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"Ratios & Harmonics: a Different Way to Trade." Summary 37 replies

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Ratios & Harmonics: a Different Way to Trade

  • #20,401
  • Aug 31, 2016 4:40am Aug 31, 2016 4:40am
This my first trade and I am posting this here just entered when price retraced back to Fibonacci level 61.8 and closed just above that level stop is just under 76.4 fib. And I am expecting a new structure high. Please comment and guide me through if I am right/wrong.

Thanks
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MRMALIK1
  • #20,402
  • Aug 31, 2016 9:07am Aug 31, 2016 9:07am
YM

This is looking like another 'no trade' day.
  • #20,403
  • Aug 31, 2016 11:29am Aug 31, 2016 11:29am
Quoting mrmalik1
This my first trade and I am posting this here just entered when price retraced back to Fibonacci level 61.8 and closed just above that level stop is just under 76.4 fib. And I am expecting a new structure high. Please comment and guide me through if I am right/wrong. Thanks {image}
I had the same trade, but if your trade is based just on 61 fib, that is not good enough
Even though I walk through the darkest valley, I will fear no evil
  • #20,404
  • Aug 31, 2016 1:06pm Aug 31, 2016 1:06pm
Quoting jmezz
{quote} On the YM chart that pullback was just barely a 382. Even though I've taken 382's in the past, I want to think that I would have avoided this setup because 382's rarely work out for me. But if I was going by your price action then I may have tried the short. As you pointed out, there was definite strength in the leg down. And when you compare the angles of the corrective legs you can see that strength was less than the main leg, especially with the 2nd leg losing momentum into the resistance. IMO that was a really good supply zone to draw...

Thank you for your feed back. Its greatly appreciated. Now that you mention it the 38.6 doesn't seem like a great reason to enter even if expected (which it wasn't) I think I'm going to start documenting the PB length and see which levels maximize profit and win ratios. It seems the opposite is true as well with deep PB, it seem less likely to produce a nsl. analyzing which areas are most beneficial seems........ beneficial. lol! In which case I would like to know the stats anyway.

"IMO that was a really good supply zone to draw as it tested from above and beneath."

Thank you. I've been doing a lot of studying on how to properly identify zones and measure them. I'm still not doing it correctly but it seems everybody has there take on this and there method on which candles to use as barriers. I think this is important, since I believe price travels from zone to zone in its on going guest to find the equilibrium price at that point in time while new information comes to light.

Here was a mistake but it never really mattered anyway.....
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Anyway. I agree with your assessment of my trade and I never really thought about the green line that you put in till you mentioned it. I don't know why it never occurred to me but that was a key piece. thank you for pointing it out.
  • #20,405
  • Edited 3:44pm Aug 31, 2016 3:32pm | Edited 3:44pm
Back from holidays, could catch yesterday +10 on YM.

Today, I intended to trade the retracement. For this I placed a pending order on the previous NSL level. I expected a deep retracement.
However, since it took too long to go down for my taste, I canceled the order. Moreover, when looking at 15min chart, I was not anymore confident that price will rotate (increase of momentum). This would have worked out and would have brought 30 pips.
Hence, the move happened without me. S..t happens.
  • #20,406
  • Edited 4:27am Sep 1, 2016 4:11am | Edited 4:27am
Testing new broker, really like gaps. Price failed to make NSH, Complex correction, and price heading down to close window!

After accelerating on the down side and completed 1 to 1 move, we expect correction, where correction will go, to close those two windows.

Now I expect price to drop, testing lows, as it made 61 retracemet to whole move down, and close window, which is open at the bottom

I understand that it is not the MR. Pip method, my apologies for that.
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Even though I walk through the darkest valley, I will fear no evil
  • #20,407
  • Sep 1, 2016 4:28am Sep 1, 2016 4:28am
Quoting monocor
Testing new broker, really like gaps. Price failed to make NSH, Complex correction, and price heading down to close window! After accelerating on the down side and completed 1 to 1 move, we expect correction, where correction will go, to close those two windows. Now I expect price to drop, testing lows, as it made 61 retracemet to whole move down, and close window, which is open at the bottom I understand that it is not the MR. Pip method, my apologies for that. {image}
Target riched
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Even though I walk through the darkest valley, I will fear no evil
  • #20,408
  • Sep 1, 2016 4:43am Sep 1, 2016 4:43am
Quoting monocor
Testing new broker, really like gaps. Price failed to make NSH, Complex correction, and price heading down to close window! After accelerating on the down side and completed 1 to 1 move, we expect correction, where correction will go, to close those two windows. Now I expect price to drop, testing lows, as it made 61 retracemet to whole move down, and close window, which is open at the bottom I understand that it is not the MR. Pip method, my apologies for that. {image}
Clear, concise, logical and straight to the point.

Now continue and take the same approach with every entry.

Post up at least 1 or 2 entries (no need to post a million charts) that you plan to take in advance of the fact.

This will cement your ideas and give you confidence moving forward.

The thinking process only needs to be as comprehensive as is necessary to make a good entry.

Good work!

Masterrmind............
Master your Mind then Master your Trades
  • #20,409
  • Sep 1, 2016 5:45am Sep 1, 2016 5:45am
Quoting Masterrmind
{quote} Clear, concise, logical and straight to the point. Now continue and take the same approach with every entry. Post up at least 1 or 2 entries (no need to post a million charts) that you plan to take in advance of the fact. This will cement your ideas and give you confidence moving forward. The thinking process only needs to be as comprehensive as is necessary to make a good entry. Good work! Masterrmind............
I have traded, but I posted it in another thread. I don't post here, because it is not clearly Mr.Pips method of trading
Even though I walk through the darkest valley, I will fear no evil
  • #20,410
  • Sep 2, 2016 11:30am Sep 2, 2016 11:30am
YM -10, +45 = +35 total

Notes on chart.
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  • #20,411
  • Sep 2, 2016 1:49pm Sep 2, 2016 1:49pm
Quoting jmezz
YM -10, +45 = +35 total Notes on chart. {image}
Nice move to reengage. It looks like your getting better or more confident in that part.

I only had 1 trade on Demo today. Break Even. Explained in Chart

US30 -89T
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  • #20,412
  • Sep 2, 2016 4:01pm Sep 2, 2016 4:01pm
Quoting jmezz
YM -10, +45 = +35 total Notes on chart. {image}

Fantastic trade in that you were able to read the action and react accordingly. Flipping like this is not easy but the right thing to do IMO to master this beast. Overall, i really like your analysis considering you just use a bar per bar methodology, i am impressed. Have a nice weekend.
  • #20,413
  • Sep 3, 2016 10:15am Sep 3, 2016 10:15am
Quoting Mack2013
{quote} Nice move to reengage. It looks like your getting better or more confident in that part. I only had 1 trade on Demo today. Break Even. Explained in Chart US30 -89T {image}
Thanks man.

While I don't feel too bad about that first trade not working out, had I waited until price hit the 618 then I would not have had a loss yesterday. I know that I'm most comfortable when a trade hits the 618 and I try to only take trades around that area but sometimes it's difficult to keep to that routine. Sometimes a trade setup looks like such a good idea however it's at the 382 or the 50 (like yesterday haha). I'll follow price action and see huge moves occur at 382 or 50 but then I'll go to try them and they backfire on me lol. 618's also fail but I feel they have the greatest likelihood of working out. So ultimately just another scenario telling me to keep to 618's haha.

Here is a little bit more reasoning for my trades yesterday.

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It sucks that I'm not able to bring up a chart of the US30 as there are some minor differences, but me using YM shouldn't matter much as the price action between the two is still very similar. So what I'm noting on my chart should still be applicable to yours. Anyway, here are some of my thoughts.

Regarding your trade, I like what you did with the yellow diagonal trend line. Sometimes these trend lines work out so great and I'll notice them after the fact haha, it's tough to remember to do them during live action with everything else we watch for.

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Given our methodology I don't think anyone can fault you for attempting the trade (I give you much credit for attempting a 382 haha), immediate order flow was down after all and there was rejection at a confluence zone.

However, I think this was a trade which should have been taken with the mentality that it should have been managed aggressively. Here's why:

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Something that I've started doing is giving myself a larger move to b/e. Before, I was moving to b/e or b/e1 and was getting bummed out if price came back and stopped me out for +1. I felt it was a wasted trade and so because of this feeling, I would not let my trades run and I'd cut them early if I felt that they weren't going to work so I could sneak away with some profit. I was watching Damian's vids again (I think it was the trade management vid) where I picked up on him moving to b/e+5 and it clicked in my head. I can't tell you how many times I've heard him say that in a few of his vids but I never understood until just recently and it makes things so much better, because if a trade makes it to the test of structure and does end up failing then I feel much better about the trade not working when taking b/e+5 or +10. And what this does is improve my trades on a couple of different fronts because I'm more inclined to let them run vs closing out early and I'm also qualifying better setups as I'm not taking trades (or trying to anyway lol) which don't give me room to move to that b/e5.

I honestly feel bad for people that come into this thread, read some of the info, watch Damian's videos, put the info into practice for a little bit then bail on the method because they're not seeing the results they want. Over the past 6 months I have watched his videos to an exhausting point and then continued to watch them. I still continue to pick up new information and new ideas from them. The videos are not meant to pick up the entire method in a couple of hours. IMO it's best to watch them then experiment with the market, and then watch them some more to pick up new information that you may have 'heard' before but didn't 'understand' until now.

Anyway, my reason for mentioning this now is that even though you came away with a couple of points it looks like you had room to lock in a little more profit once price created that NSL. Have you tried doing that? It may not be for you and that would be fine, but maybe something to look into.

So to sum up, this is all just my after-the-fact analysis. As always, it's much more difficult to decipher during the live market but just wanted to lend some input to help out. I think the analysis was there for the short and ultimately it did work out as the NSL was created and you came away with some points .
  • #20,414
  • Sep 3, 2016 10:22am Sep 3, 2016 10:22am
Quoting crixus
{quote} Fantastic trade in that you were able to read the action and react accordingly. Flipping like this is not easy but the right thing to do IMO to master this beast. Overall, i really like your analysis considering you just use a bar per bar methodology, i am impressed. Have a nice weekend.
Thank you crixus.

When I see a possible setup forming, I have been trying to pay much more attention to every individual bar that forms. This was very difficult to do when I was using the 162 tick chart however is a little bit more simple now that I'm back to using the 233.

I am seeing some benefit to doing this but I've really only just begun doing this so still more research required.

Thank you for the kind words and I hope you are having some great trading and also have a great weekend!
  • #20,415
  • Sep 3, 2016 1:25pm Sep 3, 2016 1:25pm
Quoting jmezz
{quote} Thanks man. While I don't feel too bad about that first trade not working out, had I waited until price hit the 618 then I would not have had a loss yesterday. I know that I'm most comfortable when a trade hits the 618 and I try to only take trades around that area but sometimes it's difficult to keep to that routine. Sometimes a trade setup looks like such a good idea however it's at the 382 or the 50 (like yesterday haha). I'll follow price action and see huge moves occur at 382 or 50 but then I'll go to try them and they backfire on me...
Wow. Thanks for your input. Its great to see another perspective and quit frankly I'm learning a lot.

I too have watched all the videos multiple times but just recently started going through them again. A lot because I felt like I was drifting away from the core concepts. I think your right about the +5. At one point I was up +30 and watch price come back to stop me out. I wasn't dissapointed. When I started the day my expectations had me in the middle of a corrective swing with the expectations of going a bit deeper but as price printed I noticed that I was late in the move.

I read some where that 2 of the biggest mistakes traders make are getting in too late into the move and entering into or just before Demand / Supply. Something I'm just trying to be aware of.

You were also right about the structure area you highlighted. I haven't been consistent in labeling my supply and demand area. It seems like such an easy concept, I'm not sure why I'm struggling with it. The far high/lows are easy its the middle thats complicated; where and trying to analyze which has the highest probability of holding.

Anyway, I added your comments to my journal for frequent review
  • #20,416
  • Sep 6, 2016 9:10am Sep 6, 2016 9:10am
YM +29

Notes on chart

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  • #20,417
  • Sep 6, 2016 9:36am Sep 6, 2016 9:36am
Quoting Mack2013
{quote} Wow. Thanks for your input. Its great to see another perspective and quit frankly I'm learning a lot. I too have watched all the videos multiple times but just recently started going through them again. A lot because I felt like I was drifting away from the core concepts. I think your right about the +5. At one point I was up +30 and watch price come back to stop me out. I wasn't dissapointed. When I started the day my expectations had me in the middle of a corrective swing with the expectations of going a bit deeper but as price printed...
I hear you with the middle supply / demand zones. It's tough to know which of those zones to use and how to play a reaction off of them, whether you're in a trade already or not. I think anytime there's a strong move in one direction, then a pause, then a continuation strong move (especially if that continuation bar engulfs the pause bar) you can go ahead and qualify that as a strong zone. I know Seiden has some info about this setup and a few different others which I'm sure you've read. I've also read some good info about s/d zones in Rocky's thread here.
  • #20,418
  • Sep 6, 2016 1:27pm Sep 6, 2016 1:27pm
Quoting jmezz
YM +29 Notes on chart {image}
+3; Since I did not trade the nice down move, I wanted to get the counter move. However, price came more down as expected and hit my protected entry (at least no loss).

Nice trade Jmezz. I did not take yours, because I saw that red news where coming and I did not thought that it will reverse completely the move.
  • #20,419
  • Sep 6, 2016 3:16pm Sep 6, 2016 3:16pm
Quoting evocpr19
{quote} +3; Since I did not trade the nice down move, I wanted to get the counter move. However, price came more down as expected and hit my protected entry (at least no loss). Nice trade Jmezz. I did not take yours, because I saw that red news where coming and I did not thought that it will reverse completely the move.
Glad you were able to come away with some points.

Where did you enter long?
  • #20,420
  • Sep 6, 2016 3:28pm Sep 6, 2016 3:28pm
Quoting jmezz
{quote} Glad you were able to come away with some points. Where did you enter long?
Since every chart is different, see attachment. This is supposed to represent a 89 tick chart (I use MT4 with an indicator; CFDs). Looks most similar to your 233 Tick. If I select 233, the chart looks completely different. This was also my prob today, since I played with different charts.
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