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Scammers - Hall of Shame

  • #1,121
  • Dec 11, 2014 7:11am Dec 11, 2014 7:11am
Quoting JoeNY
Scammers actually believe in their minds, they are not doing anything wrong because in reality, they are the desperate ones always trying to make a buck at all cost. (Prison) Peace
AAh no ..Cheaters know exactly what they do !
They just accept what they do and accept that kind as a good income .
If it´s still profitable in the long turn , I´m not sure .. a good example is Burnie Madhoff .
Risiko birgt immer auch die Chance.
  • #1,122
  • Dec 11, 2014 7:31am Dec 11, 2014 7:31am
Quoting deltaone
"what a difference a day made, twenty four little hours brought the sun and the flowers where there used to be rain..." appr. 1 year ago i joined ff, but this is certainly one of the best. doomsday for scammers
Rocking
  • #1,123
  • Dec 11, 2014 8:27am Dec 11, 2014 8:27am
Looks like some people are not happy with this thread .............


http://assets.forexfactory.net/nfs/c...tar80279_1.gifhttp://assets.forexfactory.net/nfs/c...r168114_12.gifhttp://assets.forexfactory.net/nfs/c...ar103015_1.gif ...........................
  • #1,124
  • Dec 11, 2014 11:05am Dec 11, 2014 11:05am
Quoting albchr
So on another note, I can see where just participating in this thread has it's consequences for long term members in good standing and it would seem even turn them against one another. After many years of friendly interaction RJ just ignored me. I have to "assume" it's due to something I said here? Anyway, if folks who are not the target of a potential scam or known as a troll in these parts are silenced for expressing an opinion, that's taking the whole MOB mentality way too far in my humble book. So if this is true? {image} I can understand his...

albchr,

First of all I do not know why you ignored and posted something against me when I have not said or done anything against you.
You are the one that posted something from real jumper against me and ignored me witch I find it not right, I did consider you a nice and straight guy but the proof is in the pudding like they say.
I had even un ignored "realjumper" when it was time for voting and he again started his smart ass comments....that is why he was put again on the ignore list.
​I have never sweated at anyone or have anything against anyone so tell "fruit loop" to take take his shovel and go play in his sand box...like I have told him before.....as for you I am thinking that some members might be right, to bad that I backed you and supported you.

4x
  • #1,125
  • Edited 8:21pm Dec 11, 2014 11:58am | Edited 8:21pm
Quoting genghistar
{quote} What happen if the EA he is being asked to code is highly profitable? That would be priceless becos as a coder he is also able to trade with it and in a worst case scenario even hijack it as his own no? GS.
Fair enough, but how does the programmer (who might not know a lot about trading, let alone the system he's being asked to code) know that the EA will turn out to be profitable, over several years worth of changing markets, before he even codes it? Should he code hundreds of requests, in the hope of finding one? And how would he know which EA(s) to run himself, given that in many cases backtesting offers no real guarantee of future performance?

I've been there, and in my experience it's not worth the effort. Even if the trader requesting the EA is profitable, there's no guarantee that the EA will trade as intelligently as he does. If I was still doing coding for traders nowadays, I'd be charging an hourly rate. If a trader is that convinced that his strategy is massively profitable, let him take the risk by paying for the work; if he's telling the truth, the finished EA will pay for its development cost several times over.

If the programmer benefits from it also, he is still nonetheless risking his own money, in a live account, to have the EA trade what (to him) is an unproven concept, and without any absolute guarantees; and if he does make some profit, at least it compensates him for the many wasted hours of developing free EAs that proved to be unprofitable.

Here are some EAs that my trader/programmer buddy wrote. They've backtested profitably over 6 years of high quality data. Could you guarantee that they will be profitable if traded on a live account? Would you be willing to run them, and risk your own money, merely on our assurance that the underlying concepts are robust? If not, then why should a programmer likewise have faith in another trader's system? Why should he be expected to accept the possibility of future profit as payment for his work?

This blog is a very good read IMO. Some highly profitable traders developed their own EA. Combining back and forward testing, the EA was handsomely profitable for more than 3 years, then in just 4 months they lost most of their profit, after the EA had turned £10,000 into £100,000 in the previous 12 months. Another 12 months and they would have been millionaires, except that the EA suddenly encountered market conditions that the developers hadn't anticipated, and it imploded. There are other stories like this one. When you're talking about automated retail systems, "profitable" is not necessarily as straight-forward a concept as it might seem.

My apologies to the OP, this has gotten somewhat off-topic. This is my last post about programming-related 'scams' in this thread.
  • #1,126
  • Dec 11, 2014 12:15pm Dec 11, 2014 12:15pm
Quoting hanover
{quote} Fair enough, but how does the programmer (who might not know a lot about trading, let alone the system he's being asked to code) know that the EA will turn out to be profitable, over several years worth of changing markets, before he even codes it? Should he code hundreds of requests, in the hope of finding one? And how would he know which EA(s) to run himself, given that in many cases backtesting offers no real guarantee of future performance? I've been there, and in my experience it's not worth the effort. Even if the trader requesting...
(or she) we have had this discussion before. Basically what you are are saying is that it is unlikely an ea will win long term and ultimately needs intervention from the trader. The problem being is that give 100 people an ea and they will all trade it differently as is I have discovered with amusement on my journey. I disagreed with you at some stage about this but you were/are correct.

Your average 'scammer' doesn't care they just want the $ - but anyone silly enough to spend on something that has not been proven live for a length of time gets what they deserve.
  • #1,127
  • Edited 8:23pm Dec 11, 2014 12:47pm | Edited 8:23pm
Quoting claudia1
......anyone silly enough to spend on something that has not been proven live for a length of time gets what they deserve.
Agreed, when it comes to buying systems, people blithely ignore the mandatory "past performance is no guarantee..." disclaimer and become blinded by their own greed, laziness and folly. Consequently, they will try anything that they hope can bring them the largest amount of money in the shortest amount of time for the least amount of work.

That doesn't change the fact that folk who sell systems, signals, education etc that they know don't work are despicable, and should be exposed and brought to justice. But I also believe that gullible buyers must accept responsibility for their own stupidity.

Also, many people cry "scam!" on the one hand, but they also protest "big brother" or "nanny state" when governments step in and legislate. I suspect that more folk lose money in lotteries and casino games than they ever do in ponzis or buying dodgy trading systems. Should lotteries and casinos be banned? At what point should we draw the legal — let alone moral — line, when it comes from trying to save people from their own foolishness?
  • #1,128
  • Dec 11, 2014 1:07pm Dec 11, 2014 1:07pm
Quoting hanover
{quote} Agreed, when it comes to buying systems, people blithely ignore the mandatory "past performance is no guarantee..." disclaimer and become blinded by their own greed, laziness and folly. Consequently, they will try anything that they hope can bring them the largest amount of money in the shortest amount of time for the least amount of work. That doesn't change the fact that folk who sell systems, signals, education etc that they know don't work are despicable, and should be exposed and brought to justice. But I also believe that gullible...
Yes. But ultimately, whichever way you look at it, it is down to the individual to make their own decision. There will always be people out there trying to take your money -caveat emptor !.

The retail market in fx is a mess that's where the problem stems. If you had to have a minimum opening of say 20k not 1 cent it would be different and the 'scammers' market in newbies would disappear overnight. But that will not happen as the market is not regulated. New offshore 'brokers' popping up all over.
  • #1,129
  • Dec 11, 2014 1:52pm Dec 11, 2014 1:52pm
Quoting claudia1
{quote} Yes. But ultimately, whichever way you look at it, it is down to the individual to make their own decision. There will always be people out there trying to take your money -caveat emptor !. The retail market in fx is a mess that's where the problem stems. If you had to have a minimum opening of say 20k not 1 cent it would be different and the 'scammers' market in newbies would disappear overnight. But that will not happen as the market is not regulated. New offshore 'brokers' popping up all over.
Yes. Good points.
  • #1,130
  • Dec 11, 2014 2:29pm Dec 11, 2014 2:29pm
Quoting hanover
{quote} Yes. Good points.
David - one of my wine bar users has asked that s4/r4 be added I know what you said previously applies to this to. But any chance ? if you don't have time I understand. She's using cwb with camarilla which is interesting.
  • #1,131
  • Dec 11, 2014 3:36pm Dec 11, 2014 3:36pm
Quoting 4xPIPAHOLIC
{quote} albchr, First of all I do not know why you ignored and posted something against me when I have not said or done anything against you. You are the one that posted something from real jumper against me and ignored me witch I find it not right, I did consider you a nice and straight guy but the proof is in the pudding like they say.....as for you I am thinking that some members might be right, to bad that I backed you and supported you. 4x
I wouldn't expect you to understand the concept behind the feelings for my post 4x. The way you run this thread shows me you couldn't.

As to the bold comments above? That's exactly the problem here. Much like trading, far too many assumptions and not nearly enough facts. For as long as I've known RJ here I've never seen him scam or troll anyone. Yes he's opinionated. Aren't we all. He had an opinion, you didn't care for it so you stifled him pure and simple. Very open minded of you.

So you and few other assumers have me all figured out now do ya? That's cool. Enjoy the pudding as proof. Do you know anything at all about me? You don't even know my name and everyone who's anyone here does. It isn't that tough to find as I'm an open book. Perhaps the most open here at FF. Which simply proves you and your "some members" have never done a lick of research into anything. About the only one here who has is Ken. But then, as I've known him for some time, that's no surprise and I've always been grateful for his "work".

Anyone who's accused me of anything I put to the task of proving it and they couldn't. None of them. Why? Because they have nothing to prove. If they did they would have .. no? Just hollow accusations based on childish assumptions. Much like you're now doing about me. Ask your "some members" to prove whatever they've told you. Just like the others, it should be fun to watch them try and fail.

I didn't seek nor do I require your backing. As if yours and your "some members" words are the end all of everything here at FF.

I've got a simple question, who are you? No matter really. Those who care about this house know me and I them.

Anywho, this will be my last post or reply here. Have fun playing detective. It's rather obvious you can use the practice.

Chow
Ghost Rider - WWTBMD?
  • #1,132
  • Edited 5:45pm Dec 11, 2014 5:26pm | Edited 5:45pm
Quoting albchr
{quote} I wouldn't expect you to understand the concept behind the feelings for my post 4x. The way you run this thread shows me you couldn't. As to the bold comments above? That's exactly the problem here. Much like trading, far too many assumptions and not nearly enough facts. For as long as I've known RJ here I've never seen him scam or troll anyone. Yes he's opinionated. Aren't we all. He had an opinion, you didn't care for it so you stifled him pure and simple. Very open minded of you. So you and few other assumers have me all figured out now...
No kidding it is your last reply cause you know you are wrong.......
I have been around as long as you have, the difference is I spend most of my time trading and the members that know me know me good,some of them are even you friends
and know what type of person I am. I used to come here only in my free time.
The issue here is not who is known better. I have nothing against you and I did not think you had anything against me.
You come and post on my thread something that is by a member that I have ingnored. I do not think you would like that
if I would do it in your thread. That is not correct.
You did if because jolly jumper cried like a baby because he was ignored and ignored you.........and you jump....wow
If you would do your investigation you would see that I ignored him and I gave him a second chance but he still played smartass.
I have ignored only 2 members not 23....and this for obvious reasons....
I am a true believer in Karma.....if you think you did right that is cool with me.
  • #1,133
  • Dec 11, 2014 6:42pm Dec 11, 2014 6:42pm
Quoting 4xPIPAHOLIC
{quote} No kidding it is your last reply cause you know you are wrong....... I have been around as long as you have, the difference is I spend most of my time trading and the members that know me know me good,some of them are even you friends and know what type of person I am. I used to come here only in my free time. The issue here is not who is known better. I have nothing against you and I did not think you had anything against me. You come and post on my thread something that is by a member that I have ingnored. I do not think you would like...
Yeah, I'm wrong. OK.

Yes I can see the date of your arrival. I've also seen earlier dates on sleeper scammers and trolls (I'm not saying you are 4x, not at all) but the date of joining is irrelevant to me. Most of my friends haven't been here as long and some longer. Funny they've never mentioned you to me if we share any in common but again, not important really.

I trade all day everyday from London to Tokyo. But really, I guess the only difference is I can post and trade at the same time. 20 seconds on my thread would show you that. The only other difference is, my thread is a "personal journal" that has grown over the past year with a few good invited friends. You started a "public" thread (or so I thought) and it should be fair game for all. Well, I guess all but RJ ... eh?

I have nothing against you at all. How could? I don't know you. But I do have a problem with censorship on a "public" thread. No matter, you're quite correct. It is YOUR thread and as such, YOUR responsibility. Since it's intent (I thought) is to serve the public good, you might consider running it a bit .... better.

I find it interesting to see my original post about "lets' see if this is indeed an honest attempt at outing scammers or just another bashing thread" in the recycle bin. Hmmmmm ... ... Did I strike a nerve with someone there on a simple "neutral" question? ... As I said it's just .... interesting.

Well, if your claim that we have friends in common (I'm talking real friends not just internet "buddies") is true, then you should have no questions about my integrity or who I am as you stated you (now) do in your last post. You can simply ask them.

Yeah, out of 300k+ members I have 23 on ignore. And your point? I'm not the sharpest tool in the box but, it's there for a reason .. no? Or ... is it just that I added you that bothers you most? I can remove you if you like. In fact I will. Truth is I don't need an ignore ... to ignore.

Anyway, a pissing match is really not what I wanted to start 4x. I Just had an opinion about the way things are done here. Sorry if that bothers you. I'll not bother you again and you have my apologies.

For the record though I did actually follow the interaction between you and RJ. (Yes, I get around ) I get it, you don't like him. Perhaps you should start a private thread like I did then. One more point for the record, if I saw anyone treated that way I'd ..... jump. So your inference that I'm somehow subservient to RJ is simply ... childish.

I'm bowing out gracefully now. If you need to believe it's because "I'm wrong" so be it. But it's really just that I don't wish to clutter up this fine, fair thread.
Ghost Rider - WWTBMD?
  • #1,134
  • Dec 11, 2014 11:35pm Dec 11, 2014 11:35pm
Latest news folks :

http://penguintraders.com/forums/top...rminated-users

They are taking this way too far. Didnt I bet that they would try to appear as martyrs toward their existing followers ....
Daily progress produces consistent growth
  • #1,135
  • Dec 12, 2014 12:02am Dec 12, 2014 12:02am
Quoting Daimari
Latest news folks : http://penguintraders.com/forums/top...rminated-users They are taking this way too far. Didnt I bet that they would try to appear as martyrs toward their existing followers ....
Looks like that they are about to start a cult
Daily progress produces consistent growth
  • #1,136
  • Dec 12, 2014 12:55am Dec 12, 2014 12:55am
Quoting Daimari
{quote} Looks like that they are about to start a cult
Every scammer's thread behaves like a religious cult.
'Thank you, Master...'
'God bless our Professor...'
'What a great soul...'
'He is the best trader FF ever saw...'
Etc
It is like in a joke - in a mental hospital, whoever is first to put the white smock on, is the doctor.
  • #1,137
  • Dec 12, 2014 3:18am Dec 12, 2014 3:18am
Quoting 4xPIPAHOLIC
{quote} No kidding it is your last reply cause you know you are wrong....... I have been around as long as you have, the difference is I spend most of my time trading and the members that know me know me good,some of them are even you friends and know what type of person I am. I used to come here only in my free time. The issue here is not who is known better. I have nothing against you and I did not think you had anything against me. You come and post on my thread something that is by a member that I have ingnored. I do not think you would like...
4x, for the love of Forex, man, shut this piece of crap down! You said you petitioned Twee. My only issue with that is that when I have asked Twee to get back to me, he always has, and very quickly too. Before you say I am a shill, please go back and check posts between Chris and I, we do not always agree. But he is a contributing member in good standing. No one can argue that. 4x, tear down this wall! Please, sir! You have all the power, this is your thread. Think about how you wield this power!
If you are good at something, never do it for free--Joker
  • #1,138
  • Dec 12, 2014 3:44am Dec 12, 2014 3:44am
Quoting jmn5611
{quote} 4x, for the love of Forex, man, shut this piece of crap down! You said you petitioned Twee. My only issue with that is that when I have asked Twee to get back to me, he always has, and very quickly too. Before you say I am a shill, please go back and check posts between Chris and I, we do not always agree. But he is a contributing member in good standing. No one can argue that. 4x, tear down this wall! Please, sir! You have all the power, this is your thread. Think about how you wield this power!
Got to agree. Said this to 4xpips on pm ages ago. Chris has a great thread and we now got people who are respected members putting each other on ignore. Madness. RJ put Hanover on ignore for heavens sake ... how crazy is that ????
  • #1,139
  • Dec 12, 2014 4:22am Dec 12, 2014 4:22am
Quoting claudia1
{quote} Got to agree. Said this to 4xpips on pm ages ago. Chris has a great thread and we now got people who are respected members putting each other on ignore. Madness. RJ put Hanover on ignore for heavens sake ... how crazy is that ????
OK, regardless of opinions about this specific thread...isn't that a tad childish to say the least?
Ignoring someone (regardless of their standing on this forum) just because you don't like a thread in which they participate? And in Chris' case, participation without any accusations or malice towards any others. How does this warrant being ignored by a respected member?

Does the reaction seem logical to everyone but me!?
Wealth comes from what you keep, not what you earn
  • #1,140
  • Dec 12, 2014 5:37am Dec 12, 2014 5:37am
Quoting claudia1
RJ put Hanover on ignore for heavens sake ... how crazy is that ????
No big surprise. I'm shamelessly opinionated about certain things, and I don't expect everybody to agree with me. Now there are only 313,999 members for me to annoy.

I think a lot of people take this forum, comments that are posted, and their reputations, much too seriously.
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