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High Risk Strategy

  • #1
  • First Post: Jul 24, 2020 5:00am Jul 24, 2020 5:00am
Ok, it is clear that we all try to respect the rules and money management BUT ...
who of you has a secondary account where he uses high risk strategies?
I am obviously referring to: aggressive lot sizing, alternative money management, etc ...
Everything that leads you to double your account easily ... more times than you could burn it ...
Now everyone will say "GAMBLING !!" but I don't agree: you can also have a backtested strategy of this type that burns your account 20% of the time. BUT HOW MUCH EARNINGS 80% OF THE TIMES CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE ...
  • #2
  • Jul 24, 2020 3:13pm Jul 24, 2020 3:13pm
Quoting HeyYou
hmmm no, the ESMA + mediation literally changed my life.... hahahaha Actually, I don't think it's a bad thing to trade ultra high risk, but, if you want to do it SERIUOSLY, it's very hard because you need a good withdrawal / deposit plan in addition to the strategy. Volume rebates, why not.
🤣🤣🤣
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #3
  • Jul 24, 2020 4:04pm Jul 24, 2020 4:04pm
Quoting HeyYou
{quote} ?
Why asking about my comment on an erased post ?
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #4
  • Jul 24, 2020 4:21pm Jul 24, 2020 4:21pm
Quoting HeyYou
{quote} hmmm...why not ? if I erase my comment it doesn't mean my comment has no value.

It does for you, why wouldn’t you keep it online then ?

I just have nothing more to say to an erased comment which has been erased being judged irrelevant by its poster.


Cheers,
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #5
  • Jul 24, 2020 4:28pm Jul 24, 2020 4:28pm
Quoting gian97
Ok, it is clear that we all try to respect the rules and money management BUT ... who of you has a secondary account where he uses high risk strategies? I am obviously referring to: aggressive lot sizing, alternative money management, etc ... Everything that leads you to double your account easily ... more times than you could burn it ... Now everyone will say "GAMBLING !!" but I don't agree: you can also have a backtested strategy of this type that burns your account 20% of the time. BUT HOW MUCH EARNINGS 80% OF THE TIMES CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE...
It is easy to have a backtesting showing tremendous returns, on a real live account it is very different, because of many things, to name a few the positive and negative excursions almost impossible to quantify on a backtesting, also the trader’s behavior in live conditions.

I hate to burst a bubble but an account that has a 20% chance of blowing up is still called gambling, way worse if this is from a backtesting !

I have a side hobby which is poker, feel free to play poker on a side live trading account, after all I have a cat named Tiger...


Cheers,
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #6
  • Jul 24, 2020 4:40pm Jul 24, 2020 4:40pm
Quoting HeyYou
{quote} because it was too obvious ok! thanks..

Same as my answer then !
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #7
  • Jul 24, 2020 4:59pm Jul 24, 2020 4:59pm
Quoting HeyYou
{quote} Fine then mate, my point was, if you want to trade ultra high risk... withdraw regularly & start very small. sooo obvious lol

LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #8
  • Jul 24, 2020 5:11pm Jul 24, 2020 5:11pm
Quoting HeyYou
{quote} Fine then mate, my point was, if you want to trade ultra high risk... withdraw regularly & start very small. sooo obvious lol

Why would you want to withdraw regularly if you start very small ? That says it all.

Better start bigger with low risk, unless you don’t know how to trade and are gambling...

If you start very small and are gambling, the only way to make it is by letting the compounding return grow.

Anyway it is still gambling, the red mist’s gambler fallacy is on the corner. Yet everyone is free to gamble their money even on forex or stocks. But I like to call this forum a trader’s forum.

Trading is the opposite of gambling, even though I do reckon that the border is very thin. Trading is the ability to control losses over any profit even if you haven’t acquired an edge yet. So any such called high risk strategies are not strategic at all.
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #9
  • Jul 25, 2020 1:56am Jul 25, 2020 1:56am
Quoting LDFX
{quote} Why would you want to withdraw regularly if you start very small ? That says it all. Better start bigger with low risk, unless you don’t know how to trade and are gambling... If you start very small and are gambling, the only way to make it is by letting the compounding return grow. Anyway it is still gambling, the red mist’s gambler fallacy is on the corner. Yet everyone is free to gamble their money even on forex or stocks. But I like to call this forum a trader’s forum. Trading is the opposite of gambling, even though I do reckon that...
no, you don't want to just compound like crazy. you need to withdraw from time to time..


yes it's close to gambling. I can talk about it on this forum, if you have problems use the ignore function. bye.
  • #10
  • Jul 25, 2020 3:40am Jul 25, 2020 3:40am
OK CALL IT GAMBLING is NOT IMPORTANT
What is important is that it can be done. There are strategies that have an advantage and can be used to make money.
For example, if you have a high win ratio, you can raise the risk per transaction and do a quick compounding and then withdraw.
Or you can trade without stop loss and by mediating the price until it burns, the important thing is that before burning you have withdrawn the deposit and actual profit.
Call it gambling if you want, but get out of the box a little !!!!!

I am not saying that this is the right way to trade. A PERSON SHOULD HAVE A LARGE ACCOUNT WITH WHICH HE RISKS AT LEAST 1% PER TRADE. I ALSO TRADE SO.
But I don't see anything wrong with having secondary accounts to have fun.
  • #11
  • Edited 5:55am Jul 25, 2020 5:38am | Edited 5:55am
This is how ultra high risk looks like in real life:
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: DetailedStatement.gif Size: 7 KB



Don't fool yourself into thinking that you can make lots of money overnight.
  • #12
  • Jul 25, 2020 6:02am Jul 25, 2020 6:02am
Quoting HeyYou
This is how ultra high risk looks like in real life: {image} Don't fool yourself into thinking that you can make lots of money overnight.
The problem is that everyone here thinks that it means trading at random, but in reality even high risk trading needs rules.
For example :
Withdrawal as soon as the deposit is duplicated - after that time it's all risk free.
How often to withdraw and how much to leave on the account
entry and exit strategy
They are all things to decide and that make up a crazy high risk trading plan - call it gambling, but gambling can also have its rules.
  • #13
  • Jul 25, 2020 3:38pm Jul 25, 2020 3:38pm
Quoting HeyYou
{quote} no, you don't want to just compound like crazy. you need to withdraw from time to time.. yes it's close to gambling. I can talk about it on this forum, if you have problems use the ignore function. bye.
Of course you can, I am not gonna argue on that, you are free as I am.

I don’t ever use the ignore button instead of so many..., didn’t you put me on your ignore list by the way ?

I am for Socratism, only healthy way to enlighten oneself.

I might be wrong all the way about my thoughts but never will be by posting them, unless I am starting to censor the contrarian views.


Cheers,
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #14
  • Jul 25, 2020 3:42pm Jul 25, 2020 3:42pm
Quoting HeyYou
This is how ultra high risk looks like in real life: {image} Don't fool yourself into thinking that you can make lots of money overnight.

Yes couldn’t agree more.

Also another chart you might show is instead those of martingale/no stops, which the profit is consistently taking the stairs while the loss are at best taking the elevator if not jumping from the roof.

Same old, high risk has no place in trading but in gambling.


Cheers,
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #15
  • Jul 25, 2020 3:52pm Jul 25, 2020 3:52pm
Quoting gian97
OK CALL IT GAMBLING is NOT IMPORTANT What is important is that it can be done. There are strategies that have an advantage and can be used to make money. For example, if you have a high win ratio, you can raise the risk per transaction and do a quick compounding and then withdraw. Or you can trade without stop loss and by mediating the price until it burns, the important thing is that before burning you have withdrawn the deposit and actual profit. Call it gambling if you want, but get out of the box a little !!!!! I am not saying that this is the...

Having a small capital to gamble exist and many do, the difference is about thinking to get a high from it or to actually think to make money with it.

I do poker, I invest a capital which is the price to pay to get the sensational emotions a poker night can provide, if I turn out to be a winner then the better but I would be a fool to think that I am playing poker to actually win money from it, only the perception and risk taken rewards me.

If in trading you think that because you have an edge you could make money simply by risking much and withdrawing it at intervals and calling it strategic then you are simply a fool. If you have an edge let say 60% win ratio, it is only after a very large sample that you can call it so, which inevitably costed you drawdown and loosing strikes, the win/loss distribution in any trading system is randomn. So by risking much you only dramatically increase your risk of losing instead of winning so it doesn’t matter how much more you can hypothetically make because the odds will be way to low.

Yet you are free to gamble on anything you want but do not call a cat a dog.


Cheers,
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #16
  • Jul 25, 2020 3:58pm Jul 25, 2020 3:58pm
Quoting gian97
{quote} The problem is that everyone here thinks that it means trading at random, but in reality even high risk trading needs rules. For example : Withdrawal as soon as the deposit is duplicated - after that time it's all risk free. How often to withdraw and how much to leave on the account entry and exit strategy They are all things to decide and that make up a crazy high risk trading plan - call it gambling, but gambling can also have its rules.

There is no such thing as risk free.

Withdrawing half of your capital once doubled still means that half of your capital is a total risk, a very bad risk:reward ratio...

Also making short money is very easy in forex, keeping it demands brain, withdrawing half of your capital once doubled does not mean you will keep it and it does make it risk free at all, and how many accounts would you have blown up before?

It is like someone buying 4 apples for 4usd, selling 2 for 4usd and saying that he got 2 apples for free. Which is very narrow minded because he still bought the 2 remaining apples for 2 usd...

I you had bought 2 apples for 2 usd and sold them 4usd for a net profit of 2 usd, would you say that the 2 oranges you bought at 2 usd with that profit are free ? I hope not.


Cheers,
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #17
  • Jul 25, 2020 7:06pm Jul 25, 2020 7:06pm
I haven't yet, but i have the intention of creating an all-or-nothing weekly account with XAGUSD once I've passed my weekly target. I've analyzed set ups that could allow for 4 times my margin in mere hours with xagusd, which would loosely translated to quadrupling my excess profits. I'm generally pretty stern in my approach, but i feel like this would be fun to try, as I'd love to see 2 grand turn to 8 grand in a few hours
  • #18
  • Edited Jul 26, 2020 12:36am Jul 25, 2020 11:46pm | Edited Jul 26, 2020 12:36am
Quoting LDFX
{quote} There is no such thing as risk free.
Yes there is. It just depends on the context and/or how you look at it.

When you invest your hard earned/saved/inherited capital in markets (or even a business), that is 'real' risk. Once you have made enough profit that you can withdraw that capital, you are essentially 'risk free' of the original capital.

The profits are still 'earned' and still at risk, but a trader can be more relaxed emotionally because his earned money is out; he can now risk more and not be so tensed.

Kind of like if I win the lottery, and I invest that in markets, I am still risking it, but the psychological aspect is greatly reduced. Therefore 'risk free'.
Another obvious example is when a trade has SL at break-even. It is essentially a 'risk free' trade.

In all 3 cases, the trader is not too worried because the risk is almost non-existent.
------------------------------------------------------

P.S. - By the way, the apple example really is risk free. I got my original $4 back and now have 2 apples left..... yes I did pay for them but the money that I paid for them, I got it back somehow... so it does not matter if I cannot sell those 2 or if they rot or they get stolen. I might be sad for a bit but hey, at least I did not lose anything lol. Like I said, it depends how you look at it.

Risk free = Nothing to lose (primary meaning).
In other news: A ranger was trapped between a bull and a bear
  • #19
  • Jul 26, 2020 12:24am Jul 26, 2020 12:24am
where is the high risk strategy?
  • #20
  • Jul 26, 2020 12:30am Jul 26, 2020 12:30am
Quoting wealthpro
where is the high risk strategy?
He is not offering a strategy... that is why it is in the discussion section. He wants to discuss the pros and cons of high risk strategies.
In other news: A ranger was trapped between a bull and a bear
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