Menu
Sister Sites

Options

Bookmark Thread

First Page First Unread Last Page Last Post

Print Thread

Similar Threads

Anyone trading with a Prop firm 2 replies

prop firm new model - my trading journey 869 replies

So I accepted a Prop Trading job in South Beach Miami 43 replies

Attachments: Prop Firm Hub
Exit Attachments

Prop Firm Hub

Quoting doyathink
{quote} And if it reverses?
The good thing is the risk is always constant here. It is '1 R' (or those 10 pips intial risk as trailing stop here). So you increase your chances but not your initial risk. You can also think of variants here. If you want to set your SL to Breakeven, you can also do scaling in from a later point on and still profit more but with 'zero' risk then. To get back to my example you can also wait for first 10 pips profit, then set SL to BE and then for the next 20 or 30 pips move you do instant scaling profiting from Euler.
  •  Soros
  • Joined Sep 2012 | Status: Edge,Phsycology And Money Managemen | 909 Posts
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Yes, 6% is automatic, under 6%, must request by email.
perfect, you ,ust send ,mail 3 days before your acc expires?
I am what Many Dream to be but only a few can achieve, im a part of the 1%
Quoting TrAndy1
Sorry, but if OutThere is only out here to make a dispute with each other, that is not constructive to anyone. It only looks like that he cannot meet Phase 1 criteria by trying it hard. But consistency can only be achieved with persistency. So do your own homework and make your own research. Those Prop firms goals are still doable.
Ok, back to your adulation now but check your knee pads for signs of extreme wear.
Quoting CableJ
Very few approach prop trading logically by dialing down the risk once live. Almost everyone (including myself) is forced to over risk in phase 1 to pass. I always do 2% risk in phase 1 to get it over with as fast as possible. I have a successful system with a >3 Sortino ratio. However, If I used responsible risk in phase 1, maybe 2-3 months out of 12 would be good enough to pass. This required over risking leads to tons of evaluation flame outs and profits for the prop firm. The large 5-6 figure payout flexing and interviews by those that get lucky...
Well done by having a >3 Sortino strategy. That means your chances are high, that you can pass Phase 1 on any prop firm challenge. Maybe MFF is your favorite one.?
Quoting OutThere
{quote} You make the perfect monkey in the monkey/master pic. You feed your master with your earnings and don't question anything. In fact you are one that nozzled to the master hinting to become enslaved. Maybe you even go to your tribe and recruite more monkeys because you like that life style of being fed a portion of your earnings. I guess there will always be Uncle Toms in this world.

Holy shit the mental gymnastics. seek help.
Quoting ladder
{quote} Surgetrader also has no time limits. But they both use EightCap as their broker, too bad.
EightCap - do you think he is a bad broker? They don't withdraw profits? Or do they have bad spreads?
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} The good thing is the risk is always constant here. It is '1 R' (or those 10 pips intial risk as trailing stusop here). So you increase your chances but not your initial risk. You can also think of variants here. If you want to set your SL to Breakeven, you can also do scaling in from a later point on and still profit more but with 'zero' risk then. To get back to my example you can also wait for first 10 pips profit, then set SL to BE and then for the next 20 or 30 pips move you do instant scaling profiting from Euler.
I assume you are using algo to add size if it's pip or pipette...

Also, I don't see much obvious online re: Euler and trading...
can you point me to some info, or explain a bit?

Thanks.
Quoting doyathink
{quote} I assume you are using algo to add size if it's pip or pipette... Also, I don't see much obvious online re: Euler and trading... can you point me to some info, or explain a bit? Thanks.
Here is one example calculated with 2:1 RRR with 10 pips SL, Risk $1250 on this trade and 19 steps for each 1 pip added lots. Not 100% instant but a good proxy. Here you see from instant Position Sizing that your initial risk of 10 pips lead to triple gains from initial $2500 to +$5093, so over $7500 in total, with that small change. Of course if you expect regularly wild moves after you enter a trade or position it does not make sense. But if you can work or trade with trailing stop, then this is superior.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Instant Pos Sizing.gif Size: 19 KB
Here are instant Position Sizing examples with RRR 3:1 and 4:1. I do not go beyond that, because then those trade setups become to rare. You see the the differences.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Instant Pos Sizing_RRR_3_to_1.gif Size: 28 KB
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Instant Pos Sizing_RRR_4_to_1.gif Size: 31 KB

Of course the increment in lot sizes get too large after some positive pips. So maybe it can only work at FTMO, or a workaround is needed for other props. Actually I do not have a solution here, except going down to smaller steps and thus decreasing the lot size to be added here. But I do not have ready EA to reduce slippage, hmm...?
The issue that a select, few people try make against prop firms just seems nonsensical to me. Sure, you can accomplish the same or better with a personal account, but you need a lot more startup capital and you need to risk a lot more of your own money.

One could certainly put up 24K of their own money, then try to flip the account, withdraw the 24K profit and boom!... you have what a prop firm offers you, with no risk, and, you get to keep 100% of the profits. But why do that when you can do the same thing with less than 1K? So you only get 75% to 85% of the profits and cannot withdraw the other 1K that is in your account, but you only risk 4% of your capital instead of 100%, and you do not need to put up 24K to do it.

The difference comes down to risk and capital. So, the benefit with prop is reaching your goals faster, with much less risk-exposure and greater reduction in psychological pressure, which most seem to overlook. Any person with simple math and business understanding should know this. Which is why the few that argue against it are either uneducated, are mentally unsound, have some hidden agenda or a combination thereof.

In truth, I think some things in life are just simply too difficult to accept or believe by some. This kind of naivety may be the result of poor upbringing, circumstances and/or brainwashing, or, a severely sheltered existence. I also think that some people just like to troll because they get some sort of pleasure out of it.

Fortunately, as Takisd already pointed out, we all have the ability to make our own choices. So, to each their own.
So my thought as workaround of larger lot size increments which needs to be added for the instant position sizing method, I see three options. First you need to divide the large lot size into smaller pieces and thus need to add sooner in smaller pip(ette) increments. Second, you can choose smaller account sizes and do copy trading, third you can add a time delay to avoid or reduce slippage. But that is the question I have. Which prop firm has which time delay so you can add an order ticket so that those order tickets are not summed up together to one big order ticket and so increase the slippage you get with a much worse order fill. Anyone knows ? Is it 50ms ?
Quoting Nsak3y
The issue that a select, few people try make against prop firms just seems nonsensical to me. Sure, you can accomplish the same or better with a personal account, but you need a lot more startup capital and you need to risk a lot more of your own money. One could certainly put up 24K of their own money, then try to flip the account, withdraw the 24K profit and boom!... you have what a prop firm offers you, with no risk, and, you get to keep 100% of the profits. But why do that when you can do the same thing with less than 1K? So you only get 75%...
Couldn't have stated it better myself.
Just to make an illustrative example how any prop firm can go bust by position sizing intraday within 1 day, I took the S&P500 as symbol with a 20 point or 0.5% as trailing stop and 4% TP move intraday (160 points here). Every 0.1% or 4 points a position is added when in gains and new equity high is made. So you see after 39 steps with Euler I get from initial 5% risk on a merged (or with copy trading) $600k account with $30000 total risk, not a $240000 profit (no scaling) I get a $80 million profit, which would result after a profit split still something around $64,000,000. So that would ruin any prop firm regardless of size I would say. Still possible scenario.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Prop Firm Risk.gif Size: 35 KB
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} Well done by having a >3 Sortino strategy. That means your chances are high, that you can pass Phase 1 on any prop firm challenge. Maybe MFF is your favorite one.?
Last year was 5.8 Sortino but it typically fluctuates anywhere from 2-6 from year to year. Over risking @ 2% which does add luck into the equation, I'm around 70% passing phase 1s. @ responsible risk that drops down to around 40-45%. Even though FTMO is harder, for whatever reason it doesn't seem to make any difference between passing FTMO vs MFF so far.
The new feed MFF installed is fast, a lot of newbies are going to struggle with that.
a mistake that I could never regret
I got 2% instead of 0.2%
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: mist.png Size: 13 KB
Quoting Soros
{quote} did you inbox them via mail for the extention?
Aye mate, I was at +4% so had to do an email request.
Quoting Paulscaff1
{quote} Aye mate, I was at +4% so had to do an email request.
Aye...finally got my trophy logo on MFF Discord.



300K lock and load.
  •  Soros
  • Joined Sep 2012 | Status: Edge,Phsycology And Money Managemen | 909 Posts
Quoting Paulscaff1
{quote} Aye mate, I was at +4% so had to do an email request.
I honestly believe prop firms are the best deal on the internet
I am what Many Dream to be but only a few can achieve, im a part of the 1%
5 traders viewing now, 1 is a member:
wealthminers