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  • #3,501
  • Jan 15, 2011 1:24am Jan 15, 2011 1:24am
Quoting bigtent
Did anyone else get this monster spike on cable, or is it just IBFX? Server time is GMT and the second chart is 1M.
no spikes here either by the way, (with FXpro)
definitely its an error on their part but what happens if you had a live trade and hit your stops? that wouldnt be funny at all.
better ask them why that was and what would have happened in the case you had a trade live then. and post the answer here plz.
thank you
  • #3,502
  • Jan 15, 2011 2:19am Jan 15, 2011 2:19am
Anyone knows of a simulator that can show multiple time frames? I love to take a look at HTF before pulling the trigger and plain 15M charts make me feel blind. I dont mind plain scrolling of chart. Its fine even if it doesn't support buy sell etc. I just want to develop a feel of things rather than count money with simulator. Any help here will be great appreciated.
Making money is easy- Just dont take losing trades
  • #3,503
  • Jan 15, 2011 3:28am Jan 15, 2011 3:28am
Quoting Survivor
Anyone knows of a simulator that can show multiple time frames? I love to take a look at HTF before pulling the trigger and plain 15M charts make me feel blind. I dont mind plain scrolling of chart. Its fine even if it doesn't support buy sell etc. I just want to develop a feel of things rather than count money with simulator. Any help here will be great appreciated.
i suppose you know that MT4 scrolls by one bar when you press F12, so you can do it manually, of course its not ideal.
i was looking for a simulator supporting multiple time frames but i havent found any free ones that do, so i am interested too if anyone knows
  • #3,504
  • Jan 15, 2011 6:17am Jan 15, 2011 6:17am
Quoting Survivor
Anyone knows of a simulator that can show multiple time frames?.......
Go to forextester.com - free version has some limitations (you have to restart after each 1/2 hour and somewhat else), but it is usable.

Multicharts also has tester with multiframes, but there isn't Sell/Buy and it is not free.
  • #3,505
  • Jan 17, 2011 2:08am Jan 17, 2011 2:08am
Just took this for +20
H1 chart bearish with retrace to 10/SR
M5 retrace to 35/50
M15 penetration of 10
horizontal SR level shows best on H1 chart
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All that matters is winning the week
  • #3,506
  • Jan 17, 2011 2:37am Jan 17, 2011 2:37am
Quoting lindsayf
Just took this for +20
H1 chart bearish with retrace to 10/SR
M5 retrace to 35/50
M15 penetration of 10
horizontal SR level shows best on H1 chart
great trade!
i was looking at GU which is still deciding where it wants to go so missed this
  • #3,507
  • Edited 4:44am Jan 17, 2011 3:37am | Edited 4:44am
Nice trade Lindsay! I took the the same entry, target is weekly pivot.

edit: Stopped out at +50.
  • #3,508
  • Jan 17, 2011 5:48am Jan 17, 2011 5:48am
Good morning to everyone here on this auspicious thread. I've been away for some time and unable to trade this system, but I'm starting back, although on reduced hours (I'll be trading from 4 am to 8 am EST). I've been following the goings on and want to congratulate everyone with their successes. My first day back and I'm up 14 pips and will call it a morning. I'm looking forward to contributing in some small way to the work of this thread, and in continuing to establish ourselves as profitable traders.
  • #3,509
  • Jan 17, 2011 8:10am Jan 17, 2011 8:10am
G'day all,

Well, after having a go last week and getting stopped on my first attempt for +1 (actually, my broker, IBFX, slipped my stop to -1 ), and then managing with extreme skill, highly honed hesitation and practiced procrastination to miss all the action on Thursday and Friday.... I finally made a couple of trades, even though I haven't quite got the M1 PA worked out yet.

The first one was on the Aussie.

First two attempts (1 and 2 on the Aussie charts) - stopped out twice (actually would have survived if my stops weren't so tight - but I'm a nervous nelly).

Got in on the third attempt (3) closed the first part of the trade for 25 pips and the trailed the second half getting the same on a retrace (4).

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Next was Cable. which I was watching while trailing the second half of the Aussie trade, and waiting for a retrace after it had broken last Friday's high, which was also the monthly high and around December's high as well.

I expected it to retrace from the RN or the Daily R1 pivot, which it did, and go back to around those highs from last Friday.

But I got fooled by the M1 and got in too early, giving up 10 pips and giving myself a sweat while I watched it go against me until it eventually went my way!

Maybe I should have "Traded what I thought and not what I saw (or thought I saw)" this time!

Anyway, got 14 pips on the first half (manually closed half on a retrace and missed the 15 pips), and picked up 30 trailing the second half.

All in all, 1% profit for the day and that's better than a poke in the eye with a blunt stick!

Would have gotten my 3% target (went within 10 pips of the TP) if some bloke from the FOMC didn't start talking, the USD was bearish, so Prosser the tosser must have been talking a lot of bull to turn it around!

Then again, if I'd gotten the entries right, I would have been home and hosed, so maybe I can shoulder a bit of the blame!

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  • #3,510
  • Jan 17, 2011 9:00am Jan 17, 2011 9:00am
Thanks to all those that responded regarding my IBFX spike.

It's not that much to worry about as I've only got a penny a pip account, but given that they also slipped my stop last week when there was no news or anything, I'll be moving it to Gomarkets once it gets worth while. (I have another account with them).
  • #3,511
  • Jan 17, 2011 10:11am Jan 17, 2011 10:11am
Quoting bigtent
G'day all,

Well, after having a go last week and getting stopped on my first attempt for +1 (actually, my broker, IBFX, slipped my stop to -1 ), and then managing with extreme skill, highly honed hesitation and practiced procrastination to miss all the action on Thursday and Friday.... I finally made a couple of trades, even though I haven't quite got the M1 PA worked out yet.

The first one was on the Aussie.

First two attempts (1 and 2 on the Aussie charts) - stopped out twice (actually would have survived if my stops weren't so tight...
Great bigtent.
My quick analysis. Nice understanding of the system. But IMHO you are entering too early in trades where you got stopped- afraid to miss the move?
Anyway i guess you should wait for what manual says " enter only AT the MA".
And also i figure out that your Sl is too tight. That kills the account pretty fast in my opinion. Give at least 10-15 pips breathing space to monsters like GU.
Anyway i am myself not perfect in touch trades. You are doing fine. Keep it up.

As an aside, did anyone notice that constrainment in 4H GU? I couldn't catch it because of large SL needed. Anyway, was fun watching it.
Making money is easy- Just dont take losing trades
  • #3,512
  • Jan 17, 2011 10:28am Jan 17, 2011 10:28am
Quoting K_Minos
Hello Dancers,

First of all congratulation Survivor for the trade. I would like to ask a few questions about the trade? I took the same trade on demo this morning with exit at 1.3390 I did not trust the trade that will go that far, my mistake.

The constrainment happened during the night when the pair is normaly sleeping and the price was just before an area of strong support (1.3380 to 1.3410), is this not taken into account before the trade?

Thank you
I realize that i missed many posts over the weekend. No offences meant but please realize that i am myself struggling to master some kinds of trades. I needs a LOT of hard work and weekend is only time i have got. Anyway here are thee late replies.

Thank you Elefante. It doesnt happen everyday though

"Well, at the rate you are going now, you are going to have to consider changing your name. "Survivor" may no longer be apt." Thanks Duffy but i still consider myself a learner till i achive 90% strike rate in all trades that i take. Moreover that name is good for me. It always reminds me of my very bloody war before i found dance (did you notice my Pic? ). It also reminds me to keep learning. There is so much to learn.

"I took the same trade on demo this morning with exit at 1.3390 I did not trust the trade that will go that far, my mistake. The constrainment happened during the night when the pair is normaly sleeping and the price was just before an area of strong support (1.3380 to 1.3410), is this not taken into account before the trade? " - You did well- very well. No mistakes. No shame in taking profits. What i did was experimental. I could feel it in my bones that this baby will go very far- maybe thats because of my experience with constrainments. But still i wont be doing it every day. Never let Greed or Fear come in your mind. They are tougher to fight than few lost pips! Also, constrainments often happen during sleeping hours. I generally ignore time rules when i see a good constrainments. And i didn't take specific note of any support there. I went by dance. As per dance if there was a constrainment that means there was very good support.

"Now is the time to not compromise what you have been doing - overconfidence and unrealistic expectations of trades becoming runners are your enemies after a brilliant outcome like that" - that's solid advice. I have been burnt often because of overconfidence with constrainments but still hitting over 90%. But once i get hit i become VERY careful. Maybe that's keeping me safe. Still words to be noted by everyone.
Making money is easy- Just dont take losing trades
  • #3,513
  • Jan 17, 2011 11:18am Jan 17, 2011 11:18am
Quoting Survivor
Great bigtent.
My quick analysis. Nice understanding of the system. But IMHO you are entering too early in trades where you got stopped- afraid to miss the move?
Anyway i guess you should wait for what manual says " enter only AT the MA".
And also i figure out that your Sl is too tight. That kills the account pretty fast in my opinion. Give at least 10-15 pips breathing space to monsters like GU.
Anyway i am myself not perfect in touch trades. You are doing fine. Keep it up.

As an aside, did anyone notice that constrainment in 4H GU? I couldn't...

Yes, you are right. I know I'm not catching the touch, but that is always a problem on the 10 EMA.

In the manual, many of the examples of 10 EMA touches show a bar where the wick just touches the MA. In real time, when that bar was at the "touch price", it was not touching the EMA line. There would be a lot fewer signals if you waited for price to actually hit the wiggling line.

It is a moving average of the close, and that means you can't tell where the MA is going to be until the close of the candle. That's why I call that line "the serpent's tongue" - it is very deceptive and unreliable.

Clay talked about this in the Dance thread here, and it requires some discretion.

I have been trying to work this out using price action on the M5/M1, but I haven't nailed it yet, as it is not quite the same as that of higher time frames.

For example, I should have waited for Cable to go lower, as I was actually expecting it to do so, but I misread the M1 price action and jumped the gun.

The Aussie was difficult as the two losses were "shooting" for the 10 EMA on the first two bars. The trade that I finally got was after the third bar and on the H1 10 EMA and the M15 50.

I still missed this by 5 pips or so, as it shot down and bounced back so quick, it was impossible to catch it "at the touch". By the time I clicked and the order was placed, it was back up at the top of that long tailed doji on the M5.

The only way to learn this stuff is in real time, as you can't do it in the simulator because you only have one time frame (although I'm looking for some ways around that - such as Stratman's minicharts as used in the THV system).

As for the stop losses on the two losers, they were 10 and 11 pips, which is about what Clay recommends, in fact he often suggests SMALLER ones in these cases, and says that if you are needing larger stops, then your entries are the problem, and this is what I am working on.

In fact, If I'd had smaller stops, then I would have perhaps fared better, as I would not have had so much to recoup before I went into profit.

I'm only using a penny a pip account, so I don't need to fret, and I'll get it right..... eventually, LOL!

Hey, it's pretty good when you can make blunders (i.e. learn lessons) like this and still end up positive for the session! Profitable education!
  • #3,514
  • Jan 17, 2011 11:40am Jan 17, 2011 11:40am
Quoting bigtent
Yes, you are right. I know I'm not catching the touch, but that is always a problem on the 10 EMA.

In the manual, many of the examples of 10 EMA touches show a bar where the wick just touches the MA. In real time, when that bar was at the "touch price", it was not touching the EMA line. There would be a lot fewer signals if you waited for price to actually hit the wiggling line.

As for the stop losses on the two losers, they were 10 and 11 pips, which is about what Clay recommends, in fact he often suggests SMALLER ones in these cases, and...
Agree completely Bigtent.

It may sound all like BS but it all comes down to discretion. I myself can nail constainments with my own "discretion" but I have a much lower strike rate in touch trades. SCREEN TIME may be the key. who knows. Again, in my exp, smaller stop loss than 10-11 pips (Am talking of monsters like GU) will kill your account faster than you think . That's my personal experience of killing accounts. you can trade otherwise and may still be profitable!

And about "recoups"- i never really think of them. If i have to recoup something, then either the system is BS or i am an idiot. As i have said earlier, i demand at least 90% strike rate. And then, i just don't demand recoups. i just let losers remain there- 10% of them are destine to lose.

So , maybe it all come down to psychology????
Making money is easy- Just dont take losing trades
  • #3,515
  • Jan 17, 2011 1:14pm Jan 17, 2011 1:14pm
Discreation is all indeed survivor.

I still can't see and catch a constrainment, but the touches are very simple for me.

Just see if the price goes to some of the MA's on M15, then close the M15 and open a M1 chart as a main with the M15 MA's from the indicators here in the thread. Then wait for the price to stall around the MA's and eirher enter, either wait for further confirmation. M1 is the key i think for a touch trade, if it doesnt stop around the MA for at least 5-6 minutes i do not take it.

Just follow the rules of this simple and efective "Dance" and monitor the price action, but not price action of just one or two bars, but the whole scene. I seek double bottoms, H&S, flags, triangles and others on a M1 chart that happen near or at MA's and only then trade it. There are more than enough opportunities for trading, but the best ones are only two-three a day, so wait for them and catch them! 30 pips a day are usually made pretty easy like that, just WAIT for it, do not hurry, it will happen !!! There will be a better price is almost all cases, so just do not Hurry !!!

The key is patients, do not hurry to take it, it will give you a point to enter, just let the market show it's hands and if your are better, take it, if not - It is better to lose opportunity rather than capital.

P.S. Personally i have lost huge amount of money to learn to wait and to be patient, so now if i can save you some money, it will be a great thing to do!
Better to lose opportunity, rather than capital !
  • #3,516
  • Jan 17, 2011 1:38pm Jan 17, 2011 1:38pm
have found this thread and been reading with interest ... congrats to those who have figured out how to profit with this method. I've been trying to understand PA for awhile now and I think the information here has surely helped ... a sincere thank you to those who offered this for the rest to benefit from ...


now an idea about the touch and maybe how to calculate it .... as mentioned it's not "seeable" until after the bar closes and price moves away but there is perhaps a way to determine a location for entry by comparing the point value of two or three previous bars (can be found by hovering the mouse over the line) and add to the sequence the same value change to find where the next location could lock in... when you see a probable entry (one which conforms to the other rules) pull the trigger .... it seems the bar identified as the best entry price gennerally goes past this point .... I haven't gone thru a lot of trials yet to see, it's just an idea I got while reading your posts .... but if more traders look it over we'll find out in short order if it's junk or maybe helpfull.
  • #3,517
  • Jan 17, 2011 9:18pm Jan 17, 2011 9:18pm
Quoting Survivor
Agree completely Bigtent.

It may sound all like BS but it all comes down to discretion. I myself can nail constainments with my own "discretion" but I have a much lower strike rate in touch trades. SCREEN TIME may be the key. who knows. Again, in my exp, smaller stop loss than 10-11 pips (Am talking of monsters like GU) will kill your account faster than you think . That's my personal experience of killing accounts. you can trade otherwise and may still be profitable!

And about "recoups"- i never really think of them. If i have to recoup...
I think you misunderstood what I was talking about there.

It's not a case of "demanding" anything, the system being BS or anyone being an idiot.

"Recoup" is just a term and it is a fact of trading that you will get losses, and you will recoup those with profitable trades. It's not to be confused with "revenge trading", etc.

It's simple arithmetic and it occurs whether you think about it or not.

If you take the inevitable losses, then you must "recoup" that loss before you make actually are in profit.

I lost about 2% on the first two trades, but the next two I made around 3% profit, giving me around 1% profit overall.

So I "recouped" the 2% loss.

But you are very right about psychology.

My target was 3%, but I was only able to make 1% as I'd made poor entries.

I will always keep a track of where I am up to, but that doesn't mean that I'm going to get into "revenge trading" or the like.

It also doesn't mean that I will let the losses stop me (fear) from making a better entry and making a profit.

I was happy with the positive result, even though I hadn't reached my target, I'd learned something (at least I hope I did)!
  • #3,518
  • Edited 3:04am Jan 18, 2011 1:37am | Edited 3:04am
Hi guys,
i've been reading but not posting as much
still doing Dance trades as well as learning ( there's so much to learn)
and been busy with life too besides trading..

here's a setup i saw pre-london

touch of M15 10 EMA, price got rejected by RN 1.5950 and R1 of the day.
i took a Long off the touch. as of writing price is testing the RN again

1)steep angle of M15 10 EMA ( 32 degrees)
2) 35/50 MAs and Higher TF MAs all pointing up and below price
3)H1 and H4 and D1 trending UP

4)Be alert about - Price tested R1 and bounced off that strongly. Also RN 1.5950 could act as mini resistance


Entry 1.5946 SL 1.5925 ( 20 pip SL )
and 1st Target 1.5956 and 2nd Target ( SL to BE and let it run )

As of writing closed half at +10 pips remaining SL to BE.

EDIT: moved stop to BE+3 pips 1.5949 now..
EDIT: Stopped out when I moved my stop to 1.5954
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  • #3,519
  • Jan 18, 2011 1:57am Jan 18, 2011 1:57am
Possible Touch Trade on EURUSD coming to your neighbourhood soon??
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  • #3,520
  • Jan 18, 2011 3:06am Jan 18, 2011 3:06am
those who missed the 1st GU touch pre-london.
You got ur second chance when price retraced to just before RN 1.5950.
quick +15 pips and more for those who caught it.

Heads up: UK CPI data in 24 mins so best to stay flat ahead of data or close most of ur positions
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