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Where can I learn more about Price Action like those in James16 charts? 9 replies

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james16 Chart Thread

  • #139,901
  • Dec 7, 2016 7:21am Dec 7, 2016 7:21am
here is another one, again i'll watch the boundaries for longs/shorts. At those pivotal areas often the market really can go either way so you want to see that tipping point through price bar analysis
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  • #139,902
  • Dec 7, 2016 10:04am Dec 7, 2016 10:04am
Hey Kevin, thought I'd drop you a message. I'm 22 and live in Northern Ireland, so not a very trader-friendly place, so it's great to see anything options related!

I'm just looking for a bit of advice/direction. I've decided that i'd like to keep learning the core j16 method on stock weeklies, which I've been demoing and having success with. Problem is, when I start trading it will most likely be a pretty small, 2-3k account. So I want to utilise the leverage options offer, this is where i'm a bit lost!

I can't afford the pf as of now, so I want to in the meantime keep getting better at reading price action, and then eventually use options to help me take those directional plays on stocks. I would focus on bull call, bear put spreads to take the pinbar trades with.

I don't feel comfortable learning everything about options by myself, as i'd rather some of the more complex styles to be coached to me as, to be honest, I don't understand a good chunk of options. So I really want to focus on how options can help me take j16 -style trades...to that end, what kind of spreads or option styles would you point towards?

I was thinking simple vertical spreads for the weekly chart trades. Another thought I had was that trading monthly chart signals (which, from what I have seen, tend to move 20+% in a couple of months) and simply going long calls or long puts, and gaining profits through the intrinsic value of the options.

Does this sound ok?

Any insight would be great, at your convenience of course!
James
  • #139,903
  • Dec 7, 2016 3:43pm Dec 7, 2016 3:43pm
Quoting Ir1sh
Hey Kevin, thought I'd drop you a message. I'm 22 and live in Northern Ireland, so not a very trader-friendly place, so it's great to see anything options related! I'm just looking for a bit of advice/direction. I've decided that i'd like to keep learning the core j16 method on stock weeklies, which I've been demoing and having success with. Problem is, when I start trading it will most likely be a pretty small, 2-3k account. So I want to utilise the leverage options offer, this is where i'm a bit lost! I can't afford the pf as of now, so I want...
oh to be 22 again lol

Keep doing what you are doing irish, demo, save up money, build your account slowly. Don't be in a rush and you will have a great chance at this. Just think about things in the long run, not the short term. It's hard to do that in trading

Keep it up too
Mike

ps i'll let kevin field the options questions that's not my area
  • #139,904
  • Dec 8, 2016 9:10am Dec 8, 2016 9:10am
Hey guys, I've been lurking around and hopefully, it was not by coincidence that I found you guys.
I have read the first page, followed some of the links that were posted and I ended up agreeing with was being said overall.

All the dumb mistakes that should not be done, I have done it in the past month. I have been attempting to trade for the last three months and yes, there is so much to learn, so much to experience, but it should not be an harsh experience, I should not have started with a live account.

I wish to restart from zero. Learn the basics and grow in all aspects.

I have visited the website but I still feel like it is too soon to jump on the bandwagon without having a slight taste of it first. However, I wish to firstly expose myself and accept that I have commited mistakes, and yes, I want to attain some advice first on how I should start. I have some knowledge about basic terminology's, support and resistance, I know nothing of indicators, probably just the MA - I understand the concept behind risk management but failed totally in applying it - so emotionally I am weak, and it happens that I'm failing terribly at trading.

I wish to renew myself.

I wish to start from the bottom. Eventually if I happen to grow, I will dig even deeper, jump on the bandwagon and hopefully become a better version of myself and a successful trader.

I know it's not easy, I got the backlash from 'gambling' and now I want to become a real trader.

Sorry for all this mushy talk but if you could enlighten me, pass me some wisdom i'd be delighted.

Thank you very much.
  • #139,905
  • Dec 8, 2016 10:01am Dec 8, 2016 10:01am
Quoting Dsnow
Hey guys, I've been lurking around and hopefully, it was not by coincidence that I found you guys. I have read the first page, followed some of the links that were posted and I ended up agreeing with was being said overall. All the dumb mistakes that should not be done, I have done it in the past month. I have been attempting to trade for the last three months and yes, there is so much to learn, so much to experience, but it should not be an harsh experience, I should not have started with a live account. I wish to restart from zero. Learn the basics...
Hey DS

Welcome to the thread. We are glad to have you. My best advice is grab a demo account, start from page 1 and slowly start to build your knowledge. Don't worry about making mistakes, just learn, ask questions, rinse and repeat. Trading is NOT easy. It's a business of ups and downs. Good trades and bad trades. The best thing i've learned over the years is that it's just about trying to be consistent. This will help get you through the down times, and keep you from losing control and gambling it all away. The emotional side of trading is tied directly to that lack of consistency.

So starting from step 1 is a great place. Build your knowledge and confidence. Start to develop and test a consistent plan. I'm currently in my second largest drawdown on the year coming of my largest gains of the year. That's the topsy turvy world we live in! You get used to it and just keep trying to get better and better. Keep your expecations in check and just treat it like a marathon and you will be ok.

Keep at it!
Mike
  • #139,906
  • Dec 8, 2016 10:13am Dec 8, 2016 10:13am
Quoting mbqb11
{quote} oh to be 22 again lol Keep doing what you are doing irish, demo, save up money, build your account slowly. Don't be in a rush and you will have a great chance at this. Just think about things in the long run, not the short term. It's hard to do that in trading Keep it up too Mike ps i'll let kevin field the options questions that's not my area
Alright thank Mike and Kevin. Need to get back into the groove of demoing consistently . Currently short SCMP based on the weekly pin bar, and will check on friday to see if any equities are setting up
  • #139,907
  • Dec 8, 2016 12:33pm Dec 8, 2016 12:33pm
Quoting mbqb11
{quote} Hey DS Welcome to the thread. We are glad to have you. My best advice is grab a demo account, start from page 1 and slowly start to build your knowledge. Don't worry about making mistakes, just learn, ask questions, rinse and repeat. Trading is NOT easy. It's a business of ups and downs. Good trades and bad trades. The best thing i've learned over the years is that it's just about trying to be consistent. This will help get you through the down times, and keep you from losing control and gambling it all away. The emotional side of trading...
Thank you Mike. I shall be seeking your advice in the future.

I have always been warned regarding risk management,but even still, it was like I needed to experience the pain before realizing the true weight of that dumb decision.

It hurts but I really need to treat this seriously from now on. Even though I lost it is as if I'm still hooked. Weird.

Shall I start reading everything from page 1 up to the current one? I know I will probably get lost along the way and will have to inquire you alot but hopefully I'll get my foundation right.
  • #139,908
  • Dec 8, 2016 1:18pm Dec 8, 2016 1:18pm
Hi gang.

GBP/AUD D1 BEOB 2 day candle.

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'Fail to plan, plan to fail'
  • #139,909
  • Dec 8, 2016 2:41pm Dec 8, 2016 2:41pm
Quoting Dsnow
{quote} Thank you Mike. I shall be seeking your advice in the future. I have always been warned regarding risk management,but even still, it was like I needed to experience the pain before realizing the true weight of that dumb decision. It hurts but I really need to treat this seriously from now on. Even though I lost it is as if I'm still hooked. Weird. Shall I start reading everything from page 1 up to the current one? I know I will probably get lost along the way and will have to inquire you alot but hopefully I'll get my foundation right.
Yes it's all about risk in trading. That's the way I see it. We are taking educated guesses each time we trade. The idea is to exploit an idea that you see work over a long time. But each individual time once you hit buy or sell it's in the markets hand. The one thing we can always do is control our risk(all things considered).

I would start and try to read the first few hundred pages, then you can jump around a bit, we have free youtube videos and guest posts too to try to help you along the way

Good luck and keep us posted
Mike
  • #139,910
  • Dec 8, 2016 2:42pm Dec 8, 2016 2:42pm
Quoting Guitarbloke
Hi gang. GBP/AUD D1 BEOB 2 day candle. {image}
really well played GB, perfect entry point which is so key!

Mike
  • #139,911
  • Dec 9, 2016 7:20am Dec 9, 2016 7:20am
Hi Mike,
 
I'm so confused. Can I ask something?
 
1. Is it necessary to read all the post of this thread? I think matching low/top, Outside bar, pin bar and DBHLC/DBCLH is already on the early page. And its great. So what the thing that inside this 6000 pages???
 
2. If Outside bar is too big. Is it will be always failure?
 
3. Is this trade for price action? But James16 use indicators so much.
 
4. Are you James16? Is it same person double account?
 
5. What is touching trade?
 
6. If you are not James, how many years take you succes on trading?
 
7. Actually I learn indicator a lot. About statistics and probability. Is it usefull? Yeah I actually have many tried. But fail just below 50% right or may be 25% right. Do you have try indcator and still use it till now?
 
 
Sorry, many questions. I feeling stupid, Mike. I look at James16's chart and feel like its easy. Outside bar everywhere. But I just demo it and yeah its just same like indicator.
 
I hope you don't mind to answer it.
And I really appreciate the answers.
RIP RTM
  • #139,912
  • Dec 9, 2016 7:49am Dec 9, 2016 7:49am
Quoting hendzwoter
Hi Mike, Â I'm so confused. Can I ask something? Â 1. Is it necessary to read all the post of this thread? I think matching low/top, Outside bar, pin bar and DBHLC/DBCLH is already on the early page. And its great. So what the thing that inside this 6000 pages??? Â 2. If Outside bar is too big. Is it will be always failure? Â 3. Is this trade for price action? But James16 use indicators so much. Â 4. Are you James16? Is it same person double account? Â 5. What is touching trade? Â 6. If you are not James, how many years take you succes on...
Hey Hendzwoter

I don't mind the questions at all

1. No it's not neccessary. It's a huge unorganized thread. it started as a small place for a few to hang out. But of course after a decade you have had a ton of posts. Nothing wrong with jumping around to the ones that draw your attention

2. No outside bars do not guarantee ANYTHING. By themselves they are largely a 50/50 shot. What makes them powerful is WHERE they are located. Do not just buy/sell an outside bar because of the bar. Combine it with location and a STORY.

3. You can use indicators if you like to help support you. I persoanlly don't use any. Just some trendliens, and horizontal lines. Others like to combine PA with bollinger bands, or MAs. Again just to help build out a story

4. I am not James He is from Texas , I am from NY. We are two very different people

5. Touch trade means to buy/sell without price bar confirmation. Example you see price approaching a major area, you just flat buy without waiting for say a pinbar/outside bar etc. It's a very useful practice in the right situation

6. I've been trading for about 15 years now, it took me about 4-5 years to start to see upwards movement in my equity curve. It took even more than that to understand better everything I was doing. I thought I had a good grasp on certain things but in hindsight I was still very much learning. I think the learning never stops. Even the last few years I feel like I am a better more well rounded trader. The learning curve is different for everyone though

7. I don't use indicators but there is NOTHING wrong with them if you have tested and found use for something. Anything anyone does in trading is about using a tool that they SHOULD have tested and understood the power of that tool. Price action is no different. I use my discretion combined with years of experience to understand the situation and nuances of the situation. Nothing more. There is no secret to trading just experience. I wrote an article on this too

https://www.james16group.us/wp/secret-to-trading


Hope that helps a bit. At the end of the day, use and do what works best for YOU. Test the heck out of stuff. Practice, backtest, demo, and continuously evaluate yourself as a trader. That's all we can do. I like to focus on the nuances at this point. Best entry points for setups, proper dynamic R:R application, drawdown and impact on psychology etc. But many years ago my focus was broader and as I gained more experience it narrowed.

Wishing you success!
Mike
  • #139,913
  • Dec 9, 2016 8:40am Dec 9, 2016 8:40am
Greetings Mike!

I have indeed started reading the thread, but I still have a hard time figuring out some things.

1- Fib ret levels? When James posted the charts, I saw percentages, which btw, from what I understood the best entry point is usually at the 50%. I have no idea however how you come up with these numbers.

2- I have been using candlesticks so far. Do you believe I should change to what is being demonstrated by you guys? I feel like it's confusing now because I've been used to the candlesticks and can easily detect when a candle is closes low and negative or high and positive.

3 - Retracement I believe I know what it is. Yet when it is associated with the 'Fib', i am lost.

4 - After you detect a Pin bar or any of the other strategies, what is it exactly that can be used as confirmation?

5- From what I understood of the double bars, the stops ate at the low or the high of the bars and the entry point at the other end?

6 - Confluence? I'm not familiar with this.

I believe there are many dynamics going into it, it's not as simple as what I'm thinking, there clearly some different aspects that come into play such as major S/R points and what not... but I feel a bit lost with some new terminology's I've read about.
  • #139,914
  • Dec 9, 2016 1:26pm Dec 9, 2016 1:26pm
Quoting mbqb11
{quote} Hey Andson Welcome to the thread, glad to have you. Since we are trading Price Action we are looking for many different scenarios. For me they all stem off the same concepts though -A confluenced area or location -Solid Price Action trigger bar(or other trigger bar) -Proper Entry(entering at the correct location in relationship to that situation) -Proper risk and trade mgmt that allows us to cut out small, and stay in the trade properly So this is going to come in many forms from playing sideways markets, to breakouts, to swing trades etc....

so here is how I handled this pair. I waited for the false breakout. We had a close back inside the wedge after a pop higher. Again I was looking for shorts ONLY because of the divergence.

These were from my charts on the james16group.com site

I actually initially entered and closed out for a small loss quick. We didn't get what I call localization to the TL. So price retreated higher then I'd like. To be safe I waited a bit more. I re-entered once price was more clearly holding. So you can see the first trade closed out. I initiated the second trade with a tighter stop loss because at that point price should NOT need to reverse past that high.

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I've closed out before the weekend. I think it's still great to now watch for breakouts shorts, or once again false breakouts.

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Wishing you all a great weekend!
Mike
  • #139,915
  • Dec 9, 2016 9:04pm Dec 9, 2016 9:04pm
Ok Mike,
It's couraging me a lot. May be blown another demo account again. LOL.
RIP RTM
  • #139,916
  • Dec 10, 2016 7:22am Dec 10, 2016 7:22am
I shorted SCMP based on the pin bar with space , though I'm closing it out due to a bullish bar , does this seem like a good reason to close out ?
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  • #139,917
  • Dec 10, 2016 8:11am Dec 10, 2016 8:11am
Quoting Dsnow
Greetings Mike! I have indeed started reading the thread, but I still have a hard time figuring out some things. 1- Fib ret levels? When James posted the charts, I saw percentages, which btw, from what I understood the best entry point is usually at the 50%. I have no idea however how you come up with these numbers. 2- I have been using candlesticks so far. Do you believe I should change to what is being demonstrated by you guys? I feel like it's confusing now because I've been used to the candlesticks and can easily detect when a candle is closes...

Hey DS

My answers below

1. The fib % are just the % amount of a retrace of the move you are marking. So when you draw a fib form say high to low this number represents how far % wise price has retraced. IE a 50% retrace means price has recouped 50% of the move down. Many like the 50% but it's importance again really has to do with confluence or what else is around vs just being a 50% retrace. A lot of people say markets love 50% and higher retrace areas before the next move, but I always say it depends before blindly buying/selling.

2. I use candles too. I used to use bars. They both tell the same information assuming you are using an OHLC bar/candle which most are. Use whatever you are most comfortable with.

3. A retracement with a fib is as per your first question. IN terms of a bar we can sell/buy a retrace back to the more critical area. So often you will see someone sell when a price bar shows up but often times it makes more sense to sell say a retrace of this bar to the critical confluenced area. It helps pinpoint your entry better and is smarter. Here is an example

We have a HUGE beob, but it closes in no mans land. The critical area was much higher up at 1.55 where price put in two major swing points(circled in green). So selling a retrace back to that area of the BEOB makes a lot more sense. It's gonna really help with managing trades better and cutting out of bad trades too(which happen all the time)

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Here is more information on this nuance in this blog post
https://www.james16group.us/wp/pract...-forex-traders

4. See question 3. Again we want to look for confluence about WHY that pinbar is there and WHY price should continue to move in the direction of the pinbar. This is your story. IE is it a false breakout of a resistance area, the pin closes back under the box area. Then where should we sell? Near the previous box high as per question 3. So we could take a retracement back to the box high. Here is an example of that.
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5. Stops generally start for most people above/below the bar we are using> Ie a BUOB stop goes below the low of the buob. Entry points can vary. You can have entries on the break of the bar(in a case of the buob above the bar), entries on the open of the next bar(much like my nzd/cad trade) or entries on a retrace(like question 3 eur/cad)

6. Confluence in the basic form means a grouping of reasons. So you have multiple reasons why an area on a chart is important. This can be a LOT of things. It's not a check list. It can be a strong resistance area that lines up with a major round number. It can be a breakout pattern that lines up with a PPZ etc. The idea is too just bring in reasons my an area is critical, or a bar makes sense to trade in a certain spot. There are tons and tons of scenarios that can great this. This is part of the discretion and experience that more screen time will help you see

Hope this helps and enjoy the weekend, off for some brunch!
Mike
  • #139,918
  • Edited 8:48am Dec 10, 2016 8:27am | Edited 8:48am
Quoting Ir1sh
I shorted SCMP based on the pin bar with space , though I'm closing it out due to a bullish bar , does this seem like a good reason to close out ? {image} {image}
ÂÂ
IMHO, I'm still newbie here.
So that is a breakout after chanelling upward. Usually it come back to level that breakout already happen (on retrace). So, please go to daily chart (I think it's weekly chart) if you see false break (I think I see it) from the trend of the swing then its just a pullback and just hold it.
ÂÂ
Please do it with your own risk. (Don't blame me)
ÂÂ
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Oh ya, Mike.
How to get 30 pips SL? I think it must be touching trade. Or.... Is touching trade just daytrading that start to look on weekly/daily chart first then go to lower timeframe so we can get tighter SL?
RIP RTM
  • #139,919
  • Dec 10, 2016 2:04pm Dec 10, 2016 2:04pm
Quoting mbqb11
{quote} Hey DS My answers below 1. The fib % are just the % amount of a retrace of the move you are marking. So when you draw a fib form say high to low this number represents how far % wise price has retraced. IE a 50% retrace means price has recouped 50% of the move down. Many like the 50% but it's importance again really has to do with confluence or what else is around vs just being a 50% retrace. A lot of people say markets love 50% and higher retrace areas before the next move, but I always say it depends before blindly buying/selling. 2. I...
Thank you very much Mike, truly.

I've been having a little bit of trouble with the termiology's mostly. Terms that I can't exactly comprehend as I read each page from the beginning.

I think that eventually everything will click, some things I must learn first. I've been reading about pivot points and how they can me calculated along with the resistances and that somehow created a bit of confusion in my head. Which is why, I was a little troubled with the fib ret issue.

Eventually I will apply to become a member of the j16 group but before that happens, I will be patient and grab the basic concepts first.

And again. Thank you. I really appreciate it.
I do not know if financial success can truly be obtained from trading, whether it is a mirage or not, I will discover.

One thing I can say though is, I'm becoming addicted to the know how.
  • #139,920
  • Dec 11, 2016 9:56am Dec 11, 2016 9:56am
Almost a pin bar that formed on AKS, but check out the 'huge' ppz that#s been around nearly 20 years
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