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Where is the EDGE in trading? The most important thing in trading!

  • #281
  • Aug 8, 2011 7:19am Aug 8, 2011 7:19am
TA - Fails You
News - Fails You
Others' Strategy - Fails You
Own Guessing - Fails You
You are sure all those things are of no use.

Then why are you traveling on the same boat. Come to land.

Let others use those Waste things and you simply do it in Reverse (What others do) or simply choose a loser and do it in reverse what.

I am a Gainer for past few months.
  • #282
  • Aug 8, 2011 7:22am Aug 8, 2011 7:22am
Quoting reres
Now let's apply this concept to the currency market; suppose you enter a long position on EUR/USD and at the same time, another trader takes a short position in the same currency pair. The broker simply matches the orders and collects the spread. This is exactly what the broker wants, to keep the entire spread and maintain a flat position.
Does this mean that in the above scenario one party has to win, and one must lose? Not at all, in fact both traders can win or lose; perhaps one has entered a short-term trade and the other has entered a long-term...
So what. This proves nothing. So one trader closes with a gain and the other has an unrealized loss of the same amount. The market maker assumes that exposure and when the second closes at a profit it comes out of the market makers pocket. Or when the first closes the market maker matches the second order up with another order to mitigate exposure or passes that order aggregated with other orders to one of their liquidity providers. That exposure still exists and someone will pay for whether it be another trader or the market maker or liquidity provider. Just because one trader closes first doesn't make the remaining exposure disappear. Someone assumes it.
  • #283
  • Aug 8, 2011 10:09am Aug 8, 2011 10:09am
Quoting reres
Wrong, wrong, wrong,Wrong, wrong, wrong !!!

This is excatly the reason why TA traders fail.

It takes 24 hours to learn everything about TA and it takes excatly 5 minutes to see that it doesnt provide any edge and is therefore pretty much useless. Anyone that is wasting lifetime on this like Mr Breakout is trully wasting their life.

Thats a myth becouse forex is NOT zero sum game as you call it. Its really sad that u dont know this fact after years of trading on forex.
It is zero sum because everybody can't win. Eventually someone takes a loss to make up for someone else's win (usually the brokers of course.) And that is exactly why it is possible to make money trading.

If you think you can learn everything about TA in 24 hours, that is why you personally can't make money with it. That is completely wrong. Just because you haven't put any real effort into learning it (I'm sorry 24 hours doesn't cut it) doesn't mean you can say it doesn't work. Of course it isn't easy to find a way to make money trading, because someone has to lose. No one who knows how to do it is willing to share, because that knowledge/experience = money.

You are saying you think you should be able to look at it for 24 hours and then be profitable?? That is ridiculous! Of course it will be difficult to make money with TA, because it is a zero sum game, and everyone else wants to make that money. It shouldn't be simple.

Cory
  • #284
  • Aug 8, 2011 10:11am Aug 8, 2011 10:11am
Quoting reres
Wrong, wrong, wrong,Wrong, wrong, wrong !!!

This is excatly the reason why TA traders fail. Its all about psyhology. They think forex is complicated and therefore the way to earn money MUST be as complicated as possible to work and can only be achieved by years and years of looking at some mumbo jumbo indicators. Wrong. Could not be more wrong.

It takes 24 hours to learn everything about TA and it takes excatly 5 minutes to see that it doesnt provide any edge and is therefore pretty much useless. Anyone that is wasting lifetime on this like...
resres you talk utter rubbish, people have tried to help you and a few others here and it seems you are all beyond help, good luck, you WILL need it.
  • #285
  • Aug 8, 2011 10:28am Aug 8, 2011 10:28am
Those of us who have mastered TA or PA sufficiently to make a living trading should not allow someone like reres to wind us up. Hard I know.......but a waste of energy and time.

He is on other threads on FF winding people up there too.

Forums are traditionally noisy places full of misleading info with a few nuggets that get overlooked and that is why some of us do feel the need at times just to pipe up and say things do work and why. It is annoying to think that folks just starting out could get sucked in by people like reres and sent down a completely fruitless path.

As a PA trader myself I have little idea where you are coming from reres.........and I just have to conclude that you are a wind up merchant.

Some people will share detailed info on how to trade effectively BUT in my experience few listen or take on board what actually works.

Trading will continue to be an arena where those who can thrive and those who cannot, continue to shoot things down in flames. So be it.


makingpips
  • #286
  • Aug 8, 2011 12:27pm Aug 8, 2011 12:27pm
Quoting makingpips
Those of us who have mastered TA or PA sufficiently to make a living trading should not allow someone like reres to wind us up. Hard I know.......but a waste of energy and time.

He is on other threads on FF winding people up there too.

Forums are traditionally noisy places full of misleading info with a few nuggets that get overlooked and that is why some of us do feel the need at times just to pipe up and say things do work and why. It is annoying to think that folks just starting out could get sucked in by people like reres and sent down a...
Great post.
  • #287
  • Aug 8, 2011 1:48pm Aug 8, 2011 1:48pm
I think the most important thing is to find a reliable system that is consistent over time.
Most methods work for just a small fraction of time
  • #288
  • Aug 8, 2011 3:43pm Aug 8, 2011 3:43pm
Quoting jag1966
resres you talk utter rubbish, good luck, you WILL need it.
Luck is needed only for those that trade mumbo-jumbo indicators. In trading probabilites factor of luck dissapears and is irrelevant. Dont worry someday you will come to realize this simple but important fact.


Quoting makingpips
Those of us who have mastered TA or PA sufficiently to make a living trading should not allow someone like reres to wind us up.
Lol, what is this? Support therapy club for frustrated TA traders? Take it easy...and besides that, if u had system based on TA that works u would not be bothered by any of the comments anyway.

Quote
It is annoying to think that folks just starting out could get sucked in by people like reres and sent down a completely fruitless path.

There is nothing more fruitless than watching random patterns and thinking they will give u magical system. Beleive me its much more annoying seeing frustrated TA traders loosing their life savings or being break even after 15 years of watching charts and not realizing where the problem is.

Let me tell you where it is. Forex is nothing like real life. In real life if you work harder, try harder, work overhours you get better results. On forex it doesnt work that way. If you have the wrong method (ta,pa) no amount of hard work can make it work. If the approach is wrong than its simply wrong and reading all books on TA, working thousands of hours watching random patterns ect....wont bring u better results, period. You have to start thinking in probabilities and logic.
  • #289
  • Aug 8, 2011 3:48pm Aug 8, 2011 3:48pm
Quoting nubcake
only if you conclude that a white person is still white even at the times when they appear to have a tan, or have a green light illuminating them, or they are hiding in the shadow.
Agreed. Your analogy with energy in this case is very good. Uncertainty principle makes forex markets fluctuate from negative to positive sum.
  • #290
  • Aug 8, 2011 3:56pm Aug 8, 2011 3:56pm
Quoting reres
Luck is needed only for those that trade mumbo-jumbo indicators. In trading probabilites factor of luck dissapears and is irrelevant. Dont worry someday you will come to realize this simple but important fact.



Lol, what is this? Support therapy club for frustrated TA traders? Take it easy...and besides that, if u had system based on TA that works u would not be bothered by any of the comments anyway.



There is nothing more fruitless than watching random patterns and thinking they will give u magical system. Beleive me its much...
You are a clueless idiot
  • #291
  • Aug 8, 2011 4:12pm Aug 8, 2011 4:12pm
Quoting jag1966
You are a clueless idiot
YUP..... What he said....
  • #292
  • Edited 5:46pm Aug 8, 2011 4:18pm | Edited 5:46pm
Quoting jag1966
You are a clueless idiot
Insulting me wont help you with trading. I really feel sorry for you man. Instead of making contribution to the edge in trading u are acting like little child becouse u wont accept the facts.
You are a typical frustrated TA trader with no arguments. Thx for prooving this fact over and over again. Anyway i wish you good luck. Keep trying.
  • #293
  • Aug 8, 2011 4:45pm Aug 8, 2011 4:45pm
Quoting Cbh123
It is zero sum because everybody can't win. Eventually someone takes a loss to make up for someone else's win (usually the brokers of course.) And that is exactly why it is possible to make money trading.
We can agree that forex is switching from negative to positive sum game. Never excatly being zero sum.

Many economic situations are not zero-sum, since valuable goods and services can be created, destroyed, or badly allocated, and any of these will create a net gain or loss. Assuming the counterparties are acting rationally with symmetric information , any commercial exchange is a non-zero-sum activity, because each party must consider the goods it is receiving as being at least fractionally more valuable than the goods it is delivering. Economic exchanges must benefit both parties enough above the zero-sum such that each party can overcome its transaction costs.


Quote
If you think you can learn everything about TA in 24 hours, that is why you personally can't make money with it. That is completely wrong.
Nope. What is wrong is the way of thinking that some random patterns can bring u a system which works. And usually this kind of thinking is accompanied by "the more complex this thing is the more money it will make". Thats wrong, no amount of complexity in failed system can make it work.

Quote
It shouldn't be simple.
Most profitable systems are simple. You would be amazed to know how many of them and how simple. KISS --> keep it simple and stupid
  • #294
  • Aug 8, 2011 5:17pm Aug 8, 2011 5:17pm
Quoting reres
...Most profitable systems are simple. You would be amazed to know how many of them and how simple. KISS --> keep it simple and stupid
I agree with this, but from your posts, am I wrong to doubt that you believe it yourself? From your own posts, it would seem you yourself do not believe retail traders can achieve profitability. Or do you?
  • #295
  • Edited 6:00pm Aug 8, 2011 5:44pm | Edited 6:00pm
Quoting infinitepips
I agree with this, but from your posts, am I wrong to doubt that you believe it yourself? From your own posts, it would seem you yourself do not believe retail traders can achieve profitability. Or do you?
I sure do believe i just dont think it can be done via useless ways of trading like ta, pa.
All the newbies should stay away from TA as far as possible so they dont get caught in a never-ending trap.

Listen to Larry Williams or some other famous traders if you dont believe me. Larry was actually pretty mild with criticism compared to others
Inserted Video
  • #296
  • Aug 8, 2011 6:53pm Aug 8, 2011 6:53pm
Great clip, reres.
  • #297
  • Aug 8, 2011 6:58pm Aug 8, 2011 6:58pm
Quoting reres
I sure do believe i just dont think it can be done via useless ways of trading like ta, pa.
All the newbies should stay away from TA as far as possible so they dont get caught in a never-ending trap.

Listen to Larry Williams or some other famous traders if you dont believe me. Larry was actually pretty mild with criticism compared to others
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFjLIk6S2Qk
Hahahahaha, so that's what this thread was all about, Larry Williams the con artist.

For years this guy kept sending me junk mail about his super duper $197 commodity trading system (google for Larry Williams scam) or read this article for example :
http://www.schoolofgann.com/LinkClic...bid=96&mid=501

Reres, please stop, stop, I first thought your post was sincere but now this is getting ridiculous by the minute.
  • #298
  • Aug 8, 2011 6:58pm Aug 8, 2011 6:58pm
My mother-in-law at 87 was the oldest practicing accountant in Australia. I asked her a year or two ago if she knew any short term traders who made money. She smiled sweetly and said she knew many who thought they did.
  • #299
  • Aug 8, 2011 7:05pm Aug 8, 2011 7:05pm
Quoting Mr Breakout
Larry Williams the con artist.
Nah, this thread is about EDGE in trading. Larry is not really a con artist, he used to win world trading championship altho he is probably not a sucessfull trader nowdays since he has to spam people with his methods. But i bet he is more sucessfull than any TA trader as they are doomed to failure.


Quote
For years this guy kept sending me junk mail about his super duper $197 commodity trading system
So what ?? This video still holds true. Any trader in the world who made some money can tell you the same. TA = waste of time, period.

Quote
I thought your post was sincere but now this is getting ridiculous by the minute.
Can u provide some argument? Elaborate a bit? I guess not
  • #300
  • Aug 8, 2011 7:09pm Aug 8, 2011 7:09pm
Quoting AllanS
My mother-in-law at 87 was the oldest practicing accountant in Australia. I asked her a year or two ago if she knew any short term traders who made money. She smiled sweetly and said she knew many who thought they did.
So true. They all think they got it when 25 more indicators are added to the chart.
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