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Ichimoku forever

  • #4,761
  • Edited 1:31pm Oct 7, 2009 1:19pm | Edited 1:31pm
Quoting Iskander
I agree , i think I sold after doji candle close below kumo , i was just testing this method , I also think that kumo doest act as strong on 1min chart as on higher timeframes , but its true that it is a lot safer to be on the right side of the kumo , especially when they all line up with higher TF . Also do u guys us CSTLB , as a confirmation after TsKs cross ?
You'll have to ask lbtrader on the CSTLB confirmation. So far, I have only used CSTLB to exit trades.
Personally, my entry is generally the exit of the Ts or Cs from the cloud as long as the candles are still fairly close to the kumo giving a good R:R and as long as Cs has crossed price. I like to see a bounce of price off S/R as well if I can but I only do this on the higher TFs at present (D,4,and 1).
But I also take the strong Ts/Ks crosses.
  • #4,762
  • Edited 1:37pm Oct 7, 2009 1:19pm | Edited 1:37pm
Thanks warriers for the help on scalping. Good advice to scalp using same rules Vic teaches.

Here's a Oanda 10 second perfect Vic setup with support of the 1m, 5m, and 15m below cloud and ts/ks crossed. Entry is the last orange triangle and exit is the green dot.

Second chart is what my screen looks like.

The 10 second chart had a consolidation pause then the cross. I held on to the 1.300 level for a TP for 28 pips demo. Stoploss was 15 pips. Price tested 13 of them. As I type, its still dropping more.

I've scalped on 10 second chart using moving averages. Its exhausting work but quick rewards with larger lot size since small stoploss.

Steve

PS: 10 second chart screen setup is a good way to learn ichi watching the various parts act in less time.
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
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Click to Enlarge Name: Ej Oanda 10 second.png Size: 74 KB
  • #4,763
  • Oct 7, 2009 1:45pm Oct 7, 2009 1:45pm
Quoting Iskander
I agree , i think I sold after doji candle close below kumo , i was just testing this method , I also think that kumo doest act as strong on 1min chart as on higher timeframes , but its true that it is a lot safer to be on the right side of the kumo , especially when they all line up with higher TF . Also do u guys us CSTLB , as a confirmation after TsKs cross ?
Iskander, the CSTLB ususally comes before the cross, if you noticed, all my examples have been strong signals, be it TS/KS or kumo breakouts (unless it is a countertrend). in the illustration below you will see the CSTLB occurs 25 pips before the kumo cross and confirmation by price clearance of the CS key resistance, so if you want to scalp that it is risky but feasible.
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  • #4,764
  • Oct 7, 2009 2:13pm Oct 7, 2009 2:13pm
Quoting lbtrader
Hi kevin,
using your settings, I think I would not have entered long before the chikou span cleared the flat kumo. and using the CSTLB that would be between 1.4695 and 1.4705. you also have to overcome the TS line although it is not a very strong resistance.
now using ichimoku with the standard settings, that is another story, the H1 TF is showing weak bearish TS/KS cross that has entered the kumo, and the H4 looks like the end of a weak bullish TS/KS cross that has retraced into the kumo now and heading towards a flat KS, so in both cases no trade....
Hello lbtrader,

You may be right about my timing, but when you enter isn't everything. What the trend is, and what price you enter with the trend at is probably more important. There are a lot of times when my timing is off, but I pick my support/resistance lines right, trading only with the trend, and therefore end up profiting. It just takes more patience; you set up your trades for the day based on what the Ichimoku is doing, and then let it sit for a while.

It's shocking to me how some people here are not even taking the daily ichimoku into account, especially since this is my main forex tool (not necessarily you, lbtrader). But the significance of a whole day's high's and low's cannot be understated.

The problem with waiting for the perfect set-up to me is that you are staring at your computer all day, waiting. You can trade based on Ichimoku daily and 3-hour flat lines, with the trend, and you will most likely make the same amount of money in less time; enjoying life more.

Just my thoughts, for what they're worth.
  • #4,765
  • Oct 7, 2009 2:26pm Oct 7, 2009 2:26pm
Quoting kharvell
Hello lbtrader,

You may be right about my timing, but when you enter isn't everything....
Kharvell

Please give more details on how you trade, and also if you are making many pips a month. It would be great to see the difference in the two ideas?

Thanks
  • #4,766
  • Oct 7, 2009 2:40pm Oct 7, 2009 2:40pm
Quoting kharvell
Hello lbtrader,

You may be right about my timing, but when you enter isn't everything. What the trend is, and what price you enter with the trend at is probably more important. There are a lot of times when my timing is off, but I pick my support/resistance lines right, trading only with the trend, and therefore end up profiting. It just takes more patience; you set up your trades for the day based on what the Ichimoku is doing, and then let it sit for a while.

It's shocking to me how some people here are not even taking the daily ichimoku into...
Hi Kevin
thanks for your thoughts and appreciate your reply, and I am not saying that a bounce off S/R is not important or carries less weight than a TS/KS cross, and I am not in favor of short TF trading, in fact I can only do that one day in the week, the rest of the week my job takes all my time.
I believe that the way you are using ichimoku is not the core method described in the major references on the subject, in fact you are using a standard S/R play using the property of one or two ichimoku components and not the whole system. if you are waiting for the perfect setup, it's because
you want to make sure you have the odds stacked in your favor and not get caught in a false move so I wouldn't qualify it a s a problem.
btw, if I'm doing a 1M trading, the daily ichimoku has very little impact on my success or failure, only my discipline and adherence to the rules does.
  • #4,767
  • Oct 7, 2009 5:03pm Oct 7, 2009 5:03pm
Quoting lbtrader
Hi Kevin
thanks for your thoughts and appreciate your reply, and I am not saying that a bounce off S/R is not important or carries less weight than a TS/KS cross, and I am not in favor of short TF trading, in fact I can only do that one day in the week, the rest of the week my job takes all my time.
I believe that the way you are using ichimoku is not the core method described in the major references on the subject, in fact you are using a standard S/R play using the property of one or two ichimoku components and not the whole system. if...
Lbtrader,

I am definitely well aware of all the aspects of the ichimoku and how they are used. I just do not see the reason of waiting for something deemed high probability set-up, when there are always pips to be made with the main trend. Think about what a TS/KS cross is or what a kumo breakout is. It's a bit redundant to me. You can draw any line on your graph and make conclusions about when the best time to buy/sell is. All a TS/KS cross is is 2 averages that cross. It does not necessarily follow that the price will move accordingly. Also Kumo breakouts, probably my preferred method if I were to have one; the kumo is just a longer-term average area where price tends to linger more. Just because price moves away, doesn't always mean it's go time.

These are the things that make me loathe "systems" and love the freedom of the ichimoku. You can use this indicator a thousand ways, as long as you're making pips; I don't care how. Just don't expect me to wait for some sort of signal, when I can enter into the trend at a good price by setting an order and enjoying other things in my day besides computer glow.

Bottom line is that everyone will (should) trade the way they want, and if my way doesn't sit well with you, use your own convictions.

The only reason I speak up around here is because I've been trading for over 5 years, and I've tried the smaller timeframes to no avail. It honestly is just harder for me to stay disciplined. Not sure how long you've been trading, but it's always the losing times that test me the most. The more standardized you are, the more you doubt yourself during the losing stretches, wondering "if I change this....". You lose and want to make up for it by betting more; digging you deeper. Trust me, I've been around a while.

Again, for what it's worth.

Ichidakiller,

I will continue to post some trades here in the near future; should be sufficient to explain how I trade. In terms of pips, it's not the pips that counts, but how much they're worth. As long as you're positive, you're doing better than most.

Good luck guys
  • #4,768
  • Oct 7, 2009 5:28pm Oct 7, 2009 5:28pm
Quoting lbtrader
page 1 of this thread.
Thanks lbtrader
  • #4,769
  • Edited 6:31pm Oct 7, 2009 5:46pm | Edited 6:31pm
Hey guys,

Just wanted to upload a successful trade. This was not using Vic's traditional strategy, this is based off a modification for the higher TFs that was pioneered by Giny. We were talking last night and we both entered a short on the USDJPY... I woke up this morning, adjusted my stop to the 15 KS, which was activated a moment later in a counter-trend move.

Total profit: 31.7 pips

Yes ladies and gentlemen, sweet green. Thank you Jesus!

God bless and the chart is below.

Doc
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  • #4,770
  • Oct 7, 2009 5:50pm Oct 7, 2009 5:50pm
Quoting drwasho
Hey guys,

Just wanted to upload a successful trade. This was not using Vic's traditional strategy, this is based off a modification for the higher TFs that was pioneered by Giny. We were talking last night and we both entered a short on the USDJPY... I woke up this morning, adjusted my stop to the 15 KS, which was activated a moment later in a counter-trend move.

Total profit: 317 pips

Yes ladies and gentlemen, sweet green. Thank you Jesus!

God bless and the chart is below.

Doc
Congrats on the pippage.
What are your entry criteria for this? Just interested.
  • #4,771
  • Oct 7, 2009 6:01pm Oct 7, 2009 6:01pm
Quoting SanMiguel
Congrats on the pippage.
What are your entry criteria for this? Just interested.
Basically monthly and weekly S/R (using CSPAN as guide), TS and KS levels (equilibrium levels or EQ levels) on the monthly, weekly, daily and 4 hourly chart. Establish the trend as normal on the higher time frames, trade in the direction of the trend after a pull back to a key level of EQ & S/R.

On my chart, don't pay attention to the 15 minute chart, I didn't use it (except to move my stop to the 15 minute KS level), I only choose to show the trade in a nice way.

Giny is the expert though, he called this one.
  • #4,772
  • Oct 7, 2009 6:17pm Oct 7, 2009 6:17pm
Quoting drwasho
Basically monthly and weekly S/R (using CSPAN as guide), TS and KS levels (equilibrium levels or EQ levels) on the monthly, weekly, daily and 4 hourly chart. Establish the trend as normal on the higher time frames, trade in the direction of the trend after a pull back to a key level of EQ & S/R.

On my chart, don't pay attention to the 15 minute chart, I didn't use it (except to move my stop to the 15 minute KS level), I only choose to show the trade in a nice way.

Giny is the expert though, he called this one.
Congrats for a big trade.
Steve
  • #4,773
  • Oct 7, 2009 6:31pm Oct 7, 2009 6:31pm
Hey guys,

As the more observant of you may have noticed, my actual profit was 31 pips not 317... I've been using Gomarket's MT4 platform and they deceptively add an extra decimal place at the end, so it appears you scored big.

Ah well, still a profitable trade!
  • #4,774
  • Oct 7, 2009 6:59pm Oct 7, 2009 6:59pm
Quoting drwasho
Hey guys,

As the more observant of you may have noticed, my actual profit was 31 pips not 317... I've been using Gomarket's MT4 platform and they deceptively add an extra decimal place at the end, so it appears you scored big.

Ah well, still a profitable trade!
Hey Doc,

Plus pips is plus pips, and thats $ in the bank.
fxScavenger Arrogance is just Ignorance misspelled. abso-PIPn-lutely
  • #4,775
  • Oct 7, 2009 7:20pm Oct 7, 2009 7:20pm
Quoting kharvell
I am definitely well aware of all the aspects of the ichimoku and how they are used. I just do not see the reason of waiting for something deemed high probability set-up, when there are always pips to be made with the main trend. Think about what a TS/KS cross is or what a kumo breakout is. It's a bit redundant to me. You can draw any line on your graph and make conclusions about when the best time to buy/sell is. All a TS/KS cross is is 2 averages that cross. It does not necessarily follow that the price will move accordingly. Also Kumo breakouts,...
Hi Kevin and lbtrader,

I can see that both of you are experienced traders. I have only been trading for a year and only on demo, so please feel free to let me know if you think I miss the mark.

I just wanted to point out that I believe you are actually agreeing with each other about trend trading. Here is a quick quote from the IchimokuWiki about trend trading and the Ichimoku:

Ichimoku Kinko Hyo is a purpose-built

trend trading charting system that has been successfully used in nearly every tradeable market.
It is unique in many ways, but its primary strength is its use of multiple data points to give the trader a deeper, more comprehensive view into price action.

In other words, Ichimoku is a system which assists the trader in establishing the trend and when the trend may be in a retracement or a reversal. So when Kevin is talking about 'the main trend', I am assuming that you are using the daily / weekly time frames to establish what 'the main trend' is?

Then, when you enter on the 3 / 4 hourly chart, you are not concerned about the signals on that chart because your long time frame signals are all giving you the thumbs up to go long (as in your eurusd trade ).


So the question I want to pose to both of you (Kevin and lbtrader) and anyone else who wants to give their 2 cents, is how many time frames need to be in line for you to consider a trade? Here is my opinion:


Weekly and Daily will establish the main trend with all of the Ichimoku signals lining up before I consider a trade. I will also check the 4hourly for possible entries, but most of my entries will be solely based on the weekly and daily charts in conjunction with weekly and monthly Chikou Span Support and Resistance levels. I don't even consider the 5m, 15m, 30m or hourly charts because in my opinion they only provide me with volatility compared to quite a smooth path on the longer time frames.


Cheers,


Giny

  • #4,776
  • Oct 7, 2009 7:32pm Oct 7, 2009 7:32pm
1h A/U has just done the signal!
  • #4,777
  • Oct 7, 2009 7:40pm Oct 7, 2009 7:40pm
That is not a valid signal. Price jumped up too much and has gone too far away from the TS. In order for me to consider this, two things would need to happen - TS and KS cross and price comes back to the TS. Then I'd look for an entrance on a lower TF.

Quoting Joe GX
1h A/U has just done the signal!
{Promotion Removed}
  • #4,778
  • Oct 7, 2009 7:45pm Oct 7, 2009 7:45pm
Quoting SanMiguel
I took a GBPJPY one as well, cloud exit, bounce from CS resistance. After 40 pips, I started trailing the KS but was stopped out by the spike, which is a bit annoying given where it has moved to now. A larger buffer might have helped me.
Hi lbtrader and San,

Good evening. Sorry for late response. Due to full-time day job, I couldn't respond to your comments. I have just got back from work for a while ago.

Very interesting concept about the trendline trading. Anyway, I would try to investigate about the trendline trading with Chikou span.

As you know, I am digesting the Ichi pdf and trying to go by with the illustrated description.

The problem is that it takes a time to go back and test the strategy. As a result, I try to test it out as I move forward with the current PA.

Thanks,
Cheers to all Ichi-pips collectors.
  • #4,779
  • Oct 7, 2009 7:50pm Oct 7, 2009 7:50pm
For all of you that like quick 1M moves, here is a nice USD/JPY 1M scalp that netted me 15pips.

http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/1806/usdjpy1m.jpg
{Promotion Removed}
  • #4,780
  • Oct 7, 2009 7:55pm Oct 7, 2009 7:55pm
Did you guys see that 46 pip gap up on the AUDUSD M1 about 20 minutes ago?
fxScavenger Arrogance is just Ignorance misspelled. abso-PIPn-lutely
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