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Attachments: The Force 5min system
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The Force 5min system

  • #3,001
  • Jul 14, 2010 9:57pm Jul 14, 2010 9:57pm
I have not read the book yet but knowing who it is from and the respect I have for the man it has to be good. Mike Bellafiore is the author of One Good Trade: Inside the Highly Competitive World of Proprietary Trading. I've met the man twice and he is a straight shooter, when everyone in the the prop trading firm are just looking for people to turn and burn his company is know to be turning out some of the best prop traders in the country.

It's worth the read, I'm picking it up for my vacation coming up!

Simple!~
A woman drove me to drink, and I forgot to thank her
  • #3,002
  • Jul 15, 2010 4:25am Jul 15, 2010 4:25am
Quoting fredgold3434
yes,so much respond and help i have got so far!!!!!!!!!!!
fred

here a good one
kino
Attached File(s)
File Type: ex4 MACD with crossing.ex4   4 KB | 462 downloads
  • #3,003
  • Jul 16, 2010 11:40am Jul 16, 2010 11:40am
The force signal is good (red line). But then we see a few (false) signals on EMA 5. What must I do? Must I stop the trade or can you see the bulls are going to win?
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #3,004
  • Jul 16, 2010 12:02pm Jul 16, 2010 12:02pm
I already understand. The market is in a down trend, so you must not trade long. I should look for a good short signal (for example the top of de trend channel). But how do I know how long the trend wil go on, you will see a lot of ema 5 signals?
  • #3,005
  • Jul 16, 2010 12:56pm Jul 16, 2010 12:56pm
I use Pivot Point Multitimeframe.mq4 from ForexJedi (first page). Is that a good one for all time frame's or must I use a other pivot .mq4?
  • #3,006
  • Jul 17, 2010 8:27am Jul 17, 2010 8:27am
Quoting Forexmist
I already understand. The market is in a down trend, so you must not trade long. I should look for a good short signal (for example the top of de trend channel). But how do I know how long the trend wil go on, you will see a lot of ema 5 signals?
Yes you are in a downtrend so you want to go south, that is correct. I would like you to look at the Macd, it also appears to be moving down. If this is the case, it is not a valid basic Force 5 set up.

As far for the question of how do I know how long the signal will go, that's the mega million dollar question and the hardest part of this job. I look at levels of S/R,TL, Pivot Points, and if the trend is making HH &LL showing a nice continuing of the trend. try to have a plan in your head or if your new on paper of what you are going do for every trade you are in. Something I learned off another thread, IF Then. If this happens, THEN i will do t his. have several scenarios played out of what could happen and then make a list of IF/THEN. basics of game theory .
A woman drove me to drink, and I forgot to thank her
  • #3,007
  • Jul 17, 2010 10:19am Jul 17, 2010 10:19am
Quoting Forexmist
I already understand. The market is in a down trend, so you must not trade long. I should look for a good short signal (for example the top of de trend channel). But how do I know how long the trend wil go on, you will see a lot of ema 5 signals?

I have been trying to put togrther a chart for you but for some reason my EU charts are not loading properly. So stay tuned.

Rufus
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #3,008
  • Jul 17, 2010 10:53am Jul 17, 2010 10:53am
Trade 1: I entered on the bar with the arrow when it broke to make a LL on the previous bar.

Trade 2: A great pin bar coming off of Support, i entered and got out on the pull back

Trade 3: i got in on the arrow and got out during the pull back

Just how I do it. I don't actually use the MACD or Stochs any more during my trades to be honest. I look at the price action. Hope it helps.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: sample chart 2.gif Size: 29 KB
A woman drove me to drink, and I forgot to thank her
  • #3,009
  • Jul 19, 2010 1:45pm Jul 19, 2010 1:45pm
Thank's for the comment. Did somone had these two (see picture), and why did you choose? My observations were:
- the day chart is up
- The Force 5 min. system was active
- A support line (first); a pivot line (second)

Call me Ishmael.......
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: foto2.gif Size: 25 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: foto3.gif Size: 27 KB
  • #3,010
  • Jul 19, 2010 10:49pm Jul 19, 2010 10:49pm
Quoting Forexmist
Thank's for the comment. Did somone had these two (see picture), and why did you choose? My observations were:
- the day chart is up
- The Force 5 min. system was active
- A support line (first); a pivot line (second)

Call me Ishmael.......
Hi Ishmael

I have been to busy working lately to do any trading. I looked at the charts and I would have taken those as well. GOOD TRADING

Rufus
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #3,011
  • Jul 19, 2010 11:55pm Jul 19, 2010 11:55pm
what are your emas?
A woman drove me to drink, and I forgot to thank her
  • #3,012
  • Jul 20, 2010 2:06am Jul 20, 2010 2:06am
I use SMA 7, 20 en 65 but when I am trading with The Force I use EMA 5 and SMA 7, 20.

Is that good?
  • #3,013
  • Jul 20, 2010 4:52am Jul 20, 2010 4:52am
I made a mistake in my post, when I use the Force:
- Ema 5
- SMA 20 en 65
  • #3,014
  • Jul 20, 2010 5:17am Jul 20, 2010 5:17am
Quoting Forexmist
I made a mistake in my post, when I use the Force:
- Ema 5
- SMA 20 en 65
What is en 65?
  • #3,015
  • Jul 20, 2010 6:23am Jul 20, 2010 6:23am
Quoting Forexmist
I made a mistake in my post, when I use the Force:
- Ema 5
- SMA 20 en 65
FM,

I understand why you use those two sma's as resistance and monitor. We use 2 5emas one at the open, and when at the close. they are the only real indicators I use any more. I use those and PA and the ema's have saved me more money than i would like to think. Things like, did the cross, how well can you see the cross, how big a gap between them, during many trends you can also use them as a way to set SL.

Just my 2 cents!
A woman drove me to drink, and I forgot to thank her
  • #3,016
  • Jul 20, 2010 12:18pm Jul 20, 2010 12:18pm
Simpleguy, Can you tell more about how you use these two indicatores (Ema 5 open and close)? There are enough false signals so it's important to see the nunaces? And what do you mean with PA?

I am learning... thanx


Midnightrun, I am from the Netherlands and we use the word 'en' instead of 'and'. Sometimes I forget to translate.

Bye!
  • #3,017
  • Jul 21, 2010 7:42am Jul 21, 2010 7:42am
Quoting Forexmist
Simpleguy, Can you tell more about how you use these two indicatores (Ema 5 open and close)? There are enough false signals so it's important to see the nunaces? And what do you mean with PA?

I am learning... thanx


Midnightrun, I am from the Netherlands and we use the word 'en' instead of 'and'. Sometimes I forget to translate.

Bye!
First lets look at this from a the most basic of levels. Let's look at the indicators we use:

1. MACD
2. Stoch
3. 5 ema open 5 ema close
4. Trend lines

Before a trade can be taken you must of the MACD moving in the direction of the trade showing a LL or HH, the stoch must cross from a point of overbought or oversold revesing with the trade and you must have the EMAs cross over. All of this has to be occurring on the same bar before you can even consider the entry. At this point if all the indicators are lined up, and the price action (PA) is correct you may enter the trade, if it is going with the daily trend.

what I use the emas for.

If they are still flowing in a nice smooth lines the trend is very likely to continue

if i see them crossing several times in the row back and forth back and forth, i will not trade that market cause it is telling me that the market is sideways and has not decided what it wants to do yet

on the reverse, i like to see them open up at a wide angle. this shows that price has reversed a lot and over time have noticed that it gives a better signal.

sometimes they act as a point of support, you will see a trend that the bars will keep going down to the 5 and bounce up, do it again, and again. i call it riding the five. if I see this and then it happens to break through it the trade has my full attention and i'm moving my SL up tight and quick.

I hope this help you a lot. I would suggest you read the whole thread paying very close attention to Forex Jedi, Robdee, Chow Clown, and vantage. I would also look at eddie grey in the beginning and watch how emotional he was, it's hard to be a good trader and that emotion. Rufus & Ezzy made some awesome progress on here. Look at the bumps and bruises we got along the way and see what we did right and wrong and learn from our experiences.

Hope this helps, good luck!

Post some charts we can go over them.
A woman drove me to drink, and I forgot to thank her
  • #3,018
  • Jul 21, 2010 8:54am Jul 21, 2010 8:54am
Quoting simpleguy

what I use the emas for.


I hope this help you a lot. I would suggest you read the whole thread paying very close attention to Forex Jedi, Robdee, Chow Clown, and vantage. I would also look at eddie grey in the beginning and watch how emotional he was, it's hard to be a good trader and that emotion. Rufus & Ezzy made some awesome progress on here. Look at the bumps and bruises we got along the way and see what we did right and wrong and learn from our experiences.

Hope this helps, good luck!

Post some charts we can go over them.

Amen Simple. Beautiful concise explanation. This thread is a great trading book on price action.

And thanks for the kind words.

Rufus
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #3,019
  • Jul 21, 2010 9:25am Jul 21, 2010 9:25am
Quoting Forexmist
Simpleguy, Can you tell more about how you use these two indicatores (Ema 5 open and close)? There are enough false signals so it's important to see the nunaces? And what do you mean with PA?

I am learning... thanx


Midnightrun, I am from the Netherlands and we use the word 'en' instead of 'and'. Sometimes I forget to translate.

Bye!
Hi Forexmist

Welcome to the Force thread.

PA ...Price action is what you learn a lot of here with this system. I havwe attached a copy of my original trading rules here. This may help.

Over the years of doing this now the place I struggle with is the mental side of things when it comes to trading. Patience for the best setups, and sit on my hands untill that happens.

Enjoy my original trading rules.

Most is exactly how FJ set it up. What I have in addition is some of my money management rules. Also I have some trade management concerning time that I implimented for me. You may like is as well.

Good trading to all

Rufus

Force 5
Trading Standards

　
This system is designed for positions that will be held for period of time that is dictated by the five minute chart. Could be held for days if I decide to let a piece run with a major trend.
EURUSD
Trading times-- 6:00-10:00 GMT 10:00-2:00 PST
11:00-14:00 GMT 3:00-7:00 PST


Screen Setup (Two charts)
(Chart #1)
5 Minute candlestick chart
50, 200, EMA
5 EMA yellow applied to open
5 EMA red applied to close
b-clock
Auto Pivot.. Calculates pivots according to GMT
MACD 12,26,1 1 means nothing
Stochastic : 5,3,3
　
(Chart #2)
5 Minute candlestick chart
20, 50, 200, EMA
5 EMA yellow applied to open
5EMA red applied to close
b-clock
Auto Pivot
MACD 12,26,1 1 means nothing
Stochastic 5,3,3
RSI 14
　
Start of each trading session convert 5 min. chart to 15 minute chart and mar the major trend lines. All trades will be in the direction of the trend. Entry will be within 20 pips of support trend line. Also each position will have at least 20 pips of room before any S/R that may hinder the move. Decide at the start of the trading session where on the chart I will open a position. Draw in a trend line to represent the zones I will take a trade
　
General Rules for Entries
1. Buy at support/ sell at resistance. Show each in trade journal.
2. At least 1:3 risk reward ratio to next known support/ resistance.
3. Establish S/R and supply/demand areas before trading begins.
4. At least 20 pips of room to “00” , pivot, or known S/R for entry
　
Trade signals are only confirmed on closed candles/bars.
Trending Market.
　
Buy Signal
a) When the stochastic crosses in bullish divergence and is not
overbought.
b) The MACD closes higher than the previous time interval
c) The Signal candle/bar closes higher bullish
d) The 5 ema to the close has crossed the 5 ema to the open
Stop Loss is the low of the previous candle or 20 pips but 20 pip min.
e) Enter signal + 1 pip within 2 bars after buy signal with no re-cross of EMA on entry candle.
　
　
Sell Signal
a) When the stochastic crosses in bearish divergence and is not oversold.
b) The MACD closes lower than the previous time interval
c) The Signal candle/bar closes lower bearish
d) The 5 ema to the close has crossed the 5 ema to the open
stop loss is the high of the previous candle or 20 pips but 20 pip minimum.
e) Enter signal + 1 pip in within 2 bars after sell signal with no re-cross of EMA on entry candle.
　
　
　
Trade Management
Count the bar I enter on.
In the money 3 bars or close position.
At least10 pips profit in 4 bars or close position.
At least 20 pips profit in 6 bars or move stop to entry price.
At least 20 pips profit in 8 bars close position, or leave small portion set with stop at entry price, if in a profit.
If in a position and 20 pips have not been reached. Candle closes (opposite direction of my entry) beyond the high/low of previous 5 minute candle, close the position.
　
Only reasons to exit position before stops or profit targets are reached.
Time rules above.
5 period EMA crosses back on a closed candle.
May consider leaving a small portion on.
Large candle moving against me.
Excessive volatility.
20 pips is the initial hard stop.
At 10 pips profit and the first half comes of.
Move hard stop ten pips. The whole position is now at break even.
At 20 pips profit move stop to entry price. All profit is locked in. The rest is let to run.
　
Win/Lose/Fail
A Win is 20 pips.
Fail is when position is closed out before 20 pips is reached.
Lose is when 20 pip stop loss is hit.
　
Position Management
1% of the account in each new position.
½ is taken off at ten pips profit.
¼ is taken off at 20 pips profit
¼ is let to run until price action takes it out.
Or set with a trailing stop equal to the 1 hour ATR.
Watch open position closely as it approaches pivot levels.
If I get another signal and I already have a running position. Let the position run and enter with another Force 5 group.
　
　
　
News Management
No new positions for 30 minutes before any high impact news release. If I have an open position during this time it may stay, but stop may need to be tightened up.
No new positions for 30 minutes after any high impact news release or until the price action calms down.
　
　
　
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #3,020
  • Jul 21, 2010 11:10am Jul 21, 2010 11:10am
Thank you guys, that's more than I asked for
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