pips range. Sure it doesn't bother you because they are not your brokers, but it would help for declaring what brokers these are.
I edited the values out of the post because I did not understand what point alexbs was making, except maybe that all broker quotes are the same. I didn't think the actual values added anything to my response, and might even bring up more questions. Which, now is the case.

Three brokers were involved in what I and another trader saw. The other trader was the person that brought the event to my attention, stating he just had a spike down to 1.0449 on his platform. I did not see such a low. I checked with two of my brokers and found spikes also, one at around 1.0465 and the other at around 1.0456. And now, if you look back on the M15 TF chart of different brokers, the low is around 1.04628! I did not want to get into this, what with the thing going on between me and Domas4 at the time,.....this would only have made things worse. The values were painted on the charts. They were there. They were different. And they remained. And now, they are gone. I'm sure Domas4 would have made another issue of this, claiming it could not have happened. So, I decided to not leave those values in the post. Well, there you now have it all. For whatever it is worth.
  • #38,266
  • Aug 2, 2012 6:10am Aug 2, 2012 6:10am
Quoting RoelsMajor
This is not the only way but keep it simple:

TP 28 pips with SL 18 pips
RoelsMajor, please post charts that clearly label the pair ID, TF, etc.

I am not sure if you are posting this as an example of a Sonic R. System long trade, which it surely is. Or, if you are posting it as a trade you made. If you are going to post a real trade of yours, please do so at the time you enter the trade, and then follow it up with a post when you exit or get stopped out of the trade.

Please remember, Master Sonicdeejay's intent for this thread is that it be a manual for those aspiring to learn the Sonic R. System and improve in its application to the market. There are a lot of posts on this thread for students to wade thru, so please make your posted charts such that folks don't have to waste time hunting for basic information (pair ID, TF, etc.).

Your TP1 was better placed than mine when I posted my trade entry, as it has so far turned out. Congratulations!

Thank you,
-tah
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
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  • #38,267
  • Aug 2, 2012 7:16am Aug 2, 2012 7:16am
Quoting traderathome
Your TP1 was better placed than mine when I posted my trade entry, as it has so far turned out. Congratulations!
Thank you,
-tah
Nope, yours better...
Congratulations for 45 pips
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 2 august 2012.gif Size: 22 KB
fooled by randomness in art
Meditation All Time Return: 8.9%
  • #38,268
  • Aug 2, 2012 7:16am Aug 2, 2012 7:16am
I would like to know if is a must for a candle to close above last swing high in a up trend or viceversa for downtrend or you just need to see the break of that high or low?Thank you
  • #38,269
  • Aug 2, 2012 7:53am Aug 2, 2012 7:53am
Quoting marcelms
I would like to know if is a must for a candle to close above last swing high in a up trend or viceversa for downtrend or you just need to see the break of that high or low?Thank you

The truth is trading isn't just about a system...Not only that if above the line..BUY and below that line SELL..

Even you have a system with 90% winning rate,,,when 1 losing trade comes, it could destroy your entire acc...

So the truth is .. a normal system with money management...

Sonic
  • #38,270
  • Aug 2, 2012 7:55am Aug 2, 2012 7:55am
whats is going on???
  • #38,271
  • Aug 2, 2012 8:14am Aug 2, 2012 8:14am
Quoting albus999
whats is going on???
very nice huh?
  • #38,272
  • Edited 8:31am Aug 2, 2012 8:18am | Edited 8:31am
Quoting albus999
whats is going on???
Not much really - it went up to an daily sr flipzone for a retest. Look at the

date of the 15 min chart marked with the last date 26/7 (the middle one)

Regards,
H.
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: eu daily.gif Size: 34 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: eu 26-07-2012 16.45 gmt + 1.gif Size: 37 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: eu 15 min aug 2-2012.gif Size: 36 KB
"The future is already written in the past"
  • #38,273
  • Aug 2, 2012 8:22am Aug 2, 2012 8:22am
Quoting sonicdeejay
The truth is trading isn't just about a system...Not only that if above the line..BUY and below that line SELL..

Even you have a system with 90% winning rate,,,when 1 losing trade comes, it could destroy your entire acc...

So the truth is .. a normal system with money management...

Sonic
Thak you for your answer but i was trying to find out if in a downtrend or uptrend i have to wait for the candle to close above or below that last swing high or swing low to be a SonicR setup.Thank you kindly.
  • #38,274
  • Aug 2, 2012 8:31am Aug 2, 2012 8:31am
Quoting sonicdeejay
The truth is trading isn't just about a system...Not only that if above the line..BUY and below that line SELL..

Even you have a system with 90% winning rate,,,when 1 losing trade comes, it could destroy your entire acc...

So the truth is .. a normal system with money management...

Sonic
"Money management is like sex: Everyone does it, one way or another, but not many like to talk about it and some do it better than others. But there's a big difference: Sex sites on the Web proliferate, while sites devoted to the art and science of money management are somewhat difficult to find."
Gibbons Burke

A Winning System has a proven Money Management.
So what makes up a Winning System?
Honesty is a very expensive gift. You wont find it in cheap people.WBuffett
  • #38,275
  • Aug 2, 2012 2:07pm Aug 2, 2012 2:07pm
Quoting traderathome
EJ: Entered long per picture.
EJ: TP1 reached while sleeping. Trade closed for 66 pips gain EP1 to TP1.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #38,276
  • Aug 2, 2012 2:10pm Aug 2, 2012 2:10pm
Quoting traderathome
EU: Entered long per attached.
EU: TP1 reached. Trade closed while sleeping for 53 pips gain EP1 to TP1.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: aug 2012 - 011.gif Size: 29 KB
  • #38,277
  • Edited 6:07pm Aug 2, 2012 5:56pm | Edited 6:07pm
Quoting marcelms
I would like to know if is a must for a candle to close above last swing high in a up trend or viceversa for downtrend or you just need to see the break of that high or low?Thank you
Quoting sonicdeejay
The truth is trading isn't just about a system...Not only that if above the line..BUY and below that line SELL..

Even you have a system with 90% winning rate,,,when 1 losing trade comes, it could destroy your entire acc...

So the truth is .. a normal system with money management...

Sonic
Sonicers, this is important!

Entries & Money Management
The rule for initial Sonic R. entry is that it should be at least a few pips beyond the end of the candle that first exists the Dragon on leg #3 of the PA wave. This is very clear, so I presume you are asking about entries in the same direction subsequent to the initial entry. In this case, you can place your order at the last high in a move up, or at the last low in a move down, so that the order is triggered if the price moves back thru it. As you know, the price could recede and not close beyond where you placed this order. If the price continues to recede, your SL management should come into play to handle the situation. As Master Sonicdeejay just said, "..a normal system with money management..."

And let us not forget the essence of the Sonic R. System, which is the analysis of PA waves with regard to support and resistance, and with regard to the Dragon also.

Dragon
As far as the Dragon is concerned, it is an essential part of the Sonic R. System, contrary to what a number of folks have erroneously stated here on this thread. A good angle on the Dragon, more times than not, is a good indication of momentum, which helps the trade. You won't get that signal from PA alone. And the rule for initial entry that uses the Dragon, more times than not, helps you avoid headfakes.

Support & Resistance
Now, on to support and resistance. We need to see clearly where support and resistance areas are. We use them to select where to Take Profit. We also use them to decide where to place the Stop Loss. Price moves from one of these levels to another, believe it or not! In support of this statement, I have included the H4 chart of the EU move during the last London session. Behold, price whipsawed between two major S&R levels! Resistance was actually support back late in June. The current support was the support area that price gapped down to late in July. So, with some reliablility, we can use S&R for TPs and for placing the SL.

As a practical illustration of using S&R I have included on the H4 chart the levels used for TP and SL on my most recent EU long trade. And, I have included the two pictures previously posted for that trade; the one at entry, and the one showing the TP reached (while I slept).

Conclusion
In conclusion, for one thing listen to Master Sonicdeejay when he says trading is not just about any system that says if above some line, buy, or if below some line, sell. Trading is about disciplined adherence to good money management more than anything else! For another thing, see the S&R areas and use them for setting the TP and SL. It won't guarantee the TP being reached, nor that the SL is not reached. You might want to place the TP a little closer than the S&R area used. You might want to place the SL a little further than the S&R area used. Using S&R works for setting the TP and SL as well as anything can! And that is pretty darn good considering nothing can predict what the market is going to do next.

For All True Sonicers,
-tah
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
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Click to Enlarge Name: aug 2012 - 005.gif Size: 33 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: aug 2012 - 011.gif Size: 29 KB
  • #38,278
  • Aug 2, 2012 6:46pm Aug 2, 2012 6:46pm
Quoting traderathome
...
Conclusion
In conclusion, for one thing listen to Master Sonicdeejay when he says trading is not just about any system that says if above some line, buy, or if below some line, sell. Trading is about disciplined adherence to good money management more than anything else! For another thing,

what is good money management?
its there bad money management?

Money Management is like sex.
Good Money Management is like good sex.
Honesty is a very expensive gift. You wont find it in cheap people.WBuffett
  • #38,279
  • Aug 2, 2012 6:54pm Aug 2, 2012 6:54pm
Quoting emmanuel7788
well don't work when trading spot forex. Now into SELL. Kind of getting hang doing this.
Quoting traderathome
No, you are not getting the hang of the Sonic R. System. You just entered a short when PA was above the Dragon. That is in direct opposition to one of the very few and very important rules.
Quoting Domas4
Excellent trading today Emmanuel. You took A/U long with tight stop and reasonable targets.... And...you took the more risky approach and shorted @ resistance when price made Lower Low.
Quoting emmanuel7788
Hi Domas, Thank you for your encouragement and your online coaching in this thread.... I know that I will need more practice and get away from the MA/dragon thing and put more weight on wave patterns setups. The waves structure actually will give more trading opportunities and also support trade management....
It is easy for anyone to see via the text here, the transition away from the Sonic R. System!

If someone purports to be trading the Sonic R. System, then they always use the Dragon and they never go short when PA is above the Dragon, and they never go long when PA is below the Dragon!

The Sonic R. System uses PA waves and S&R and the Dragon. It is not just a wave pattern trading system like the Turtles used.

Sonicers, each of you decides what trading system fits you best. The Sonic R. System is just one of many. Properly applied, it is a very conservative trading system to better help you make money instead of losing money. If you are looking for "....more trading opportunities...", then there are other methods galore that profess to doing this.

I am posting on this particular chain of events because whenever I see information posted that is contrary to the Sonic R. System it is best for all True Sonicers that a reply be posted to set the record straight.

-tah
  • #38,280
  • Aug 2, 2012 7:25pm Aug 2, 2012 7:25pm
Quoting traderathome
"TAH I have no words. You have been saying the same wrong thing for as long as this thread has been here. Why would Big Wigs need to hit your stops? Most brokers' do not even transfer their clients' trades to market so only broker can see them and broker does not move the market, banks and corporations do. They do not care about us, they do not hunt for our little stops and there is no benefit in doing that. " - Domas4

Domas4, you keep saying the same. Yes, the market does not hunt individual traders stops. But the aggregate of tens of thousands...
Does anyone have any more information about this thing call Liquidity Creation Drives in spot forex trading?
.... any research paper, reports , and /or book written on this subject.

I find it very hard to understand this and to believe this here in this FF thread all written behind anonymity and without any credentials of qualifications and expertise on such subject matter.

regards,
Honesty is a very expensive gift. You wont find it in cheap people.WBuffett
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