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Trading Without a StopLoss

  • #641
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:15pm Nov 15, 2013 4:15pm
Quoting Samer1970
after few days from now, when i close this deal with profit + good swap. I will remind many traders who attacked me here how much they were rude with their judgment the same trade was in floating loss of -$800 before one week and the swap was $30 today the same trade is -$461 and swap +$62 all of this is proving my strategy i would like to thank you joe for your good understandings my way and i wish you many pips thank you
You are at -9.6%. You've been -11 to -14 to, I think at one point you showed -8?. Your LOSSES have more swings to them than a playground. But they are still losses that you are dearly holding onto... with faith.
Congratulations ScalaFX for coming out of the closet!
  • #642
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:25pm Nov 15, 2013 4:25pm
Quoting nubcake
{quote} You are at -9.6%. You've been -11 to -14 to, I think at one point you showed -8?. Your LOSSES have more swings to them than a playground. But they are still losses that you are dearly holding onto... with faith.
THE STRATEGY I AM USING , AT WHICH IT IS SHOWING IN THE BALANCE WAVES .

SWINGS , WAVES, CYCLES.. WHATEVER YOU CALL IT , THEN CALL IT,

SCALPERS NEED STOP LOSS, SOME TRADERS LIKE TO USE STOP LOSS, BUT MYSELF : NO, I DO NOT USE THEM.
I USE 40% OF MY ACCOUNT TO PROTECT MY TRADES AT WHICH I CHOOSE THE TRADE AS PER MY RULES.

33 DAYS OF TRADING, MAKING 22% PROFIT, WITH MINOR CLOSED LOSS TRADES 2.7% AS PER MT4 REPORT.... ..

THIS IS MY STYLE.

I AM HAPPY WITH IT.

REALLY I WISH YOU TO BE HAPPY IN YOUR WAY OF TRADING TOO. ( ALL TRADERS )

Attached Image
GUYS BE AWARE FROM HUNTING YOUR STOP LOSSES BY YOUR BROKER & BY "GHOSTS"
  • #643
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:31pm Nov 15, 2013 4:31pm
97% winning trades are very impressive. I doubt anyone else in this thread can accomplish that.
  • #644
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:34pm Nov 15, 2013 4:34pm
Quoting Samer1970
MAKING 22% PROFIT
Here's a simple fact that even a child should be able to grasp: You have a net loss.

Quoting BeginnerJoe
97% winning trades are very impressive. I doubt anyone else in this thread can accomplish that.
Congratulations ScalaFX for coming out of the closet!
  • #645
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:40pm Nov 15, 2013 4:40pm
Quoting nubcake
{quote} Here's a simple fact that even a child should be able to grasp: You have a net loss. {quote}
It's perfectly normal for businesses to have floating losses from time to time. Can you do better ?
  • #646
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:44pm Nov 15, 2013 4:44pm
Quoting Samer1970
{quote} THE STRATEGY I AM USING , AT WHICH IT IS SHOWING IN THE BALANCE WAVES . SWINGS , WAVES, CYCLES.. WHATEVER YOU CALL IT , THEN CALL IT, SCALPERS NEED STOP LOSS, SOME TRADERS LIKE TO USE STOP LOSS, BUT MYSELF : NO, I DO NOT USE THEM. I USE 40% OF MY ACCOUNT TO PROTECT MY TRADES AT WHICH I CHOOSE THE TRADE AS PER MY RULES. 33 DAYS OF TRADING, MAKING 22% PROFIT, WITH MINOR CLOSED LOSS TRADES 2.7% AS PER MT4 REPORT.... .. THIS IS MY STYLE. I AM HAPPY WITH IT. REALLY I WISH YOU TO BE HAPPY IN YOUR WAY OF TRADING TOO. ( ALL TRADERS ) {image}...
For new traders who are reading this thread, please consider the following. He can be considered making a profit if he does not count the huge list of negative trades as part of his trading. It's like a store saying that they made $1000 profit when they sold you a TV for $1000, just ignoring the cost of the TV (and in this case, the cost of the TV was $1200). And, he has a great win/loss ratio, because he never acknowledges the list of negative trades. Samer, best of luck to you. And, anyone who tries to emulate this trading style, you have been warned.
  • #647
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:46pm Nov 15, 2013 4:46pm
Quoting nubcake
{quote} here's a simple fact that even a child should be able to grasp: You have a net loss. {quote}
i did not deny that .
i have a net loss , yes .
but not from the stop loss.
it is by the compounding to get rid of the complete pair from my collection of opened pairs.
this is not a loss, as and because, when the compounding is achieved, the closed trade(s) with loss will guarntee double profit with the open trades will be closed with it..

this is opposite of stop loss.

stop loss, you close the trade with a loss. Period.

look to my trades charts by ff

when ever there is a loss trade , mirror to it there is same trade with profit. And three to four smaller trades with profit

i have shown this above in older post about the usd/rub

i do not know if you are aware of the "compounding process in forex " many traders do not know it, and the brokers or guru will not tell you about it, as this a real solution to the stop loss.

closed with net profit $13
while gross profit $26
and loss tarde is -$13

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Screenshot1.png Size: 58 KB
GUYS BE AWARE FROM HUNTING YOUR STOP LOSSES BY YOUR BROKER & BY "GHOSTS"
  • #648
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:46pm Nov 15, 2013 4:46pm
Quoting BeginnerJoe
{quote} It's perfectly normal for businesses to have floating losses from time to time. Can you do better ?
No it's not, because that leads to cash flow problems...which leads to borrowing from the bank to meet fixed cost expenses...which, if not arrested will lead to further losses, which will lead to more borrowing from the bank to cover fixed cost expenses.....which will lead to still further cash flow problems....until the bank eventually says 'NO MORE' and calls in the receivers to claw back their money......just the same as a margin call.
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #649
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:47pm Nov 15, 2013 4:47pm
Quoting BeginnerJoe
{quote} It's perfectly normal for businesses to have floating losses from time to time. Can you do better ?
Joe, if a business neglects to account for the losses on their financial statements, someone will likely go to jail. It's called fraud and banks/stockholders/partners frown on this practice.
  • #650
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:47pm Nov 15, 2013 4:47pm
Quoting gefx
{quote} for new traders who are reading this thread, please consider the following. He can be considered making a profit if he does not count the huge list of negative trades as part of his trading. It's like a store saying that they made $1000 profit when they sold you a tv for $1000, just ignoring the cost of the tv (and in this case, the cost of the tv was $1200). And, he has a great win/loss ratio, because he never acknowledges the list of negative trades. Samer, best of luck to you. And, anyone who tries to emulate this trading style, you have...
thank you - noted
but your example here is totally wrong
use your head-mind and think outside the box, you will understand that you are totally wrong.
GUYS BE AWARE FROM HUNTING YOUR STOP LOSSES BY YOUR BROKER & BY "GHOSTS"
  • #651
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:50pm Nov 15, 2013 4:50pm
Quoting realjumper
{quote} No it's not, because that leads to cash flow problems...which leads to borrowing from the bank to meet fixed cost expenses...which, if not arrested will lead to further losses, which will lead to more borrowing from the bank to cover fixed cost expenses.....which will lead to still further cash flow problems....until the bank eventually says 'NO MORE' and calls in the receivers to claw back their money......just the same as a margin call.
Then you have invalidated all your bets, because they all start at a loss. Why do you continue ?
  • #652
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:50pm Nov 15, 2013 4:50pm
Quoting LizardGizzard
Is there any way to divert this thread back to reasonable discourse about the topic at hand ?
Good question. I think, no. There's too much selling in here. Really can't see the bottom anywhere.

Until this thread I used to think mindset/psychology was secondary to edge/method and MM/risk control. MM being like a force exerted by mind over the tool method. But now I can see clearly I was wrong. Mindset comes before anything else. The flaw in my reasoning was in looking at the world through pink glasses by believing that virtually all mind issues were due to lack of sound edge. Hence, any average guy having found that illusive edge by insistence or even by sheer luck would then be intelligent/reasonable enough (ie, would magically achieve the correct mindset), and apply proper MM to that edge, et voilá insta-trading success. Edge before or after Mindset, might seem like an egg and chicken paradox, but 20/20 I see now that without the base foundation of mindset(psychological attributes, competences) people are very unlikely to ever have find any edge (except by chance), and are 100% guaranteed incompetents at MM. Simply put, on average people are not reasonable, nor do they have so called 'common' sense, as this thread clearly attests.

My 2 pips
"To hold, you must first open your hand. Let go." - Lao Tzu
  • #653
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:51pm Nov 15, 2013 4:51pm
Quoting BeginnerJoe
{quote} Then you have invalidated all your bets, because they all start at a loss. Why do you continue ?
Ask Samer this question...he's the one continuing
Doing what you like is Freedom. Liking what you do is Happiness.
  • #654
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:52pm Nov 15, 2013 4:52pm
Quoting GEfx
{quote} Joe, if a business neglects to account for the losses on their financial statements, someone will likely go to jail. It's called fraud and banks/stockholders/partners frown on this practice.
Samer clearly stated he had a loss. So no need for him to go to jail in that case.
  • #655
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:52pm Nov 15, 2013 4:52pm
Quoting BeginnerJoe
{quote} It's perfectly normal for businesses to have floating losses from time to time. Can you do better ?
It's not normal for businesses that expect to last to have losses, and buy into more losses, and even further losses... and it's far from normal for them to jump up and down saying how great they are doing.

Oh, except for Enron.

Yes, I can do better. Everyone can. Everyone can sit on their hands right now and do precisely nothing, and be doing objectively "better".
Congratulations ScalaFX for coming out of the closet!
  • #656
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:52pm Nov 15, 2013 4:52pm
why you are going to such far away discussions, the thread is about stop loss, do you use it or not.

myself i do not.

i show the case of my way of trading why i do not use stop loss.

it is not to prove my theory is correct by you or not.

take it or leave it.

i will stop posting here my results as i have shwed my way of not using stop loss.

ssii does not use stop loss..

bye-bye.
GUYS BE AWARE FROM HUNTING YOUR STOP LOSSES BY YOUR BROKER & BY "GHOSTS"
  • #657
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:54pm Nov 15, 2013 4:54pm
Quoting Samer1970
{quote} i did not deny that . i have a net loss , yes . but not from the stop loss. it is by the compounding to get rid of the complete pair from my collection of opened pairs. this is not a loss, as and because, when the compounding is achieved, the closed trade(s) with loss will guarntee double profit with the open trades will be closed with it.. this is opposite of stop loss. stop loss, you close the trade with a loss. Period. look to my trades charts by ff when ever there is a loss trade , mirror to it there is same trade with profit. And three...
This is just brijon's bulldog bullshit all over again. This all smells so very familiar.

It's obvious you aren't brijon because he couldn't dribble a broken sentence without a teleprompter and someone by his side running their fingers underneath each word to be spoken. But, somehow this nonsense continues to pervade the forum.
Congratulations ScalaFX for coming out of the closet!
  • #658
  • Nov 15, 2013 4:56pm Nov 15, 2013 4:56pm
Quoting BeginnerJoe
{quote} No, it was determined from the earlier part of the thread that it is not possible to predict how long or how deep something will remain. So if you choose to take a loss, it is not necessarily the right decision. For people who persistently taking a loss at a whim, it is a road to ruin. Hence we have lots of people who use stop losses coming in here looking for salvation.
Joe, that may not be what I meant. My assumption (prediction) is that if your trading strategy has you in a huge hole, it will likely have you in a hole...always. But I also agree with your point about taking a loss at a whim. You better have a reason for everything you do, or you should quit trading. I use stops on every trade, but I know other professional traders who never use them. However, not one of them would ever hold a losing trade, because it's easier and smarter to flip the loser and trade with the structure of the market, not against it hoping for salvation at the hands of some future event.
  • #659
  • Nov 15, 2013 5:04pm Nov 15, 2013 5:04pm
Two approaches. One with SL and one without. If you have time to watch the market 24/5 and babysit your trade, then by all means don't use a stop-loss.

This is for the case of using limit orders. if you are using stop-orders to enter the market I will presume you will definitely need a stop.

So what makes a good limit entry order? One that allows you to get out at break-even once you are proven wrong.

I would say that if you read the market correctly, you should never run into a situation of a train moving against you...

The only exception I would think of that one needs to be extremely careful is a downward or upward sloping triangle (also called leading diagonal). These things look like corrective moves, but are actually moves that precede impulsive follow throughs. Learn how to spot those and you will be fine. When in doubt, get out.
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  • #660
  • Nov 15, 2013 5:05pm Nov 15, 2013 5:05pm
Quoting nubcake
{quote} You can chose to be elsewhere. I won't force you to stay and drink the punch. It is all of your choosing, and you made your choice. Drink-up, champ. And I do have you on ignore, but this thread is priceless and I am enjoying everyone's posts. This includes yours, for now.
I'm enjoying the party, and just suggesting that everyone avoid the crappy punch (where you are floating). It's a much better party when you just skip the punch and enjoy everything else that's going on.
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