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The DIBS Method... No Free Lunch continues

  • #781
  • May 27, 2008 10:28am May 27, 2008 10:28am
Quoting Shefa
Hi TradeStar,

I took the same trade, and was also stopped. At that time the market was very very lazy, and I was thinking that it might not be a good idea to enter a trade. Then, I have decided that t h i s t i m e I shell keep the rules...........
For some reason, my loss is 2 x 22pps, although the bar is only 14 pps. I belive I make a mistake with the spreads. As you have corrected me yesturday regarding the orders - can you, please, give me an example (with numbers) of how would you place the orders for that bar ?

I have a question also to Jarroo - why do you think the daily U/J trend is up ? I learned to use the EMA200 for the daily trend, and it shows a down trend.

Appreciate your replies,

Shefa.
Buy example:
IB with range 103.95 - 103.80. I want to buy 1 pip above and my SL is 1 pip below, spread is 3 pips. This will be a buystop, price is 103.99 (103.95 + 0.01 + 0.03) with SL at 103.79.

Sell example:
Same IB range gives a sell stop at 103.79 with SL at 103.99

As for the trend, just remeber that there's always trends within every trend. The M1 trend might be different fromthe M15 trend and so on.
  • #782
  • May 27, 2008 10:37am May 27, 2008 10:37am
Just a thought for those of us that can not always be at the screen is there a email alert than can be incorporated into the dibs indicatror i know several other indicators have such a facility. Also i also have experianced the problem with the indicator disapearing or not showing . (Hopefully someone can fix the bug)
thanks
  • #783
  • May 27, 2008 10:39am May 27, 2008 10:39am
Quoting TradeStar
Another quick question to re-confirm:

If the IB is not broken on the desired direction (but broke in the opposite direction) comes back and breaks in the desired direction after 5 or 6 candles, is it still valid to take ?

You can take a look at the GBP USD chart for example.

TS
Hi TradeStar,

I am by no means an expert but I would go with advice given earlier in the thread. I.e. it's a breakout setup and it's already broken out to one side so ignore it and move on.
I'm not saying this is right or wrong but just my preference on what I've read so far.

I also think the 'hot hand' issue about going with the trend is very valid and would like to know people's thoughts on the below -
If anyone looks at the weekly chart before you take a trade do you just look to see if the current week's bar is above/below the open or do you look at the whole trend?

I think the 'whole trend' is more secure but I haven't tested this and have no solid basis for saying it, so all views would be welcome

In saying that, I took the USD/JPY long today and was stopped out.
I noticed that the IB was above the daily open and therefore valid if that's all we look at, but the weekly trend appears to be down and therefore maybe the long trade should not be taken, or if you have to take it, do so with minimal risk????

Cheers
Enter Signature
  • #784
  • May 27, 2008 10:42am May 27, 2008 10:42am
I also realise my long on USD/JPY goes against what I just said in previous post (the bar has broken to the other side - forget it and move on), but I am
testing all sorts of theories - hence this trade.
Enter Signature
  • #785
  • May 27, 2008 10:45am May 27, 2008 10:45am
Quoting HouseTrader
I almost got that, but I don't like small IB's after a BIIIIG bar (I'm more comfortable if the IB's length is more than 1/3 of the precedent... big chance of more correction). If you watch the next bar, it broke the first IB low, but not the big up bar limits. I f you could "join" both bars (2nd and 3rd), we still got an IB, with a better length (at least for me), I understand this as a continuation of the indecision of Mr. Market. So I took the second entry...

Oh, yes, I can say I'm a "perverted"...... cause what you took was exactly a classic DIBS setup ... and I shouldn't but I keep messing with the system sometimes....

Cheers!

HT
Hi HT,

Thanks to messing the trading style, I made profites with the E/U and G/U fall
today.

Just sharing,

Shefa.
  • #786
  • May 27, 2008 10:47am May 27, 2008 10:47am
Well, my first live trade ended up in a stop out. I was basing the trade off a IB that happened before the start of the session so maybe I should not do that next time. I hope this thread continues to grow!

golferguy99!
PIP'N
  • #787
  • May 27, 2008 10:58am May 27, 2008 10:58am
Quoting cologg
Hi TradeStar,

I am by no means an expert but I would go with advice given earlier in the thread. I.e. it's a breakout setup and it's already broken out to one side so ignore it and move on.
I'm not saying this is right or wrong but just my preference on what I've read so far.

I also think the 'hot hand' issue about going with the trend is very valid and would like to know people's thoughts on the below -
If anyone looks at the weekly chart before you take a trade do you just look to see if the current week's bar is above/below the open or do you look at the whole trend?

I think the 'whole trend' is more secure but I haven't tested this and have no solid basis for saying it, so all views would be welcome

In saying that, I took the USD/JPY long today and was stopped out.
I noticed that the IB was above the daily open and therefore valid if that's all we look at, but the weekly trend appears to be down and therefore maybe the long trade should not be taken, or if you have to take it, do so with minimal risk????

Cheers
Hi Cologg,

I did start to look at the weekly close price, after HT has mentioned it in his posts. In my opinion, that famous losing U/J bar was a b o v e last week close, so that the "LONG" was according the rules.
Please correct me if I am wrong.

Cheers,

Shefa.
  • #788
  • May 27, 2008 11:04am May 27, 2008 11:04am
Quoting Shefa
Hi Cologg,

I did start to look at the weekly close price, after HT has mentioned it in his posts. In my opinion, that famous losing U/J bar was a b o v e last week close, so that the "LONG" was according the rules.
Please correct me if I am wrong.

Cheers,

Shefa.
Hi Shefa,

I agree. It was above last week's weekly close and therefore if that's what we decide to look at, it's a solid trade and was simply a losing one.

However, I also think if we ignore last week's bar on its own and look at the whole weekly trend - potentially down depending on how you look at it - then if you agree the weekly trend is down, maybe we'd be safer not to take long trades because we're going against the bigger trend and have less chance of success?

Cheers
Colin.
Enter Signature
  • #789
  • May 27, 2008 11:05am May 27, 2008 11:05am
Quoting Shefa
Hi TradeStar,

I took the same trade, and was also stopped. At that time the market was very very lazy, and I was thinking that it might not be a good idea to enter a trade. Then, I have decided that t h i s t i m e I shell keep the rules...........Also it was around 10:00 GMT, which is a dangerouse time for me, as around 11:00 GMT the market use to have some moves, also in the opposite direction.
For some reason, my loss is 2 x 22pps, although the bar is only 14 pps. I belive I make a mistake with the spreads. As you have corrected me yesturday regarding the orders - can you, please, give me an example (with numbers) of how would you place the orders for that bar ?

I have a question also to Jarroo - why do you think the daily U/J trend is up ? I learned to use the EMA200 for the daily trend, and it shows a down trend.

Appreciate your replies,

Shefa.
Sorry I can't post a chart. Not at home.

The Daily has been in a uptrend since March 16th, but you are correct that the long term trend is down. Remember we want to catch a ride in the beginning of the trend. This might be the start of the uptrend.
Indicators show the past. Price Action "Indicates" the future.
  • #790
  • May 27, 2008 11:07am May 27, 2008 11:07am
Quoting NowAndLater
Buy example:
IB with range 103.95 - 103.80. I want to buy 1 pip above and my SL is 1 pip below, spread is 3 pips. This will be a buystop, price is 103.99 (103.95 + 0.01 + 0.03) with SL at 103.79.

Sell example:
Same IB range gives a sell stop at 103.79 with SL at 103.99

As for the trend, just remeber that there's always trends within every trend. The M1 trend might be different fromthe M15 trend and so on.
Thank you NAL,

This is the answer I was waiting for.The following questions are :

1) Do we take the spread into account only in the enterance direction?
2) This way, do we charged for 15+1+3=19 pps, or only for 15+1= 16 pps ?
3) BTW - for the sell stop, shouldn't it be enterance at 103.76 with SL 103.96?

Thanks for your help,

Shefa.
  • #791
  • May 27, 2008 11:21am May 27, 2008 11:21am
Quoting cologg
Hi Shefa,

I agree. It was above last week's weekly close and therefore if that's what we decide to look at, it's a solid trade and was simply a losing one.

However, I also think if we ignore last week's bar on its own and look at the whole weekly trend - potentially down depending on how you look at it - then if you agree the weekly trend is down, maybe we'd be safer not to take long trades because we're going against the bigger trend and have less chance of success?

Cheers
Colin.
Hi Colin,

I am not sure if I am experienced enough to give you the right answer, so people will correct me, if neccesary.
I think the weekly trend is down. But, 1H is very short time compare to it, and there are the 2h, 4h, 8h, daily patterns that people are using very often - which affect the 1H trend more effectivly than the weekly. Means, that if the daily or 4h trend turned to be Long - this is where the price will go.
I think, HT wrote that the weekly close will s t r e n g t h the trend if it is down, but will not avoid it if it is up.

Cheers,

Shefa.
  • #792
  • May 27, 2008 11:25am May 27, 2008 11:25am
Quoting Shefa
Hi Cologg,

I did start to look at the weekly close price, after HT has mentioned it in his posts. In my opinion, that famous losing U/J bar was a b o v e last week close, so that the "LONG" was according the rules.
Please correct me if I am wrong.

Cheers,

Shefa.
Right!

To me it was above the Week´s Open too, so it was a "hot hand" trade, according to Peter Crown's definition... (even with the long therm trend being down, below 200MA for sure, and in my opinion, it will continue to go down for some time... let's profit from the Mr. Market hiccupps!)

Good move on E/U and G/U!

Cheers!

HT
Many share my views with me. But I don't share them with them...
  • #793
  • May 27, 2008 11:31am May 27, 2008 11:31am
Quoting Shefa
Thank you NAL,

This is the answer I was waiting for.The following questions are :

1) Do we take the spread into account only in the enterance direction?
2) This way, do we charged for 15+1+3=19 pps, or only for 15+1= 16 pps ?
3) BTW - for the sell stop, shouldn't it be enterance at 103.76 with SL 103.96?

Thanks for your help,

Shefa.
Hi Shefa,

Study the example number given by NAL carefully.
The price shown in the MT4 platform is always sell price. You pay spread only when you buy (either during initial buy when going long or buy back when closing a short)

So when you go short, you just take the bar low minus 1. You got to pay the spread when you clear your position (when buying back) Thats why the SL is high of the bar + spread.

Hope this helps.
TS
Haste not to Enter AND Haste not to Exit !-TradeStar
  • #794
  • May 27, 2008 11:34am May 27, 2008 11:34am
Quoting jarroo
Sorry I can't post a chart. Not at home.

The Daily has been in a uptrend since March 16th, but you are correct that the long term trend is down. Remember we want to catch a ride in the beginning of the trend. This might be the start of the uptrend.
Thanks Jarroo,

If it is not too much for you, please, write me more detailed how do you decide about daily trends.

I have to go now, so it is not urgent.

Cheers, Shefa.
  • #795
  • May 27, 2008 11:34am May 27, 2008 11:34am
Quoting Shefa
Hi Colin,

I am not sure if I am experienced enough to give you the right answer, so people will correct me, if neccesary.
I think the weekly trend is down. But, 1H is very short time compare to it, and there are the 2h, 4h, 8h, daily patterns that people are using very often - which affect the 1H trend more effectivly than the weekly. Means, that if the daily or 4h trend turned to be Long - this is where the price will go.
I think, HT wrote that the weekly close will s t r e n g t h the trend if it is down, but will not avoid it if it is up.

Cheers,

Shefa.
Right again!

hey, I'm not an experienced trader too (far from it... an experienced doctor, maybe... )

The long therm trend is down, as you can see on W1 or M1 charts. But the long therm is MADE of sequential medium and short therm trends. D1 is like a mess on USD/JPY... H4 and H1, which I use more, are up. Maybe it is just a correction, maybe a reversal (I don't believe in the last, but NO ONE can predict the market). Since the long therm trend takes a LOT of time to change, I prefer to trade and make some profit form the medium and shorter therm movements... Hey, H1 is not so short anyway.... Anything below this is noise... Peter Crowns said before that the big traders NEVER look to a 15M chart....

Cheers and Pips!

HT
Many share my views with me. But I don't share them with them...
  • #796
  • May 27, 2008 11:40am May 27, 2008 11:40am
Quoting HouseTrader
Right again!

hey, I'm not an experienced trader too (far from it... an experienced doctor, maybe... )

The long therm trend is down, as you can see on W1 or M1 charts. But the long therm is MADE of sequential medium and short therm trends. D1 is like a mess on USD/JPY... H4 and H1, which I use more, are up. Maybe it is just a correction, maybe a reversal (I don't believe in the last, but NO ONE can predict the market). Since the long therm trend takes a LOT of time to change, I prefer to trade and make some profit form the medium and shorter therm movements... Hey, H1 is not so short anyway.... Anything below this is noise... Peter Crowns said before that the big traders NEVER look to a 15M chart....

Cheers and Pips!

HT
Hi HT,

Thanks for your views and explanations.
It does make sense that there are smaller trends within the larger trends and I wondered if people are even bothering with the larger trend as any kind of indication, and if so, does it keep them out of many bad trades, but at the same time keep them out of too many good ones.

This is the kind of thing I'm testing at the mo, so any advice from you or anyone else that has an opinion/info on this is more than welcome.

Cheers
Colin.
Enter Signature
  • #797
  • May 27, 2008 11:44am May 27, 2008 11:44am
Quoting TradeStar
Hi Shefa,

Study the example number given by NAL carefully.
The price shown in the MT4 platform is always sell price. You pay spread only when you buy (either during initial buy when going long or buy back when closing a short)

So when you go short, you just take the bar low minus 1. You got to pay the spread when you clear your position (when buying back) Thats why the SL is high of the bar + spread.

Hope this helps.
TS
Thank you TS,

That was a very important explanation, which I did not know, although I use MT4 for a while........
Also, does the long considered as 19 pps or 16 pps ?

I have to go now, and eceive your answer tomorow(?).


Cheers,

Shefa.
  • #798
  • May 27, 2008 11:44am May 27, 2008 11:44am
Quoting TradeStar
Not sure anyone else has taken this.

I am short on this one based on the IB and encouraged by the weekly BEOB. Will see how it goes.

Regards,
TS
It's interesting.

This incorrect IB, I happen to take yesterday by oversight seems to running fine so far.

TS
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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Haste not to Enter AND Haste not to Exit !-TradeStar
  • #799
  • May 27, 2008 11:49am May 27, 2008 11:49am
Quoting HouseTrader
Right!

To me it was above the Week´s Open too, so it was a "hot hand" trade, according to Peter Crown's definition... (even with the long therm trend being down, below 200MA for sure, and in my opinion, it will continue to go down for some time... let's profit from the Mr. Market hiccupps!)

Good move on E/U and G/U!

Cheers!

HT
Thank you HT for your answers,

Jarroo thinks we are in an up trend, and will write about it later (I hope so).

I have to go now. Hopefuly, tomorrow(?) will consider DIBS method more.

Cheers,

Shefa.
  • #800
  • May 27, 2008 12:05pm May 27, 2008 12:05pm
Quoting Shefa
Thank you TS,

That was a very important explanation, which I did not know, although I use MT4 for a while........
Also, does the long considered as 19 pps or 16 pps ?

I have to go now, and eceive your answer tomorow(?).


Cheers,

Shefa.
Your risk is always the range of the IB + 2 pips for just over and below the IB + spread. So you are risking 19pips for both buy and sell, the difference is where you put on the spread. In a buy-stop you add the spread to the entryprice, in a sell-stop you add the spread to the SL. Hope this helps.
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