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  • #3,801
  • Jul 10, 2008 9:36am Jul 10, 2008 9:36am
Quoting ianf0ster
Hi,
Since you mention De mark trend lines, are you using DIBS with the T De Mark targets (as in Mouteki)?

Just curious,
Ian
Hi Ian

If you mean the potential price target moves from a TD breakout (which are drawn in on the Demark indicator) then the quick answer is no. For sure price often does reach these targets but I use 100% discretion on profit targets. I always have my eye on support/resistance areas and channels, as well as previous day,week,month high lows. No one knows where price will go, so I find it pointless thinking I will not take profit until point X. If price hits a serious area of resistance I will take profits simple as that. If I see I reversal candle I will take profits. Sometimes I flip to a 5 minute chart watching price bouncing off a 20 period ema as a profit trail. Of course all these presume I am in profit to start with.
  • #3,802
  • Jul 10, 2008 9:36am Jul 10, 2008 9:36am
Here's the deal for me and how I do it:
I like to take trades only in the beginning of the day, at or just after the daily open and within the first few hours. If there's been a move and I missed it I'm out for the day usually. Why - Forex is traded mainly in the European session, high % of the volume traded each day is traded then. And we need volume to move the market right?! So from lunch time (when the market movers are on lunch) and until the US session begins the market isn't moving so much, so I don't look to trade during the lunch time, and here is where you will see a few IB's after the initial move (read the first post on the original thread). Then you might see some action at the start of the US session and until the end of the European session when we should stop taking trades. And PC says the first 6-9 hours are the best for us - that means from 6gmt to 12-15gmt. 12gmt is just around the NY session so we don't even need to look for trades then.
So I look for trades from the daily open around 5gmt and a few hours on. If the market has made a big move compared to the daily average range (no number here) then the chanses for a new trade to have a run isn't as big as for the first trade (not saying it's like this always but thats my rule). If I get a setup that I like (it should be above average setup based on more that just an IB) after a move then I will play it, but risk less (%) since the rewards imo is less. If the market has been in a range all morning going into the NY session - then I'll look for setups in the NY session the usual way since I figure the risk:reward is good.
I do trade priceaction overnight ranges and that usually gives me an early entry with good risk:reward potential. But that is close to the DIBS system so I trade both whichever I find is more rewarding on the day. And I try to look for higher timeframes, which is why I shared with you the H8 charts.
Not all IB's are the same, this you have seen. So I've found a way to restrict my self from taking every trade. I don't know how PC does but every one has to find their own comfort zone. And one last thing: I don't look at IB's as if they were a signal, like the signal you get from a mechanical system where you would buy/sell when all indicators line up. Again not every IB is the same. Demo for a while, see different IB's, look at where they come and look at the overall picture with tredlines and s/r. Just practice and remember that this doesn't happen overnight - hell I'm not even close to being a fulltime trader and I'm learning new stuff almost everyday, just by studying. It's ok lo lose now - those losses will make us richer later because we will learn from them. And we are looking to make losses, it's part of the game! We aren't even looking for a good win/loss ratio with this system, we are looking for low risk entries/high rewards entries.
Here's my suggestion to all of you who are struggeling (this is what I've done and will continue to do): Keep a journal over all trades you make. Before entering a trade type some thoughts like where the IB is, s/r and such and what you think might happen. After the trade is closed (win or loss) add that to the journal with a few comments to why things happened as they did. And add a chart or two. Later you can go back and compare trades that you've made, wins and losses, and get a better view of things and I'm sure this will help you. Try it and be consistent with the journal, it's a very important step in the learning process. Take only demotrades for 2-3 month and then go back and read the whole thing and I'm sure you'll see things differently.
Long post but I feel it was necessary. I'm still a newbie and if you feel that I'm wrong in a way then you are probably right, because I still have a lot to learn!
  • #3,803
  • Jul 10, 2008 9:38am Jul 10, 2008 9:38am
I think it is important to have some understanding of the currencies you are trading which is why it is better to only trade a few.

The USD/CHF and EUR/USD are directly inversly correlated. ie. If EU/USD goes up, CHF/USD will go down. There is also some inverse correlation with the EU/USD and USD/JPY.

Yesterday the Euro went up and was trying to break important resistance.

Although it did a pull back today, it did seem very likely that it would try to break the resistance again sometime today.

For these reasons I would not have taken a long position in either the CHF or USD/JPY whilst the EU/USD was coming off bottom of important trend line support and attempting to go back up.
  • #3,804
  • Jul 10, 2008 9:43am Jul 10, 2008 9:43am
Hi Kimmy,

I might suggest that when markets are very rangy (and choppy, too), you need to trade in a more conservative manner.

For example, even though the rules state that your TP and SL should be equal to the length of the IB, I might let my SL go only one-third to one-half that distance so as not to incur a greater loss, until the market begins to show somewhat more cohesive trending. This is purely discretionary, of course.

And, the same goes for taking profit. In these markets, you might consider taking your profit early. So, instead of holding out for gains of 20 pips or more, simply take what the market is willing to give you up front. If you find yourself ahead by say, even 3-5 pips and price begins to fall back, get out asap, take your profit and keep smiling! More trades will come your way.

Live to trade another day...



Quoting kimmy
Hey Guys

I am in despair ........loss after loss after loss !!!!

someone just shoot me and put me out of my misery haha

cheers
kim
Jeff Singer, K2KV
  • #3,805
  • Jul 10, 2008 9:47am Jul 10, 2008 9:47am
Quoting HouseTrader
Absolutely true!

Let's say the market is much more "sensitive" to news and speeches, sometimes in the (which we call) the "wrong" direction... (Mr. Market is never wrong...). I've been chasing the market this whole week, but pulled the trigger just a few times... Most of the times I was glad to be sitting on my itching hands...

By the way... isn't Ferrari that red car with a little horse on it?

http://www.dyna.co.za/cars/Car_-_Transport_Horse.jpg

I guess this one I can afford

Cheers!
Isn't that horse IN it, not ON it, maybe that's why you can afford it
  • #3,806
  • Jul 10, 2008 9:49am Jul 10, 2008 9:49am
TOO LATE; I found the website for the dibs system trading method but I got there too late. They were only enrolling 27 people and they had filled up; but I'm an the waiting list. It's a "steal-deal" at $327.00 per month . They also guarantee 841 pips per month, and if you don't like the program just let them know within 8 days & get an instant refund. Such a Deal.
Hej.
  • #3,807
  • Jul 10, 2008 9:49am Jul 10, 2008 9:49am
Quoting NowAndLater
Here's the deal for me and how I do it:
I like to take trades only in the beginning of the day, at or just after the daily open and within the first few hours. If there's been a move and I missed it I'm out for the day usually. Why - Forex is traded mainly in the European session, high % of the volume traded each day is traded then. And we need volume to move the market right?! So from lunch time (when the market movers are on lunch) and until the US session begins the market isn't moving so much, so I don't look to trade during the lunch time, and here is where you will see a few IB's after the initial move (read the first post on the original thread). Then you might see some action at the start of the US session and until the end of the European session when we should stop taking trades. And PC says the first 6-9 hours are the best for us - that means from 6gmt to 12-15gmt. 12gmt is just around the NY session so we don't even need to look for trades then.
So I look for trades from the daily open around 5gmt and a few hours on. If the market has made a big move compared to the daily average range (no number here) then the chanses for a new trade to have a run isn't as big as for the first trade (not saying it's like this always but thats my rule). If I get a setup that I like (it should be above average setup based on more that just an IB) after a move then I will play it, but risk less (%) since the rewards imo is less. If the market has been in a range all morning going into the NY session - then I'll look for setups in the NY session the usual way since I figure the risk:reward is good.
I do trade priceaction overnight ranges and that usually gives me an early entry with good risk:reward potential. But that is close to the DIBS system so I trade both whichever I find is more rewarding on the day. And I try to look for higher timeframes, which is why I shared with you the H8 charts.
Not all IB's are the same, this you have seen. So I've found a way to restrict my self from taking every trade. I don't know how PC does but every one has to find their own comfort zone. And one last thing: I don't look at IB's as if they were a signal, like the signal you get from a mechanical system where you would buy/sell when all indicators line up. Again not every IB is the same. Demo for a while, see different IB's, look at where they come and look at the overall picture with tredlines and s/r. Just practice and remember that this doesn't happen overnight - hell I'm not even close to being a fulltime trader and I'm learning new stuff almost everyday, just by studying. It's ok lo lose now - those losses will make us richer later because we will learn from them. And we are looking to make losses, it's part of the game! We aren't even looking for a good win/loss ratio with this system, we are looking for low risk entries/high rewards entries.
Here's my suggestion to all of you who are struggeling (this is what I've done and will continue to do): Keep a journal over all trades you make. Before entering a trade type some thoughts like where the IB is, s/r and such and what you think might happen. After the trade is closed (win or loss) add that to the journal with a few comments to why things happened as they did. And add a chart or two. Later you can go back and compare trades that you've made, wins and losses, and get a better view of things and I'm sure this will help you. Try it and be consistent with the journal, it's a very important step in the learning process. Take only demotrades for 2-3 month and then go back and read the whole thing and I'm sure you'll see things differently.
Long post but I feel it was necessary. I'm still a newbie and if you feel that I'm wrong in a way then you are probably right, because I still have a lot to learn!
Words of Wisom - all very true and very well put. I agree fully with your ideas. AS PC said - trade when and where the big money is. Also working on doing this stuff full time some day. My regular job is killing me but the steady income is hard to give up with kids to educate and a mortgage to pay. With the help of all you folks I am sure many of us will make the giant leap to the world of full time trading! Keep the ideas coming.
Never argue with a fool....
  • #3,808
  • Jul 10, 2008 10:10am Jul 10, 2008 10:10am
Words to cheer us all up:
No news in the morning that will hurt us
So lets look for a nice Friday so we can party with a good mood this weekend. See ya'll tomorrow
  • #3,809
  • Jul 10, 2008 10:50am Jul 10, 2008 10:50am
Quoting NowAndLater
Isn't that horse IN it, not ON it, maybe that's why you can afford it
Oh damn it.... here I go slaughtering the English again.....

Come on, just ONE letter make such a difference?
Many share my views with me. But I don't share them with them...
  • #3,810
  • Edited 11:11am Jul 10, 2008 10:59am | Edited 11:11am
haha. just to prove that trading has fried my brain..
I'm SO unbelievably slow. I JUSTT got HouseTraders joke with the horse/car lol. im an idiot. that is really funny tho haha. im going to have to use that pic.

hopefully after some successful trading we can get the horse on the car instead of in it yea now that i get it its pretty hilarious lol.

__

Sonic: AWESOME signature quote. i loved that movie!! cant wait for the sequel on the 18th.
__

.:back to trading related topic:.

i've gotta re-start my journal as well. nowandlater is right.. its definitely helpful. and i think i will take a more discretionary approach to this. i already have 2 things in place.. one of which being I look at the daily range potential as well. but i may consider support/resistance on a 4hr chart as well. would've kept me out of of the usdchf trade.

i like to keep a checklist as well. for those of you using mt4.. check this out. ill attach a picture. i took a chart.. changed its settings so everything is blank.. and use 'text labels' to create a checklist so it stays pretty static. nice little reminder onscreen, next to the charts.

actually since im posting this pic.. i might as well explain 2 of the things in my checklist. 2 "filters" i use to see how good a setup is.

[#3 : on a 5min chart, i like to see a clear move. then see price take a breather which forms the IB. sometimes IBs form bc of just congestion and no move prior.. thats lower quality. kept me out of a few losers recently. logically makes sense too.
#4/#5: on a 5min chart.. when a good IB is forming. it usually creates a bullish flag or pennant. i like to see how good it looks to help me choose which trade to take if i need to choose between eurusd/usdchf or something thats correlated. PC in his earlier posts mentioned that in addition to inside bars.. some traders do well with trading "pennants and other formations." Sometimes theyre the same thing at the same time.. higher probability setup from what I've seen. Whether it has some profound effect on profitability is yet to be determined.. with time.

just a quick glimpse in to my trading habits(addiction ) . just wanted to post so to show what i was talking about turning a chart into a checklist.]

http://nicksamaroo.brinkster.net/fil...screenshot.jpg
- nick andre -
  • #3,811
  • Jul 10, 2008 11:10am Jul 10, 2008 11:10am
Quoting NowAndLater
Here's the deal for me and how I do it:
I like to take trades only in the beginning of the day, at or just after the daily open and within the first few hours. If there's been a move and I missed it I'm out for the day usually. Why - Forex is traded mainly in the European session, high % of the volume traded each day is traded then. And we need volume to move the market right?! So from lunch time (when the market movers are on lunch) and until the US session begins the market isn't moving so much, so I don't look to trade during the lunch time, and here is where you will see a few IB's after the initial move (read the first post on the original thread). Then you might see some action at the start of the US session and until the end of the European session when we should stop taking trades. And PC says the first 6-9 hours are the best for us - that means from 6gmt to 12-15gmt. 12gmt is just around the NY session so we don't even need to look for trades then.
So I look for trades from the daily open around 5gmt and a few hours on. If the market has made a big move compared to the daily average range (no number here) then the chanses for a new trade to have a run isn't as big as for the first trade (not saying it's like this always but thats my rule). If I get a setup that I like (it should be above average setup based on more that just an IB) after a move then I will play it, but risk less (%) since the rewards imo is less. If the market has been in a range all morning going into the NY session - then I'll look for setups in the NY session the usual way since I figure the risk:reward is good.
I do trade priceaction overnight ranges and that usually gives me an early entry with good risk:reward potential. But that is close to the DIBS system so I trade both whichever I find is more rewarding on the day. And I try to look for higher timeframes, which is why I shared with you the H8 charts.
Not all IB's are the same, this you have seen. So I've found a way to restrict my self from taking every trade. I don't know how PC does but every one has to find their own comfort zone. And one last thing: I don't look at IB's as if they were a signal, like the signal you get from a mechanical system where you would buy/sell when all indicators line up. Again not every IB is the same. Demo for a while, see different IB's, look at where they come and look at the overall picture with tredlines and s/r. Just practice and remember that this doesn't happen overnight - hell I'm not even close to being a fulltime trader and I'm learning new stuff almost everyday, just by studying. It's ok lo lose now - those losses will make us richer later because we will learn from them. And we are looking to make losses, it's part of the game! We aren't even looking for a good win/loss ratio with this system, we are looking for low risk entries/high rewards entries.
Here's my suggestion to all of you who are struggeling (this is what I've done and will continue to do): Keep a journal over all trades you make. Before entering a trade type some thoughts like where the IB is, s/r and such and what you think might happen. After the trade is closed (win or loss) add that to the journal with a few comments to why things happened as they did. And add a chart or two. Later you can go back and compare trades that you've made, wins and losses, and get a better view of things and I'm sure this will help you. Try it and be consistent with the journal, it's a very important step in the learning process. Take only demotrades for 2-3 month and then go back and read the whole thing and I'm sure you'll see things differently.
Long post but I feel it was necessary. I'm still a newbie and if you feel that I'm wrong in a way then you are probably right, because I still have a lot to learn!

Great post my friend!

I trade basically the same way.... I would say 90% of my entries are at the first 3-4 hours...

Some times during the last 2 weeks I jumped into a trade early in the morning, and trailed my stop (because the YO-YO effect...), just to see the daily trend reverse, but that's ok, I collected some pips... then the price came back to my initial side, making a big move later, for some reason, but with all this indecision pattern, I was done for the day. With all this mess I fortunately got few, but still positive pips... That's definitely not my edge with this system, I'm still waiting for the big runners show up again, but I'm dancing according to the music...

Cheers!

HT

PS: I strongly suggest we read again Bemac's first posts, the "guilty" for all that stuff (just kidding, Bemac...).... some very interesting points about the big movers behaviour... when they start trading, lunch time, pee time, taking profits time... I read it always, it helps me a lot to understand the mechanics of a trading day. Oh, no, Forex IS NOT a 24h open shop.
Many share my views with me. But I don't share them with them...
  • #3,812
  • Jul 10, 2008 11:30am Jul 10, 2008 11:30am
Quoting Nick_likes_pips
....i like to keep a checklist as well. for those of you using mt4.. check this out. ill attach a picture. i took a chart.. changed its settings so everything is blank.. and use 'text labels' to create a checklist so it stays pretty static. nice little reminder onscreen, next to the charts.

actually since im posting this pic.. i might as well explain 2 of the things in my checklist. 2 "filters" i use to see how good a setup is.

[#3 : on a 5min chart, i like to see a clear move. then see price take a breather which forms the IB. sometimes IBs form bc of just congestion and no move prior.. thats lower quality. kept me out of a few losers recently. logically makes sense too.
#4/#5: on a 5min chart.. when a good IB is forming. it usually creates a bullish flag or pennant. i like to see how good it looks to help me choose which trade to take if i need to choose between eurusd/usdchf or something thats correlated. PC in his earlier posts mentioned that in addition to inside bars.. some traders do well with trading "pennants and other formations." Sometimes theyre the same thing at the same time.. higher probability setup from what I've seen. Whether it has some profound effect on profitability is yet to be determined.. with time.

just a quick glimpse in to my trading habits(addiction ) . just wanted to post so to show what i was talking about turning a chart into a checklist.]
Nice approach, Nick. I'm going to give a try to my checklist this way, it's very concise.

Flags, triangles, pennants, all have some meaning, in every time frame...

I, personally, don't believe too much on those isolated candlesticks formations (doji, hammer, pins...) on TFs lower than 4H. In the 1H or lower they seem very unreliable to me, since they can be so discrepant according to the broker's feed. Above 4H, together with the swing points and S/R lines they are much more reliable.

But flags, a pennants, triangles, are always meaningful, on any TF (Ok, I admit that my thick brain is still struggling to understand it....... I'll get there some day....)

Cheers!

PS: Don't mock on my car, folks...... You just can't imagine how many HP's lie under that roof...
Many share my views with me. But I don't share them with them...
  • #3,813
  • Jul 10, 2008 2:13pm Jul 10, 2008 2:13pm
Quoting Alberto_Jazz
Hi all, please find attached this clock indicator. I seem it is helpful!
Directly on your graphs!
Hello does anybody know how I can set the clock indicator like HH:MM:SS
instead of HH:MM?

Clock_v1_3.mq4

Thank you in advance ;-)
  • #3,814
  • Jul 10, 2008 2:16pm Jul 10, 2008 2:16pm
Its not only been a tough week for DIBs but the market in general. I liked Nick and NALs posts. I too drop down to a 5 min chart and wait for a trend, then a pullback, which forms an IB, then enter 1 pip above. I don't take breakouts at the moment, I would rather wait for a direction to have formed. My line in the sand is 5 gmt. It has really helped my trading having that on my charts. Also I don't trade for as long. Like NAL and the Doc said, those first few hours are when you get the good moves. I only take a "good" IB which to me is a breather in the the trend. If it has broken the bottom in an uptrend... it's toast.
Not strictly by the rules, and I may be limiting myself, but its working for me.
Hopefully we'll have some runners next week.
FF journal: Peaks and Troffs
  • #3,815
  • Jul 10, 2008 3:00pm Jul 10, 2008 3:00pm
Hi everybody, is there someone that trades with the inside bar method on daily time frame?
Thank you!
  • #3,816
  • Jul 10, 2008 3:29pm Jul 10, 2008 3:29pm
Quoting bogus
...those first few hours are when you get the good moves. I only take a "good" IB which to me is a breather in the the trend. If it has broken the bottom in an uptrend... it's toast.
Not strictly by the rules, and I may be limiting myself, but its working for me.
Hopefully we'll have some runners next week.
That's DIBS!

This simple thing has kept me away from low potential trades... Ok, we can be a bit flexible, PC himself showed some charts in which he took a trade after a tiny broke (let's say, a glimpse...) to the "wrong" side, I think we can accept 2 or 3 pips of margin, no more. But, as you said, if the price makes a good break to the limits, to the "wrong" side, I'm out.

Cheers!
Many share my views with me. But I don't share them with them...
  • #3,817
  • Jul 10, 2008 8:07pm Jul 10, 2008 8:07pm
Hi all,

I like the ferrari but with trading sometimes you feel like the horses arse.
Anyway, a lot of things being mentioned (journals etc) I already have in place and I keep a manual record of daily average movement. I notice on some of your charts that information is in the top lh corner. I have only just started using mt4 so could someone please direct me to where I get the template (or whatever) to install that and a brief description of how you load extra stuff into mt4, I am having a little difficulty with that. I am computer literate so a general description is ok.

Regards,

The horses head.
  • #3,818
  • Jul 10, 2008 8:10pm Jul 10, 2008 8:10pm
If Jarroo, at any point in this thread, attempts or seems to attempt gleaning funds from followers, I will eat my hat.

The Baddest thing amongst learners is their inability to identify teachers that teach because their pride lies in knowing they possibly helped someone.
Not because they {the teacher} Made Money but purely because they have offered some wisdom and the further possibility that Some may have received it.

Kudos Jarroo; I wasn't sure {back then} but now I am.
You are Perfect for this thread!

Your friend,
Bill
  • #3,819
  • Jul 10, 2008 9:14pm Jul 10, 2008 9:14pm
May I know what is it and how can I create one like that???

sonic
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: workstationscreenshot.jpg Size: 139 KB
  • #3,820
  • Jul 10, 2008 9:49pm Jul 10, 2008 9:49pm
Quoting Bemac
If Jarroo, at any point in this thread, attempts or seems to attempt gleaning funds from followers, I will eat my hat.

The Baddest thing amongst learners is their inability to identify teachers that teach because their pride lies in knowing they possibly helped someone.
Not because they {the teacher} Made Money but purely because they have offered some wisdom and the further possibility that Some may have received it.

Kudos Jarroo; I wasn't sure {back then} but now I am.
You are Perfect for this thread!

Your friend,
Bill
Thanks Bill and thanks again for all of your help.

I like sharing what I know and helping others for two reasons.

I was new once too and many on this forum helped me; Jim (James16), Daillist (Charles), Mike (mbqb11), and many many others. I know what it feels like and it was great that some one went out of there way to help me with my goofy questions. How could I not do the same?

Secondly, I learn so much from answering question, no matter how many times their asked. I leaned this from the James16 Chart Thread when Price Action started coming together for me. You pick up different ways of looking at Price, Confluences, etc., when you have to explain it to someone. It helps the jelling of the mind on what you are studying.

Don't get me wrong the study time, practice, dumb mistakes, etc., have to take place to get to a point when trading is not as stressful and actually fun.

Oh . . .did I forget to mention that this is a whole lotta fun. It's a blast!

Jim
Indicators show the past. Price Action "Indicates" the future.
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