Challenge James16

I get you completely. However, if the consumer decides to do this, who are we to stand in their way?

Mike is held to a higher standard? Says who? Who is the arbiter of what standards are held? As a free market capitalist, I have to take issue with this.

Who are you to impose your morality on others, Winston? Do you honestly consider your own moral standard to be objectively true and universally binding?

I too embrace capitalism. However human nature (the greed factor) necessitates some regulation as much as I hate it sometimes. The FDA oversees the pharmaceutical industry too prevent the hawking of drugs that are either too dangerous or don't do what their manufactures say they do.

I said before, if you post a system in the "systems" section and invite others to join in because you think it worksyou really have little or no obligation to anyone. The standards are quite low. If you make claims that you are profitable with your system the standard increases. It is only logical that you should be able to answer questions about your claim. If you refuse then you are really just a blow hard and most will just write you off and move on. The standard increases when you make claims that you are profitable with your system and tell others they can be profitable too but you require payment to have full access. Then IMHO the standard is elevated and includes displaying documentation that the system as traded by yourself or others has a record of turning a profit. In fact I believe such claims should be continually verified so that consumers can make informed decisions.

It is only a matter of time before the FTC steps in to regulate or shut down scammers like J16 who make unsubstantiated claims and statements to entice individuals to fork over their dough. I am only one of many who have filed complaints with the FTC. Believe me they are listening. J16 and others like them are engaging in deceptive practices and taking millions from consumers. The consumer in this case is benefitting almost zero.

Dont you think if J16 and traders who have bought their product were really making significant profit that they would want to reveal that. I know I would. The fact is likely that few and perhaps no one is really profiting from J16 material. To me that's the same as a pharm company selling a drug that does absolutely nothing and raking in millions. Should we really just sit there and live completely by "buyer beware". I think not and I will not. I will continue attempts to make scammers like J16 and others responsible and accountable for taking millions for nothing in return.

It is not just "my morality" or "my moral standards". Many others agree with me and hold the same moral values.

"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."

I don't know enough about j16 to evaluate his system. But I view it like this, most trading books that I bought early in my career were absolute junk. I had to buy the book, try out the concepts, and reject them before I could say it is junk. Most things are junk. Most advertisements are over inflated if not absolutely false. I doubt that j16 is profitable for the reasons you state, but we cannot become a nanny state either.

Well Winston, you made me go back and look at j16. He is teaching price action, most of this stuff from what I can see can be had for free. It is very hard to be sympathetic to people who just shell out a lot of money and don't do their homework. While I do not condone commercial sites for trading very often, as I believe that they only way to learn FX is to fail fast until you are done making mistakes, I think the consumer has to bear some responsibility.

That said, being a watchdog has it's purpose and you do provide a valuable service to the community.

Under the Federal Trade Commission Act (link is external):

1. Advertising must be truthful and non-deceptive;
2. Advertisers must have evidence to back up their claims

On their first webpage they claim "For over 10 years the james16group has produced successful traders" Carefully worded for sure but is it truthful? What is successful? Is success being profitable? Do you think individuals who are paying or who have already paid have the expectation they will be profitable using the methods advertised on their website and on the public forum here at forex factory? Mike says he is just providing education. Is this deceptive or is their an underlying implied claim of profitability

Does James16 have evidence to back up any of their claims they have made expressly and implied?

How does the FTC determine if an ad is deceptive?
A typical inquiry follows these steps:

1. The FTC looks at the ad from the point of view of the "reasonable consumer" - the typical person looking at the ad. Rather than focusing on certain words, the FTC looks at the ad in context - words, phrases, and pictures - to determine what it conveys to consumers.
2. The FTC looks at both "express" and "implied" claims. An express claim is literally made in the ad. For example, "ABC Mouthwash prevents colds" is an express claim that the product will prevent colds. An implied claim is one made indirectly or by inference. "ABC Mouthwash kills the germs that cause colds" contains an implied claim that the product will prevent colds. Although the ad doesn't literally say that the product prevents colds, it would be reasonable for a consumer to conclude from the statement "kills the germs that cause colds" that the product will prevent colds. Under the law, advertisers must have proof to back up express and implied claims that consumers take from an ad.
3. The FTC looks at what the ad does not say - that is, if the failure to include information leaves consumers with a misimpression about the product. For example, if a company advertised a collection of books, the ad would be deceptive if it did not disclose that consumers actually would receive abridged versions of the books.
4. The FTC looks at whether the claim would be "material" - that is, important to a consumer's decision to buy or use the product. Examples of material claims are representations about a product's performance, features, safety, price, or effectiveness.
5. The FTC looks at whether the advertiser has sufficient evidence to support the claims in the ad. The law requires that advertisers have proof before the ad runs.

​Is James 16 expressly claiming or implying that if you pay for access to the products they advertise that you will be profitable? Are they backing up these claims? Is that the expectation of those paying membership fees?

The FTC wants to know.

It is with absolute certainty that I agree that if you want to sell something, PROVE it works as advertised. To me this means provide a real money TE that you leave up on a permanent basis for people to analyze PRIOR to spending their money. I for instance may choose to open one of these sites in the future for trend following. I would not expect someone to pay me money unless I had a TE that was profitable, period. I would even go so far as to say that if I were running one of these sites, I should put 50% of subscription fees into a trading account that is being monitored by MyFXbook or a live TE at the very least and most likely I would choose to have the performance results audited by a CPA firm for verification. How refreshing would that be for a change??

I personally have spent money to join 3 of these sites for one month in order to see what was being offered. There was a lot of material in them, but no concrete plan on how to advance as a trader and become profitable. Lots and Lots of technical PA and indicators and things, but I did not see the answer to one BIG question. How do I turn all of this advice into profitable trades month in and month out over a period of time.
Lastly, but the most important, where is the running total of real money trades taken by the instructors and verified by 3rd party monitoring that prove the methods to be valid...NONE AVAILABLE ACROSS THE BOARD!!

There is one guy who is now conducting on site live "seminars" that run 1400 Euro for a seat!!!

This business is full of snake oil salesmen and they are very good at what they do which is sell you the dream without any proof the dream is achievable or even remotely possible using what they are selling.

Have to agree that I did request for his trading results but never got to see it. However, I did see traders under James 16 that has become good profitable trader.

Sad to say, if 1 day. James 16 show us a real account with profitable result as stated on website. I will personally say SORRY however till then

James 16 does have a strong group of followers that are biased