The Force 5min system | Page 174 | Forex Factory

Options

Go to
Permalinks
Print Thread

Similar Threads

Intresting finding or simply statistic: 5min candel 14 replies

5min Bollinger breakout system 42 replies

My journal on The Force 5min system 5 replies

Backtest Data Timeframe > 1min, 5min necessary? 2 replies

Attachments: The Force 5min system
Exit Attachments

The Force 5min system

  • #3,461
  • Jan 31, 2011 3:33am Jan 31, 2011 3:33am
Quoting thomsonfx
thanks rufus and simpleguy

sorry I still have some newbie questions, for the basic system, the buy signal is only triggered at the close of bullish candle when all criteria met, however, I saw in page 1 #3 that the 5 sma crossover has already happened 1-2 bars ago, the author still consider it as valid for the signal, if it is really so, then how many bars of crossover before the bullish candle close is considered as valid at the maximum?

another question, how do we define the "stochastic crosses up from the 20 line and is not overbought"...
FJ looked for 1 pip move above the signal bar and I believe it had to be within two bars after it. I don't remember for sure.


Overbought means the stochastic is over 80. If the stochastic is in a tight zigzag you are dealing with a ranging condition and want to leave it alone.

The thing I try to tell myself is that the entry should look obvious.. The signal then confirms it. Not the other way around. If you are having to make an entry work leave it alone and get the next. Don"t squint to make it work

As for the chat...No one that I know of is doing it.

Hope this is of help

Rufus
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #3,462
  • Jan 31, 2011 3:37am Jan 31, 2011 3:37am
Quoting thomsonfx
follow the post above, for "the stochastic crosses up from the 20 line and is not ovebought", I discovered that forexjedi suggests us to take the trades only when it is below 20 and cross up from below 20, however, when I refer to the page 1 #3, the "crossing up" happened few bars before the close of bullish candle, so actually within how many bars are considered as valid?

another question is for the sell signal in the same graph (page 1 #3), when the bearish candle close, one of the stochastic lines had not yet cross down from...
You will get a feal for the trade after a bit..Remeber don't get hung up on some of the little things. Read through howm FJ laid it out and you will see what he was trying to present.
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #3,463
  • Jan 31, 2011 3:49am Jan 31, 2011 3:49am
The three arrows indicate where I took positions today. The Long with London is still active.

Ths short with the Asian session.was a little pipper.

The next short with FF was ok but fooled me and I closed it early with a small loss.

Londons long looks to be the keeper. As I type it is up by 22 pips. We will see how much more life is left in it.


Rufus
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 1.30.1f5.jpg Size: 77 KB
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #3,464
  • Jan 31, 2011 7:15am Jan 31, 2011 7:15am
Rufus is right, if you have to struggle to see the trade, then it's normally not a good trade and should be passed up. Consider doing this for a couple of days. Don't trade a real account or demo account. Just sit there and watch how price bounces off of the fives, how the fives cross back and forth during congestions, how price reacts to on the stochs on an up, down, range, what happens at pivots. Just kinda watch it for a little get a feel for it. After you do that for a couple of sessions then go and demo trade the account for a while.

One of the most important lessons I got taught about trading like this is this: The market is going to push in a direction, at some point it going to come back. Wait for it to hit something, (a TL, Pivot, S/R) and start to bounce back.

Now, we don't know if this push is for 5 pips or 500 pips, we just try to rid it out for all its worth.

right now I'm seeing something I like. we are in an up trend and the stochs just hit 20, that doesn't happen too often and has normally been a good entry for me.

Good luck all.
A woman drove me to drink, and I forgot to thank her
  • #3,465
  • Jan 31, 2011 8:56am Jan 31, 2011 8:56am
Quoting simpleguy
Now, we don't know if this push is for 5 pips or 500 pips, we just try to rid it out for all its worth.

Good luck all.

My Last target WAS 1.3694.....Agreat thing to see when you get up in the morning

I am especially fond of this because I started my trading session with thinking shorts....
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 1.31targetsgonef5.jpg Size: 72 KB
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #3,466
  • Jan 31, 2011 9:35am Jan 31, 2011 9:35am
Yes I agree with you simpleguy, I will just sit there and watch only, make sure I understand before real trade, thanks for help

1. Do you take the buy trade when one of the 2 stochastic lines are decreasing but between 20 and 80 ?
2. At this moment, I saw a bullish candle is forming and rising rapidly, if we wait it to close before making a trade, it may have already risen a lot, but seems we still need to wait according to the strategy, right?
3. I have loaded the theforce5.tpl, it always show 4 mins 57 sec left to bar end, it doesnt change even I click refresh...
  • #3,467
  • Jan 31, 2011 9:47am Jan 31, 2011 9:47am
Quoting thomsonfx
Yes I agree with you simpleguy, I will just sit there and watch only, make sure I understand before real trade, thanks for help

1. Do you take the buy trade when one of the 2 stochastic lines are decreasing but between 20 and 80 ?
2. At this moment, I saw a bullish candle is forming and rising rapidly, if we wait it to close before making a trade, it may have already risen a lot, but seems we still need to wait according to the strategy, right?
3. I have loaded the theforce5.tpl, it always show 4 mins 57 sec left to bar end, it doesnt...
1. I like to see both lines break the 20/80 lines but as long as one of the two stoch touches it, that is the bare minimum for the trade.

2. You are right, that nice bullish candle just formed and you would not want to enter after that. If the signal candle is big like that last one you want to stay out of it cause like you said the move may have run out of steam. that's just assuming risk.

3. I don't know anything about the candle clock, don't use it.

4. where I traded this is after the big bullish move we had another short up bar. On this bar i moved my TL up to the top of it to make my TL correct again. then the next bar moved up touched a line and started to come back down. When you are learning to trade, the next bar would have been the entry for you. At the basic level, you would have only gotten out at BE but as time moves on you will see more aggressive ways to trade that would have made some bucks on that trade for you.

5. Remember this is an endurance race. learn to get in there and earn 20 or 30 pips a day. just keep hitting for singles and doubles and before you know it your account will start to grow, and you'll get a few home runs along the way.
A woman drove me to drink, and I forgot to thank her
  • #3,468
  • Jan 31, 2011 10:01am Jan 31, 2011 10:01am
The current market is up and we just had a 3 bar down turn, did you see how far that pushed the stochs down? It even used it through my R1, now we wait to see if the market wants to push it up higher again or not.

Only time will tell.
A woman drove me to drink, and I forgot to thank her
  • #3,469
  • Jan 31, 2011 10:09am Jan 31, 2011 10:09am
A lot of people use Stochs, put do you really know what they are? Other than just two lines moving up and down at the bottom of your screen? don't you think you should have a clue of what your going to put your hard earned money into and understand why they are considered "laggging" indicators and why?

Here's a simple explanation of what Stochs really are and do.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stochastic_oscillator

Hope this helps you some!
A woman drove me to drink, and I forgot to thank her
  • #3,470
  • Feb 1, 2011 1:03am Feb 1, 2011 1:03am
Quoting simpleguy
1. I like to see both lines break the 20/80 lines but as long as one of the two stoch touches it, that is the bare minimum for the trade.

2. You are right, that nice bullish candle just formed and you would not want to enter after that. If the signal candle is big like that last one you want to stay out of it cause like you said the move may have run out of steam. that's just assuming risk.
thanks for the answers

FJ do not take the signal when only 1 line touch the 20/80 lines, I discovered it in post 91: http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...=120606&page=7

however, for his definition of "touch", it can touch even 4 bars before the closing candle and still consider as valid, example is post 92: http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...=120606&page=7

in practice, how many bars at max do you accept ?

for the big candle, FJ still accept the candle that has already risen 20 pips, example is post 92, how big do you think is too big ?
  • #3,471
  • Feb 1, 2011 4:43am Feb 1, 2011 4:43am
Quoting thomsonfx
thanks for the answers

FJ do not take the signal when only 1 line touch the 20/80 lines, I discovered it in post 91: http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...=120606&page=7

however, for his definition of "touch", it can touch even 4 bars before the closing candle and still consider as valid, example is post 92: http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...=120606&page=7

in practice, how many bars at max do you accept ?

for the big candle, FJ still accept the candle that has already risen 20 pips, example is post...
thomsonfx,
your links show something different from what you described, could you check and provide the links you had in mind, thank you
  • #3,472
  • Feb 1, 2011 7:06am Feb 1, 2011 7:06am
Quoting thomsonfx
thanks for the answers

FJ do not take the signal when only 1 line touch the 20/80 lines, I discovered it in post 91: http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...=120606&page=7

however, for his definition of "touch", it can touch even 4 bars before the closing candle and still consider as valid, example is post 92: http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...=120606&page=7

in practice, how many bars at max do you accept ?

for the big candle, FJ still accept the candle that has already risen 20 pips, example...

thompsonFX,

Nice find in searching through the posts. I see that he did post that but i can tell you from trading with him and the others in the chat room that they only looked for a touch of one of them but admittedly that if both of them break through it gave a much higher chance of success

Be careful when if you are entering three and four bars after a touch for signal candle. many times when you do that the move has already started and you might be jumping on the band wagon a little late. I've always felt a little uneasy with that one and have noticed higher percentages of losers. just my two pips.

Simple
A woman drove me to drink, and I forgot to thank her
  • #3,473
  • Feb 1, 2011 8:41am Feb 1, 2011 8:41am
I want to thank everyone who has kept this thread alive. Espescially Rufus and simpleguy. If not I would never have found it. There is a treasure trove of information here.

I'm doing more observation with this method than trading atm but am learning the basic and advanced at the same time.

Going to go back and read a number of posts again.

Again thanks.

Mark
Mark ... Everything you have been told is a LIE
  • #3,474
  • Feb 1, 2011 9:19am Feb 1, 2011 9:19am
Quoting spzd
I want to thank everyone who has kept this thread alive. Espescially Rufus and simpleguy. If not I would never have found it. There is a treasure trove of information here.

I'm doing more observation with this method than trading atm but am learning the basic and advanced at the same time.

Going to go back and read a number of posts again.

Again thanks.

Mark
Attached Image
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #3,475
  • Feb 1, 2011 9:11pm Feb 1, 2011 9:11pm
Quoting simpleguy
thompsonFx,
2. close is on price action, this is correct. I'm sure ithat Rufus and I do not do it the same way but what I do is move my stop loss up when it hits a point of resistance, give it enough room to bounce around for a little and then decide what it wants to do. it will either continue in our direction, which is good, or come back and hit our stop loss, which i consider good also.
hi simpleguy, I am still confused with the close (sell close in basic system), since I am just a beginner, I would like to stick with the basic system rules first

FJ may have an error in the basic system description, for sell trade, the take profit is still base on EMA 5 crossover but not price action, examples are
at post 3
http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=120606
at post 87
http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...=120606&page=6

What do you think ?

Another question, in case I want to be more advanced and work with price action, when there is a buy signal, I can see the pivot/R1 is just very close above, say, 20 pips, then should I still open it? On the contrary, when there is a sell signal, I can see the pivot/S1 is very close, then should I still open it? How frequent will it happen ?
  • #3,476
  • Feb 1, 2011 9:21pm Feb 1, 2011 9:21pm
Quoting MidnightRun
thomsonfx,
your links show something different from what you described, could you check and provide the links you had in mind, thank you
Oh sorry I made a mistake, in that post FJ try to explain that we should wait for BOTH stochastic lines ever touch the 20/80 lines but not violating his rules

However, I think it is not very strict as an example shown in #242
http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...120606&page=17

One of the trades is nearly touch the line but havent touched it
  • #3,477
  • Feb 1, 2011 9:53pm Feb 1, 2011 9:53pm
thsonfx

FJ also statated in post 110 that a touch was a valid entry but he did say it was riskier.

http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...=120606&page=8

Mark
Mark ... Everything you have been told is a LIE
  • #3,478
  • Feb 1, 2011 10:01pm Feb 1, 2011 10:01pm
Quoting thomsonfx
Another question, in case I want to be more advanced and work with price action, when there is a buy signal, I can see the pivot/R1 is just very close above, say, 20 pips, then should I still open it? On the contrary, when there is a sell signal, I can see the pivot/S1 is very close, then should I still open it? How frequent will it happen ?

Price just wnt thru WR2. Don't know how often this happens but price has been trending up since Sundays open. My take on this is to be aware of the trend when price is approaching pivot areas.

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: eurusd.gif Size: 31 KB
Mark ... Everything you have been told is a LIE
  • #3,479
  • Feb 1, 2011 10:06pm Feb 1, 2011 10:06pm
Quoting thomsonfx
hi simpleguy, I am still confused with the close (sell close in basic system), since I am just a beginner, I would like to stick with the basic system rules first

FJ may have an error in the basic system description, for sell trade, the take profit is still base on EMA 5 crossover but not price action, examples are
at post 3
http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=120606
at post 87
http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...=120606&page=6

What do you think ?

Another question, in case I want to be more...

Glad to see the detail that you are working through this. I personally will be careful with 20 pips of room if the area has been untested. Remember S/R, pivots, fibs, etc. are like stop lights. Sometimes they are green and price flies through. Other times they are yellow or red. So at times I will take the position. As the level gets closer watch the PA and take profit on all or part if necessary.

Price action is the ultimate indicator. So no matter what the stochs or macd are telling you it is PA that has the first vote. So watch the price action. If you are uncomfortable with a position there is no harm in closing it down. Remember to act in your own best interest first and foremost.

Hope this helps a bit and have fun with it.

Rufus
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #3,480
  • Feb 1, 2011 10:08pm Feb 1, 2011 10:08pm
Quoting spzd
Price just wnt thru WR2. Don't know how often this happens but price has been trending up since Sundays open. My take on this is to be aware of the trend when price is approaching pivot areas.

Attachment

My previous post.....Stop lights...
Attached Image
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
1 trader viewing now