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  • #141
  • Jun 11, 2013 4:37pm Jun 11, 2013 4:37pm
Quoting tarrini65
i did not want to offend dancing phil ...mine was real curiosity ...how would you act with 50 million in your account ? i would not trade for sure , 4 percent a year from a bank is easy to get with such a deposit , i live in italy , and you can imagine how great life would be . I never heard of a trader like him posting in this losers rooms. I am really interested in the way he trades, i love countertrend , i cancelled my trade explorer because i don't want to count all the money i have lost in these 4 years .I have a business and a good life ,...
I have a hide like a rhinoceros and I don't get offended or rattled by the opinions of others. Perhaps I am a sociopath that way. I've been spat on, abused too many times (I'm an ex-cop) as well as shot at and nearly stabbed. It was in 20 years of business (after being a cop) that I found out where all the criminals were hiding. I certainly got much more death threats in business than I did as a cop.

As a businessman I learned that I hate owning and operating businesses - because they have employees. I hate the feeling of being tied down and of having to be there. I resented having to work so hard to meet payroll every week for 245 families, while never did I have a week with all 245 shoulders honestly applied to the business.

If it is human, it lies, cheats and steals; at least part of the time and to varying degrees.

I am not going to start a thread. I have no interest or desire in being committed and responsible for it. Read that is I have much better things to do. The occasional mentoring I can enjoy, while retaining my freedom of movement and mood. Those I have mentored have always been very understanding that when I am around, I am fully engaged with them. And when I disappear and fuck off, there can be a void for a week or two where they must think more for themselves, experiment and review what I have taught them up until that time.

We all have our personal decision to make for our wealth needs and when enough is enough. I have never traded for the money; rather I have always found trading to be a mental challenge much more interesting to master than learning crossword puzzles.

I do admit to a personal curiosity as to just how large a trader can grow. I am no where near such a limit at only 500 lots. Forex is a 50,000,000 lots per day market; though very small amounts of that is at 400:1 leverage.
  • #142
  • Jun 12, 2013 1:46am Jun 12, 2013 1:46am
Quoting Chicky
{quote} With $240,000 - Quite possible if you are a very good trader With $3,000 - No.
top man! I'm with you
https://linktr.ee/Soultrader
  • #143
  • Jun 13, 2013 11:21am Jun 13, 2013 11:21am
Quoting dancingphil
I have been trading for many years. I am up $50 Million and change now. But at the beginning, I blew up many $200 live accounts before I finally got over my emotional issues to trade successfully. Back in the day, I worked demo accounts with great passion to test and prove my strategy. When I felt I was ready, I would go live with $200. When I blew that up, I would go back to demo and work out what I was doing wrong. Was it my strategy, or was it me? It was always me. Trading live is a whole new set of emotions to deal with. I eventually learned...
Hi DP,

I am still looking for my own way after several years of up and downs and I am struggling like hell to reach some consistency!

Do you have any suggestion about readings or videos on human behaviours while trading? Or somethigh which has been significant to you?

And I would appreciate if you could give some hints for the "non conventional thinking".... I know what it means in general, I try to apply it every day (night), but can you give some direction where to look for or some examples?

Many thanks in advance if you could help and support us!

Puma
  • #144
  • Edited 6:30pm Jun 13, 2013 11:39am | Edited 6:30pm
Quoting puma
{quote} Hi DP, I am still looking for my own way after several years of up and downs and I am struggling like hell to reach some consistency! Do you have any suggestion about readings or videos on human behaviours while trading? Or somethigh which has been significant to you? And I would appreciate if you could give some hints for the "non conventional thinking".... I know what it means in general, I try to apply it every day (night), but can you give some direction where to look for or some examples? Many thanks in advance if you could help and...
Sure.

You "could" buy important ways to begin understanding them on Amazon. I didn't.

Nor did I buy them on www.thepiratebay.org with my utorrent.exe credit card.

But if I were window-shopping for 2 great audio-books on the subject of how our brains work, and how our emotions are important, I would look at:

"Jonah Lehrer - How We Decide" and,

"Jeff Hawkins - On Intelligence"

The fatigue or headache you get from learning a new skill, that sense of frustration etc; it is is the physical exercise of your brain growing new synapse - new brain cell connections to store new skills and memories.

We all have 10-30 billion neurons. No one knows how many because they are too tightly packed in together to count.

Between each neuron there are 5,000-15,000 synapse. That's 50-450 trillion brain-cell connections depending on who is counting; all dynamically growing with new skills learned.

The old school way of thinking is that our memories were stored in our neurons. Now they understand they are stored in our synapse. And it hurts just like tired or sore body muscles do when we exercise with weights.

Phil
  • #145
  • Jul 21, 2013 2:57am Jul 21, 2013 2:57am
There is no limit of making money from trading but to do that you need extensive practice in forex market. When you get you hands running in smooth, then there is no end to forex earning.
  • #146
  • Edited 4:32am Jul 21, 2013 3:54am | Edited 4:32am
Quoting MapleLeaf
{quote} QUOTED FOR TRUTH. I said it many times in this forum. 99.6% of traders LOSE LONG TERM. Only 0.4% are profitable after 1 year of trading. Go figure, people.

I am just getting frustrated by all the negative posts!
I did lot of research on this subject.Bottom truth is traders by occupation are 30% successful!!! Much better then conventional businesses.

Out of every 1000 new businesses, 40% fail within the first year,and 80% would fail within 5 years. Don’t celebrate yet because even if you have made it to 5 years, 80% of those businesses fail before they make it to 10 years. That leaves us with 4% of new businesses still around after 10 years.

With that perspective Trading is great! If you can't fking put the time,effort and train yourself then fk off and stop bitching and look for a job!
Getting sick of this losing BS

Lets compare conventional business VS trading
No rent
No overhead
No bad weather
No Employees to deal with (unless you are a fund,bank)
No merchandise getting old seating on the shelves
No Transportation required

Now think trading as business
24hr 5days trading
Just internet cost and minor spread.Ridiculously cheap to operate
Can trade from Cafe,Restaurant.Park even on top of your girlfriends butt
No delay in delivery!No merchandise getting spoiled,No weather issues!
Come on guys this is the heaven of business!What more do you want!
If you lose then work at it!Examine why!Maybe you are a long term swing trader and not a scalper!Maybe your approach is totally wrong!Maybe you are using a "system" which does not suit you.Your psychology,personality,nerves,habits,patience all play a role.Without throughout examination of yourself chances are you won't get far.
Demand more of yourself!Held yourself to higher standard.Challenge yourself!Without it life is worthless to me.
Seek and you shall find
Average 8-10% a month this month 18.5% on my 2nd year of trading.1st year was a washout then I stopped and did what I needed to do and still working getting better by every month.Key for me was educating myself.So I posted books that helped me the most.


"Bird Watching in Lion Country" might open your eyes about trading.

Trading in the Zone by Mark Douglas-classic book on trading psychology
The Disciplined Trader by Mark Douglas
REMINISCENCES OF A STOCK OPERATOR -about one of the greatest traders ever Jesse Livermore essentially he invented Pivot trading.Started at age 14 in Massachusetts my home state and by 17 bucket shops were trying to push him away because he was winning like crazy.Anyway I learned patience from him.
He would read the tape (equivalent of charts at the time) for weeks without any orders then fire his orders at the right time.
Super Trader by Van K.Tharp-Extremely valuable book on trading.Tharp takes no excuses.
Harmonic Trading-Anything by Scott Carney-his free ebook is on his site.

For inspiration read
THE MARKET WIZARDS 1 and New one by JACK D. SCHWAGER

Although not required but if you like probability theory read
Probability Theory:

The Logic of Science
by
E. T. Jaynes
Wayman Crow Professor of Physics
Washington University


They are challenging books for challenging career so get to it.They are no short cuts.
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In trading, you have to be defensive and aggressive at the same time
  • #147
  • Jul 21, 2013 12:54pm Jul 21, 2013 12:54pm

  1. http://assets.forexfactory.net/nfs/c...ar230796_8.gif
  2. Davit


I am just getting frustrated by all the negative posts!]


Hi Davit,
I have to express my admiration and gratitude.
Novice, non-profitable trader from UK.
Love the subject : politics, economics, business, psychology, technicals vs fundamentals etc etc etc
Despite very strong academic background in one of the professions I have found filtering through some of the available information overwhelming.
I really sincerely appreciate your various posts on your growth and improvement pathway - its a tall order and challenge but so helpful to have someones experience who is ahead of the game. Thank you.

  • #148
  • Jul 21, 2013 3:23pm Jul 21, 2013 3:23pm
Quoting ponzi
{image} Davit I am just getting frustrated by all the negative posts!] Hi Davit, I have to express my admiration and gratitude. Novice, non-profitable trader from UK. Love the subject : politics, economics, business, psychology, technicals vs fundamentals etc etc etc Despite very strong academic background in one of the professions I have found filtering through some of the available information overwhelming. I really sincerely appreciate your various posts on your growth and improvement pathway - its a tall order and challenge...

Ponzi
Nice post man.What hit me in the head was the realization that one must allow PA to do its thing and that requires time.That is why I swing trade and sometimes hold trades for a week or two.
Key is to get away from short TF at least for me.If you entered a short for example EC at 3760 and you know its high point for particular wave then allow price to fluctuate and come down. To feel relaxed about this you should reduce your lot size so you are not in panic when trade goes against you 20-30pips.That is the key.Most common traders place their stops too close and often once stopped out price goes back to their original direction without them hence you must develop strategy to overcome this.Increase your range and increase your pips.I normally go for 75-150pips but allow PA to do its thing.
Stop loss is grossly misunderstood in trading.In my opinion its the Brokers golden goose.
REad the material I posted you will have lots of ahhaa moments.
Keep in mind that trading is inherently ambiguous full of uncertainty and patience.You must train your brain to feel relaxed and ok even when you are stressed to max.
Most successful traders take this as occupational fact and thrive in it.Its in the head fear and greed and how to see the market within this context.
I always find posters who dismiss fundamentals or fundamental traders dismissing technical traders are doing themselves disservice.You need both.
When Bernanke speaks and you are looking at some chart,candle formation but fail to understand significance of him talking then you could find yourself missing a huge opportunity or getting into a big hole.
Trading is complex and reading the market correctly takes time,screen time.Write a journal and keep writing what you think is important and after a while things will come together.
Anyway please do read books I posted.Lot of them can be downloaded free in PDF format.I convert PDF into Mobi and read them on my Kindle paperwhite by converting with calibre free app.I read an hour before sleeping every night.Paperwhite is great product easy on the eyes advance light built in and long lasting battery.It can hold over 1k books
Regards
In trading, you have to be defensive and aggressive at the same time
  • #149
  • Jul 21, 2013 6:55pm Jul 21, 2013 6:55pm
simples, buy when the suckers are selling, and sell when the suckers are buying. think like a bank
https://linktr.ee/Soultrader
  • #150
  • Jul 22, 2013 2:47pm Jul 22, 2013 2:47pm
Quoting soultrader
simples, buy when the suckers are selling, and sell when the suckers are buying. think like a bank
And who do you do that? Determine who is who.
  • #151
  • Jul 25, 2013 7:22am Jul 25, 2013 7:22am
It mostly depends on the account of any trader. Speaking in terms of percentages many trader with small accounts often get more than 100% profit if they are good in trading.
  • #152
  • Jul 25, 2013 8:56am Jul 25, 2013 8:56am
Quoting hedging
It mostly depends on the account of any trader. Speaking in terms of percentages many trader with small accounts often get more than 100% profit if they are good in trading.
right, once or twice, but on the long run unfortunately very few will remain. But to trade with large sums is psychologically difficult (
  • #153
  • Jul 26, 2013 6:37am Jul 26, 2013 6:37am
Quoting DitterPD
{quote} And who do you do that? Determine who is who.
Sorry, not who, but how
  • #154
  • Jul 27, 2013 5:52am Jul 27, 2013 5:52am
This is purely subjective and depends upon the traders capability to make money.
  • #155
  • Jul 21, 2014 7:00am Jul 21, 2014 7:00am
Although the last reply to this thread was a year ago, but I have to reply because you guys are really destroying my confidence before migrating from demo to live account !
Why is everyone looking at the dark side? it's logical to explain to noobs like myself that it's not a dream world when it comes to trading, there is a dark side too! but why most of the opinions are pointing that I will eventually get into the dark side no matter what ?
I understand that "emotions" makes a huge difference when migrating from demo to live accounts, which I believe I can overcome with strict discipline, what else will make me eventually give away my account to some "professional" trader's pocket ? why can't I keep up the winning, and handling the losses and overcome them ?
I attached my custom money management screenshot, the previous month I started with 5000$ and ended with 4900$, I studied what I went through and this screenshot is how my account is doing this month so far... there is at least a month more before I can actually fund a live account, so I will have a total of 2.5 months of serious trading ( my experience is more than that with stocks and forex markets, but the 2.5 months are the ones which I actually treated the demo account as a live account and real money )....
I was very much confident, until I googled (why am I making huge profit on my forex demo account ? ), and it lead me here, where you guys destroyed that confidence may someone please explain logically why most of the posts here leads to make me sure that I will loose my profit and my funds at some point ? apart from emotions, what else will lead me there ?
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  • #156
  • Jul 21, 2014 11:38pm Jul 21, 2014 11:38pm
It is human nature to look at the dark side, guess we are all fatalistic to that extent. Confidence is like that, you can be as confident as you would want to be and all it would take to destroy it is a single thread here in fp. My two cents, concentrate on your strategy and if it works for you and with a micro acc, that's good enough. In time, with actual trading experience, you should be able to retain that confidence in your trading abilities..
  • #157
  • Jul 22, 2014 12:46am Jul 22, 2014 12:46am
Quoting Davit
{quote} If you can't fking put the time,effort and train yourself then fk off and stop bitching and look for a job! Getting sick of this losing BS Lets compare conventional business VS trading No rent No overhead No bad weather No Employees to deal with (unless you are a fund,bank) No merchandise getting old seating on the shelves No Transportation required Now think trading as business 24hr 5days trading Just Internet cost and minor spread.Ridiculously cheap to operate Can trade from Cafe,Restaurant.Park even on top of your girlfriends butt No...

I couldn't have say this better myself (actually I did say it...to a small irc chat room full about 30 trader noobies and some few pro...)
But I can't believe you just straight out motivate people like that.

However, people like you David and including me as well should never be a teacher because you know why right?

#1 - The world start wining, you are like to lose why? because of the one simple concept. " There is alway some one better than you" ...
It's ok if some one better than you and me in doctor/engineer/programing/architecture etc... it does not matter. Just as long as the "World doesn't fill with forex PHD/master..(which in reality if that happen then the win rate of all pro trader should be around 50% of the time due to competition)

#2 - If everyone think like you (which I hope it never happen...) then the money you make from forex is not GOOD for living. Because No one is going to mow your lawn, no one is going to cook your food (aka restaurant), no one is going to be farmer to give your rice, vegetable, meat...
Obviously there will be some loser who just can never make it in forex, so they open restaurant guess what lol.... when everyone making nice money in forex they it's the restaurant people who actually the one making big buck Since the competition is low...

It make lot of sense, who in the right mind would go to work, do blue AND white collar works for their boss when you can just at home ...click buy/sell and voila EASY money come in your bank through bankwire.....

#3 I am sure you are not the only one with big dream and this realization. However many people just can't succeed and you should just let them ....lose their way so they can go work a normal stable income job to "service" your "desire"..... (obviously you have to pay by the money you win in forex)..
  • #158
  • Jul 22, 2014 12:57am Jul 22, 2014 12:57am
Quoting Davit
{quote} If you lose then work at it!Examine why!Maybe you are a long term swing trader and not a scalper!Maybe your approach is totally wrong!Maybe you are using a "system" which does not suit you.Your psychology,personality,nerves,habits,patience all play a role.Without throughout examination of yourself chances are you won't get far.
I had to quote this for "lazy noobies".... But this is the main problem why people who follow the "top hit Trading system (freely distribute) on forex factory forum" do not win.. because the system was create by the author and ONLY HE can use it to win because it's design by him and for his characteristic (you will be surprise that even the author sometime break the rule to his own system ...obviously he's not going to tell you that.

Everone is different, even "Born Twin are different in characteristic"... If you noobies just "system hop" instead of creating a system that fit you... you will never win in forex.....

But do keep in mind that "you need lot of knowledge and experience in live trading before you can actually create your own system"..
  • #159
  • Jul 22, 2014 1:18am Jul 22, 2014 1:18am
most people look to the dark side becuz when they started trading they lost, and wish they could go back in time and approached everything much differently. The prime being more risk conscious, and able to understand your not going to make alot over night. They hope to scare the beginners so they approach the market with much more respect then they when they started.

Me included,


Rome wasnt built over night
Learn, a forex trader must, unlearn and relearn he will.
  • #160
  • Jul 27, 2014 8:46pm Jul 27, 2014 8:46pm
Quoting AkMaLiTo
Although the last reply to this thread was a year ago, but I have to reply because you guys are really destroying my confidence before migrating from demo to live account ! Why is everyone looking at the dark side? it's logical to explain to noobs like myself that it's not a dream world when it comes to trading, there is a dark side too! but why most of the opinions are pointing that I will eventually get into the dark side no matter what ? I understand that "emotions" makes a huge difference when migrating from demo to live accounts, which I believe...
I am not sure we're being downers, we're just being realistic. When you go live, start out with much smaller lots than you did with your demo trading, and move up from there. It was quite an adjustment for me personally when I could see my equity balance (i.e., my hard-earned money) swinging up and down as it is want to do when you're in a trade, and it takes a bit of getting used to.
Fireworks are fun ... as long as you don't blow your fingers off.
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