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"Ratios & Harmonics: a Different Way to Trade." Summary 37 replies

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Ratios & Harmonics: a Different Way to Trade

  • #17,801
  • Mar 3, 2016 10:08pm Mar 3, 2016 10:08pm
Quoting ujku80
{quote} I have, and I save all the images of the trades that I take there. with some brief comments. I'm afraid this thread has become sort of my trading journal too i hope you don't mind me posting trades live here.
Haha. Nice. I find your entries and management useful. I try and use them to pick up tidbits to help my own trading. If you can't do it yourself , steal it.

Quoting ujku80
{quote} I think you are right but...you're spot on. but it's not easy to do what you suggest though. I have to find a way to short-cut my emotion. After all I think of myself as a rational person... it shouldn't be that hard.. And yeah, I have placed a decent amount of money in my future account that allows me to trade 4 contracts at once, and that's what I'm doing...I'm trading 4 contracts at EU because I'm certain (have high win/loss ratio) and only one contract at YM cuz most of the time I loose there. but it definitely it is emotion...
I feel the same. certain pairs and vehicles react different. move differently during certain hours with different "personality" in Price action. Sort of hard to explain but like you said , you need to drive the thing to know its characteristics.
  • #17,802
  • Mar 3, 2016 10:12pm Mar 3, 2016 10:12pm
EURUSD - 15M

Kind of a bigger picture and a little more foreseeing then I like. Can't really make an expectation on the next swing when the current hasn't been establish but heres what I'm thinking.....

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  • #17,803
  • Mar 3, 2016 10:22pm Mar 3, 2016 10:22pm
Quoting Mr. Pip
{quote} I'm about to get stopped too
tough week. But maybe its just another lesson. How to deal with draw downs. Everybody sooner or later gets them. Like you stated in your live session. Your strategy has an positive expectancy, just because you had a few losing days doesn't mean you need to change your strategy. There is still 43 more weeks this year, plenty of time to go on a hot streak.
  • #17,804
  • Mar 3, 2016 10:27pm Mar 3, 2016 10:27pm
is there technical approach to determine patterns. i use zup indicators but now working anymore.please help with good harmonic indicator
  • #17,805
  • Mar 4, 2016 12:37am Mar 4, 2016 12:37am
Quoting camry
is there technical approach to determine patterns. i use zup indicators but now working anymore.please help with good harmonic indicator
We do not use indicators. We trade what we see in the chart (or at least try to)
  • #17,806
  • Mar 4, 2016 12:39am Mar 4, 2016 12:39am
Quoting evocpr19
{quote} We do not use indicators. We trade what we see in the chart (or at least try to)
im still not proficient if looking the patterns. i need first indicator to help me. when i be better like you guys maybe i can remove indicator. what do you suggest?
  • #17,807
  • Mar 4, 2016 2:38am Mar 4, 2016 2:38am
[quote=Mack2013;8792204]{quote} Haha. Nice. I find your entries and management useful. I try and use them to pick up tidbits to help my own trading. If you can't do it yourself , steal it. {quote}

OK Mack, thx for the nice comments. Here is what I'm looking at right now. I'm a bit busy and not going to trade until maybe 3pm my time (9Am Damian)...so let's see.
Now, the long term order flow has changed to the upside. Don't look for set-ups to go short. look only for longs. Maybe my chart could help you a bit.
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  • #17,808
  • Mar 4, 2016 2:41am Mar 4, 2016 2:41am
again, I'd rather wait for the completion of those violet lines as then we have a 38.2% retrace of the large swing from the start of the move. and that zone looks also stronger in terms of PA. see how many times price has to bounce to cross it, and then bounce off to establish it a good level. just my thought here.
  • #17,809
  • Mar 4, 2016 2:48am Mar 4, 2016 2:48am
Quoting Mack2013
{quote} tough week. But maybe its just another lesson. How to deal with draw downs. Everybody sooner or later gets them. Like you stated in your live session. Your strategy has an positive expectancy, just because you had a few losing days doesn't mean you need to change your strategy. There is still 43 more weeks this year, plenty of time to go on a hot streak.
it's funny cuz with after so many months trading live I'm still at break even. And the story is that what I win with EU i loose by trading YM (trading the same number of contracts on both pairs), and what I loose in YM, I recover in the next day in EU. Yesterday, for example YM trades were came at loss, but those wins in EU made me come with profit in total (4 lots in EU vs 1 in YM). So..i should probably refrain myself from trading YM. i don't know what else to think. But, i'm looking forward to a nice streak of wins on EU now. let's see if this is possible.
  • #17,810
  • Mar 4, 2016 2:53am Mar 4, 2016 2:53am
Quoting camry
{quote} im still not proficient if looking the patterns. i need first indicator to help me. when i be better like you guys maybe i can remove indicator. what do you suggest?
i suggest you remove all the indicators at once, and start training your eyes immediately, because this wonnt come in a day, or in week. it may take months. I had to read this thread from the first page and trade demo acc for like 6 months before i decided to go live. And before this, I've always used naked charts focusing only on pure price action. So, that previous experience has helped, but you will never come in this position if you don't start focusing on price itself, swing and candles and highs and lows etc etc. just start now.
  • #17,811
  • Mar 4, 2016 3:10am Mar 4, 2016 3:10am
Mr. Pip Question to the Trade management Trailing stop and which swing to use for the fibo.

My trade was taken on the retracement from the LH marked LH ( 2 ) in my attached chart. When I reached Fib ext 23.6) ( Not on chart ) I was drawing and fib retracement from LH (2 ) to the NSL as it proceeded and moved my SL to above the 38.2 fib trailing ) It survived the first retracement that I marked as LH ( 3 ) . and my trade continued to make NSL . After a while I saw that my trail was giving space 17 pips for the trailstop and i was moving my fib to LH ( 3 ) NSL and startet to trail from above the 38.2 for that new fib. Is that good way to do ? Or is it advised to use the fib from LH2 where I took my entry all the way ?

I tried to explain in my chart too that is attached.
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Trading in the shadow of SM
  • #17,812
  • Mar 4, 2016 4:06am Mar 4, 2016 4:06am
Quoting Earleone
Mr. Pip Question to the Trade management Trailing stop and which swing to use for the fibo. My trade was taken on the retracement from the LH marked LH ( 2 ) in my attached chart. When I reached Fib ext 23.6) ( Not on chart ) I was drawing and fib retracement from LH (2 ) to the NSL as it proceeded and moved my SL to above the 38.2 fib trailing ) It survived the first retracement that I marked as LH ( 3 ) . and my trade continued to make NSL . After a while I saw that my trail was giving space 17 pips for the trailstop and i was moving my fib to...
Hi Earleone, the trailing stop that Mr Pip uses is:

Retracement from LH (in your example) to the swing low (NSL in your example). The trailing stop is placed between the 50% and 32.8% retracement.

As the move continues downward, you move the retracement to the Lowest low, and move your stop accordingly.

If you look at what means, you catch the majority of the move... lets say you got in at 10% away from the top of the swing, and get taken out at the 45% retracement, you have captured nearly 50% of the entire move, whcih shoudl net you quite a lot of profit, bearing in mind that usually it will be risk free for most of the ride... It also allows you room for the trend to continue.

The Trailing stop only comes into force once you hit the 127 extension, so on the 5 min on the YM, that would already have been about 20 pips locked in. You move your stop to BE on the test of structure, and then when it hits 127% you start the trail.

It keeps you lots of room to search for those extended targets - however, this is only 1 trailing stop method, for instance, you could also have set TP levels and scale out of the position as each one is hit - at the 1.27%, at the 141 and the 161.8 extensions... You could have a step system, a set percentage (which the fib TS is) or fixed pip amount...

The point is it is up to you how you deal with profit takings, but, capturing half the move is pretty good, and goes along the old adage of letting your profits run and keeping your position open and giving it room to breathe. After all, if you have a position run to the 161.8% extension, it is considered overbought, but you would still be expecting a shallow pull back (to the 38.2% retracement, and no more) so this TS should keep you in the trade, when normally you would get out.
  • #17,813
  • Mar 4, 2016 4:24am Mar 4, 2016 4:24am
Greetings Traders,

I've been a silent follower of this thread since a couple of months. From this point - I'd like to thank Mr. Pip for all his generosity and efforts he has put into this thread. Thanks Damian.

I'm very familiar with the concepts you are introducing here - so it fits my way of looking at the markets, however the most phenomenal market behaviour can be observed with breakouts and false brakeouts. These happen all the time on any pair, any instrument. I believe combining orderflow expectations and awareness of false breakouts - equip trader with some extra edge.
I will not violate any rules concerning adding anything beyound this thread is about, but for your potential interest - below is the attached screen shot explicitly showing what's happening when market does not want to go higher or lower.

Have a nice weekend.

All the best,

MBJ
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  • #17,814
  • Mar 4, 2016 4:54am Mar 4, 2016 4:54am
Quoting rolandW
{quote} Hi Earleone, the trailing stop that Mr Pip uses is: Retracement from LH (in your example) to the swing low (NSL in your example). The trailing stop is placed between the 50% and 32.8% retracement..
Thank you rolandW. Most of what you say is clear to me . What i try to figure out is how I should do for extended TP goals . When new swings are formed. I guess it is just to start the trail process new again for the new LH - NSL if trying to reach extended tp target. Or keep the original one to give it more room to breath. But it becomes on the side since actually tp should be within reach for the first trail , and then it should be new entry after retracement so actually what I try to do is take first entry and let it run passing its TP target. So the answer gives itself then . Thank you.
Trading in the shadow of SM
  • #17,815
  • Mar 4, 2016 5:13am Mar 4, 2016 5:13am
ok traders, apparently I missed a noce move north. well, we don't chase price, so let's see to where is market retracing to.
i guess, like for every profession in this world, one has to dedicate time to this business
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  • #17,816
  • Mar 4, 2016 5:39am Mar 4, 2016 5:39am
Quoting ujku80
ok traders, apparently I missed a noce move north. well, we don't chase price, so let's see to where is market retracing to. i guess, like for every profession in this world, one has to dedicate time to this business {image}
Some great moves from EU, EJ and AU to the up side.... i fortunatly got all of them and i'm still in EU with profit locked.

This 3 trades erased 2 losses i had earlier and gave me good pips.

Asmodai
  • #17,817
  • Mar 4, 2016 6:16am Mar 4, 2016 6:16am
Quoting Asmodai
{quote} Some great moves from EU, EJ and AU to the up side.... i fortunatly got all of them and i'm still in EU with profit locked. This 3 trades erased 2 losses i had earlier and gave me good pips. Asmodai
Good job Asmodai.
Unfortunately, I'm busy at work and missing trade opportunities. That's why i was saying that, in order to be successful at trading you have to invest a certain amount of time every day in it.

But, from next week, I'm starting to work 50% in my job (i asked for a 50% job position and I just got that) and will be spending the rest of the time on the market, learning Damian's method and trying to be profitable in the same time. So, you could say that I'm officially a part-time trader now.

Let's hope that reduction of my monthly income from the job will be replaced by my profit in trading... fingered crossed. Well, after all this is a business which needs respect and that means that you either take it seriously by investing time and efforts in it or just look for other opportunities in life, right?!

cheers mate.
  • #17,818
  • Mar 4, 2016 6:28am Mar 4, 2016 6:28am
Well, I woke up this morning to the not very pleasant sight of a rather roomy stop loss on an overnight trade hit. It's okay. However, this combined with a couple other losses effectively wiped out my profitable trades of the week (I don't trade on Fridays) so I'm ending this week in a little bit of draw down too-- about -40pips from where I started.

I'd blame myself but in retrospect honestly I'm not sure if there's a lot I'd do differently. I'm not at all inclined to the blame the system (or even my application of it) since I can see that it works.

I will have to give more thought to what I'm doing with trade management and yet again rewatch some of Mr. Pip's videos over the weekend.

To better days!
  • #17,819
  • Mar 4, 2016 6:29am Mar 4, 2016 6:29am
Quoting ujku80
{quote} Good job Asmodai. Unfortunately, I'm busy at work and missing trade opportunities. That's why i was saying that, in order to be successful at trading you have to invest a certain amount of time every day in it. But, from next week, I'm starting to work 50% in my job (i asked for a 50% job position and I just got that) and will be spending the rest of the time on the market, learning Damian's method and trying to be profitable in the same time. So, you could say that I'm officially a part-time trader now. Let's hope that reduction...
Hey, congrats! Wishing all the best for you on this venture. Keep us posted as to how it goes!
  • #17,820
  • Mar 4, 2016 6:36am Mar 4, 2016 6:36am
Quoting beepbop2015
{quote} Hey, congrats! Wishing all the best for you on this venture. Keep us posted as to how it goes!
Thank You. Yes, I will keep you posted, and place my analysis here. I think this month it will be only E/U real trading and YM demo trading. let's see how it goes.
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