How far is your Stop loss | Forex Factory

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How far is your Stop loss

  • #1
  • First Post: Aug 30, 2006 6:57pm Aug 30, 2006 6:57pm
Hello everyone.

I Made this thread which i assume has been made 1000's times already but why not make it 1001 : How far do you Put your stop loss? Do you put it 30 pips 50 pips? or go further and put it to 70 or 90 or even further? Tell us your stop loss and where you place it and why do you place it there?

Ill start off with i place my stop loss at Key Reversal points if its bull market im gona place it at Key Support point if its Bear market it im gona place it at key resistance point which can be as far as 125-200 pips sometimes more. I place it at special key points that market reachs when it Reverses from bull to bear or vice versa.

Tell us yours.
There are those who know, and there are those who don't know.
  • #2
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:15pm Aug 30, 2006 7:15pm
The perennial question!

Personally, I tend not to use them - but that isn't advice. The reason is the same as for trailing stops which aparsai was just talking about.

The currencies move in a fluid way according to the fractal patterns that you can see when you apply the Absolute Fibonacci Framework. They stick, turn and pause on or around these lines, and the lines are not equally spaced. Therefore, if you have a strict stop loss policy of a certain number of pips, you will get knocked out of lots of trades - often unnecessarily. And that's really annoying. If you know where the framework is, there's less of a worry around 'loss', since you expect them to retrace to certain points, and if they do, you feel better because that confirms wheich part of the framework they are on.

I sometimes use 'stop wins'. That is, once I am in a trade, if I don't want to watch it or I want to completely forget about the charts for a while and go and eat, sleep or whatever, I'll just put a stop somewhere that keeps me in profit should I have mis-read something.
The framework is there; we just have to work on our frame of mind.
  • #3
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:17pm Aug 30, 2006 7:17pm
I'm very much a day trader, and my account is very small, so I aim to be a sniper pretty much on my entrys, ie I jump in on the existing Short Term Direction, using a set of SMA based rules, so I run a 15-17pip stop ( 5 of this is generally the spread )


Most of the time, I can see when it's going to turn against me and get out for less.

Some stupid times, I keep moving my stop away like today, if my stops going to hit guarantee it'll keep moving and take it out even if I move it 30pips, as it keeps proving MUST NOT MOVE MY STOP, must exit and flip direction though.

and thats GBP 15pips bagged was fearing bust, got lucky for once LOL
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #4
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:26pm Aug 30, 2006 7:26pm
Quoting Turveyd
I'm very much a day trader, and my account is very small, so I aim to be a sniper pretty much on my entrys, ie I jump in on the existing Short Term Direction, using a set of SMA based rules, so I run a 15-17pip stop ( 5 of this is generally the spread )


Most of the time, I can see when it's going to turn against me and get out for less.

Some stupid times, I keep moving my stop away like today, if my stops going to hit guarantee it'll keep moving and take it out even if I move it 30pips, as it keeps proving MUST NOT MOVE MY STOP, must exit and flip direction though.

and thats GBP 15pips bagged was fearing bust, got lucky for once LOL
Oh Man Turveyd, don't move them stops. you are never smarter during a trade than you were before it. Take the hit and evaluate the loss later. Wait until you are seeing the market clearer and make it back. I have been down that road and experience has been bought and paid for.
Profit is where readiness meets Opportunity
  • #5
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:27pm Aug 30, 2006 7:27pm
Quoting niceguy777
The perennial question!

Personally, I tend not to use them - but that isn't advice. The reason is the same as for trailing stops which aparsai was just talking about.

The currencies move in a fluid way according to the fractal patterns that you can see when you apply the Absolute Fibonacci Framework. They stick, turn and pause on or around these lines, and the lines are not equally spaced. Therefore, if you have a strict stop loss policy of a certain number of pips, you will get knocked out of lots of trades - often unnecessarily. And that's really annoying. If you know where the framework is, there's less of a worry around 'loss', since you expect them to retrace to certain points, and if they do, you feel better because that confirms wheich part of the framework they are on.

I sometimes use 'stop wins'. That is, once I am in a trade, if I don't want to watch it or I want to completely forget about the charts for a while and go and eat, sleep or whatever, I'll just put a stop somewhere that keeps me in profit should I have mis-read something.

your doing what i used to do while i was learning. But question is...You didnt put stop loss you come back you see that due to "something happening" you are down 150 now....Do you sit and wait for it to retrace or pick a stop??
There are those who know, and there are those who don't know.
  • #6
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:29pm Aug 30, 2006 7:29pm
Toying with the idea, at leaving it at the default which for FXCM and GBP is 10pips ( also the Min )

To be honest, I don't see me being stopped out more, as I rarely see a -10pips that doesn't stop me out at 15 - 17 anyways.

But I'm also paying $10 for what is effectively 5pips of movement, rather than 15, 50% more for twice the movement.


hmmmm compromise at 12 - 13 I think, less emotional when stops hit there, the 26 today and 40 the other day ruin my emotional state and waste, and leave me on the wrong side of a move way to long.

Thanks, for making me think about this in detail, tis my current bad area.


MUST NOT MOVE STOP AWAY, MUST NOT MOVE STOP AWAY, MUST ALSO NOT JUMP BACK ON THE SAME TRADE DIRECTION WITHOUT RE THINKING THE TRADE, GOING OPPOSITE DIRECTION HISTORICALLY HAS BETTER ODDS!!


Thanks

Dyl
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #7
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:35pm Aug 30, 2006 7:35pm
Turveyd, being sniper trader. Is you Reward greater then your risk in other words are you makeing more then you are loseing because lets say you enter the EUR/USD on up trend but due to noise it first went down hit your stop and then went back up again, at the end of the day is your win's greater then your loss's?
There are those who know, and there are those who don't know.
  • #8
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:36pm Aug 30, 2006 7:36pm
FXoppurtunist, ohhhh yeah being paying for it the last 2 or 3 weeks, 1/2'd the account due to slip back into old ways sadly I'd quadrupled it in the 2 or 3 weeks weeks before this.

Back to $1 per point here, until I get it sorted

Strangely, every time I decide no can't take any more and don't move the stop, thats the one that woulda saved the trade and generally the market moves back.

Niceguy 777's system is okay, not as stupid as you'd think, BUT you need to be able to handle serious draw downs at times, and need to be very good at picking a longer term direction to make this profitable. Remember for any random event which can cause the market to move seriously against you, 1 should enable the market to move in your direction, so Excellent days and Really Bad days, should cancel each other out in theory, it's just against general thinking, but thats likely a good thing.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #9
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:45pm Aug 30, 2006 7:45pm
Turveyd, Hang in there if you stay long enogh eventually you will find a system that works for you. If forex was easy then no one would have to work any more!
There are those who know, and there are those who don't know.
  • #10
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:47pm Aug 30, 2006 7:47pm
Palabara,

tough question, I'm generally pretty good at picking the entrys ( having a bad time recently, over tired LOL )

Over the last 131 trades, I've got 59% winning Trades ( got some stupid trades in there to be fair, still learning as is everyone )

I worked out a few days ago ( it's not as good now due to going stupid LOL ) my average profit was 12pips, my average loss was 9 pips.

I'm trying to work on holding longer in some cases, want the 12, 20+ really, and my win ratio nearer 70%.


Got to have targets, but I'm trying too hard recently, which has tired and stressed me out, hence my bad trades, but I'm learning from them, losses or not so is worth it, kinda.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #11
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:51pm Aug 30, 2006 7:51pm
Palabara, don't worry got the system, it makes demo accounts Sing LOL, sadly with real money Fear and Greed take over, so it's the implementation of the system of the system that I'm struggling with.

Just got to keep hammering it, until it's 2nd nature.

131 trades since I last funded the account, and still up 100% on my addition, the previous £100 lasted 31 trades, the early days was errr 17 trades LOL


So getting there.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #12
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:55pm Aug 30, 2006 7:55pm
Quoting Turveyd
Palabara, don't worry got the system, it makes demo accounts Sing LOL, sadly with real money Fear and Greed take over, so it's the implementation of the system of the system that I'm struggling with.

Just got to keep hammering it, until it's 2nd nature.

131 trades since I last funded the account, and still up 100% on my addition, the previous £100 lasted 31 trades, the early days was errr 17 trades LOL


So getting there.

Lol, Yes Displine is something that isnt easy but after years of takeing hits you at the end just will lose all feelings kinda like falling in love first you fall in love and you got all those feelings 10 years later you think what the hell did i see in her 10 years ago lol and you just have no more feelings same with forex : Displine comes with age.
There are those who know, and there are those who don't know.
  • #13
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:56pm Aug 30, 2006 7:56pm
Quoting Turveyd
...so Excellent days and Really Bad days, should cancel each other out in theory, it's just against general thinking, but thats likely a good thing.
Too bad that the really bad days just so happen to sledgehammer your account into oblivion just because you didn't use a stop loss, which is so simple that I can't fathom why someone would not use them.

There are strategies that don't employ stop losses, but they are mostly automated ones with very quick (1-3 minutes timeframes) entries and exits and a high amount of trades a day, but even then, they are far and few between.

I know why Lewis doesn't use them, and that's because he's "freed his mind" to totally trust his system. I've bought the book, attended the webinar, and yes, I even use his framework. But trading it without a stop loss? No freakin' way.
Mr. Trend
  • #14
  • Aug 30, 2006 7:59pm Aug 30, 2006 7:59pm
Stopping moving my stops is the Key error and accounts for eccckkkss vague calc ( some trades where saved from stop moving I'm sure but... ) 139pips is what this error adds upto in the last 2 - 3 weeks.

To be honest, there aren't many saves, not 139pips worth by any means.

account for 80% of my losses the last 2 - 3 weeks.


thats a wake up call hey.


How do I hack the FXCM software make the stop default to 13 and make it unchangeable LOL
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #15
  • Aug 30, 2006 8:02pm Aug 30, 2006 8:02pm
Palabara, yep fighting the addiction to trade, losing the fear the weird adreneline rush which I can only compare to a first date, but get it every trade, well used to, less so these days.


It's also easier to trade when the account is heading up, when it's in a downward spiral it can get outta hand, since going to $1 per point I made 5trades and no losses, proves I can't handle $2 hey.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #16
  • Aug 30, 2006 8:06pm Aug 30, 2006 8:06pm
Mr Trend, yes and no, as long as he trades his lots sensibly so a 200 point move against him doesn't bother him too much, then in theory ( haven't tried it ), it's not as bad as it seems, I do see the advantages.


As long as he also holds for 200+ wins, if he guns for 30 then he's in trouble.

As long as he keeps a vague eye on the markets I'm sure he can avoid too many stupid losers.


I'd still personally have a 200pip stop incase your in a car crash say, wake up in 3months time and find your skint LOL
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #17
  • Aug 30, 2006 8:13pm Aug 30, 2006 8:13pm
Quoting palabara
your doing what i used to do while i was learning. But question is...You didnt put stop loss you come back you see that due to "something happening" you are down 150 now....Do you sit and wait for it to retrace or pick a stop??
The thing is, if you are checking your charts correctly, using the framework, it doesn't let you down, so, once you have got the hang of it, there are no more freak outs like that!

The framework is there; we just have to work on our frame of mind.
  • #18
  • Aug 30, 2006 8:16pm Aug 30, 2006 8:16pm
Quoting Turveyd
Niceguy 777's system is okay, not as stupid as you'd think, BUT you need to be able to handle serious draw downs at times, and need to be very good at picking a longer term direction to make this profitable.
Er...., thanks for the massive vote of confidence!

When I was learning this technique, there were a few fairly big drawdowns, but as you get to know it, there aren't. I put it down to me not having my head in the right place when I have been trading.
The framework is there; we just have to work on our frame of mind.
  • #19
  • Aug 30, 2006 8:18pm Aug 30, 2006 8:18pm
Quoting Mr Trend
I know why Lewis doesn't use them, and that's because he's "freed his mind" to totally trust his system. I've bought the book, attended the webinar, and yes, I even use his framework. But trading it without a stop loss? No freakin' way.
Hi Mr Trend. So, what's the answer then?

It's what we all avoid most, isn't it?
The framework is there; we just have to work on our frame of mind.
  • #20
  • Aug 30, 2006 8:22pm Aug 30, 2006 8:22pm
Niceguy, was toying with no stop systems for a EA recently, had better results than none stop based systems, win %%%% Ratio climbs to 90%+ easily doing this, but the computers inability to actually think or me to program it with smart enough rules, meant the losers wiped out any profits quickly.

But with a better plan/brain, I do see the logic.


plus the big players are the ones that teach us to use stops, and lets face it most of the stuff they teach us is actually done cause it's in there favour, and they want to take our money, infact without they'd just be passing it around each other and would never make, they need our money, sadly.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
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