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Objective Thinking And Trading

  • #381
  • Jul 10, 2022 12:06am Jul 10, 2022 12:06am
..... And why not much is as it seems ....


LEARN something today and stop treating all of it as just "information". Stop thinking like a person "spawned out of" the world and start thinking as a person "in the worlds' world".

https://www.bis.org/publ/qtrpdf/r_qt1909b.htm


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #382
  • Jul 10, 2022 10:08am Jul 10, 2022 10:08am
"Accepting what's presented without asking questions."

Deeper mind.

Faith.

Something a cult leader teaches.

Warning.

Experiential learning.

Master apprentice dynamic.

A mind tickler. Good one, Peter. TOUCHE`
My Threads: Trading is as simple as 1-2-3, Highest Open / Lowest Open Trade
  • #383
  • Jul 10, 2022 8:24pm Jul 10, 2022 8:24pm
Quoting TooSlow
"Accepting what's presented without asking questions." Deeper mind. Faith. Something a cult leader teaches. Warning. Experiential learning. Master apprentice dynamic. A mind tickler. Good one, Peter. TOUCHE`


When I cross the road I either use -

= the crosswalk that is lined up with traffic signals to walk or don't walk

Or

= I use my own judgment to cross at another point along that road.

Now, some people who are too worried about being 'booked for jaywalking" need not worry about thinking on their own, because management has pre-arranged the crosswalk so everyone can feel "safe".

Unfortunately though, this has no connection to whether you WILL in fact be safe while you cross that road. So to just walk out blindly because you get a 'signal' to walk, would be foolish and rather suicidal. The number of times I see people now, who merely walk on that signal without first checking left and right, is phenomenal.....and rather disturbing.

So I choose to look left and right and use my own signals, thank you very much.

This situation is frequently similar to trading.

Too Slow, what you have written and in its sequence, shows no regard for what is happening here and is just a silly attempt to twist the context. Maybe you need glasses or a recheck of some of your faculties. I don't care how many times or how many ways people make an attempt to delude what is said here, people just need to expect they will become the lesson for others who wish to learn. Or, you may have meant it with good intentions, however, this does not change what is happening here.

What I have written is going to have 1 of 2 affects on a person - either they screw around or, they get serious. Everything else is somewhere in between.


Happy learning and trading


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #384
  • Jul 11, 2022 12:34am Jul 11, 2022 12:34am
Quoting PeterCaleb
{quote} ...Too Slow, what you have written and in its sequence, shows no regard for what is happening here and is just a silly attempt to twist the context. Maybe you need glasses or a recheck of some of your faculties. I don't care how many times or how many ways people make an attempt to delude what is said here, people just need to expect they will become the lesson for others who wish to learn. Or, you may have meant it with good intentions, however, this does not change what is happening here. What I have written is going to have 1 of 2 affects...
Peter,

No attempt to "twist" or do anything. What I listed are the interpretations that came to mind, when I read that phrase, in the order they came. Nothing more, nothing less.
My Threads: Trading is as simple as 1-2-3, Highest Open / Lowest Open Trade
  • #385
  • Jul 11, 2022 2:28am Jul 11, 2022 2:28am
Quoting TooSlow
{quote} Peter, No attempt to "twist" or do anything. What I listed are the interpretations that came to mind, when I read that phrase, in the order they came. Nothing more, nothing less.


Then I would suggest you make your lists on a piece of paper and leave this thread clear.

Thank you.


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #386
  • Jul 12, 2022 8:54pm Jul 12, 2022 8:54pm
From interpretation to something more and something better ....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EB-a7nDqM3s


There are so many layers to society now, that I don't think people are aware of just HOW MANY layers are present. However one easy and sure fire way to get a glimpse is to simply look at your own life at present. Try this ...

Make a list of all the different categories and sub-categories of everything going on in your personal reality. Make sure this list is itemized.

And then make another list of how many different roles you play as a person in someone else's life or livelihood. It will surprise you how many different things you are to different people.

People who come to this thread need to see, that this is not about being king of my own castle, that I do not aim to 'make friends or enemies' here.

It goes far beyond me and everyone's opinions or judgments, INCLUDING my own, whenever they turn up.

A good example of this = Someone recently showed confusion toward trading re: the means and the end result.

People who skulk about on sites like these, seeking only to steal other people's ideas or hard work to make money for themselves, really, are no different to those people who place their own hard work out in the common area and expect everyone to "respect it"..... AKA do not steal it "it's for everyone".

How is it that these two seemingly different people could be seen as the same type of person?

A - They share an equal amount and a similar degree of naivete and ignorance when dealing with money and people.

Because people's understanding of money is "presented to them", "given to them" repeatedly over and over again, they become snowed underneath a mountain of assumptions and pre-determined conclusions.

The funny thing about all of this, is, when a person begins to speak about this in this way, many will think you're being extreme, or radical or anti something. Or perhaps that it's an unnecessary discussion to engage in or thing to think about.

And this is where true ignorance steps in and replaces genuine common sense. The basic definition of genuine common sense goes something like this ....

A person's ability to operate in a natural way towards any and all types of information and situations presented. Whenever I see robotic responses/reactions from people, I know they are NOT using G. common sense. They are using programmed responses they have learned during the course of several exposures. As I have said many times before, copying/imitating is NOT the same as learning.

How does all of this relate to the means and end ?

A + B = C
B + A = C
A + C = B
C + A = B
B + C = A
C + B = A

But the question that is/needs to be asked in the first step of the entire process, is the most important in its own specific context.

The answer to that query sets the tone for the process. And the level / layer on which that answer is seated sets the tone for what you will learn and how you will learn it. The more materialistic or superficial the desired outcome (end), the less you will learn on pass-through number 1 (means).

THIS is part of the reason WHY people take so long to reach a level of happy trading "success". Trying to cheat the process ...... reason->means->end.

It's also why IF tomorrow, trading was shutdown indefinitely, many people would be at a loss for what to do with their new found "information and knowledge". It's too hyper-specialized and is not grounded in real life.

A good example of all this ---- 21.00 minutes in.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wlb1bdU-G7o



Something to think about.


Happy learning and trading


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #387
  • Jul 13, 2022 1:53am Jul 13, 2022 1:53am
Most people miss or overlook the symbolism of how similar trading is to real life. Check this out as an example hehehehehe .......


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThtJ2Mg1kFU


Happy learning and trading


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #388
  • Jul 15, 2022 10:27am Jul 15, 2022 10:27am
Quoting PeterCaleb
A + B = C
B + A = C
A + C = B
C + A = B
B + C = A
C + B = A
A = 0
B = 0
C = 0.
My Threads: Trading is as simple as 1-2-3, Highest Open / Lowest Open Trade
  • #389
  • Jul 15, 2022 8:03pm Jul 15, 2022 8:03pm
Some people just don't get it ........


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Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #390
  • Jul 19, 2022 5:29am Jul 19, 2022 5:29am
A lot of people these days seem to act more like stunted children than grown ups or "adults". You can see this whenever you watch them walk, talk, write, ponder situations and even try to find solutions to their troubles. Many have become very "comfortable" with letting "management" do the thinking for them. And when it comes to trading, it's really no different.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BBfpF4B0Do


Do you think THAT guy has the luxury of letting other people do his thinking for him ?

Part of the psychological game of trading, in all its many "forms", is to determine who's playing the game that's handed to them and who is playing a game on other people.

Of course if you're a person who is not interested in wasting your time with trying to mix socializing with what people these days call "trading", then at least you're off to a good start. The average person's idea and definition of trading is nothing better than the equivalent of believing that what Phil said earlier in that video, is simply not true or accurate. Using an opinion as the truth is a dangerous thing.

Part of the problem is, personal psychology, is not taught to children as they grow up, as it is with the other subjects. So it means that a person has to find a way to figure it out on their own. And to do this effectively, it all boils down to your deepest motivation. If you're only after the money, then you'll be poorly prepared or competent to really help anyone and at times, even yourself. So you need something more. Something more real.

In my experience, many people can do the technical stuff re: trading or speculating, but have trouble with the real life stuff.

The "Self Help" stuff around is a wonderful distraction for fantasy goers, but IF you look not at the products but the MARKETING of everything in that area of society, you may see the tiny piece of truthfulness sitting in the corner of the room......

* They are ALL based on the same things, the same ingredients, exactly the same elements.

The language of observation can teach you more in a day than reading 100 books. Why?

You are a conduit. It doesn't matter what your opinion is here, it has no effect on the truth of this. If you see something or read something you internalize it. Admittedly some things more than others but it's there..... waiting.

When first arriving at this website, I found it rather disturbing just how much people simply do not make their own observations anymore. They feel and believe so poorly about themselves that they would put their trading future in the hands of a nobody on some virtual establishment.

For those who think I "just don't understand the 21st century", you'd be very wrong.

I can still call my brokers on the phone if I choose. Can you do that? I bet most people just assume the internet is the only "form of communication" around now. Such a distraction.

So if you really want to learn how to help yourself, I mean REALLY, then you have to learn what is genuinely real and what is a distraction. Just as it is in the world of trading.

If you don't "agree" or "don't believe me" then maybe you need a refresher .....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BBfpF4B0Do


So having the motivation to "make money" is rather juvenile when set against real things. You need to go deeper, much deeper.

Trading is JUST an activity, one out of millions of activities. Once you stop fighting with this realization, all the talking words and mouths online and the people around you, will be put in their place in your mind, so you can learn instead of chasing the carrot.

Your task, should you choose to accept it, is to arrive at the realization that learning how to improve yourself is exactly the same, whatever the context - be it spiritual or physical or mental or environmental..... or whatever is important to you at this time and place in you life.

People who 'inhabit' these kinds of sites are questionable at the very least. Take it from someone who has been doing this for a very long time, the tech may change but people STILL cannot hide what is really there. Try and try as they might.

The way to approach any situation is always the same. You need to create a blueprint. A living breathing knowledge base and understanding that will aid you when you feel lost or without hope, not only when you are doing well.

And you need to observe yourself so you can start to see what a problematic approach really is and how it looks from the outside looking in at you.

Many people I come across don't see how they affect others, with their shortsightedness, their selfish will and with their attitudes toward learning. These are things you will face within yourself.

If your motivation is not strong enough, then you know you have not gone deep enough to learn about yourself.

People ask me sometimes why I don't supply "help" on this thread. Here's a reply ......

If you do not see that you are drowning then when it's seeming too late you will reach out due to desperation instead of the need to learn. But it's never too late to learn. I can only make suggestions and offer a way to begin. Although I have found most people's hearts are about the same, it's the "other stuff" they carry with them that will drown them. You don't "need" anything categorically man-made to begin a journey of self learning, you merely need to sense the need to start. A "want" simply is not strong enough to get you through the dark times or those days when you feel overwhelmed or betrayed.

You cannot withdraw from responsibility without there being some form of consequence.

Another Life lesson that is 100% relevant to trading.

A friend of mine has a great way to approach it, albeit rather forward .........

Whenever he hears or sees someone nearby, who is bitching about something rather trivial but making a racket about it, while offering zero options for resolution, here's what he says to them.....

"If you feel so deeply about this, and you feel there's no way to change it, why not go and enter yourself into the sex slavery business?"

I know what you're thinking here ...... WHAT ??!!!

Juuust wait .....

Then the person usually reacts with something like this ....

"WHAT?! NO WAY!! That's disgusting/Horrible/so degrading !!!"

And then my friend would quietly ask "Why do you feel SO deeply about THAT ? Could it be because you still have some self respect?Some type of value for yourself?"

Yeah sure, the reactions vary, BUT, once that question is raised, it gets them thinking. Then it's simple enough to share with them the fact that their "problem" IS in fact solvable.

Now admittedly he doesn't do this all the time. That would be rather extreme. However in many situations, the person is faced with the real life question pertaining to their self respect and what they're focusing on. And yes some people blow it off and others actually learn something.

Common denominators.

That's the name of the "game"

It could be personal development or trading or whatever you would like to choose.

If your goal is (for lack of a better word here) ... pure, then you can and will learn if you give yourself the chance.

When learning is happening in a natural way, you can do more with it. When it's forced or manipulated, there are always problems.


So you choose .....

Watch. Do. Or bitch and complain.


Happy learning and trading


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #391
  • Jul 24, 2022 12:25am Jul 24, 2022 12:25am
The Ignorance / Non-Knowledge Shell


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* First created in BC times to improve people's thinking capabilities in business and commerce

* Was written as a way for a person to move "through" their own types of non-knowledge stages.

* Is useful in all areas of thinking that must eventually lead to Doing

* Has nothing to do with "being told" what is what

* Is a natural way to challenge your true view of how you actually think

* Was designed to test your strength of conviction


It is one of those tests you never hear about but "interestingly", is what modern Psychology and personal development etc is all based upon.

Most people have a very petty and superficial view on trading - buy or sell and it takes X amount of time and generates Y amount of profits or losses. Very shallow. Akin to standing on the edge of a sandy beach with one inch of water glossing over your feet and calling it a Big Kahuna wave.

And people wonder why they're so addicted to social media and websites like this yet they don't get anywhere. When I say "anywhere" I mean they understand the process enough, to know that it doesn't just stop when they have money in their bank account from profits transferred. You're not dealing with what goes on, you're dealing with the screen in front of you. The funny thing about profits, is you don't ACTUALLY have ANY right to them UNLESS you understand certain things first.

For example -

* Money cannot be an endgame because it only possesses perceived value.

* In a system where money must continue to move around, "your" profits cannot legally remain yours indefinitely.

Investing your time and energy into something that yields little more than "what everyone believes they already know" is pretty silly if you ask me.

HISTORY shows that "what everyone believes they know" has a nasty way of leading people down the garden path.

And people who do not study real history, to me, are destined to keep playing that game "why are you hitting yourself?!".

Non-knowledge is when a person believes they know and understand something but, deep down, they know they have not sought out any real value in it. Therefore they've done no research and study. I come across this everyday on sites like this.

So maybe this post will turn a few lights on for people. As I've said many times, the basics are the foundation of everything.

So if you want to speculate, then you will choose specific basics to build on. If you want to value trade, you may choose some of the same basics from the speculative pile, but you also know that today leads into tomorrow, therefore, you need to learn how to operate in a lateral way, so you can adapt and adjust. This is something speculators cannot do. Why not?

They do not understand or know about the law of human averages. It is something that human civilization is built from and on. And has always been built on.

One eg -

Low-medium-upper socio-economics.

Another eg. -

Central providers-Intermediaries-End User

Starting to get the picture yet?

So all the people who trade to make money or earn a living or whatever you want to call it, the idea of arguing over whether a X% Win SR over 100 trades VS on a per trade basis is a worthy use of your time, is folly. It's the same coin you're fighting over.

If someone fails there are only two options of why - lack of natural talent or poor attendance of learned / acquired skill.

If you can only scalp or only trend trade then you have failed yourself. You can either argue about this or start to consider why.

Learning about yourself and learning how to trade properly are the same thing. The information and labels appear different but the concepts are the same.

Whenever you have to "be told" what to learn and "how" to learn it then you failed to learn. Right / Wrong answers do not apply here. Creative and lateral thinking is what helps you learn.

Happy learning and trading


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #392
  • Aug 16, 2022 9:54pm Aug 16, 2022 9:54pm


Get Your Head Right And Trade


People don't seem to understand that the crap in your head stops you from adapting to change and the future that hasn't reached you yet.

Before 'fundamental and technical analysis' were popularized, people had to think their way through problems. It really is amazing how low people's standards are now. I can say that because they display it by obsessing over things that are meant to be indicative NOT conclusive.

For eg.


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Now for a second, assume that you are not seeking answers on those charts. If you do this you are now in the half of people who have already realized the difference between certain things apparent ........


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People who have never experienced market downturns where fortunes have been lost and people have lost everything, would not know what it's like to rebuild. There is a poignant lesson in this. A lesson I see that many people still have not learned.

-----> stupid goat following is a choice not a requirement.

Most people try and stabilize their present by seeking to master the past, but if you obsess over this you will not be able to adapt. We have seen this play out now worldwide re: this virus and lockdown stuff. The stories, the misinformation and the delinquent nature of people's ability to learn.

So there's no point in arguing about it.

Clear out the crap in your head and learn.

"How do I do that Peter?"

Most people are too ashamed to admit they have problems. So start there. If you remain full of crap in your beliefs and opinions then you'll never learn anything and in doing so, you lock yourself away from Life. Most people have heads of full of "modern stuff" but are empty when it comes to the true basics of Life itself, in all its forms.

If you obsess over "fitting in" then you have already lost the battle.


Happy learning and trading.


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #393
  • Sep 8, 2022 10:01pm Sep 8, 2022 10:01pm
For people still learning and wanting to improve .......

Allow me to say something here......

Something that must be made very very clear here - this whole site and everything on it is NOT trading. It is technical analysis and technical perception. The repetition of the past and anticipation of a potential future are your allies but, as has been asked of me many times ..... is there more to it?

Yes of course.

So what would be more important than technical perception and repetition ?

Adaptation.

This is what offers you the chance to KEEP your money, be it hard earned or not. There is nothing else that really compares to being prepared BEYOND "the act of anticipating and being prepared".

Adapting to small,or large changes. Observing and more importantly, being able to learn HOW TO see around corners. Most people accept to live with such low personal standards that they accept mediocre levels of thinking and anything above this, choose to call it "overthinking".

But this is just laziness disguised as "I reckon I know better".

One example of Adaptation is when you keep one eye on the past to present timeline and the other eye on present to 'potential futures' timeline. Are you doing trading to escape reality or are you seeking to learn and generate a benefit?

A lot of people on silly sites like this think this is ridiculous or ludicrous or a waste of time.

But seeing around corners is what keeps a hunter alive. It's your use of foresight and using your other natural born skills together, that you don't just rely on your screen and the presumed Win Strike rates etc etc etc.

The best hunters in the history of this planet were those who prepared by running mock scenarios of "what IF". (When you do this, you learn to make your mind stretch and see many perspectives (inside a situation) instead of just one. This is one way to understand why some people "take" all the time and others only "give" and why some do both. Scientists call it "the neuro-pathways" but it's a lot more than that.)

On top of this, they carry a knowledge about money that has nothing to do with what 'modern man' even ever considers. People are usually too busy with their silly stories and ideas of 'what is'. Take a look around - this site and others are full of them.

If you are to adapt, you need to keep a clear head and your instincts sharp.

One problem I see with so many people these days is this - they have either a love or a hate relationship with "the system". and because of this people develop blind spots.

Therefore it does you no good to "try to keep everything the same in your life all the time". It's unnatural and unhealthy.

And not surprisingly, this urge for the static, places people in a very vulnerable position to be distracted by a story, or a "preference". And this leads to learning bad habits that cause compounded problems, both in your trading as well as your personal life.

And so, the next obvious question is - "How do I learn to adapt and see around corners?"

One word - observation.

Pure unadulterated observation work. No prejudice. No bias. No preference.

For some people it may take weeks, for others it may require months.

Personal gain and self interest are 2 motivators that will always cloud a person's judgment. (History CAN BE a wonderful teacher IF you allow it to speak to you.) These 2 motives have caused more problems and wreaked more havoc and destruction in people's lives in history, than anything else. And they always 100% of the time without fail, create an opaque view of what is going on right in front of your face and around you.

But these should not be confused with the instinct of basic survival and self preservation. No. Once a person's baseline for survival is stable enough, the world at large begins to creep in and these 2 motives start to come into view.

So selfish want is not strong or deep enough to process the need to do more. Adapting is the art of and act of learning through observation and combining past knowledge with new awareness and then seeing feasible options going into the future. Then the next step is viewing the potential path for each option. This is nothing "new". However to many it may be new to read about.

For technical traders, they might see "up, down, sideways".

But for someone who works backwards, who works from end to beginning, before seeking to satisfy their selfish desire, those 3 options are merely a path to reaction, not to succeeding in reaching your goal.

The "law" of adaptation states - those who survive are the ones who seek the end of the narrative first to then understand the how and why so one can learn and stay ahead of the curve.

Hehehehe, no not "really" a law, but it makes a very good point. People who believe something when it is untrue, cannot protect or "bend" with the times. Technical readouts are not real life. I have spoken many a time about real things and people have laughed. And now, out in the real world things have changed and people are starting to see that it's not so funny.

One of the main brick walls you will face with this type of personal work, is your approach.

In simple language, you have two choices ...... exclusive or inclusive.

On a site like this, you will observe that some people "prefer" technical approaches, while others choose what is thought to be "fundamental".

It always reminds me of that saying/quote (but not the way people usually refer to it) ..... "How do you eat an elephant?"

Usually the answer is "one bite at a time". However a more realistic answer could be - one bite at a time, with a very sharp knife and fork and a big enough plate."

For me, on sites like this, I see many people "playing to their strengths" when determining what type of approach to use with their trading.

But seeing as "trading" is not actually what people think it is, it really should be more and more obvious to you, that doing this might appear "easier" in the moment, but this is unnatural and creates all kinds of blind spots that will only get worse as time passes.

The reason I raise all these different things here at once, is because "adaptation" is really very fluid in its existence in each minute of your day. So it cannot and should not be put in a box and "defined" but needs to be understood using a simple process known as observation. To see the why, when, where, how and who in each situation. The "what" is usually there also but is generally determined by you, the trader. And once you actually learn how to do this properly, you can use it in your real life too.

An exclusive view seeks only to satisfy the selfish want. This is a feasible reason why people fail miserably when they attempt trading. It's never really about the money, if it were, everyone would have it all and every "retail trader" would trade every situation and "never lose". Everyone would just chase and chase and chase.

Exclusivity in your mind, your brain, means you isolate something and remove everything else. It's then fitted with your motive for doing it and this leaves the door open for your "personal issues" to put pressure on you to "perform".

And through this mindset, your focus can become an obsession..... a fixation.

With an inclusive approach, you want to learn to learn not just "get". This approach always works more effectively because it gives you the tools to learn and adapt.

Please understand this is not about "selling you" on an idea. It is to educate you about specific forms of living that include your thinking.

What affects one also affects the other.


I hope this helps.


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #394
  • Sep 13, 2022 2:13pm Sep 13, 2022 2:13pm
I had my doubts about this thread to begin with but I was wrong. I just spent a few hours reading some of the more detailed posts - this content is a Magnum Opus and quality reading. Thank you Peter.
  • #395
  • Sep 19, 2022 9:06pm Sep 19, 2022 9:06pm
If you have traversed this site and sites like this, and you have actually paid attention as you went along, you will eventually start to see certain patterns of behavior and the conspicuous downfalls to "being too invested" in the site and the people on it.

One of my old friends and mentors said to me on numerous occasions - You can tell a lot about the substance of a real to life trader by how they portray the markets they interact with. The average person and the "so-called" experienced traders on these sites, at the end of the day, really only talk from experience and whatever they've filled their heads with.

Most of the time this stops them actually learning anything beyond what's right in front of them.

My old mentor also pounded into me - the will of a man (or woman) to achieve is ALWAYS coupled with their level of maturity. And while you will find many so-called knowledgeable "traders" etc on this planet, the ones who truly excel at what they do, realize early on, that 'gathering places' and people, when it comes to trading, real trading, do not mix well. Why?

The best way to answer this is to offer a real to life example........ this site and sites like it.

Personally, I have learned that it is acceptable to give someone the benefit of the doubt, once. But after that they prove whether they actually have any real intelligence or not.

For example, a "chart" is not a "price chart". Not really. And it's rather disturbing when I read people saying "all you need is a chart". Just the same in saying "all you need is an indicator".

I think I have met MAYBE 3 personas on these sites who I would possibly trust with my money. And I have been here since Nov 2020. Why?

Most grab the assumption stick at the wrong end, showing exactly how ignorant and immature they are, NOT on some dinky website, but in actual physical real life. And I've read people saying "oh that shit doesn't matter or help or make any difference".

Try this - turn OFF your trading for a month and then track your movements and behavior and emotional/mental status.

Most I have come across talk big and talk a lot of rubbish. The words they will almost never utter are these - "I am an immature person who refuses to be more mature and I hide myself from what I am really doing - speculating .... or even gambling, if I am really only in it for the thrill of the action and have money and time to burn".

For some I have met, they lord and master over others in all different ways. But most of them, in real life, would simply get bitch slapped for being such a tosser, behaving in ways that prove they "know some stuff" but don't even have enough self respect to teach themselves the real life basics.

Professionals? Experienced traders? yeah UUUUMM .... no.

NO ONE will operate your financial accounts like you will. FACT. SO why would you ever listen to tossers who NEED to involve themselves in things that pull down the parts of you as a trader or investor, that are MORE essential than a mere chart?

The world is full of morons and idiots, "fake it til you make its" and wannabe's..... seeking recognition and praise and for what?

Do you think so little of yourself that you fall to your knees and allow others to do the work for you?

If you want to "socialize", join a knitting bee or go to a Starbucks and gossip over coffee.

As I have said many times - a trader cannot operate without a brain in their skull.

So whenever someone says something, you have to learn to immediately consider the other side to that view. Not judge, but simply think about and observe that "other side".

And so, the other side and counterpart to having your brain firmly inside your skull, is being emotionally mature enough to see that trading has almost nothing to do with accessing a chart and "buys and sells". That's a fool's game. Almost everything on these sites is geared around "forming" someone to be something. That's why IF you take a good hard look at the personas on these sites, majority are of people who don't REALLY believe they'll do any better than they have and are. Why?

You cannot improve if your view is lopsided. It's as simple as that.

Real trading requires lateral thinking not "follow the leader".

So ask yourself whether you want to be here in 30yrs STILL "trying to trade" ..... or, do you see that people are always a result of their environment getting too involved in what they do?

When you have a situation where there is little to no assistance or guidance or instruction that relates to real life personal development that also involves money ..... then you know something's off.

Things to consider.

If you really want to learn, you need to start with the assumption that most people are lazy and ignorant but expect to be well treated for this belief and position. These people, deep down, KNOW they're not doing enough, but make up excuses and stories to contain their weakness. If you actually want to learn, you cannot do what they do.

The difference between a real person and a silly online person = it's all in the background work. There's no better way to find out what you don't know or understand. An easy way to view people who are addicted to these sites - they are just scared. Scared of something and have frozen in time. If you choose to learn of people's motivations, then you will get a look at why they have such a hard time dealing with reality.

This is the way of the trader, the real person behind the trading, the chart, the device and the silly and dinky websites that try to keep people right where they are.

Being a single minded speculator is not healthy or useful.

Choose to be better and do better........ and then follow through.


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #396
  • Oct 6, 2022 9:10pm Oct 6, 2022 9:10pm
So you wanna "learn how to trade" hah?!!

Ok, well, let's start wit this .....

Q - do you wanna "maaaaake money" ????

Q - Do you wanna exercise your opportunity?

Q - Do you wanna learn something?

Most people who read this will judge it as being "too simple" or "too general" or something else?

NEWSFLASH ---> Most people wouldn't know their left hand from their right hand. They build their lives based on assumptions of something. And THAT is why they never really learn anything....... always waiting for SOMEONE ELSE to tell them the answer or what to do next. Never actually dealing with their problems and therefore never really getting better at something.

And now with all these 'weaponized causes' floating around out in the world, is it surprising that many people are going out of their minds.

So ....... you wanna learn how to trade? Well, before you embark on that journey, you might wanna checklist a few things first.


"What is the modern definition of a trader ........ to YOU?" Forget other people's ridiculous toxic sense of definition and just ask yourself that question.

Do you REALLY think most "social media addicts" on sites like these have ANY CLUE what a legitimate response to that query would really be ? No.

To me, I think of and remember the old times of merchant traders. IF they wanted to be in business for at LEAST 20 or 30 years, they HAD TO offer value to get value in return. Some people might say this is about integrity or morals or ethics. But this thinking process is all wrong. And shows a rather disturbing lack of understanding of past life and present life. Return to the above statement about value and read it all again.

Recon.

When a person becomes addicted to the "person" who is helping them then they have now lost all focus. Most people rely on other poor souls to teach them something they know nothing about or cannot do for themselves.

I read a lot of people saying "Keep what works and discard the rest". Sure if you're gambling BUT "believe" you are trading.

Doing your background work is actually more important than "pushing the button to buy or sell".

Why? If the "trading industry" stopped indefinitely today, you've still learned something. Most people hear or read words like "fast track" or some other thing and never ask the most pertinent questions.

Many people do not understand, respect or appreciate the incredible overlaps between personal development and work. So how could they know what questions to ask.

Personal knowledge.

Knowing yourself is not some "new thing", not some "movie thing" or some "popular thing".

It inevitably leeches into EVERY area of your life. Your personal beliefs, whatever they may be, do not count here with this. The faster a person stops resisting this and running away from this, the faster they will come to understand that "trading", could really. be just about ANY activity. Why is it deemed to be so different?

Money.

People say and believe the funniest things when encircling money. I COULD tell you that it's "just an idea" ..... but you wouldn't believe me and you would have a very hard time understanding how that could be real or true. Why? It's not YOUR conclusion based on your understanding. That's why. You haven't done the searching and researching, done the checking and rechecking. You haven't sat in a dark room at night and thought about anything beyond your own wants.

It's not at all funny to watch good people get turned round and round because they do not understand the layers that are setup in each industry and category of society to keep them searching and "tasting" and searching and "tasting" some more.

To truthfully understand this area, consider this equation .....

({a person + money} x 24 hours a day 365 days a year)

Consider how this may change the person, change their attitudes, their beliefs, their focus, their priorities, their definitions about Life/their life and human society in general. And now consider what assumptions are born out of all this.

What IF .... you got paid to go to the toilet? So, every time you legitimately needed to go to the toilet, you earned a commission. IF you can be objective for a moment here, ask yourself HOW is this any different? REALLY be serious here and ponder this question.

A REAL problem that people continue to reproduce, is the act of straight line thinking. It is rather rigid, linear and literal in its ways of seeing a situation and it also makes a person VERY VERY VERY VERY predictable. And this makes people emotionally reactive.

It's the reason why most people would be disgusted by the above scenario. You're not as mature or intelligent or in control of yourself as "you believe" you are. I didn't say "do it" I merely offered it as a "what IF" opportunity.

And THIS, in some ways of looking at everything, is why people fight and argue over "how to do this or that".

How you "think" is PART of the situation but it's not the only part.

Indeed I have only made a quick note here of what is relevant and important. (Hehehe I'd love to be a fly on the wall of people's room, when they read this to see and hear their reactions.)

Humility check.

Just because you've accumulated 'money' in your account has nothing to do with value. Nor does strategy or testing or taxes or any of the other ridiculous stuff that goes on.

It's merely a sign that you've found a way to do ONE thing well.


Being human I too sometimes struggle with these things. But the Life lesson I found that helps me through it is this .....

---> Learning and Living are one and the same thing. Once you become stagnant, you cease to be alive. Trying to learn only with your brain (without emotions or vice versa) produces the same result.

Another one I have found especially helpful ......

------> Most people really live in a glass box but believe they're free to make their own choices. Each and every category of physical and material society reflects this everyday. Therefore people are not offering themself a chance to be thorough in their perspective and overview. For if they were, they will quickly see their victimization is a ruse.


Action plan.

Many people, especially online and now with the rise of the "personal development" industry, as well as the modern Psych. areas of study, have lost touch with the basics.

You. Your feeling and emotions. Your thoughts and ideas and thinking. Your body and activity of daily living. Your basic general area and environment. And if there's anything deeper than these for yourself, well then that too.

All of these are your responsibility. It doesn't matter if you agree or not. It's yours to take care of. In my lifetime, I have found there is a direct correlation between movement of learning and idea of reality.

Most people deem it acceptable to be obsessed with going outside themselves to learn.

It hasn't worked for over 10,000 years. Why would the "information superhighway" make it any easier or prettier or better or clearer?

All of this comes from a person who has a genuine interest in seeing you learn, rather than some pseudo plutonic persona.

Scientists always want to dissect but a real person needs and wants to learn. This means defragmenting the whole situation. Every time "shortcuts" are attempted disaster follows. LEARN THE LESSON. Therefore the action plan is always the same.

Consider this .... "If you don't use it you'll lose it."


Peter


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Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #397
  • Nov 4, 2022 12:16am Nov 4, 2022 12:16am
Many people find it unrealistic or unbelievable to consider that 100% is possible in trading.

It's funny how people are sometimes. You ever notice that? Yeah I do.

Let me ask you this first - Do you want glory or a definite EOD / EOW outcome ?

Please consider.

Let me ask you this ......

What do you think the possibility AND the probability is, that you will die sometime in the future?

Would you say it's ............ 90%? 50%? 20%? 100%?

So is the certainty of outcome an external fact or is it just in your head?

Think about that for a bit. And then consider what you think 'thinking' really is.

If I'm having a 10% down day, I don't just pack up and walk away. Are you nuts ??!!

Or are you someone who says "Oh .... oh my ...... that order just disappeared and got stopped out. Oh well, guess I'll just tuck tail and run away" ???

"Your triumphs should never dispel or mask your failures".

Nor should your failures exceed your thinking.

So I ask you again ..... how likely is it that you will die in the future? Pretty bloody certain right ??!!!!!

SO ..... 100% DOES IN FACT EXIST in this world and the world of probabilities and numbers. The problem people have is in the CONTEXT of how to APPLY such a thing.

On these sites, silly poodles say silly things without checking the validity of it first. Please learn to think for yourself and utilize as many perspectives as is possible.


Happy learning and trading.


Peter

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Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #398
  • Edited 12:38am Nov 11, 2022 12:04am | Edited 12:38am
A family friend asked me yesterday, how it was going on the trading website, with trying to help people trade or invest. I giggled because I didn't think he was listening when we last spoke. But in fact he did. So I told him the truth ..... I hadn't been doing much lately as I think I had handed over too much already and people would need to digest it all, to make use of anything there.

The interesting thing he said next sparked a thought in me. Here's what he said ... "I guess some people just don't really understand the concept of fish."

And so here's something to help people along.

An issue I see all too often is how much time people use living in or occupying their own head.

Let me give an eg here.

"Trend"


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Why is this important?

A simple, truthful and easy exercise that you can perform right now, is this .....

Sit in front of your price chart, zoomed out enough so you can view the ups, the downs and the side movements. Now, zoom in til you mainly see the recent previous activity as well as the current detail. Now unlock your scroll and slowly look at the chart. only this time, arc your head left or right or horizontal, to mimic the "direction" you think you see it going. Now draw your momentum line as if you are the market seeking arcing levels, while ignoring "human foolishness" re: trend etc etc. Connecting together processed arc lows and lowers and arc highs and highers AS THE MARKET SEES IT, NOT YOU. After you do this a few times, sit back and observe the axis of price and time set up on that chart view. Then go and reread post 2 here on this thread that discussed Tier levels. And then you will better understand.

Most people do not process, processed "trending lows and highs" correctly. "High, inside high, Low, inside low". "Higher high Lower Low". Again just words! So they make assumptions and keep making the same type of mistakes. Another factor is, as I have said already, the jargon people "buy into using" when trying to understand it all. Try using your common sense and leave the word squabbling to the idiots.

Now answer this query - "Generally speaking, how many axes (multiple axis) can you observe?"

If you said 3, you'd be right and wrong. Correct if you are only talking about the chart observing itself. But this then excludes you doesn't it.

Your view or perspective is what gives it "shape/form" ...... Not what "it is doing". Understand? You must include YOUR view/position of observation if you are to see that it merely arcs up then seeks to arc down then arc up then down again. So why is this happening?

If you asked most people online they'd give you some sort of baloney talk about trends and economics and fundamentals and inflation and everything else that clearly they don't truly understand. For IF they did, they wouldn't be so quick to misrepresent it in trying to answer that question in that way.

A truthful simple answer is this = just like a fish or more specifically, a shark, for example, if it stops moving, it becomes static and if this happens ... it dies. DEAD. The end.

So, just as it is for trend traders, a market must be "made" so things don't stop and die.

Now, think about the exercise from before. Head arc left, right or centered.

For people with a fixed perception as it is with "the markets" .... if things do something different .......


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And .....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKj4upY1VYI


Have you ever asked why it seems to be so hard and or difficult to understand "the markets"? (A genuine and serious question)

Lack of or basic absence of common sense (which seems less common these days).

So, if someone asked me today - "Peter, how should I go about becoming apt in price chart evaluation and tracking?"

First, if you do not learn what a market really is or are too lazy to find out, then write on your forehead in thick black marker *Speculator* and if you realize that there are / must be ways to mitigate / almost eliminate the many different types of risk involved, then write *willing to learn*.

My old friend and mentor said it beautifully, "Those with very low standards and belief about themselves, will always end up using other people as their benchmark for success or failure. However, once you learn that most people who are used by people in this way, are usually dickheads, then you deflate them and now they can be seen for what they really are. People want success so badly they're willing to brown nose to then incidentally learn all the wrong things."

Another example is regarding "Support and Resistance or Supply and Demand". I am very sorry to inform you that these things are just words. They have never ACTUALLY existed. For example, think about the last time you kicked your toe on the corner of the chair etc. It hurt yes ??!!! And so, in a particular context, it feels real and is declared to be real. The same with S and R etc. In my earlier days we were shown that resistance placed on a market is due to something, not the "boogeyman" lurking about. And this applies to ALL scenarios in real life. Both upper AND lower slowing and turning and possible reversal. If you would prefer to be "hip with the cool kids" and feel like you "fit in" then sure, use words you don't understand. But in real life, just as in the global markets, for some people upper is upper but for other people, it's lower.

So if you have learned ONLY one thing here today, let it be this. Markets think in different ranges of understanding than you do. IF you so choose therefore, to now appreciate that Support or Resistance in a market IS JUST RESISTANCE (from a specific point of view), exactly as you know it to be in physical real life, then you now understand that merely turning your head to the left or right, to mimic the "trend" momentum is a truer way to draw your trend line. Taking into consideration horizontal, angular and vertical. Up, upper, low, lower. IT'S A GRAPH. WHOOOHOOOOO !!! Hehehehe. See, common sense. You're not sitting inside the control room guiding that market, so, you need to mimic what it does in a way you can repeat anywhere anytime. So to all the people 'naked chart trading' ........ you're doing it the way PEOPLE say it is to be done, NOT how the market does it, uses it and sees it. Capeesh ??!!

People waste SO MUCH time with things that work a fraction of the time. WHY ???!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you use something that really TRULY only works let's say 5% of the time, that would mean it does NOT work 95% of the time, correct?

Mmmmmmmmm, I wonder if that has something to do with the perception that 90 something % of retail traders lose? Mmmmmm, some-thing to think about the next time you feel the urge to "listen to someone else" ...... instead of training your heart and mind to access its common sense !!! Hehehehehehe.

DID YOU KNOW ...... that human error generates more accidents in social flirtation situations? WHAT ??!!!! REALLY ??!!!

Yes. They keep spilling everyone else's drinks trying to find someone to tell them what to do next !!!

Oh how I wish people would just be confident in their own skin. It'd certainly be less expensive than continually paying for everyone's rounds at the bar !!!!!! Hihihihihehehehehe. Get my point yet ????

You wanna hear something hilarious?

I've had people say to me "Well, that's just YOUR opinion. I don't agree and I'm gonna keep doing it MY way!".

Once you have tried something on say, 100 different instruments, across maybe 3-10 different asset classes, and done it in a multi-generational way (A single generation refers to 1 version of a market and its operations), then you'll learn what "works" and you will learn the true level of your own personal standards....... and just how much bullshit people carry in their heads about "the markets".

As I have said to people before, Life offers better lessons to teach you about trading than people ever will. People have blind spots that Life will help you remove but on their own, people can only remove jam spots. Hihihihihehehehehahahahahahahaa.

I hope you learned something here.


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #399
  • Nov 11, 2022 12:18am Nov 11, 2022 12:18am
Here's a basic example as seen on a chart.


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Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #400
  • Nov 12, 2022 10:53pm Nov 12, 2022 10:53pm
Here's a good question for everyone around -

Q = Generate 20 to 100 p's per day or week EVERY day/week consistently, OR, try to outsmart the market you access and go for more?

For me, I've been actively trading for 4 decades now and I will tell you it's a REALLY juicy question. Hehehehehe. But, for me, there's no competition between which one I would choose.

I will choose the former every time. Why? What's my reasoning?

When I got out of floor trading etc, I started with my own accounts. And I had to ask this very question of myself. I came to the conclusion that reality for the financial markets is SO SPRAWLED and DIVERSE that IF, you are willing to accept the possible risks, learn to manage those risks in all forms, then as time progresses, as does society, you will get better at managing your positions and overall exposure, BOTH on AND off the field.

I knew I wanted and needed to form a management plan that focused on primary and secondary income, not gambling profits, so this is why the first option appeals to me.

I know people love the idea of using a 10 p Stop loss to make 1000 p's but for that you would need to micro-fathom the possibilities and I wasn't going to spend my whole life glued to screens.

Perspective is everything here. Trying to trade "for profit" unto itself is feeble at best and completely irresponsible at worst. And a lot of the time it's the people around you that get hurt.

Something else I will add here - about Leverage and its use. Have you ever watched a TV show or movie where the person owes money to a loan shark and then when they're late to pay etc, the goons come around to collect. Maybe smash a knee cap or leg or arm or something to make a point and push the urgency for payment.

The issue here is being loaned money to hit the casino or poker tables, seeking to "win big"........ to GAMBLE.

Get it yet?

People do not understand the relationships within compound interest in its sum total. Your money, your account, the market, how it moves and why it stops. People think "the big boys" are just putting in orders or there's liquidity or low liquidity.

Liquid = loan. I'll say this again so you remember it ........ Liquid = loan. Brokers, both good and bad, hate traders using little or no leverage. Why? There's no cream and cherry on top. Plain and simple. There's no "conspiracy" here. "Stayed money" as it used to be called, is stored banked money. So it can be used as collateral on leverage. Still with me? Good. Think of "fixed term deposit" accounts etc. and mortgage payment accounts. 2 prime examples of this.

So for a retail trader/end user trader ...... you don't see the backend where "1's and 0's" are collateralized and leverage is born.

This is why compound interest can be your friend when your trading is doing well but its enemy when it's performing poorly. The other time it is against you is when you overexpose. Eg - a trade setup with potential 50p's in the move is presenting. One ticket provides a multiplier that is designated by its margin/leverage level position AKA relationship. But the second is not so kind. Usually I work with a 2.5-3.0 multiplier for the second because a loss from the first imposes a new exposure level. Account equity and balance is affected by position overall now and this is in effect even if you hedge to carry the order out the backdoor later on. A mistake I see many traders trying to do by using hedge to close out as a single trade instead of 2 separate orders. Most retail traders assume their own personal risk but do not care what others carry. The funny thing about this is they do not see that it's all connected in.

So "adding" to your position if you have not assessed the ROROI (Rate of Return On Investment) correctly, means you are gambling not technically investing time energy and money into a definitive healthy outcome. The short answer wording = You cannot arrive at use of leverage if you are gambling from the start. Because it is NOT about the days of trading where you 'get away with its use' but the days where you are blindsided because something BIG affects service to the markets. Eg. a big event wave such as GFC or some other pervasive situation mostly no one accounted for.

Leverage is good for those underexposed but bad for those who do not possess an underlying awareness of WHO is underexposed. Understand?

YOU, the retail order (I am assuming here) are the latter. If you do not see who leverages the collateral, why they do so and then look at your own approach, you are gambling. I'm ok with you gambling (I know people do it) but don't try and dress it up as something more and call it strawberry shortcakes and talk yourself into believing you understand what you're doing.


Happy learning and trading.


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
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