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The similarity system

  • #10,341
  • Oct 17, 2014 1:08am Oct 17, 2014 1:08am
Quoting LITEchild
{quote} Hey buddy! Never got to thank you for the insight into UTZs! Works like a charm. Notice that the last 10 UTZs on M30(h=24) were all winners. No losses.(if you managed your exits well of course). Cheers!
Hi LITEchild,
Are you talking about EU? If so, they look untradable to me (I'm assuming that you trade away from them). The problem is that if you wait for them to be fully formed (h=24 in your example) then the move away has already happened in most cases. You might be able to pick up a few more scraps but at what cost / stop loss? And if you try to anticipate them before they're fully formed then you risk getting hit because several look like they are going to be full UTZs but they become invalid before middle+24 bar.

Also, you said that the last 10 on M30 were all winners but on my chart the one at 09:30 GMT on Oct-14 was a loser (price broke below it after middle+24 bar).

Kudos to you if you're managing to trade this method on its own but for me it can only be a backup signal.
You reap what you sow.
  • #10,342
  • Oct 17, 2014 2:40am Oct 17, 2014 2:40am
Quoting FX-Jay
If you feel inclined to hate or give bad/useless/nonconstructive thoughts, I just need you to read these posts before: (I bet all your questions have been answered there) http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?p=7785885#post7785885 http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?p=7785904#post7785904 This is as real & good as it gets. I started this journey live on this thread. Please go back and check my posts from day 1 which is almost a month ago. If I can do it, I don't see any reason why you can't. Again I repeat, read...
Hi FX-Jay,

Congratulations mate, you have worked hard for this. It feels nice to be a part of this thread(though I haven't contributed much), it feels great just to know that success is achievable in forex. Now I know two people(Jay and EURUSDD) who are successful in ways which is hard for others to imagine.

Very well done!!

Ravs
  • #10,343
  • Edited 11:47am Oct 17, 2014 2:43am | Edited 11:47am
Quoting vlady1974
{quote} Congratulations Jay! AMAZING RESULTS! GENIUS IMPLEMENTATION! You're one of a handful that got the gist and grafted hard, and certainly one of the very few to stamp their own creativity into making it their own. A shining example. ================= For the rest of you reading this.... I wonder how many of you will respond by: asking for the indicator that he used to achieve this? asking what "specific" techniques he used? asking what concepts out of the 1 million that are on here, he used specifically asking...
This is my account story so far. I made a new one for this.

100% - 110% - 120% - 80% - 120% - 130% - 120% - 90% - EDIT - 115%

This is just 3 days, the % not correlated to how many trade I took but roughly how the account went. Two big losses on GU one due to poor mm the other poor entry and all had to be cut before they turned profit. Yesterday's EU took a huge chunk out. Since Wednesday it went ape shit with news I was expecting it to follow yesterday's news and held on to a loser but price did'nt give 2 cents about news and I took way way too much extra losses which illustrates a few points.

Was there a TZ to trade to for the GU? Yes but I, not price was not capable of getting to it. Was there a TZ for the EU? Honestly on my personal settings none. I was just being stupid.

The wins/recovery were all sound implementation of the TZs so to speak.

So whats my point?

This subject of TZ has 3 modules. What is a TZ (A), Be a trader (B), How to use a TZ(C)

1) (A) Has been quite extensively explained so if you want your credits for this module just read the thread. Get this straight first then go for (B), (C). Don't try both at the same time. Already I am telling you how to approach the subject. This is the first step.

2) I only have a 90% account as I type this and I speak like I'm FX-Jay with a 800% account. Because I can hah! Look I pass (A) fairly well, after some time and help thankfully and I'll out right say that I barely pass as a trader else I'll have a 300% account or something by now. You'll have your stupid moments were your mind is not working and you lose a chunk because of this that and blah blah, I can't help you. No one can help me too. This is the only caveat/demon we must each face on our own. So welcome to module (B)! Most people get stuck here contrary to what they think.

3) Finally module (C)! Well the rigorous demands of this thread dictates that you spend 5 years on a remote mountain practicing module (B) before you can finally complete this module! Haha you can skip right here actually at your own risk but really you should have some basic proficiency as a trader. Serious. Ok now assuming "trader"mode is on always ask :

Where is my TZ?
How it look on the other Tfs?
Is this a UTZ/TZ/FTZ/PTZ
Do it trade away from or towards it?
When do I make my move?

Eg Oh looky a TZ! Hmm seems in sync on the other TFs...ah its a UTZ..uneven hmm Vlady said something bout these. I think I should trade away from this. Ok if PA bounces off some support or my magic indy say so I will enter and trade away from it!

And this is how you make pips. Credits in (A), (B) and (C) nothing less.

Tip again..Some TZs you trade away from and some you trade a return to. There is already an almost textbook on the away type thanks to V. The master has been talking about the return type since day 1. It should be decently obvious what kind of TZ you return to.
I want more brain power!
  • #10,344
  • Oct 17, 2014 2:53am Oct 17, 2014 2:53am
Quoting NorthTrader
{quote} Hi LITEchild, Are you talking about EU?
Yes

Quoting NorthTrader
{quote} If so, they look untradable to me
Why?

Quoting NorthTrader
{quote} (I'm assuming that you trade away from them).
Not necessarily.

Quoting NorthTrader
{quote}The problem is that if you wait for them to be fully formed (h=24 in your example) then the move away has already happened in most cases. You might be able to pick up a few more scraps but at what cost / stop loss?
These are scalping setups. Each UTZ yielded a minimum of 1:1 R:R. Remember in scalping, entries and exits are extremely vital. UTZs themselve are not the entries. Just setups. Whats your entry trigger? Exits should be at least 1:1.

Quoting NorthTrader
{quote}And if you try to anticipate them before they're fully formed then you risk getting hit because several look like they are going to be full UTZs but they become invalid before middle+24 bar.
I don't usually anticipate them.

Quoting NorthTrader
Also, you said that the last 10 on M30 were all winners but on my chart the one at 09:30 GMT on Oct-14 was a loser (price broke below it after middle+24 bar).
You mean UTZ No.4? It wasn't a loser.

Quoting NorthTrader
{quote} Kudos to you if you're managing to trade this method on its own but for me it can only be a backup signal.
It's ok to use as backup signal.
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  • #10,345
  • Oct 17, 2014 3:04am Oct 17, 2014 3:04am
Quoting bradu
{quote} Valdy, that guy asked a very good question (i saw that posted many times and no clear answer, except classic read the thread..etc), even posted charts to see his toughts and mistakes. wouldnt it be better iif you - since you seem to understand the concept, just tell him the right interpretation of those zones, on the same chart...maybe with one egsample of a good (by the rules) trade on a confirmed zone ? i mean there are a few of you guys that seem to understand the concept,...
These are the kind of statements that are very disrespectful to the efforts made by others to try and help. Simply because you don't understand what is being explained doesn't mean the problem is from the person doing the explaining. Have you thought maybe the problem is from YOU not understanding? Too lazy maybe? Too thick maybe? Too biased maybe? Too tired? Too drunk? I mean, many explanations here have been spot on and clear as daylight. Give credit where it is due and stop whining like cry babies. And a little gratitude doesn't hurt.
  • #10,346
  • Oct 17, 2014 3:06am Oct 17, 2014 3:06am
Quoting burnssss
I still think that the thread of "delicate secret", also has relation with "tz" for the way in which omega appears. Somewhat confused.:nerd: Sorry: the thread of "3-plan" is where appear omega.
Hi burnssss,
Yes, I also thought delicate secret is related to transient/recurrent idea. But cannot duplicate his chart exactly.
(I borrowed transient zone indicator(h=2) from Freefox. Thanks to him.)

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I also think 3-plan is related to transient/recurrent.
(I have to go work now, so cannot attach charts now.)

Thank you,
  • #10,347
  • Oct 17, 2014 3:12am Oct 17, 2014 3:12am
Quoting LITEchild
{quote} Yes {quote} Why? {quote} Not necessarily. {quote} These are scalping setups. Each UTZ yielded a minimum of 1:1 R:R. Remember in scalping, entries and exits are extremely vital. UTZs themselve are not the entries. Just setups. Whats your entry trigger? Exits should be at least 1:1. {quote} I don't usually anticipate them. {quote} You mean UTZ No.4? It wasn't a loser. {quote} It's ok to use as backup signal. {image}
Yes, the UTZ are set ups.

There is a popular measurement you can use every week that can support the direction that is indicated by a UTZ setup. Go with the direction.
A pip is only worth it if you know how much you risked to earn it
  • #10,348
  • Oct 17, 2014 3:14am Oct 17, 2014 3:14am
Quoting jimsterk
{quote} Hi burnssss, Yes, I also thought delicate secret is related to transient/recurrent idea. But cannot duplicate his chart exactly. (I borrowed transient zone indicator(h=2) from Freefox. Thanks to him.) {image} {image} I also think 3-plan is related to transient/recurrent. (I have to go work now, so cannot attach charts now.) Thank you,
Excellent! I haven't read the Delicate Secret in a while, but I do know this is inter-related. Your charts are spot on... Perhaps we can work out a basic logical extension to the TZs.
A pip is only worth it if you know how much you risked to earn it
  • #10,349
  • Oct 17, 2014 3:27am Oct 17, 2014 3:27am
Quoting vlady1974
{quote} Yes, the UTZ are set ups. There is a popular measurement you can use every week that can support the direction that is indicated by a UTZ setup. Go with the direction.
Yes indeed! But just trying to illustrate that trading TZs alone(scalping) from a probability oriented mindest, works just fine too. No extra filters. Just work out sensible entry and exit triggers is all. Simple works just fine too.
  • #10,350
  • Oct 17, 2014 3:28am Oct 17, 2014 3:28am
Quoting jimsterk
{quote} Hi burnssss, Yes, I also thought delicate secret is related to transient/recurrent idea. But cannot duplicate his chart exactly. (I borrowed transient zone indicator(h=2) from Freefox. Thanks to him.) {image} {image} I also think 3-plan is related to transient/recurrent. (I have to go work now, so cannot attach charts now.) Thank you,
Hi jimsterk,
everything is related !!.
I was reading "3-plan." Simply "not have 3 losses in a row" made ​​me think. Omega means recurrent zone. When the price reaches omega, "eurusdd" trade in the life of the candle. omega is the stoploss !!
Interesting.
  • #10,351
  • Oct 17, 2014 3:36am Oct 17, 2014 3:36am
Quoting LITEchild
{quote} Yes indeed! But just trying to illustrate that trading TZs alone(scalping) from a probability oriented mindest, works just fine too. No extra filters. Just work out sensible entry and exit triggers is all. Simple works just fine too.
Mate, apologies - I wrote that on the train! LOL
It wasn't directed at you directly but I liked your post so much I thought I'd add a crypic clue for the worthy ones.

Speaking of scalps.... what is your size definition of "scalp" is it anything under x pips? eg. 40-50? 10-20?
I figure that PTZ -> UTZ are best in ranging so that would typically be 80-100 ATR? So about 2-3 trades on a 40 pip target.... or 5-10 on lower target?
A pip is only worth it if you know how much you risked to earn it
  • #10,352
  • Oct 17, 2014 3:40am Oct 17, 2014 3:40am
Hello house, hope you all are pipping. I have totally changed the way i see market. This tz thing is really powerful. This is a lifetime study. My mind is blown and i have become humbled. I went back to the begining of the thread. And also tz concept from page 286.
Learning new stuffs. Theres so much work to be done.
  • #10,353
  • Oct 17, 2014 3:42am Oct 17, 2014 3:42am
Quoting ephisi
Hello house, hope you all are pipping. I have totally changed the way i see market. This tz thing is really powerful. This is a lifetime study. My mind is blown and i have become humbled. I went back to the begining of the thread. And also tz concept from page 286. Learning new stuffs. Theres so much work to be done.
Mate you said it. There are sooooo many applications.
A pip is only worth it if you know how much you risked to earn it
  • #10,354
  • Oct 17, 2014 3:45am Oct 17, 2014 3:45am
Quoting vlady1974
{quote} Mate, apologies - I wrote that on the train! LOL It wasn't directed at you directly but I liked your post so much I thought I'd add a crypic clue for the worthy ones. Speaking of scalps.... what is your size definition of "scalp" is it anything under x pips? eg. 40-50? 10-20? I figure that PTZ -> UTZ are best in ranging so that would typically be 80-100 ATR? So about 2-3 trades on a 40 pip target.... or 5-10 on lower target?
hahaha. No need to apologise buddy, I understand the angle you're coming from. I only mentioned simplicity, so some will not accuse us of hiding some 'secret' filter without which TZs don't work! I know you are aware I use the weekly filter you talked about, but honestly the TZs work well without it too...and speaking of scalps...I define mine as any trade that moves Stops to BE or closes at minimum 1:1 R:R(9<R<51pips).
  • #10,355
  • Oct 17, 2014 3:55am Oct 17, 2014 3:55am
Quoting LITEchild
{quote} hahaha. No need to apologise buddy, I understand the angle you're coming from. I only mentioned simplicity, so some will not accuse us of hiding some 'secret' filter without which TZs don't work! I know you are aware I use the weekly filter you talked about, but honestly the TZs work well without it too...and speaking of scalps...I define mine as any trade that moves Stops to BE or closes at minimum 1:1 R:R(9<R<51pips).

Cool! Cool! That's great to know and compare!

The 1:1 works well for me on the 15M which is why I wondered what effect going to 30M would do or whether I'd have to adjust the h value as effectively I'd have twice as less bars on the 15M so hence potentially wider SL or R. I will have to investigate this - so thanks for doing the 30M research!

Just recently I've been trying to understand and implement Van Tharp's concept of R multiples... so I've been re-analysing my setups/methods and finding some gaping holes in my treatment (or lack thereof) of position sizing.
A pip is only worth it if you know how much you risked to earn it
  • #10,356
  • Oct 17, 2014 4:00am Oct 17, 2014 4:00am
Quoting vlady1974
{quote} Mate you said it. There are sooooo many applications.
Yes mate, im speechless
  • #10,357
  • Oct 17, 2014 4:10am Oct 17, 2014 4:10am
An uneven transient is simply a failed retest. Not a new concept, and certainly not a winning one without another filter. Too many potential fails between the confirmations. There is however, a filter... Lower settings or timeframes combined.
  • #10,358
  • Oct 17, 2014 4:18am Oct 17, 2014 4:18am
with respect to thread creator
systems:
stoch/BB + 1MA/BB:
you are actually trading the diverenge of 300,1,1 stoch to Price Close
when stoch cretaes diverenge which it happens way rare then the 5,3,3 setup you assume that price will test that level again. nothing magical. just a math underlying stoch

MTF stoch differencies:
is the cause of bar gaps occuers during the fast price moves. data feed fails to print complete bar on 5min TF but at the same time prints the bar at 1 min TF this creates a difference between two stoch calculations and again you assume that price will retest that fast price move zone again for filling the micro gap. the issue is it really might be a micro gap or it might be a data feed mismatch due to connection and/or broker data errors.

TZ zones:
are 5 bar fractals. an improved version B.Williams fractals of 2-3 bars. you can go upto 10 even 100 what ever fits you. but this migth have an edge

my2cnts
GL
My Best Trade is Next Trade!
  • #10,359
  • Oct 17, 2014 4:18am Oct 17, 2014 4:18am
Quoting vlady1974
{quote} Cool! Cool! That's great to know and compare! The 1:1 works well for me on the 15M which is why I wondered what effect going to 30M would do or whether I'd have to adjust the h value as effectively I'd have twice as less bars on the 15M so hence potentially wider SL or R. I will have to investigate this - so thanks for doing the 30M research! Just recently I've been trying to understand and implement Van Tharp's concept of R multiples... so I've been re-analysing my setups/methods and finding some gaping holes in my treatment (or...
1:1 works well on most timeframes if you know how to relate the action to the price. Price is the same on all timeframes. I know someone who scalps well on the Daily TF! That being said, I started getting really interested in scalping as whole after seeing the results a good friend of mine started achiving recently(919gilead). He still holds a day job and he's managed to make about 150% in 17days. On a live account. So far 44 trades, 2 losses. Win rate, 95% and very few trades making above 15pips. That makes a strong case for scalping. I only use him as an example because he has a trade explorer to verify the stats.
I'm sure it's possible to achive similar using TZs. EURUSDD also demonstrated something similar when he traded a demo account with a verifying TE recently. I started too, but ran into problems with my position sizing. The lure of high leverage trading. Anyway, I'll keep at it and open up another TE to track my progress. For the time being I only swing trade on my live account which is doing just fine thank you.
  • #10,360
  • Oct 17, 2014 4:23am Oct 17, 2014 4:23am
Quoting leeshindig
An uneven transient is simply a failed retest. Not a new concept, and certainly not a winning one without another filter. Too many potential fails between the confirmations. There is however, a filter... Lower settings or timeframes combined.
Why? Care to show proof of that statement? It mostly hinges on your h value on a particular timeframe.
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