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Sonic R. System

  • #4,681
  • Aug 7, 2009 1:15am Aug 7, 2009 1:15am
Sonic, now that the news for today do not have much time gap, what should we do? should we still follow your system or should we wait for the news
  • #4,682
  • Aug 7, 2009 1:18am Aug 7, 2009 1:18am
Quoting Rastaman
You are right, NVO certainly looks more predictive of volume comming into a trade than the volume indicators.

My mistake....I am losing it for sure today.
No, you are not losing it. "Reading" volume can be a very tricky thing. Sometimes, if you really want to dig into it, when you see a spike on NVO, you go to smaller TFs that made up that spike and try to see from the smaller TFs if the spikes there were on candles driving the price down or up. When just looking at a spike and a tall candle, there needs to be caution, because we don't know from only that, where all that volume was distributed over the price range encompassed by the candle! We don't want to make the assumptions that "Better Volumes" makes! Looking at smaller TFs and continuing to carefully analyze PA, before and subsequent to the spike is about all we can do to try to come to a reasonable conclusion.
  • #4,683
  • Aug 7, 2009 1:19am Aug 7, 2009 1:19am
Quoting gusismith
Sonic, now that the news for today do not have much time gap, what should we do? should we still follow your system or should we wait for the news
If u follow my system properly "now", it will tell u to wait for the news...as it is ranging now with no proper set up of Sonic R...


Sonic
  • #4,684
  • Aug 7, 2009 1:24am Aug 7, 2009 1:24am
Quoting traderathome
No, you are not losing it....

Many, thanks T....That is indeed something and probably one of hte finer points to this indi.
Starting to see instead of just looking.
  • #4,685
  • Aug 7, 2009 1:38am Aug 7, 2009 1:38am
thank you sonic. I'm a newbie to your system and moreover i just started taking live trades. I'll wait.
  • #4,686
  • Aug 7, 2009 1:48am Aug 7, 2009 1:48am
Quoting traderathome
"Reading" NVO Volume:

Look at the chart. Before price moved down, there was relative high volume interest. As price went lower, volume dropped off. But price was worked back up a bit and then again in came relative high volume interest.

In the first event, PA was above 89 ma. The second event occurred only when the price, which had fallen, was being worked back up to "test" the 89 ma, now as resistance....and a good place to resume selling before the price drops again.

So, in conclusion, it would appear, so far, there is a good senario...
Remember this "volume may be selling volume" senario? If it was traders selling off/going short, then they did it just in time......
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  • #4,687
  • Aug 7, 2009 1:58am Aug 7, 2009 1:58am
GU M15: GBP PPI about 22 minutes ago.....PA is drooping...
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  • #4,688
  • Aug 7, 2009 2:23am Aug 7, 2009 2:23am
Quoting gusismith
thank you sonic. I'm a newbie to your system and moreover i just started taking live trades. I'll wait.

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

You don't want to be making live trades with real money with a system you obviously do not know much about!
Starting to see instead of just looking.
  • #4,689
  • Aug 7, 2009 2:31am Aug 7, 2009 2:31am
TAH

So, can we consider the lack of volume in the areas I marked with yellow boxes, as a lack of volume or interest in Bulls to force price up? And, that in this state the market is undecided and we may see a reversal on the cards?
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Starting to see instead of just looking.
  • #4,690
  • Aug 7, 2009 2:49am Aug 7, 2009 2:49am
Quoting Rastaman
TAH

So, can we consider the lack of volume in the areas I marked with yellow boxes, as a lack of volume or interest in Bulls to force price up? And, that in this state the market is undecided and we may see a reversal on the cards?
The lower volume in those lower price areas may mean that most of the trading is being done by sellers. When the price gets too low for them, they become less active.....wait for market to settle and see how hard it will be to coax the price back up so they can resume their selling. Anyway, that is how it struck me.
  • #4,691
  • Aug 7, 2009 5:37am Aug 7, 2009 5:37am
Quoting gusismith
thank you sonic. I'm a newbie to your system and moreover i just started taking live trades. I'll wait.
I Suggest That You Trade Only On Demo. There Are Many Things With Any System That You Should Find It Out YOURSELF. So Don't Rush To Trade Live. Trade Demo And After You Find Out Yourself Growing Your Account Three Months In a Row, Then You Can Try Micro Accounts, Then Standard Account.

Let Me Tell You My Experience On This Attitude. There Was a Time That I Entered A Thread Or Read a Book , Then I Backtested It Little, Or Doing Some Demo For 2 Weeks Or Just Under Impression Of Posters In That Thread Or Examples In That Book, I Decided To Trade Live.
But I Lost Large Amount Of Money On That. Then I Found Out Something , I Found Out It's Not Only The System That Makes You Profitable, It's You. Just Like DD Said Before, It's 99% On You And 1% On SonicR (Because Many Of Us Are Making Profit With This System) To Be Profitable. 99% On You Because If The System Isn't Working, Why Some People Are Making Profit Trading It And Many Other Loosing Their Money On It ? So It's Compeletly You, Your Ego, Your Greed, Your Patience, Your Emotions, Your Money Management, Your Trade Management, Your Discipline, Your Effort, Your Knowledge From The System And Market ...

Even If You Were Not a Newbie To Forex, It Take Time To Adjust Yourself To System, Find Out The Details Of It, And More Importantly, Find Out HOW It Works For You. But If You Are Experienced Trader In Forex, It Takes You Maybe Few Weeks To Master a System, But If You Are a Newbie (Lower Than 1 Year Trading Experience), It Takes You Few Months Or More To Master It.


I Should Emphasize It, Not Just For You, But For Everyone Who Is Reading This Post And Made Some Profitable Trades And Say "Why Not Making Real Money When I'm This Profitable ?!", : Don't Rush Otherwise Your Account Will Be Destroyed, Not With This Method, But With Any Other System That You Are Trading. Money Will Come, Just Concentrate On Learning.


I Think It's Like Football Game. In This Game, All 11 Players Don't Concentrate On Goalge, They Just Do What They Are Supposed To Do. One Will Defend The Goal For Their Team, One Will Defend, And When They Are Attacking, Again Many Of Them Even Don't Look At Their Opponent Goal, They Just Concentrate On Passing, Dribbling And Such Things. Then Result Is A Goal. I Think It's Somehow Like Forex : When You Are Newbie To Any System, Specially With Forex, You Shouldn't Think Of How Much You Can Get, You Should Concentrate On Learning This Business.

Ever Think Why 95% Of Traders Loose Money ?! One Think May Cause You And Your Accounts a Huge Damage, And That's Being SPECIAL. First When I Start To Work Forex, In First Two Weeks With Real Account (After 4 Months With Demo), I Doubled My Account (1000$ To 2000$) , And I Thought That I Was Special, I Can Make a Shortcut To Being Profitable, But I Loose That 2000$ After Few Months ... This Thought Could've Damaged Me Very More, But Then I Realized NOONE Is Special. No One. Some May Learn Faster But There Is No Special. Like Said In 5Steps Pdf In Post #1, It's Takes You 1 To 3 Years For Being Profitable, And Moslty 3 , I Think It Depends On You Stubbornness. It Depends How You Listen To Those Who Gone Through What You're Going Through Now. They Did Many Things That You Do. It's Really Amazing That How People Act The Same. And It's More Amazing That Many Of Them Don't Accept, They Don't Accept That They Are In Wrong Direction. They Want To Find Everything Out Themselfs, They Think There Is a Way Thay Many Of Experienced Traders May Not Know Or If They Know, They Kept It As a Secret.

I Believe You Can Approach To Being a Successful Traders With Just One Attitude ... Have Hearing To Those Who Ride This Road Before You.

I'm Not Pointing All The Post To You, I Sometimes Use Some Posts To Say Some Of My Exepriences. And After All, It's Just My Opinion

Regards,
Basber
Trading methods are designed to put the odds in our favor, not predicting.
  • #4,692
  • Aug 7, 2009 5:44am Aug 7, 2009 5:44am
As usual Freak Friday.

look how market react when us news came out.

Long or short. will be kill!!
trade safe
  • #4,693
  • Aug 7, 2009 5:58am Aug 7, 2009 5:58am
NFP really live up to its name...

First..it flush up to eat up Short's SL... and to trap newbie Long...
and It brings all the way down to finish off Long SL, and bring newbie Short...

Double edged sword...

I am bullish for this as the news figure is good

Sonic
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  • #4,694
  • Aug 7, 2009 6:06am Aug 7, 2009 6:06am
I just sat and watched this rocket take off.
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Starting to see instead of just looking.
  • #4,695
  • Aug 7, 2009 6:24am Aug 7, 2009 6:24am
Quoting Rastaman
Ok, I need the P4 clock to show me when London opens, NY, Berlin and how much candle time is left when I check the Higher TF. I need a volume indicator as Sonic recommends one and this is obviously a good idea to give some idea of expected move and ranging. I just added the Demark indicator not for breakout but to give me an idea of possible Tp1 as to be honest with you, I have NO idea how you guys are working out the Tp1 & Tp2. Once I get used to this system and it becomes (IF) second nature like you guys, I will ditch excess...
SonicR will not become second nature for you so long as you are trying to substitute reading indicators for reading price action.

You do not need to know what time it is! You do not even need to know that news is pending! I do not know anything about when news is coming or when a market is opening or closing. I trade 24 hours a day (when I am awake, I am trading). Price action is the same all the time. I will enter a trade 30 seconds before Non Farm Payroll if SonicR Price action tells me that is what to do. Price does not care about news. Price does not care about what time it is. Price goes where it is going to go and it usually tells us in advance where that is. You keep looking for a directional indicator. You already have one or your chart, but you have so much other stuff on your chart that you can't see the one indicator that will tell you what you want to know. Price itself!

As far as TP's, you find them the same way you set your EP and your SL - price gives them to you - We use support and resistance. There has not been an indicator developed that calculates support and resistance, and there never will be. Support and resistance are visible. Support and resistance are observable. I am half blind, and I can see them. You need only to open your eyes, which I would bet are much better than my eyes, and you will see them too.

Quoting Rastaman
Thanks, but are these volume indicators?
By directional, I mean a volume indicator that shows if the volume is in buying or selling, not the direction of the trend.
Rastaman, there is no such thing as "directional volume." For every "buy," and I mean every buy, there is a sell. Everytime you buy, someone, whether it is you market maker or one fo their customers is on the other side of you trade.

I am quoting TAH's post below. My post is so long that FF will not let me quote the whole post - but I suggest you read it again: I think it it the best post so far concerning volume and volume indicators in this thread. (Great Job TAH!)

Quoting traderathome
The falicy behind "Better Volumes" is assigning volumes to accumulation if the bar closes higher, and assigning it to distribution if the bar closes down. We know that many times during a single timeframe the price can be driven down, then high volume, then driven up on light volume, to close higher! Yes, that could be buying/accumulation. But there are also many times when the price is first driven up on light volume and then held up while heavy volume comes in..........SELLING! This is why that indy can show a Red and a White bar, one soon after...
That is exactly right ... spikes in volume give you a hint that something is up, or, better yet, a hint that something might be up. It does not, as Sonic has stated over and over, tell you the direction that that something will take.

There is only one directional indicator. That indicator is price itself. Learn wave analysis, learn to distinguish a swing high and a swing low from the random meanderings that create the swing itself. You are wasting precious time playing with all sort of indicators, volume and otherwise, and you are avoiding spending time on the most important part of SonicR - The part that will help you make more and lose less money on your trades. PRICE!

Rasataman, if you are still demo trading SonicR, then do this exercise, as it helped me when I was trying to learn to trade it: Take off all indicators except the Sonic Dragon and the Sonic CCI set to 63.

Then, just watch price every waking moment. Don't even demo trade. Just try to identify when price has given a L-H-HL with an entry point above the dragon and Sonic CCI blue for a long.

Identify when price is giving a H-L-LH with an entry point below the dragon and Sonic CCI red for a short.

Price Action - the only indicator you will ever need.
  • #4,696
  • Aug 7, 2009 6:29am Aug 7, 2009 6:29am
Quoting Rastaman
You are right, NVO certainly looks more predictive of volume comming into a trade than the volume indicators.

My mistake....I am losing it for sure today.
Anticipate ... not predict.

Winning traders use Price Action to anticipate future PA.

Losing traders use indicators to (wrongly) predict future PA.
  • #4,697
  • Aug 7, 2009 6:39am Aug 7, 2009 6:39am
Quoting Rastaman
Now, my head is really doing the Whatoozie!

Ok, I think the best bet is to go back to the NVO.
I hope you do not think I am picking on you, Rastaman. You see, eight months ago I was exactly where you are now. I went on the same expedition for the magic indicator. I am trying to help you see what it took me months to see:

I was avoiding the hard work of studying SonicR, studying Sonic's original manual, studying this thread, and studying price action; and instead I was trying to substitute a magic indicator for that hard work.

There is work to be done. Once you do that work, you will have a skill the likes of which you will find in few other poeple. It is a skill that will ultimately set you free. Now, stop it with the indicator hunt, and get to work! We are here to help.
  • #4,698
  • Aug 7, 2009 6:47am Aug 7, 2009 6:47am
Many fools want to fool you, many liars want to lie to you, many thieves want to steal from you. Then you will realize it was all your doing. If you want to follow pathetic systems like this you should flip a coin because it has the same probability rate of success. Back in 2001 some guy on a blog flipped a coin each day for his direction on the ES as an experiment. Best out of 3 and he took the direction with a 10 point stop 10 point profit. After 18 months he had made something like 13000% on his demo and stopped posting. No one could ever find him again, I wonder if he went on to successfully trade the markets and forgot about the internet.
  • #4,699
  • Aug 7, 2009 7:02am Aug 7, 2009 7:02am
Quoting ddaytrader
I hope you do not think I am picking on you, Rastaman. You see, eight months ago I was exactly where you are now. I went on the same expedition for the magic indicator. I am trying to help you see what it took me months to see:

I was avoiding the hard work of studying SonicR, studying Sonic's original manual, studying this thread, and studying price action; and instead I was trying to substitute a magic indicator for that hard work.

There is work to be done. Once you do that work, you will have a skill the likes of which you will find in few...
Not at ALL DD. I am reversely extremely grateful for all the advice and realize from the start that this is the true spirit of this thread that Sonic intended.
Especially as I received a PM from Sonic explaining how he started out and in this pm I could sense the genuine caring Sonic has for people.
I must also say that I am sure Sonic is proud of all who try to help people like myself who are relatively new to forex and even newer to this system.

I see someone posted something rather abrasive about this thread above this post!
I hope that person will read this post and perhaps get an inkling of the humanism in this thread and thus with a little luck, learn that what they wrote is simply a reflection of their own bitter human situation.

So, thanks DD and please don't hold any punches when I go off track.
Starting to see instead of just looking.
  • #4,700
  • Aug 7, 2009 7:06am Aug 7, 2009 7:06am
Quoting Rastaman
I see someone posted something rather abrasive about this thread above this post! I hope that person will read this post and perhaps get an inkling of the humanism in this thread and thus with a little luck, learn that what they wrote is simply a reflection of their own bitter human situation.
I put negative people on my Ignore list. Life and trading has enough adversity without having to put up with undue negativity from bitter people.

1) Click on Negative User name to bring up his/her profitle
2) Click on "add to ignore list"

Repeat as necessary
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