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How do you trade news?

  • #421
  • Aug 4, 2006 10:47pm Aug 4, 2006 10:47pm
Hi,

I really think this thread is not working as it should. No one is commenting their trades. Thanks Pipman for trying!

This was my experience today: I tried to trade the NFP with CMS this morning. My order was requoted after more or less 5 or 10 minutes of being sent! The requote was 60 pips higher! So, there was no trade for me.

Anyone trading the NFP with OANDA willing to share his/her experience?

Pablo.
Pablo
  • #422
  • Aug 4, 2006 11:48pm Aug 4, 2006 11:48pm
Yeah ptejerina,

I tried to trade news with CMS few months ago, it wasn't NFP, some far less important news, they didn't let me place an order. I kept receiving some " ... server error ... " message or something. After that I tried to trade FOMC with them, got disconnected and couldn't log back in for the next hour or so. That was it for CMS. I am using them now on demo, for charting only.

I am trading news with Oanda. So far didn't have problems. I usually stradlle, they always accept my buy/sell limit orders, even though I put them few seconds before the news release. And when the numbers come out and market goes nuts, my orders are always filled without any slippage or requote. And when the spike reach my TP or SL, they get executed exactly to the pip. Maybe bacause they are good, maybe because I trade with relatively small amount of money so they don't care much, but so far it's going good.

Cheers,

branac
  • #423
  • Aug 4, 2006 11:59pm Aug 4, 2006 11:59pm
Pipsman

In response to your post I have a live account with FXSol and my order went right in with no problem. I waited to enter about 4 minutes after the release and got my pips! I have only had my order not go through once!
PIP'N
  • #424
  • Aug 5, 2006 1:21am Aug 5, 2006 1:21am
Quoting ptejerina
Hi,

I really think this thread is not working as it should. No one is commenting their trades. Thanks Pipman for trying!
....

Anyone trading the NFP with OANDA willing to share his/her experience?

Pablo.
Pablo & Pipsman,

This thread is working fine. Many posted NFP results in the thread entitled "NFP Results".

Have a good day.
  • #425
  • Aug 5, 2006 2:42am Aug 5, 2006 2:42am
Quoting ptejerina
Hi,

I really think this thread is not working as it should. No one is commenting their trades. Thanks Pipman for trying!

This was my experience today: I tried to trade the NFP with CMS this morning. My order was requoted after more or less 5 or 10 minutes of being sent! The requote was 60 pips higher! So, there was no trade for me.

Anyone trading the NFP with OANDA willing to share his/her experience?

Pablo.
I did't trade the news, not doing that anymore sice I found out why news trading is for noobs, but I noticed Oanda started widening the spred to unprecedented levels. It was 3 pip before then a few months ago started going to 4 or 5 and yesterday it even hit 10 pip. Even if news trading works, it will work less and less because of threads like these that make all the noobs go for it and trading at the same time. Good luck to everybody. Make lots of money and don't keep your mouths shut. That's the way to win in a zero sum game. I'm sure George Soros bragged after every trade on the internet and shared his strategies with everybody.
  • #426
  • Aug 5, 2006 5:47am Aug 5, 2006 5:47am
lol atlast a jessie post with a little bit of sense as opposed to just plain bitterness.

you make a fair point, spreads will widen, and you cant fault brokers for that since thats how they make their living, being the counter party to your trades. anyone who thinks minis or even small standards get STP is a noob and will learn this isnt so in due course.

the upside of this however, is that the noobs will provide the additional volatility well beyond any slippage, even if its +35, cos thats all they know, so it could have the positive effect of making news moves even more extreme.

good or bad, it all depends on how you evolve and adapt your strategy.

if your strategy cant adapt and evolve, then all you have is a system, and systems fail. but strategies evolve to suit the circumstances.
  • #427
  • Aug 5, 2006 7:04am Aug 5, 2006 7:04am
Quoting jessieblue
"news trading is for noobs"...................... "but I noticed Oanda started widening the spred to unprecedented levels. It was 3 pip before then a few months ago started going to 4 or 5 and yesterday it even hit 10 pip."
Jessieblue,

I happen to know of many very successful and experienced traders who ONLY trade the news. In fact if someone asked my humble opinion, I would tell any newbie NOT, NOT, NOT to trade the news. It takes alot of experience, a certain nerve, and great discipline to trade it successfully. It is certainly not for everyone.

It has been my experience with news traders that we encourage newbies to gain experience and discipline before entering this risky but exciting group of traders. They must be determined, and put alot of hard work in. It is NOT an easy way to trade. They should also tap the experience of other successful news traders, perhaps even having one as a mentor. This is just IMHO.

As to your comments on the spread. This is technically incorrect. My broker does NOT widen the "spread", they widen the market. For example: If the market price at the moment is 1.8000 on the GBP they will widen out the market from there. My broker has done it but the widest point has never been more than 30 pips. I could put my entry stop no closer than 1.8030 to buy and vice versa on the short. I am gauranteed fill at that price however, with no slippage. (That is an extreme number) My spread of 4 pips remains the same.

Do I have a problem with this? Well I certainly do not like it. But if I want to trade the news, I MUST accept the rules. It is much better than the last trade I had with my old broker. They allow entry orders without widening the market, but my last trade slipped by 58 pips. That's right, 58!!! I would rather have a gauranteed fill where I could put my order in than a hugh slip that is unpredictable. (My current broker doesn't even do this very often, in fact, when they do, it seems that they knew something that none of us could have known, and the market screams in one direction)--and I make money!!!

Brokers WILL do what they do, if we cannot deal with it, DO NOT TRADE THE NEWS!!!!

I for my part, even with the brokers take, make money trading the news, and as I continue refining my systems and disciplining myself with more success I will make even more.

I hope that all of this makes sense, and for any newbies out there, DO NOT TRADE THE NEWS, UNTIL.....you have learned the skill of discipline and you have put your time in with the boring work of knowing your market, knowing the fundementals, knowing the news and how the numbers in the report relate to the market price and it's movements. And learning from some of the experienced news traders in forums such as this.

DC
"There is MORE Happiness in giving than receiving"
  • #428
  • Aug 5, 2006 12:35pm Aug 5, 2006 12:35pm
I have a question for people who trade the news. Do you guys straddle before the news report? Or do you guys trade when the news comes out? Or does anyone trade during the spikes? Right now, i am trying to determine which is good way to trade the news, and it comes down to these 3. Some input would be great.

- J
  • #429
  • Aug 5, 2006 1:02pm Aug 5, 2006 1:02pm
Quoting hunter101
I have a question for people who trade the news. Do you guys straddle before the news report? Or do you guys trade when the news comes out? Or does anyone trade during the spikes? Right now, i am trying to determine which is good way to trade the news, and it comes down to these 3. Some input would be great.

- J
Those who are subscribed to a good and fast news service, like Reuters or Bloomberg, they wait for numbers to come out and then they jump in the trade, catch few pips and after few seconds they are out.

Those who are not subscribed to a news service, they straddle.

The third group waits for dust to settle down, and then try to catch some pips on the retracement. This technique can actually bring some good pips, and it's not too stressfull and risky, coz very often, after the initial spike, the price comes back to the level where it was just before the news. For less important news this can happen in 15 - 30 mins, for more volatile ones, like NFP, it can take days, but it happens.
  • #430
  • Aug 5, 2006 1:09pm Aug 5, 2006 1:09pm
MM:
Thanks for the link. Will visit the page right after writing this.
MM, I read all of your great posts on this thread, I want to thank you for your insight, passion and inspirations. I learned a lot from you!
Too bad that idiot ruined the whole thing. Still, your wisdom and active presence on this thread are sorely needed. Please stop by often.

Branac:
Re. NFP trade with Oanda, did they hike the spread more than 5~10p yesterday, 2 or 3 minutes leading up to the 8:30a release?
If Oanda indeed offers a manageable spread (<10p) and little slippage during big news like NFP, I may want an account there. However, their 50:1 leverage (industry low?) is discouraging.

Drcole1:
Trying to understand your point re. spread. Widening the "spread" or the "market" seems to me has the same deterring effect for straddle, even for stop entry or market orders. In your example, the pair @ 1.8000, but you can only buy @ 1.8030, and sell @ 1.7970. As such, straddle, stop entry order or market entry order, all need to have at least 60+p stop loss to NOT be stopped out, right? Correct me if I'm wrong.
Due to the drastic expansion of spreads by my broker prior to release, I can no long do straddles with them. If I enter the position long before, I still will be stopped out unless I have a huge SL or no SL (only have it mentally). This leaves me the only choice of entry during or afer the initial spike, often at lousy price. Of course, missing the big chunk of the initial spike certainly increases my risk. Anyone has better strategy, I hope you wouldn't mind discussing it here. After all, we're a whole bunch of such "small" fish for brokers to take us seriously, I think.

Trade well. Cheers,

PM
  • #431
  • Aug 5, 2006 1:12pm Aug 5, 2006 1:12pm
Hi pipsman,

5 mins before the NFP yesterday, Oanda widened EUR/USD spread from 1.5 to 3 pips. 2 mins later, the spread was 4, and after few seconds 6. Around 8:29 the spread came to 10 pips.
  • #432
  • Aug 5, 2006 1:33pm Aug 5, 2006 1:33pm
"As such, straddle, stop entry order or market entry order, all need to have at least 60+p stop loss to NOT be stopped out, right? Correct me if I'm wrong"......"Due to the drastic expansion of spreads by my broker prior to release, I can no long do straddles with them."

Pipsman,

No I do not have to have a 60 pip s/l, usually a 20. And the 30 pip widening of the market is just an example, I have NEVER had that wide of a market. When my broker does widen the market, it usually only effects my entry order by a few pips anyway because of my style of trading.

Every broker deals with these fast moving markets differently. The real point is that you need to KNOW what their policy is and assume that this is what will happen. If it doesn't then bonus to you. If it does, then so be it, trade your system and be confident.

**The difference between widening the market and widening the spread.

1) If I was to enter 1 second before the spike with a market order. I would be filled with the exact same spread that I always have.

2) The widening effect is only applicable to entry stop orders. But if, in the above example my entry stop order has to be at 1.8030 my spread of 4 pips is still applicable and I get filled when the price hits 1.8026. (normal spread behavior)

There are some news systems that allow you to enter with a market order if you just don't like the widening of your entry stops. Be careful though, you may experience slippage. Something that I don't ever deal with with my secondary, (now main) broker when I use my entry stops. They may widen the market just before some news reports, but I ALWAYS get filled correctly. Never disappointed.

Hope this helps

DC
"There is MORE Happiness in giving than receiving"
  • #433
  • Aug 5, 2006 5:07pm Aug 5, 2006 5:07pm
Quoting jessieblue
I did't trade the news, not doing that anymore sice I found out why news trading is for noobs, but I noticed Oanda started widening the spred to unprecedented levels. It was 3 pip before then a few months ago started going to 4 or 5 and yesterday it even hit 10 pip. Even if news trading works, it will work less and less because of threads like these that make all the noobs go for it and trading at the same time. Good luck to everybody. Make lots of money and don't keep your mouths shut. That's the way to win in a zero sum game. I'm sure George Soros bragged after every trade on the internet and shared his strategies with everybody.

Man, I agree with you.

Maybe is a case, but since 3 weeks ago trading the news for me was fine, now also my broker started to make stop hunting , freezing and crap like that..

I think that since 3 weeks we passed from one milion on the world trading the news to 10 milions...



Good eastern ......
  • #434
  • Aug 5, 2006 7:01pm Aug 5, 2006 7:01pm
Quoting drcole1
And the 30 pip widening of the market is just an example, I have NEVER had that wide of a market. When my broker does widen the market, it usually only effects my entry order by a few pips anyway because of my style of trading.

....

Every broker deals with these fast moving markets differently. The real point is that you need to KNOW what their policy is and assume that this is what will happen. DC
Pipsman,

To buttress Doc's point. At 8:00 am est on NFP day, USA, my broker FXSol allowed normal buy and sell stops, i.e., at whatever price chosen by the trader. By 8:15 am, FXSol added 35 pips to the market price, so a buy stop was market plus 35 and same for sell stop.

At this point, the trader decides whether to enter at market or accept the broker's offer of the premium of 35 pips for the buy and sell stops (if straddling). Accepting the 35 effectively (and obviously) reduces potential profit but you nonetheless have a guaranteed entry price with unlimited upside (or downside to the short). So given a total initial move of approxiamtely 70 pips, your profit is 35. I'll take that, especially with multiple lots.

As doc said, you know their policy, you adapt your strategy. The strong evolve and continue to play the game. Or as Darwin said, "You gotta be fit to get outta here alive."
  • #435
  • Aug 5, 2006 7:15pm Aug 5, 2006 7:15pm
So MM you are sayn that Fxsol will widen their speard, but a least they give you a "guaranteed entry price"?? Is this so?
  • #436
  • Aug 5, 2006 7:29pm Aug 5, 2006 7:29pm
Money Master,

I use FXsol myself and find them to be reliable and trustworthy, at least to date. They filled my price, and I made the decision. That's all I want. Do I feel like I left some pips on the table? Yes. But I took some pips with me when I left.

At the end, I had control of my stops and my profits, and that is what I want.

Another broker that allows your entries at any price slipped me by 58 pips without telling me. I called them and they said "tough luck". Sorry GFT, you just lost my business. They could not even tell me where there "Fast moving market policy could be found". Enough is enough.

Perhaps I am fortunate because I talk directly to a manager of customer service at FXsol, not just a rep. He has been very helpful.

I understand there policy and trade with it instead of against it.

And really, these widened markets have only been a recent thing, and only on the really big moves. In the BOE Rate Hike I was +++128 pips inspite of it. Can't complain about that.

Now, Let's stop all of this peripheral talk and get down to trading the news.

DC
"There is MORE Happiness in giving than receiving"
  • #437
  • Aug 6, 2006 12:47am Aug 6, 2006 12:47am
FXCM is another broker you dont want to trade news with.
  • #438
  • Aug 6, 2006 6:50am Aug 6, 2006 6:50am
Quoting BurgerKing
FXCM is another broker you dont want to trade news with.
BurgerKing,

Several days ago, I asked you who was your broker and received no response. The reason I asked you is because in this forum, we try to help each other become better traders.

FXCM is one of the more disliked brokers, but like anything else, it depends on who you talk to. Seems like those trading mini lots hate FXCM while those trading standard lots have no problems.

Go to the thread below. It's a detailed discussion of traders on Forex Factory and how we ranked brokers. I think you'll find it useful.


http://www.forexfactory.com/forexfor...ead.php?t=5747

PM me if you have problems getting to the thread.
  • #439
  • Aug 6, 2006 10:31am Aug 6, 2006 10:31am
Hi i have a few questions, since i am doing my research on howto trade the news.

1) since there is a spike, i was wondering if possible to trade the down trend after the first spike? oppisite direction? If so, how do you determine it and how long do you keep it for?

2) how do you straddle to make profits? Can this go against you?

3) Do some brokers screw with your orders and fills?

I know alot of economic reports that can cause currency pairs to move fast for a short time, but i am in a diff forum where this guy posted who posts major news and which are good to trade, here it is:

There are 7 events this week:

---------------------------------------------------------

PERSONAL INCOME & PERSONAL SPENDING
August 1, 2006
8:30 AM EST
Rating: 3 Stars
Quality Trades: 67%
True Spikes: 53%
Reversals: 33%
Average High: 48 pips

---------------------------------------------------------

CONSTRUCTION SPENDING
August 1, 2006
10:00 AM EST
Rating: 5 Stars
Quality Trades: 80%
True Spikes: 73%
Reversals: 33%
Average High: 52 pips

---------------------------------------------------------

ISM INDEX
August 1,2006
8:30 AM EST
Rating: 4 Stars
Quality Trades: 73%
True Spikes: 67%
Reversals: 13%
Average High: 60 pips

---------------------------------------------------------

INITIAL CLAIMS
August 3, 2006
8:30 AM EST
Rating: 5 Stars
Quality Trades: 80%
True Spikes: 57%
Reversals: 30%
Average High: 50 pips

---------------------------------------------------------

FACTORY ORDERS
August 3, 2006
8:30 AM EST
Rating: 4 Stars
Quality Trades: 73%
True Spikes: 67%
Reversals: 13%
Average High: 40 pips

---------------------------------------------------------

ISM SERVICES
August 3, 2006
10:00 AM EST
Rating: 4 Stars
Quality Trades: 75%
True Spikes: 50%
Reversals: 25%
Average High: 37 pips

---------------------------------------------------------

NONFARM PAYROLLS
August 4, 2006
8:30 AM EST
Rating: 5 Stars
Quality Trades: 75%
True Spikes: 81%
Reversals: 38%
Average High: 65 pips

------------------

My question is, are all of these reports profitable? The guy who posted got it in an email from some website that trades news too. Can someoen back up tihs post? Right now, i can only see the NFP to be the most profitable out of all of them, i guess i have to do more research.

- J
  • #440
  • Aug 6, 2006 10:41am Aug 6, 2006 10:41am
Quoting branac
Hi pipsman,

5 mins before the NFP yesterday, Oanda widened EUR/USD spread from 1.5 to 3 pips. 2 mins later, the spread was 4, and after few seconds 6. Around 8:29 the spread came to 10 pips.
Branac,

Did you notice what was the spread when it was time for you to exit your trade? Was it back to 1.5 pips?


Pablo.
Pablo
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