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Transient Zones - Basics

  • #141
  • Oct 22, 2014 12:36pm Oct 22, 2014 12:36pm
Quoting SunSaltwater
{quote} I take it Kiads is a professional trader and taking the piss? Some strange people out there. I am going to just watch for a while and end the contribution, obviously not worth it. Good luck out there.
Been there. Done that. The thing is my friend, posting charts in hindsight is something even a 12 year old can do and appear smart. An considering the fact that you are a new member on FF. About 30 posts so far I see. First, show some 'skin'. That means, show some live trade examples. win rates. R:R. even some losses. Practicals. Not theory. Maybe even a trade explorer(no matter how flawed). Then you'll begin to gain some respect(at least in my books). How do you think EURUSDD got the attention of so many intelligent traders here? By simply talking? He put his reputation where his mouth was. Made some live calls. Put up trade explorers(no matter how briefly), suffered some losses. That's how you show some 'skin'. That's how you get the right kind of attention. My 2 cents.
  • #142
  • Oct 22, 2014 12:39pm Oct 22, 2014 12:39pm
Quoting SunSaltwater
{quote} I take it Kiads is a professional trader and taking the piss? Some strange people out there. I am going to just watch for a while and end the contribution, obviously not worth it. Good luck out there.
Oh Boy, don't be angry my friend.. (please.. you are my friend), and don't you read my signature..? I'm noob and always noob after this whole 14 years in financial market.. and always willing to learn from everybody.. including you. So, please don't get me wrong..

But, regarding trade without any indicators ? i can't do that since i'm indicators coder, and correct me if i'm wrong, that anything we can see 'visually' in our chart to recognize instrument movement is indicators including candlestick formations or any other type of charts that help us to 'indicate' what's going on atm.. ?

best regard
MTH
  • #143
  • Oct 22, 2014 5:55pm Oct 22, 2014 5:55pm
Quoting LITEchild
{quote} Been there. Done that. The thing is my friend, posting charts in hindsight is something even a 12 year old can do and appear smart. An considering the fact that you are a new member on FF. About 30 posts so far I see. First, show some 'skin'. That means, show some live trade examples. win rates. R:R. even some losses. Practicals. Not theory. Maybe even a trade explorer(no matter how flawed). Then you'll begin to gain some respect(at least in my books). How do you think EURUSDD got the attention of so many intelligent traders here? By simply...
Sorry, but this is comical to me. I don't want attention, I don't need to prove myself to anyone on here. My only motivation PERIOD was trying to help simplify what TZ is all about with easy to understand language and straight forward charts.....again, I felt this thread and the Similarity one was lacking in this regard. That was it, I couldn't care less about proving myself to anyone, I can just as soon disappear as quickly as I came, I am not selling or trying to gain anything from anyone on here by my posts. Hindsight charts? LOL, who cares, I would have loved some hindsight charts when I first came to the Similarity thread as simple and as clear as mine so that people could actually see what was happening.

The one thing I did gain, unintentionally I might add, is a lot of PM's thanking me for making it easier for people to see what TZ's is all about. I will admit this is a nice feeling knowing that you may have helped someone. "....get the right kind of attention" LOL, again, couldn't care less and have no clue what that even means.

I probably won't engage in further back and forth, simply not worth my time.

Cheers.
  • #144
  • Oct 22, 2014 5:59pm Oct 22, 2014 5:59pm
Quoting vlady1974
{quote} It's not about whether we are professional traders or not. Post #1 - this is a beginner's thread for the purpose of explaining TZs. You made a leap in your understanding, and you thought that it was worth sharing. Fantastic. But from what I've read - as good as it is - you've made the assumption that your view of the world can be learned by others. As an NLP practitioner, I can tell you it doesn't work that way - no matter how you think you've simplified it. So I don't want you to take this the wrong way - you're on the right track. But...
So strange....my actual goal was to make it as simple and basic as possible because it was being grossly overcomplicated.....wow, LOL.
  • #145
  • Oct 22, 2014 6:02pm Oct 22, 2014 6:02pm
Quoting Kiads
{quote} Oh Boy, don't be angry my friend.. (please.. you are my friend), and don't you read my signature..? I'm noob and always noob after this whole 14 years in financial market.. and always willing to learn from everybody.. including you. So, please don't get me wrong.. But, regarding trade without any indicators ? i can't do that since i'm indicators coder, and correct me if i'm wrong, that anything we can see 'visually' in our chart to recognize instrument movement is indicators including candlestick formations or any other type of...
Fair enough point, if indicators improve your trading by all means carry on. With all the sayings, and trading diatribe spouted all over the web only one thing really matters, profit, do you make consistent profit. If your trading account is growing keep on keeping on even if your chart has a zillion indicators on it and you can't even see the price bars, again, all that matters is that bottom line.

Cheers.
  • #146
  • Oct 22, 2014 6:05pm Oct 22, 2014 6:05pm
Thanks Vlady for all your effort and help. I was hoping you or someone could clarify if my understanding of how the recurrent stats works is right.

Right now, on the EurUsd 4h chart, I have the indy set at 6 left, 4 right, and it gives me 92% chance (with fractal bars)
If I change the setting to 6 left, 16 right, the chance only increases to more than 92%. Lets just say 93% even though it isn't quite that high.

Lets assume those averages actually play out... That would mean that:
in 100 trades, 92 of the 100 come back into the zone within four candles. That leaves 8 trades that didn't touch/get filled within the first 4 candles.
In the next 12 candles (which would total 16 candles) only 1 more gets filled (now totaling 93 touched). That means after the first 4 candles there is only a 1 in 8 chance of getting filled in the next 12 candles.

If that math is right, and I am sure I'm doing something wrong, then that means there is a 92% chance of a transient zone being retouched within the first 4 candles. For those zones that don't get touched in the first 4 candles, there is only a 12.5% chance they will be touched in the next 12 candles.

Please correct my thinking. Stat class was over 30 years ago.
  • #147
  • Oct 22, 2014 6:17pm Oct 22, 2014 6:17pm
Quoting SunSaltwater
Do you see it? Short based on discretion anywhere in the black arrow area, take profit anywhere in the white arrow area as price comes back to fill the transient zone drawn by the different coloured boxes. Long same thing, but purple and light blue arrows. Study this chart and my previous post. This is all you need. Zero indicators. {image}


Thanks SunSaltwater!
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  • #148
  • Oct 22, 2014 6:19pm Oct 22, 2014 6:19pm
Quoting SunSaltwater
{quote} I would have loved some hindsight charts when I first came to the Similarity thread as simple and as clear as mine so that people could actually see what was happening.
so you're saying ALL the charts and help given on the similarity thread by so many great and helpful people are not simple and clear enough? That in itself is an insult to the effort being done here by Vlady. Nobody has made it simpler and clearer than Vlady(and a few others) have done. You are being very pompous and arrogant for someone who is just here to help. Hindsight charts are easy make 'simple' and 'clear' like yours! That's how scammers appear at first too...(not necessarily saying you are one), but thats why it is always needful to be wary of new members who suddenly appear out the blue just to 'help'! Whatever.
  • #149
  • Oct 22, 2014 6:27pm Oct 22, 2014 6:27pm
Price isn't 97% TZ? Really? Really? It is if you look at it like my mind does, maybe I am crazy
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  • #150
  • Oct 22, 2014 6:32pm Oct 22, 2014 6:32pm
Quoting LITEchild
{quote} so you're saying ALL the charts and help given on the similarity thread by so many great and helpful people are not simple and clear enough? That in itself is an insult to the effort being done here by Vlady. Nobody has made it simpler and clearer than Vlady(and a few others) have done. You are being very pompous and arrogant for someone who is just here to help. Hindsight charts are easy make 'simple' and 'clear' like yours! That's how scammers appear at first too...(not necessarily saying you are one), but thats why it is always needful...
I am saying EXACTLY that, it wasn't clear to me. Maybe it was clear to Lady and hundreds of others, but to me the thread was very complicated so I attempted to make it simple and clearer for other people that may have been struggling and didn't 'get it' when looking at it from other people's posts, perhaps even EurUsd himself. If I helped one person fantastic.....pompous and arrogant? LOL Wow.

One last time, I am not trying to sell anything, or gain anything from my posts so no clue how I am scamming.....not sure why it's difficult to understand this.
  • #151
  • Oct 22, 2014 6:51pm Oct 22, 2014 6:51pm
Quoting SunSaltwater
Price isn't 97% TZ? Really? Really? It is if you look at it like my mind does, maybe I am crazy {image}
Why not put some trades where your mouth is? Have you taken even ONE trade based on all the theaory you are spouting?
Here are four charts(trades) I'm in presently. Based on what is being explained here. 'simple' and 'clear' enough for you? I dare you to show even ONE! If not, then maybe you are crazy afterall. Your words not mine.
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  • #152
  • Oct 22, 2014 7:04pm Oct 22, 2014 7:04pm
Quoting LITEchild
{quote} Why not put some trades where your mouth is? Have you taken even ONE trade based on all the theaory you are spouting? Here are four charts(trades) I'm in presently. Based on what is being explained here. 'simple' and 'clear' enough for you? I dare you to show even ONE! If not, then maybe you are crazy afterall. Your words not mine. {image} {image} {image} {image}
You need help my friend. Against my better judgment, please see below a trade executed this evening. Posting this in real time would be very difficult as it lasted less than 2 mins. Now please leave me alone, put me on ignore if you wish.
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  • #153
  • Oct 22, 2014 7:22pm Oct 22, 2014 7:22pm
Quoting SunSaltwater
{quote} You need help my friend. Against my better judgment, please see below a trade executed this evening. Posting this in real time would be very difficult as it lasted less than 2 mins. Now please leave me alone, put me on ignore if you wish. {image}
Dude! The attached char shows the trade dynamics from the account history you posted. The green horizontal line marks your entry price. The red horizontal line marks your exit. How the blazes does that trade have anything to do with TZs?
For the last confimed TZ I'vemarked the proper entry. Based on the currently forming potential TZs, probability says to SELL, not yet BUY. And you're trying to help others? What a joke! 3pips??? What was the risk? Where was your stop? I think it's better you just shut up, humble yourself and learn what is being taught here. You obviously don't know what you are doing and desperately looking for attention and respect. Again another suspicious trait of potential scammers. And by the way, name calling is only childish if it doesn't fit. Stop being an idiot.
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  • #154
  • Oct 22, 2014 7:23pm Oct 22, 2014 7:23pm
Quoting SunSaltwater
{quote} You need help my friend. Against my better judgment, please see below a trade executed this evening. Posting this in real time would be very difficult as it lasted less than 2 mins. Now please leave me alone, put me on ignore if you wish. {image}
Quoting LITEchild
{quote} Dude! The attached char shows the trade dynamics from the account history you posted. How the blazes does that trade have anything to do with TZs? For the last confimed TZ I'vemarked the proper entry. Based on the currently forming potential TZs, probability says to SELL, not yet BUY. And you're trying to help others? What a joke! 3pips??? What was the risk? Where was your stop? {image}
Chill fellas, chill...

http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...32#post7818532
  • #155
  • Oct 22, 2014 7:36pm Oct 22, 2014 7:36pm
Quoting LITEchild
{quote} Dude! The attached char shows the trade dynamics from the account history you posted. The green horizontal line marks your entry price. The red horizontal line marks your exit. How the blazes does that trade have anything to do with TZs? For the last confimed TZ I'vemarked the proper entry. Based on the currently forming potential TZs, probability says to SELL, not yet BUY. And you're trying to help others? What a joke! 3pips??? What was the risk? Where was your stop? I think it's better you just shut up, humble yourself and learn what is...
LOL, wow, just wow, I mean the whole thing, shocking is an understatement. Have a good life.
  • #156
  • Oct 22, 2014 7:55pm Oct 22, 2014 7:55pm
Hi,guys
there is nobody can help me?or he is right?this game is a game to find a confirmed top and bottom?
thx
Quoting Blackeagle
{quote} I know probability is on your side based on Eurusdd's explanations but what if the price DOES NOT go back to transient zone? Therefore I understand that if my zone turns out to be h-recurrent, my sell position will win, but I don't understand how my sell position wins if my zone turns out to be h-transient and price DOES NOT want to make it recurrent this time and price DOES NOT want to make it recurrent this time and keep going up? I believe this is where SL plays its part but then how about Eurusdd's win-win condition?...
This is Eurusdd say
Quoting Eurusdd
Let us supposed we know the yellow area but the market has not develop the blue area yet. We can then assume that when the region B is matured, it will be transient. So, we declare the area A as recurrent. We then move ahead to find sell position above B. Now, if the market pulls back into B, we win. If B turns out to be transient, our assumption of A as recurrent will give our sell a profit. Both ways, we will win!!!
http://i.imgur.com/mDehfGk.png​
  • #157
  • Oct 22, 2014 8:00pm Oct 22, 2014 8:00pm
How we know if the price will keep going down?
Guys look EU yestoday,the price is down,if we use the method of SunSaltwater,we will have a big risk.
  • #158
  • Oct 22, 2014 8:29pm Oct 22, 2014 8:29pm
Quoting Dr.Phoenix
{quote} Thanks for explanations. I will take a look at them closely. Edited. I have found that the "Middle of Bar" TZs are similar to the Hiddengap's zones.
Hiddengap's zones are like mid-bar TZs with h=1. But Hiddengap's zones take one another factor into consideration, that is volatility, measured by comparing the size of their bodies which must sastisfy the condition that bigger than n bars prior to those bars to become Hiddengap's zones - WRB. WRBs are only tradable zones, like TZs. To trade them there are a school of price action can be applied to. Just dropped some words to share a coincidence between TZs and WRBs, do not want to be out of topic and on the wrong track of this great thread by Vlady1974.

@Vlady1974: This is where your ...... one-bar to right
  • #159
  • Oct 22, 2014 8:43pm Oct 22, 2014 8:43pm
Quoting blueface
Hi,guys there is nobody can help me?or he is right?this game is a game to find a confirmed top and bottom? thx {quote} This is Eurusdd say {quote}
Because in reality;
1-for a single timeframe, there are always 2 sides of zones; the short side zone and the long side zone sandwiching price.
2-for a single timeframe, these zones overlap, depending on number of values of H used
3-scale #1 + #2 for multiple timeframes to get the overall reading.
  • #160
  • Oct 22, 2014 8:47pm Oct 22, 2014 8:47pm
Quoting Relativity
{quote} Because in reality; 1-for a single timeframe, there are always 2 sides of zones; the short side zone and the long side zone sandwiching price. 2-for a single timeframe, these zones overlap, depending on number of values of H used 3-scale #1 + #2 for multiple timeframes to get the overall reading.
Thanks Relativity
I will try multiple timeframes,thx
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