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  • #404,001
  • Mar 10, 2011 5:56am Mar 10, 2011 5:56am
time to go to disko in 5 min
i am bored last two hours
Everything is RISK just learn how to live with
  • #404,002
  • Mar 10, 2011 5:56am Mar 10, 2011 5:56am
Quoting cloggie
The question really should be, do you use WTF stops or stops above next SR as most retailers do. Using the next SR is just asking to get your stops hit, using a WTF stop is something not many retailers think of. If you have redundant systems then WTF stops can be easily handled manually and the SR stop can be eyeballed to see if that is a point where one should get out of a trade.

The problem in general is that most retailers are so undercapitalised that they have to use tight stops to keep their risk exposure to a minimum.
I feel like a complete newbie but wtf is a WTF stop??
  • #404,003
  • Mar 10, 2011 5:57am Mar 10, 2011 5:57am
Quoting cloggie
The question really should be, do you use WTF stops or stops above next SR as most retailers do. Using the next SR is just asking to get your stops hit, using a WTF stop is something not many retailers think of. If you have redundant systems then WTF stops can be easily handled manually and the SR stop can be eyeballed to see if that is a point where one should get out of a trade.

The problem in general is that most retailers are so undercapitalised that they have to use tight stops to keep their risk exposure to......
agree with that...

undercapitalised retailers should cut their cloth to suit their means and scale down their lot size, over leverage is the real issue here...
  • #404,004
  • Mar 10, 2011 5:57am Mar 10, 2011 5:57am
hi all


nice sleep miss some action
  • #404,005
  • Mar 10, 2011 5:59am Mar 10, 2011 5:59am
Quoting Tenshi28
I feel like a complete newbie but wtf is a WTF stop??
a very loose stop in case of a wtf just happened occurrence...
  • #404,006
  • Mar 10, 2011 5:59am Mar 10, 2011 5:59am
Quoting Tenshi28
I feel like a complete newbie but wtf is a WTF stop??

A WTF stop is one where the price needs to get to, to make no sense. It is a spike caused by fat fingers or a slip of a CB member. It is the WTF just happened with that moment. The problem is though that most retailers can't afford a WTF stop and have to use the obvious SR's. Why do you think so many here get stopped out only for the price to reverse and hit their PT.
  • #404,007
  • Mar 10, 2011 5:59am Mar 10, 2011 5:59am
I'm watching...3824 below, and 3858/61 above...
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: chart3.gif Size: 13 KB
Look Sharp/Trade Tight
  • #404,008
  • Mar 10, 2011 5:59am Mar 10, 2011 5:59am
Quoting kill56
hi all


nice sleep miss some action
hey kill...
  • #404,009
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:01am Mar 10, 2011 6:01am
Quoting kill56
hi all


nice sleep miss some action
Nahhhhh.....you miss nothing
  • #404,010
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:02am Mar 10, 2011 6:02am
Quoting FibbinArchie

undercapitalised retailers should cut their cloth to suit their means and scale down their lot size, over leverage is the real issue here...

But that is the intrinsic problem with retail traders, they can't afford a proper account size so have to use leverage to make some money, by using leverage they can't afford the proper stops so have to use the obvious ones. Leverage works against a retailer big time and just causes your stops to be hit.

If a retailer really thinks about it he will quickly realise that using anything over 10:1 leverage forces him to either reduce his lotsize to a point where the leverage becomes useless or keep his stops so tight that the leverage actually hurts.
  • #404,011
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:04am Mar 10, 2011 6:04am
Quoting cloggie
I tried really hard to help the kid out, hope he listened to it. I eventually got him to move his stop to 3930 so unless he chickened out he should be fine.

I am still waiting for my target I posted yesterday.
AM look for 3713, are you same boat as mine?
  • #404,012
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:05am Mar 10, 2011 6:05am
Quoting cloggie
But that is the intrinsic problem with retail traders, they can't afford a proper account size so have to use leverage to make some money, by using leverage they can't afford the proper stops so have to use the obvious ones. Leverage works against a retailer big time and just causes your stops to be hit.

If a retailer really thinks about it he will quickly realise that using anything over 50:1 leverage forces him to either reduce his lotsize to a point where the leverage becomes useless or keep his stops so tight that the leverage actually hurts....
and why subsequently most tap out...
  • #404,013
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:05am Mar 10, 2011 6:05am
Hi Cloggie,

I missed your posts yesterday, what is your current target?


Quoting cloggie
I tried really hard to help the kid out, hope he listened to it. I eventually got him to move his stop to 3930 so unless he chickened out he should be fine.

I am still waiting for my target I posted yesterday.
  • #404,014
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:06am Mar 10, 2011 6:06am
Quoting cloggie
A WTF stop is one where the price needs to get to, to make no sense. It is a spike caused by fat fingers or a slip of a CB member. It is the WTF just happened with that moment. The problem is though that most retailers can't afford a WTF stop and have to use the obvious SR's. Why do you think so many here get stopped out only for the price to reverse and hit their PT.
I see, just a wide stop then, thx.
  • #404,015
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:07am Mar 10, 2011 6:07am
Quoting cloggie
The question really should be, do you use WTF stops or stops above next SR as most retailers do. Using the next SR is just asking to get your stops hit, using a WTF stop is something not many retailers think of. If you have redundant systems then WTF stops can be easily handled manually and the SR stop can be eyeballed to see if that is a point where one should get out of a trade.

The problem in general is that most retailers are so undercapitalised that they have to use tight stops to keep their risk exposure to a minimum.

This is correct. To be trading this pair short now your stop needs to be above 13940 yesterdays high, even then you may get banged out the trade later when the US sess starts.

Theres people here going on about 13865 SL resistance is at bla bla 13850 etc. 13807 is the key etc bla bla.

its bullshit. if your trading this short stop above 13940 end of story otherwise your gambling.

if you cant afford to stick your stop above 13940 then your in the wrong game. you wont last long in this bussiness


forget your 61.8824656787% fib retrace and your daily sp and resistance and head and shoulders on the one minute chart.

trading is really not that complecated. I can even do it! and i make a nice living from it.

I'm short and if it starts getting back up to the 139's later then I'm wrong and i may think about long entries
rat
  • #404,016
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:07am Mar 10, 2011 6:07am
Quoting cloggie
Can't wait for another one, made an absolute killing on last year's DOW F-up
Nothing new in the UK.

Oh come on mate thats exactly the point. I was there too trading the ES and if you remember, it was a low volume bars late before the close on a intraday retrace to major daily and weekly S. I was very tempted to take a long there as it was 100% vaild but floor was closing in a few mins so pointless to take a trade on globex...

if you were smart enough or lucky enough to take a short on that massive S at the close and get paid for a technical/fat finger problem you were one of the few, in my case I was lucky not to take that trade (imagine without stop...) and the majority of traders around the world got screwed.

So yes I see your point on managing the stops the way you do it but lets agree that is not healthy or beneficial to not have a stop for 99% retail in FF.

sisse
Pending conversations? PM for a chat...I am mainly in OTM now
  • #404,017
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:07am Mar 10, 2011 6:07am
thanks for your comments Magix
much appreciated
HK

Quoting Magix
There are a few things I have in consideration as of current...

One being the USDCAD chart the other being the USDX while also watching for true direction on Fiber...

I don't see USDCAD falling much below current, but that don't mean that it cannot...historically speaking this bitch gotta lotta room to the downside...

My issue with the Monthly chart is on a different sort of indication...and the way I see it, there is still potential for another attack at top and possibly higher highs...

On the day, we are below weekly roll, so still...
  • #404,018
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:09am Mar 10, 2011 6:09am
yip
I even have 1.3945.


Quoting rattyo
This is correct. To be trading this pair short now your stop needs to be above 13940 yesterdays high, even then you may get banged out the trade later when the US sess starts.

Theres people here going on about 13865 SL resistance is at bla bla 138850 etc. 138807 is the key etc bla bla.

its bullshit. if your trading this short stop above 13940 end of story otherwise your gambling.
  • #404,019
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:09am Mar 10, 2011 6:09am
Quoting sisse
So yes I see your point on managing the stops the way you do it but lets agree that is not healthy or beneficial to not have a stop for 99% retail in FF.

sisse

Agree 100%, no aspiring trader should trade without a stop.
  • #404,020
  • Mar 10, 2011 6:11am Mar 10, 2011 6:11am
Quoting Tenshi28
I see, just a wide stop then, thx.

No, not really.
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Yaruki