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give me a system

  • #1
  • First Post: May 23, 2007 6:34am May 23, 2007 6:34am
ok everyone. i just wanna share something with you guys and im sure alot of people will be able to relate. ive been trying a billion systems..usually they failed me while backtesting them manually. ive paid for some..some were available for free on forums like this one (not to bad mouth them).
none of them worked..either they were just scams or they just werent working for me and would work for someone else. even my own strategy that worked for a few months failed me in the end because i was too inexperienced in backtesting and came up with false results that encouraged me to trade it with real money. but all those things helped me figure out what i should be looking for. i discovered that im the impatient type and id rather capitalize on smaller moves even in a sideways market than in a trending one. so i know now that i need a rather short term strategy with maybe 1 trade a day. also its good if its a set and forget system...enter the trade..set up the tp and the sl and thats it. a steady monthly pip gain to me is better for the mental state than months of 500 pips of profit followed by months of maybe 10 pips of loss. it would be good to concentrate on one pair..maybe the gbp/usd because it has the bigger moves even in a sideways market..maybe the usd/chf too for the same reasons. the time zone really doesnt matter to me because i can be online at any time. so...there are 2 reasons for this post..the first is to just get it off my chest...which ive done now..thank you..and the other reason is...i wonder how many people out there are looking for the same type of system i am looking for..or maybe have found it already and could recommend it. if there are some people out there..feel free to speak up..we could join forces and scan the net for something that would work for us. we could keep each other on track and keep each other motivated to finally come up with something. there are people who make money in this market and i dont see why we should be left out.
so what are your thoughts on this? any kind of response would be appreciated.
  • #2
  • May 23, 2007 6:41am May 23, 2007 6:41am
Ok a few things I MUST say..

1. A system that works for one person does not mean it will work for you.. Twoblink said it best with his cookie analogy. Even if two people follow the same instructions and have the same ingredients, their cookies can taste entirely different. So, you cant just pick up someone's system and expect it to make you money. Also, any system you buy.. will not work.. sorry

2. You are focusing to much on the entry of your trades it seems, and that is the least important part of your trading..

3. Dont be lazy.. read books. Study the market for a while. Demo trade, and most importantly when you do start trading make sure you are underleveraging, since you are new to trading you will lose money at first, might as well be a small amount of money

good luck


Quoting piperoni
ok everyone. i just wanna share something with you guys and im sure alot of people will be able to relate. ive been trying a billion systems..usually they failed me while backtesting them manually. ive paid for some..some were available for free on forums like this one (not to bad mouth them).
none of them worked..either they were just scams or they just werent working for me and would work for someone else. even my own strategy that worked for a few months failed me in the end because i was too inexperienced in backtesting and came up with false results that encouraged me to trade it with real money. but all those things helped me figure out what i should be looking for. i discovered that im the impatient type and id rather capitalize on smaller moves even in a sideways market than in a trending one. so i know now that i need a rather short term strategy with maybe 1 trade a day. also its good if its a set and forget system...enter the trade..set up the tp and the sl and thats it. a steady monthly pip gain to me is better for the mental state than months of 500 pips of profit followed by months of maybe 10 pips of loss. it would be good to concentrate on one pair..maybe the gbp/usd because it has the bigger moves even in a sideways market..maybe the usd/chf too for the same reasons. the time zone really doesnt matter to me because i can be online at any time. so...there are 2 reasons for this post..the first is to just get it off my chest...which ive done now..thank you..and the other reason is...i wonder how many people out there are looking for the same type of system i am looking for..or maybe have found it already and could recommend it. if there are some people out there..feel free to speak up..we could join forces and scan the net for something that would work for us. we could keep each other on track and keep each other motivated to finally come up with something. there are people who make money in this market and i dont see why we should be left out.
so what are your thoughts on this? any kind of response would be appreciated.
  • #3
  • May 23, 2007 6:51am May 23, 2007 6:51am
You MUST understand that success will NOT come from a trading system. I keep repeating this stuff, but it's ultimately true: a system is there to give you the work frame, like a tool-box is there to aid the carpenter. But if you dont learn how to actually carve a wooden door like a real carpenter, that beautiful hammer and that shinning brand new screwdriver are going to be of little use for you.

So search for a system that suits your time frame and trading style and DONT rely on it like a Holy Book. Use it JUST as a work frame, and learn how to actually trade assisted (and not commanded) by your system.
  • #4
  • May 23, 2007 6:54am May 23, 2007 6:54am
thanks for your reply..but i must say im not THAT new in forex..ive been working on it since a little over 3 years. i did read books and all that too..but i just didnt find it too useful. i learned a bunch of words and stuff which is nice. but i couldnt put them to good use yet..like i said..i had a strategy that worked for around 6 months giving me a great income but then it got sour and i realized i made mistakes in backtesting which were glaring..i didnt have any experience in backtesting anything manually at that time. i know you didnt mean to attack me with your last post...but i have to say i havent been lazy at all..it just hasnt worked out so far. but im not gonna give up thats for sure
  • #5
  • May 23, 2007 8:47am May 23, 2007 8:47am
Sorry mate I don't understand the point...

You were looking for a system, both paid and free, the systems were absolute crap, so you dropped them, and right now you are looking for more, basically the same way you used to except this time the chances are higher 'cause you found a cool forum?

I hope it is not that way.

If you are really looking for a day-trading system, you are more than welcome to search the forums and look for the system by yourself.

I totally agree when people say that if system works for one trader, it may not work to another. With that said, of course there are thousands of methods, but are they really the flesh and blood of your personality as a trader?

Here is my advice:

Find what indicator you like most, try to describe properly what is it you like about particular strategy, what seems to be out of picture. Gather information, choose an indicator, FORWARDTEST, then again, put all the pieces of the puzzle in one place and start developing you own trading system, and most important thing, stick to one trading system for a bit longer, don't change them every few days, cause that way you'll never make it any further than it is now...
  • #6
  • May 23, 2007 8:53am May 23, 2007 8:53am
do you think forward testing is more reliable? ive heard about a million strategies that were doing fine in 05 and totally sucked in 06
  • #7
  • May 23, 2007 8:53am May 23, 2007 8:53am
I strongly recommend to visit this thread http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?p=26320

It will save a ton of your time knowing where you are now and where you want to be in the future
  • #8
  • May 23, 2007 8:59am May 23, 2007 8:59am
Quoting piperoni
do you think forward testing is more reliable? ive heard about a million strategies that were doing fine in 05 and totally sucked in 06
Yes, forwardtesting is at least 50 times more reliable, cause by forwardtesting, not only you test how system is performing in present market conditions, you also test how YOU perform sticking to the rules of the system (or not).
  • #9
  • May 23, 2007 9:05am May 23, 2007 9:05am
i dont know man..i know a few strategies that wouldnt be doing so great this year so far but kicked ass in 05 or 06.you think its just bad backtesting on my part?
  • #10
  • May 23, 2007 10:44am May 23, 2007 10:44am
Here's an idea that I have been practicing.

Instead of looking for a system, try to brainstorm some concepts about the markets. ex. why does s/r exist? etc.

You don't want to look into specifics like indicators, what period should i set my rsi or moving average. Instead, figure out what rsi does (knowing its formulas) and what it means.

You want to focus on concepts that define ranging and trending markets. Basically what characteristics define those two market conditions.

You want a dynamic system that can survive the range fluctuations and trending conditions.
i hope i made sense
  • #11
  • May 23, 2007 11:02am May 23, 2007 11:02am
I second hilmy83
  • #12
  • May 23, 2007 11:13am May 23, 2007 11:13am
Quoting piperoni
i dont know man..i know a few strategies that wouldnt be doing so great this year so far but kicked ass in 05 or 06.you think its just bad backtesting on my part?
I think you need to sit back and ask your self. Do you think the mkt is going to do the same thing day in day out year in year out. I only set my trades once a day but I still consider it a good 15 to 20hr a day job.
  • #13
  • May 23, 2007 11:18am May 23, 2007 11:18am
yes, indeed,
we are single fighter, unless you are co operating with a group and you manage the trade while other manage the system , or ect ect
  • #14
  • May 26, 2007 11:08pm May 26, 2007 11:08pm
Quoting hilmy83
Here's an idea that I have been practicing.

Instead of looking for a system, try to brainstorm some concepts about the markets. ex. why does s/r exist? etc.
Much wisdom in this post by hilmy. And all the previous posts. Take their words seriously. If you've read many books and got nothing from them then possibly your missing something. And you may be only an inch away. Pick up your favorite few and reread them. Now that you've spent some time trading you will probably absorb more from your books. One little epiphany will lead to another.

Don't rely on an indicator until you fully understand what is driving it. I believe different indicators should be given different weight at different times. I think if you spent six months trading trendlines only, you would see some progress. Then learn a few indicators inside and out and give them only the weight they deserve.

If you are impatient and want to trade short time frames in a sideways market that's fine. But you'll still need to learn patience because the market doesn't always move sideways. And sometimes the ranges are pretty tight and even experienced range traders will sit on their hands. If your going to trade that way you'll need to establish your own rules for range trading. No matter what your style, patience will always be an element.

You say you learned "a bunch of words and stuff" but it doesn't sound like your putting the pieces together yet. There are good books out there and some that are not so good but all of them offer at least a few gems. Keep going through them and the pieces will start coming together. We've all been through it.

Forge your own system from your knowledge of the market and with what is agreeable to Your personality. There is enough info here on FF to get you started.

All the comments on this thread are meant to help you, not to criticize. You're fortunate that all the responses to your thread have been sage advice--every one of them. By all means enter this thread in your journal, because someday not too far away you'll see the value of it. And you'll be passing it on to someone else.

Welcome Piperoni, to FF and the world of figuring things out!
  • #15
  • May 27, 2007 12:21am May 27, 2007 12:21am
Hi Piperoni,

What you are looking for is a winning "Mechanical System" with strict and defined laws for entries and exits.

Well, think about that.. If there is such a system, why not create an EA based on these laws instead of manually trading it (with all the known human emosional mistakes)?

The answer is (and you figured it already) that there is no such system that could work in the long run. The market is ever changing and such a system will probably break down after a while.

That's why it takes years to become a trader - When one could look at the ever changing market and has the ability to decide upon the current price information how to best react.

Now, I'm not saying that mechanical systems could not work, but it is a toataly different approach: -1- it is based only on computorized trading. 2-It means running many (even 20 strategies or more) at the same time to compensate the winners/loosers. 3-The design of such a system uses special software for optimization and backtesting
  • #16
  • Last Post: May 27, 2007 6:53am May 27, 2007 6:53am
To Author of the Thread

Probably, not so all is so bad with your old successful system.
If it isn't formalized still - do it. Then, meaning the losses on any period, simulate adequate conditions and receive the CONCRETE NEGATIVE bargains. You will have the information:
When in minutes, at what meanings RSI, MACD, MA etc. this misfortune has taken place... Probably, it is a little enough TO CORRECT LOGIC, and the business will go. For example, it may be useful simply change M30 trading periond with H1. And that's all u need to do.
And in general - to buy - to buy not clearly knowing what it is - I would not become.
If only somebody/thing WILL CONVINCE me! As the thing costs some money, I have to understand HOW it works, - and I can only then pay money.
A rose will bloom, it then will fade...
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