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How much do people make trading FOREX

  • #161
  • Edited 3:06am Aug 3, 2014 2:33am | Edited 3:06am
How much do people make trading (retail) FOREX?

Long term = 0 and probably in denial of a big lost to be written off and forgotten in order to settle in a real job.

Why must it be so, you ask?
The truth is always simple.

of the millions who have tried and are trying, no one ever comes forward and claim to be retail forex millionaires and having be so for years!...
not only on these forums (which is nothing) but in the whole world!

Understand the nature of the tree by the fruits that it gives.

Of course, I am not saying it's not possible to make a few pips here and there.
Easy come easy go...
  • #162
  • Edited 5:36am Aug 3, 2014 4:57am | Edited 5:36am
"How much do people make trading FOREX ?"

95% of the people make -100% gain within 3 months.Pretty impressive isn't it?

The other 5% could make from 10% to 10.000%/year, if done correctly.The 10.000% gain/year is only reserved to the most ambitious ,intelligent, and innovative traders, its possible but the chances to be you are very slim, its almost like winning the lottery.

An average winner professional could make about 200%/year if he puts itself to work, which is not really bad considering it exceeds the bank deposit rates returns, the S&P 500 yearly return and every bond market return, so its a good "investment", however the DD should be not more than 5-10% of the balance.
"There's a sucker born every minute" - P.T. Barnum
  • #163
  • May 27, 2015 1:03am May 27, 2015 1:03am
Quoting Proximus
"How much do people make trading FOREX ?" 95% of the people make -100% gain within 3 months.Pretty impressive isn't it? The other 5% could make from 10% to 10.000%/year, if done correctly.The 10.000% gain/year is only reserved to the most ambitious ,intelligent, and innovative traders, its possible but the chances to be you are very slim, its almost like winning the lottery. An average winner professional could make about 200%/year if he puts itself to work, which is not really bad considering it exceeds the bank deposit rates returns,...
excellent lol
DON'T TRADE THE DIRECTION, TRADE THE MOVE
  • #164
  • May 28, 2015 4:06am May 28, 2015 4:06am
Quoting Proximus
"How much do people make trading FOREX ?" 95% of the people make -100% gain within 3 months.Pretty impressive isn't it? The other 5% could make from 10% to 10.000%/year, if done correctly.The 10.000% gain/year is only reserved to the most ambitious ,intelligent, and innovative traders, its possible but the chances to be you are very slim, its almost like winning the lottery. An average winner professional could make about 200%/year if he puts itself to work, which is not really bad considering it exceeds the bank deposit rates returns,...
lol Proximus . Is this 95-5 theory from you that 95% of retail blast their accounts in 3 months (MAX) and 5% of retail double their accounts in 3 months..

Do you have some data from brokers to support that theory
Scoobi doobi doo
  • #165
  • May 28, 2015 9:17am May 28, 2015 9:17am
Quoting Scoobidoobi
{quote} lol Proximus . Is this 95-5 theory from you that 95% of retail blast their accounts in 3 months (MAX) and 5% of retail double their accounts in 3 months.. Do you have some data from brokers to support that theory
I also would love to know where those figures come from, they are repeated endlessly on this site and others but where do they come from?? I been seeing them from the first day I ventured into forex and I've Never seen anything to back them up. not once, not ever.
having said that I don't doubt a lot of people do burn their accounts.
I make decent returns from this game now, after some time learning and losing of course. other people I trade with consistently make decent returns as well.
follow a good solid (preferably simple) system with good money management and there's no reason why you won't make a return on it.
Don't ask me, I have no idea what's going on.
  • #166
  • May 28, 2015 9:33am May 28, 2015 9:33am
Quoting Gizzledonk
{quote} I also would love to know where those figures come from, they are repeated endlessly on this site and others but where do they come from?? I been seeing them from the first day I ventured into forex and I've Never seen anything to back them up. not once, not ever. having said that I don't doubt a lot of people do burn their accounts. I make decent returns from this game now, after some time learning and losing of course. other people I trade with consistently make decent returns as well. follow a good solid (preferably simple) system with...
Agreed mate!, Its the same forex media propaganda which lures retail investors into becoming rag2riches or overnight millionaires, also create the very same fear that only 5% out of the retail are successful I presume...
Scoobi doobi doo
  • #167
  • May 28, 2015 9:39am May 28, 2015 9:39am
I think I'd also be willing to bet (just a little bit) that the people that start winning consitantly spend less and less time in the forums.
Just my suspicion that is, I have no evidence to back it up.

Don't ask me, I have no idea what's going on.
  • #168
  • Jun 3, 2015 8:47am Jun 3, 2015 8:47am
Quoting Scoobidoobi
{quote} Agreed mate!, Its the same forex media propaganda which lures retail investors into becoming rag2riches or overnight millionaires, also create the very same fear that only 5% out of the retail are successful I presume...
The reality is that retail forex trading destroys life.

oops, sorry that's meth
my bad.
  • #169
  • Jun 3, 2015 3:08pm Jun 3, 2015 3:08pm
Quoting Gizzledonk
I think I'd also be willing to bet (just a little bit) that the people that start winning consitantly spend less and less time in the forums. Just my suspicion that is, I have no evidence to back it up.
Most successful people avoid doom and gloom, others just see the users here as their personal entertainment. I would assume.

To get back to the numbers: I'd like to see some numbers split by currency pair, trading style and the preferred time of trading. But some general numbers like 95% lose is worthless. First: it's probably not so different from a lot of undercapitalized startups, Second: do these people have a fulltime job? During which hours? Not all hours are equally good for all trading types and then your trading type needs to fit your personality. Third: Do they play forex or do they trade forex? Fourth: I could go on and on why I mistrust those numbers ...

Quoting Mingary
{quote} The reality is that retail forex trading destroys life. oops, sorry that's meth my bad.
From your last comments I'd say you got f*cked pretty hard and without any lubricant by the SNB?!
  • #170
  • Jun 3, 2015 4:01pm Jun 3, 2015 4:01pm
Quoting JensG
{quote} Most successful people avoid doom and gloom, others just see the users here as their personal entertainment. I would assume. To get back to the numbers: I'd like to see some numbers split by currency pair, trading style and the preferred time of trading. But some general numbers like 95% lose is worthless. First: it's probably not so different from a lot of undercapitalized startups, Second: do these people have a fulltime job? During which hours? Not all hours are equally good for all trading types and then your trading type needs to fit...
Nope.
It's just a fact; forex is glorified gambling.
  • #171
  • Jun 3, 2015 5:53pm Jun 3, 2015 5:53pm
Yes start off small. You should try to set up goals on how much you want to make each week.
Profit is profit whether small or big just be consistant and keep playing until you become better.

Eventually you will have your own system.
Dont listen to everyone that will say most traders fail. Most traders fail if they dont learn first.
  • #172
  • Jun 3, 2015 7:54pm Jun 3, 2015 7:54pm
Quoting jayjay050
Yes start off small. You should try to set up goals on how much you want to make each week. Profit is profit whether small or big just be consistant and keep playing until you become better. Eventually you will have your own system. Dont listen to everyone that will say most traders fail. Most traders fail if they dont learn first.
This is incredibly terrible advice. Setting a goal for how much you want to make each week will make you trade poorly. Also, he *should* listen to people saying most traders fail, because the vast majority of traders fail, and most people who are selling methods or "teaching" people aren't actually selling something that any regular person can just come and trade and be successful.

If you trade forex you are trading against a lot of the smartest people in the world, and most people are going to lose in the long run due to the spread, and human nature. If you want to be successful, you need to find an actual edge, then trade it with discipline. Yes, you can learn to "read the charts" as well, but most people won't ever get to that point, so encouraging people to just "keep playing until you become better" is not wise advice. Better advice would be, trade until you can successfully trade a demo account for hundreds of trades, then start gradually trading a tiny amount and work up to a larger amount gradually. But people don't have the patience for that, and they risk a lot early on, and that is why most people lose. That is reality, so telling someone to ignore it isn't helpful at all.
  • #173
  • Jun 4, 2015 12:58am Jun 4, 2015 12:58am
Quoting Mingary
{quote} Nope. It's just a fact; forex is glorified gambling.
Depends on how you define gambling. You can't control price, yes. That's all. How you work with it is a whole different topic. You can't control overall business climate too, or your employees - you can only hire them based on guesses and fire the losers early before they can do serious damage to you. The only certainty is death and even here you can't predict the when and the how.
Whole life can be gambling, it all depends on your definition. Studying? Was it the right decision? Buying a house on borrowed money? Many people burned their fingers with it in Spain.

Quoting Cbh123
{quote} Setting a goal for how much you want to make each week will make you trade poorly.
I agree.

Quoting Cbh123
{quote}
Also, he *should* listen to people saying most traders fail, because the vast majority of traders fail, and most people who are selling methods or "teaching" people aren't actually selling something that any regular person can just come and trade and be successful.
I partly agree. Yes, FX (or trading speculative stuff in general) isn't for everyone and a system must work FOR YOU, that it does work for someone else does not mean much. But! he should not listen to all the moaners and quitters, the vast majority of people telling you that most traders will fail are just dragging you down.

Quoting Cbh123
{quote}But people don't have the patience for that, and they risk a lot early on, and that is why most people lose. That is reality, so telling someone to ignore it isn't helpful at all.
Demo may or may not help you. Demo completely takes the emotion out of it. Their is no problem in burning a few 100$ accounts, call it learning expenses. It's only a problem if you keep on making the same mistake over and over again.
  • #174
  • Jun 4, 2015 1:57pm Jun 4, 2015 1:57pm
In my demo account trading, I had $50k in balance, I had no experience whatsoever so I basically bought low and sold high. Made $30k extra over 2 weeks ($80k total). I was getting 5-10 pips per trade and making around 20-30 trades a day trading at 10 lots..

I felt I would be rich as soon as I began trading live..

Now I opened a live account with much lower balance, trading with 0.01 lots, and it was 100x different and more difficult. Whenever I see my balance in red (negative) I would panic and close my trade a few minutes later, although in my demo I would never close it/never use stop loss and win in the end.

So in short, I just wanted to say that psychology has a lot to do with it, so don't be over-confident and trade loosely ending up blowing your account + your hard-earned cash..

As I was told, this is a get-rich-slowly scheme. Better to be making consistent small profits than get big profits that will one day be big losses that will outweigh all those gains.

Hope that helped
  • #175
  • Edited 8:46am Jun 5, 2015 8:08am | Edited 8:46am
Here's how it went for me.
I got myself ForexTester 2 with reaaaaally nice tick data. I developed some strategies played for about 6 months (a week in real time) and then i decided to open demo account. I was stunned that my scalp strategy was making me loose - in real life a 3-pip move can happen in almost an instant. So does 10-pip move. Getting in the middle is impossible. So I decided to use my strategy at higher time frame. Where 2-3pip move wouldn't kill my profits. Guess what? Playing 1% trades I lost 20% in barely 2 days. Now I have 2k real life account playing between 0.01 and 0.1 lots (that's less than 0.5% risk) and it's also very different. Thanks to demo I saw london open in real life I saw big news come in real life I saw that candle patterns ARE actually worth something looking into. Same for VSA.

To sum up:
1. From paper trading you learn to look for profitable indicators and you learn to think it's easy. If you're a bit smart you choose non-colinear indis.
2. From demo trading you unlearn all of that. You learn to test your indicators by WHEN they loose. If they loose a little then they are 90% good. If they also win a lot they are 100% good. not the other way around.
3. From demo you learn to be patient. 24 1H candles take 5cm on your screen and 2sec to tell you what's going on. In real life 24 1H candles form over.... yes you guessed it right - 24 hours.
4. From demo you learn that you are clueless in face on conflicting indicators. S/R and trend lines tell you to go short but MACD %R RSI and others tell you to go long? Almost NEVER majority of indicators are in confluence. When you cannot see what is in the future you cannot say "it's obvious this indi showed up so I'd have to go up".
5. Always use stop loss. Getting in-out of the trade costs 1.5-2.0 pips. A 20 pip loss is getting in and out 20 times. I'd rather enter again for 2x2pip=4pip comission that loose 1x15pips. Also, you avoid that vibe of "I'll keep it longer. The chart will turn around...."
6. 80% of the time the best trading decision you can make is NOT to trade. Out of 10 daily "sort-of-becoming-nicely-looking situations" maybe 2 are worth taking. Ignoring the 8/10 is hard. VERY HARD.
7. The most important thing you learn: *secret* *go make demo to experience it yourself*

Now with just 2 days of rl account I get different.... vibe from trading. I am sure I'll discover something important....
  • #176
  • Jun 5, 2015 9:20am Jun 5, 2015 9:20am
i think 5% monthly profit is sustainable...
Those who know dont talk, those who talk dont know.
  • #177
  • Jun 6, 2015 12:12am Jun 6, 2015 12:12am
Quoting Silens
i think 5% monthly profit is sustainable...
Yup, one can, expect at least a 5% monthly profit,provided one trades effectively..
  • #178
  • Jun 6, 2015 7:36am Jun 6, 2015 7:36am
I find it amazing how people choose to fool themselves despite the evidence.
  • #179
  • Jun 10, 2015 8:30am Jun 10, 2015 8:30am
Quoting Mingary
I find it amazing how people choose to fool themselves despite the evidence.
I don't know why but I often read your posts and I find them interesting and I like them.

The only thing I have to ask is this, do you really think that FF represents the majority of retail traders? I can't help but think the average FF member is a 17 year old living with parents, not really sure about how the markets work, trying to post successful trades to get a little shiny red diamond near their username? (of which they probably have 3 accounts)

I met someone who traded forex a few weeks ago, it turns out he's been trading by himself for little over 10 years. Trading is the only income he has since he left his job 10 years ago.

I didn't ask him if he was successful, his collection of ferraris was enough. I didn't ask him how he traded, but I know he rarely sleeps as he's awake for London, US and Asian sessions...
  • #180
  • Jun 10, 2015 9:31am Jun 10, 2015 9:31am
Quoting Gareth22
{quote} .... I didn't ask him if he was successful, his collection of ferraris was enough. ... ..


This is telling me your story cannot be true.

==> do you really think that FF represents the majority of retail traders?
Yes. A lot of hope and half lived half lies and no money in the end. (:
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