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  • #81
  • Aug 26, 2009 8:14pm Aug 26, 2009 8:14pm
Quoting takingthepip
Then Renko Bricks are nonsense?

I'm still using C4, but cannot see the difference between Renko Bricks and lines on a regular chart spaced 5 or 10 pips apart. Would someone like to explain the advantage of Renko? Isn't waiting for a new brick to form the same as waiting for price to move 5 pips or 10 pips on a regular chart?

Renko is a charting method designed to help visualize PA by filtering out the noise.

Whether this is an advantage or not, who knows. Edge presented the idea and claimed it could be profitable, all we are trying to do is figure it out. Nothing more, nothing less.

In the end, it may not provide an advantage. But for now, the assumption is that it does.

Doc
  • #82
  • Edited 8:47pm Aug 26, 2009 8:45pm | Edited 8:47pm
Many many many years ago I was a member of the Boy Scouts in the UK. We were taught that when we had a long task to complete we mentally broke it down into maneagable pieces.

So on a long hike we would concentrate on a landmark a small distance ahead of us to focus on, when we reached it we would pick the next one. In any long taslk we would break it down into sections. Humans do this instinctively, finish this chapter before starting the next one, etc.

So with trading. we tend to break down the moves into achievable targets, be it s/r lines, fibs, sweet numbers whatever, as out pea brains can handle that.

Renko bars mentally give us a maneagable goal, only one brick and we can take profit. Using lines at 10 pips accomplishes the same thing. If you want to handle it that way that is your choice.

So for us pea-brains let us beaver away on our own method and find our way to success.

I would say the advantage of Renko bars is that they remove the distractions along the way so that your focus can remain on your target.
  • #83
  • Aug 26, 2009 8:51pm Aug 26, 2009 8:51pm
Quoting takingthepip
Then Renko Bricks are nonsense?

I'm still using C4, but cannot see the difference between Renko Bricks and lines on a regular chart spaced 5 or 10 pips apart. Would someone like to explain the advantage of Renko? Isn't waiting for a new brick to form the same as waiting for price to move 5 pips or 10 pips on a regular chart?

I think this is a question many people have. Renko charts are useful because they take time out of the equation. The forex markets have slow periods and ranging periods, which effect indicators such as moving averages (the price stays at the same price so it flattens out). With Renko bars, you get to see the movement, and remove the time element. Indicators look different when applied to renko charts because it focuses only on the movement.

Watching the price with 10 pip lines can have a similar effect, but only if you aren't using indicators on your charts.

Either way, Renko is an easy way to isolate price movement.

I hope this is helpful.

Cory
  • #84
  • Aug 27, 2009 12:10am Aug 27, 2009 12:10am
Quoting RacerX7
Good to see this new thread started!
Ive been testing nitro for 2 weeks and Im still no profitable AT ALL.
I lose constantly every day

But I see many goods results so I will keep practicing so I can master this system.

All you losers using nitro, you are not alone we need to practice more!

Thanks all.

Can you please post your losing trades? We can all learn from them.
  • #85
  • Aug 27, 2009 12:38am Aug 27, 2009 12:38am
Winning 70%, you will lose money.

It's simple math, I did some test and here's result.

1 win would be (1 renko bar size - spread)

1 lose would be (1 renko bar size * SL (appx, 2 or 2.2) + spread)

One of tightest spread ECN broker would charge you commission of 0.5 pip lose or bit less or more depending on the size of lot.

I tested backward and forward. I did not even includ splipage.


total trade: 100
symbol: EUR.USD
won: 70
lost: 30
renko bar size: 10 pip
spread: 1pip
SL: (renko bar size * 2)
Commission: 0.5 pip (only for me, I am using an ECN broker)

win pips: 70 (win) * 9 (renko bar size - spread) = 630
lost pips: 30 (loss) * 20 (renko bar size * SL) + spread (30) = 630


this is result before the commission. no splipage applied.

For me I had to add 50 pip to losing side for commission.

My ECN broker offered 0.5 pip, 1.5 or 2pip spread for EUR.USD. So I took average, 1 pip.

If I were you guys, I would seriously consider about scalping. In addition to this you need to set 2.1 SL because spread, or some of you win trades become losers.

Another fact, splipage would kill your profit, altough you did good mony management.

Please, be very cautious doing scalping unless you have a rock solid stregegy of at least 80% winning ratio.

You can not ignore spread, it is the secret weapon will wipe out your money.



Thank you.
  • #86
  • Aug 27, 2009 1:08am Aug 27, 2009 1:08am
Quoting jzw
Does reversing 20/30/40 pips mean that the next 5 pips will also be in that direction? I don't know - but you don't need Renko charts to test that assertion.
When you use standard candlesticks instead of Renko and price "reverses" 20/30/40 pips, are you sure that next 5pips also will be in that direction ?Does this make a sense ?
  • #87
  • Aug 27, 2009 1:56am Aug 27, 2009 1:56am
I think another thing to look at is renko block consolidation periods. They seem to range within a 2 to 3 block tunnel. At the breakout it usually runs for a couple blocks.

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: renko 4.gif Size: 85 KB
  • #88
  • Aug 27, 2009 2:54am Aug 27, 2009 2:54am
Quoting 4xtrader2
Can anyone see how to eliminate the single bar trades?
A possible way is using 'hi-lo activator' set to '3, 0' and wicks enabled on Renkos.

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: ej hi-lo.gif Size: 10 KB
Attached File(s)
File Type: ex4 HiLo Activator_v1.ex4   3 KB | 849 downloads
Wherever you look, there's something to be seen
  • #89
  • Aug 27, 2009 3:45am Aug 27, 2009 3:45am
Could you explain exactly how you'd use it?

Quoting justme
A possible way is using 'hi-lo activator' set to '3, 0' and wicks enabled on Renkos.

Attachment
  • #90
  • Aug 27, 2009 4:07am Aug 27, 2009 4:07am
Hi, have been giving some thought on avoiding the 1 bar swing change.
The thing that has interested me is why use 10 pip bars when chasing 5 pips.

What I have done is switch to 5 pip bars and used the MA line set to 5. Basically this doesn't change colour until the 2nd bar starts forming.

It seems to work, alright and incidentally should give more trading opportunites.

I have taken some one elses template and indicators for this. It seems to work better than anything I could develop. Apologies for not being able to recall who provided it, it is impressive.

FOr those trading without indicators I think the inclusion of the MA is still worth considering.

Food for thought

regards

Peter
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 5 pip bar example.gif Size: 30 KB
  • #91
  • Aug 27, 2009 4:25am Aug 27, 2009 4:25am
Quoting bali2002
Could you explain exactly how you'd use it?
It serves as S/R levels indicator. While price is under the red section of the indy I only look for selling, while price is over the green section I look for buying. In most cases 'one brick reversals' are filtered this way. When indicator is changing it's color or price is retracing from the lower or upper level it may be a quick scalp opportunity.
Also, when lower level (support) is breached, the newly formed upper section can be considered as an initial SL level. The same is true in the opposite situation.
I'm still experimenting with this, Renko is something relatively new in my trading experience.

Hope this helps.
Wherever you look, there's something to be seen
  • #92
  • Aug 27, 2009 5:09am Aug 27, 2009 5:09am
Quoting Wlfx
When you use standard candlesticks instead of Renko and price "reverses" 20/30/40 pips, are you sure that next 5pips also will be in that direction ?Does this make a sense ?
Wlfx - for the pairs that Nitro uses I don't know. But before trading Nitro I'd certainly want to know that it was true.

I find the whole Nitro discussion strange because no-one is sure exactly what the rules are and no-one knows whether it works. All you seem to have is a hope that it works.

Its good to see that some people are trying to test it before committing real $$$ because I don't think hope is a viable trading strategy.
  • #93
  • Aug 27, 2009 5:53am Aug 27, 2009 5:53am
Please post this template here so those interested don't have to
search forever on the other thread..LOL

Oh and if you will post the fx sniper kim IV as well
I think I deleted it with other indicators not long ago.

thanks

Brian

Quoting peterke
Hi, have been giving some thought on avoiding the 1 bar swing change.
The thing that has interested me is why use 10 pip bars when chasing 5 pips.

What I have done is switch to 5 pip bars and used the MA line set to 5. Basically this doesn't change colour until the 2nd bar starts forming.

It seems to work, alright and incidentally should give more trading opportunites.

I have taken some one elses template and indicators for this. It seems to work better than anything I could develop. Apologies for not being able to recall who provided it,...
  • #94
  • Aug 27, 2009 6:01am Aug 27, 2009 6:01am
Quoting bali2002
So it is basically providing the same function than the HMA!
As far as I can see, almost all trend-following indies provide similar functions
Initial question was about filtering out 'one brick reversals' which was not achievable with the tools presented. So I'm suggesting a possible solution based on wicks instead of pure Renko bricks.
Wherever you look, there's something to be seen
  • #95
  • Aug 27, 2009 6:52am Aug 27, 2009 6:52am
Thanks for the good job done here. Pls what is the TF I can use??
  • #96
  • Aug 27, 2009 7:01am Aug 27, 2009 7:01am
Quoting jzw
Its good to see that some people are trying to test it before committing real $$$ because I don't think hope is a viable trading strategy.
I think if you read through prior posts you'll see it is based on a lot more than hope. We have people starting to make consistent returns using renko PA, some have gone 7 days or more without a single loss. That is why we see such huge potential in this.

Many others who are trading this successfully have not yet posted here.

Now we are working to refine the method & find the best way to trade it for steady profit. That is why we are not interested in variations on the method in here (i.e. greater profit taking, smaller stops, re-entries, etc).

One thing I've noted: when people start to trade with renko they usually lose more than win the first couple of weeks. With consistent practice however sooner or later a lightbulb switches on and one starts to 'see' the PA others are talking about. No short-cuts, I think, although we continue to look for them.
******************* I'd rather make money than be right.
  • #97
  • Aug 27, 2009 7:02am Aug 27, 2009 7:02am
Quoting Angel Moroni
Thanks for the good job done here. Pls what is the TF I can use??
There is no TF with renko, it is based on # of pips move, not time.
******************* I'd rather make money than be right.
  • #98
  • Aug 27, 2009 7:24am Aug 27, 2009 7:24am
Quoting justme
It serves as S/R levels indicator. While price is under the red section of the indy I only look for selling, while price is over the green section I look for buying. In most cases 'one brick reversals' are filtered this way. When indicator is changing it's color or price is retracing from the lower or upper level it may be a quick scalp opportunity.
Also, when lower level (support) is breached, the newly formed upper section can be considered as an initial SL level. The same is true in the opposite situation.
I'm still experimenting with this,...
This is interesting and may be more useful than the HMA, at first glance .. but I don't get why it is important to see the wicks. Do they add something to interpretation of the indicator?
******************* I'd rather make money than be right.
  • #99
  • Aug 27, 2009 7:41am Aug 27, 2009 7:41am
Quoting 4xStar
I think if you read through prior posts you'll see it is based on a lot more than hope. We have people starting to make consistent returns using renko PA, some have gone 7 days or more without a single loss. That is why we see such huge potential in this.

Many others who are trading this successfully have not yet posted here.

Now we are working to refine the method & find the best way to trade it for steady profit. That is why we are not interested in variations on the method in here (i.e. greater profit taking, smaller stops, re-entries,...
Mate,

100% agree. Its not about Indi's its about the trader.

The indi's for this system are there to prompt to trader to look at the chart and analyze, nothing more. Not one of them is there to say TAKE THE TRADE NOW.

When the Trix, and the Ma and the Meter and the Momentum etc..... are all there it is still up to YOU the trader to decide if to take the trade. This decision will be based on all of those mentioned and correlation but MOST IMPORTANTLY the traders understanding of what is happening and belief of what will happen.

Don't forget the target is only 5 pips. The visual back testing on Renko wont show how many of the 1 bar formations would have been profitable if taken. Also, there are no rules to say you have to wait until the Renko bar has closed before taking the trade.

Aiming for 1 - 4 trades a day at only 5 pips is a TINY amount to get out of the market. YES, is very frustrating to take 5 pips at the start of a 40 pip move...... but to go 40 pips it has to go 5.

Why do you need the 40 pips? Is it so you can get more money? If so up your lot size. And Yes i know, bigger lot size bigger loss if the SL is hit...... but by only taking 1 trade at each market overlap there is no pressure to take trade after trade after trade..... If you are happy with what you can see and can be patient to ONLY TAKE THE TRADE WHEN YOU CAN FEEL that it is going to work then the number of losing trades should be inconsequential.

That is how i see it and as previously stated without 6 months of trading and the number to show am not going to know if it works out that way.

All i know is that 7 days on the trot without losing a trade is very good for me and plan on continuing that way.
  • #100
  • Aug 27, 2009 7:58am Aug 27, 2009 7:58am
Quoting waddij
Mate,

100% agree. Its not about Indi's its about the trader.

The indi's for this system are there to prompt to trader to look at the chart and analyze, nothing more. Not one of them is there to say TAKE THE TRADE NOW.

When the Trix, and the Ma and the Meter and the Momentum etc..... are all there it is still up to YOU the trader to decide if to take the trade. This decision will be based on all of those mentioned and correlation but MOST IMPORTANTLY the traders understanding of what is happening and belief of what will happen.

Don't forget...
Good posting here for sure.

Wish all of you the best btw.

As you gain proficiency with MT4 Nitro, it has the ability to consistently operate in the 88-92% renge if trading in good volatility times.

More than enough for you to survive off of.

Also, have no intent of dominating this or any other offshoot thread. Keep plugging forward. The plan is solid. Not all will grasp it as scalping plans are a quandry to many quite often. Just the way it goes.

Will wander around for a while.
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