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Pepperstone Forex

  • #2,301
  • Aug 7, 2013 4:52am Aug 7, 2013 4:52am
I want to move my live account to this broker, but I am experiencing some problems with demo account. Sometimes my pending orders are not executed, they remain in 'yellow'. Has anyone experienced similar problems in live trading?
  • #2,302
  • Aug 7, 2013 5:01am Aug 7, 2013 5:01am
Quoting DavidRP
I want to move my live account to this broker, but I am experiencing some problems with demo account. Sometimes my pending orders are not executed, they remain in 'yellow'. Has anyone experienced similar problems in live trading?
No, not at all. Pepperstone live is very reliable.
Forex is a losers game.
  • #2,303
  • Aug 7, 2013 6:19am Aug 7, 2013 6:19am
Quoting trader121
{quote} No, not at all. Pepperstone live is very reliable.

well, i don't know anymore, i'v been with pepper live for 3 months now, everything was good, very fast execution ( which is important for me because i trade the news sometimes).
but things went south a few days ago, my pending orders get slipped 2 or 3 pip, and one of my news trade (ISM Non-Manufacturing PMI) which was supposed to be a nice winner ended up being an ugly loss.

as you can see the chart was literally ripped apart ! , thats the first time i see this.
i hope its just a one time thing, and things will get back to what they were
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i lose money for a living
  • #2,304
  • Aug 7, 2013 6:57am Aug 7, 2013 6:57am
I'm also moving live operations to pepper after demoing them for awhile. I hope for good execution otherwise will move, I have no problem with that. No broker stays good forever. Pepper are generally new so they had to offer above the well establised brokers to quickly gain market share . But if they become sneaky there's always another broker around the corner waiving his hand at me.
Trading = a mirror to your human flaws. Fix them or be fixed.
  • #2,305
  • Aug 7, 2013 10:22am Aug 7, 2013 10:22am
Quoting tylerbose
{quote} well, i don't know anymore, i'v been with pepper live for 3 months now, everything was good, very fast execution ( which is important for me because i trade the news sometimes). but things went south a few days ago, my pending orders get slipped 2 or 3 pip, and one of my news trade (ISM Non-Manufacturing PMI) which was supposed to be a nice winner ended up being an ugly loss. as you can see the chart was literally ripped apart ! , thats the first time i see this. i hope its just a one time thing, and things will get back to what they...
It won't be the last time you've seen in and it will affect all brokers: News releases cause all sorts of volatility, especially when they include economic numbers that were different from what was forecast.

A 1 minute period candlestick chart can look like that when the very next tick (as news is announced) jumps far just as the 60 second point passes. I've seen news cause gaps on a chart of 50-80+ pips before.. sometimes it appears as a single long bar if it prints after the next period bar starts, but in reality it's a gap in price since no liquidity was really there between the ticks that caused such a large move.

Thus is the nature of news release in forex. They can be very profitable if you come out on the right side of them, but you always risk being slipped hard against your stop if the news isn't in your favour.
FXGears.com
  • #2,306
  • Aug 7, 2013 10:28am Aug 7, 2013 10:28am
Quoting DavidRP
I want to move my live account to this broker, but I am experiencing some problems with demo account. Sometimes my pending orders are not executed, they remain in 'yellow'. Has anyone experienced similar problems in live trading?
Oddly enough, this isn't the first time I've heard of the demo server hanging pending orders.. but as others have said, in live, there's no such problems.

Live execution has been pretty decent for me, and the odd time there's an issue, I've just brought it up to their support and it gets fixed/corrected pretty quickly.
FXGears.com
  • #2,307
  • Aug 7, 2013 12:36pm Aug 7, 2013 12:36pm
Quoting Jack_Larkin
{quote} It won't be the last time you've seen in and it will affect all brokers: News releases cause all sorts of volatility, especially when they include economic numbers that were different from what was forecast. A 1 minute period candlestick chart can look like that when the very next tick (as news is announced) jumps far just as the 60 second point passes. I've seen news cause gaps on a chart of 50-80+ pips before.. sometimes it appears as a single long bar if it prints after the next period bar starts, but in reality it's a gap in price since...
i'v never been slipped using pepper, i'v traded news spikes on many occasions ( more than 20 times), the spread widen but i'v always had instant fills (less than 100ms) and managed to get out of each trade with a consistent profit.


i'm not blaming papper for this one, that news was unexpected and had more impact that it usually have, i can understand the lack of liquidity.


i hope it won't happen again, for the sake of my account
i lose money for a living
  • #2,308
  • Aug 7, 2013 2:57pm Aug 7, 2013 2:57pm
Quoting tylerbose
{quote} i'v never been slipped using pepper, i'v traded news spikes on many occasions ( more than 20 times), the spread widen but i'v always had instant fills (less than 100ms) and managed to get out of each trade with a consistent profit. i'm not blaming papper for this one, that news was unexpected and had more impact that it usually have, i can understand the lack of liquidity. i hope it won't happen again, for the sake of my account
Ah, so you're just not used to seeing it... this is the nature of any ECN-like or DMA style broker (or any exchange that runs a book of orders to make up price for that matter), it doesn't happen every day but it does happen and traders have to be mindful of the possibility, especially around news with shocking results: The real market simply won't have liquidity at your stop price when the order triggers should price have skipped/gap'd through the order. The triggered order goes 'market' and hits the next bit of liquidity available, be that near or far from your stop price.

The only brokers out there that can guarantee a stop price are some select market makers who offer an order type called GSLO's (Gauranteed stop loss orders), since they will take on the difference as their own risk. GSLO's aren't cheap though, since they are really a form of insurance premium against such drastic slippage and thus most brokers who offer them add an additional cost to every trade (IG for instance, will pad the spread +3 full pips if you signal that the stop will be GSLO.) This makes sense since the MM style broker is holding the bag if they fill you at your stop at the price you set, but can't get out of the order they placed in the market for you at the same level.
FXGears.com
  • #2,309
  • Aug 7, 2013 7:13pm Aug 7, 2013 7:13pm
update on ctrader ??
  • #2,310
  • Aug 8, 2013 5:28am Aug 8, 2013 5:28am
Quoting Jack_Larkin
{quote} Ah, so you're just not used to seeing it...

i don't use pending (not for news trading at least), i would understand if i did.
i have an EA directly linked to Reuters terminal, i receive the news, analyze it and the order (buy or sell) is sent to mt4, the whole process takes less than 40ms.
i have no lag on my side, it was from them

i wish i still had LCG currenex so i can compare the charts at the ISM Non-Manufacturing PMI relese.
i lose money for a living
  • #2,311
  • Edited 10:34pm Aug 8, 2013 9:44pm | Edited 10:34pm
Quoting tylerbose
{quote} i don't use pending (not for news trading at least), i would understand if i did. i have an EA directly linked to Reuters terminal, i receive the news, analyze it and the order (buy or sell) is sent to mt4, the whole process takes less than 40ms. i have no lag on my side, it was from them i wish i still had LCG currenex so i can compare the charts at the ISM Non-Manufacturing PMI relese.
Compare charts? That doesn't reflect liquidity available though.. :/ A chart can be painted in all sorts of ways but we're talking about liquidity that you can hit in a volatile market. No chart is going to show you that.

In this case, your biggest hurdle isn't even the broker, but MT4 itself. Sure, a fast broker is required--and Pepper is pretty snappy--but if you're trying to catch a snap move in the first 40ms of a "market shaking" news event, then the session window initiation between MT4 client and MT4 server will hold you up. (This takes place before a new order messages can be passed, and is done if you haven't sent an order in the last 30+ seconds since the old session window gets closed.)

I've had Pepper support pull the server logs for me in the past when we were investigating a trade, and it pretty much showed the order being filled within 2-3 milliseconds once the server received the order message itself. That's fast, but the time between when the client started the process of sending the order message and when it was received by the server took longer given the latency to the server and session window 'handshake' process I just described.

(Basically, MetaQuotes decided that MT4 was going to drop the active message session windows between the client and server after ~30 seconds of inactivity, presumably to keep hung sessions from bogging down the server, so even though you are logged in and seeing quotes update.. after enough time the client needs to 'shake hands' with the server first before sending a new order. Some people try to get around this by using scripts that modify a pending order every 20-30 seconds to keep the session artificially open while they scalp, and you can find a few of these scripts floating around the net, but I'm not recommending them myself.)

Anyway, point was, it just sounds like MT4 is going to be in your way more than the broker given what you described. Pepper is going to be releasing CTrader sometime in the future, and from what I understand it is far more modern and "latency" friendly. Perhaps you should look into it as an alternative once it's out and see which does a better job getting the fills you want.

All that aside, what you're describing about news trading specifically is a hard game to play. Trading before the news release hoping to profit from it coming out your way works (with potential slippage on your stops if it didn't go your way and the market gaps against you,) trading a few minutes after during the fallout hoping to ride the momentum (which I personally enjoy doing) works as well...but trading the millisecond news/numbers are released hoping to take out any liquidity provider dumb enough to get run over by price... well... so many other factors go into how such trades will cleanly execute that it becomes a bit of a gamble (think velocity, distance in how far the news cause price to gap, LPs pulling price faster than you can hit them, liquidity available at the time, all changing like a volatile mess millisecond to millisecond for the first few moments of the news release...) yeah, it's not a trade you can expect any consistency with in terms of fills. Each news release will cause a different reaction after all.
FXGears.com
  • #2,312
  • Aug 9, 2013 12:30am Aug 9, 2013 12:30am
Quoting Jack_Larkin
{quote} news trading specifically is a hard game to play...
you sound wise and well informed.
we agree on that, i never said it was easy, but thats where the real money is.
i know that the liquidity dries out during those times, but not completely at least !, there are still long term traders (also some dumb EA) who trade H1 H4 and daily and don't care about news, so their money is still in, the liquidity is still out there.
what happened last time during the ISM Non-Manufacturing PMI, was like diving in the sea and while you still in the air you see the water pulling out and you end up head first in the sand !, i was like WTF ?!?!?
anyhow, lets hope pepper add some LP to their pool.
and let's see what Ctrader has to offer, do you know when they'll release it ?
i lose money for a living
  • #2,313
  • Aug 9, 2013 5:49am Aug 9, 2013 5:49am
ok, now i'm really starting to think that pepperstone is trying to screw me on purpose ! , lucky i didn't take this one ( CAD Unemployment Rate)
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i lose money for a living
  • #2,314
  • Aug 20, 2013 4:54pm Aug 20, 2013 4:54pm
Quoting tylerbose
anyhow, lets hope pepper add some LP to their pool.

My account manager at Pepper just told me that they added a new source of liquidity in the last week or so and that it should have a positive impact on average spreads.

Though, even with that, and after reading your last post, I kinda think you're being unrealistic with your expectations of news release trading with MT4 in general, let alone forex in general, or Pepper for that matter. I've already covered off the reasons why. Any chart will look cut up if you are printing the gaps caused by news. Any quote feed painting the candles to cover the gap will not likely be able to fill you at the prices the market gapped over anyway. Comparing how a chart looks during a news release gap proves nothing about liquidity and if you are able to get the preferential fills you are looking for...

..but anyhow, I'm just going to drop it, since I'd only end up repeating myself from what I posted earlier about it.
FXGears.com
  • #2,315
  • Aug 20, 2013 7:06pm Aug 20, 2013 7:06pm
Quoting Jack_Larkin
{quote} My account manager at Pepper just told me that......
thanks for the replay, and i hope things get better with the new LP.

i don't want to sound like a broken disk, but a "hole" in the chart doesn't mean low liquidity/high volatility, it literately mean that there is no counterpart at all (no liquidity at all) and thats just not possible.

my theory is that pepper's quote server can't keep up with high number of orders and the fast moving market during those times, so it overloads and freezes for a second, thats one theory.
the other is that pepper is doing it on purpose to discourage people from trading during those times.

we'll never know, lets move on .

do you know when ctrader will be available ?
i lose money for a living
  • #2,316
  • Aug 21, 2013 2:50am Aug 21, 2013 2:50am
does anyone know how do the withdrawals go? how much time do we need for withdraw to bank card?
  • #2,317
  • Aug 22, 2013 6:05am Aug 22, 2013 6:05am
I am with pepperstone. I was short at the UK open and noticed that price was likely to reverse, I moved my SL to 130.97 and placed pending buy at 131.00. There was news and my stops got hit but at 131.238. With my SL position I was 26 pips worse off and 23 pips on my pending long position. Excuse they are giving is that the market reacted to the news and gapped up creating slippage. There is no gap when look at the 1M charts. I have told them to refund the money or I withdraw and go elsewhere and should hear back tomorrow.

Appreciate your thoughts with this issue?? By the way eurjpy
  • #2,318
  • Aug 22, 2013 11:05am Aug 22, 2013 11:05am
Quoting GRforex
I am with pepperstone. I was short at the UK open and noticed that price was likely to reverse, I moved my SL to 130.97 and placed pending buy at 131.00. There was news and my stops got hit but at 131.238. With my SL position I was 26 pips worse off and 23 pips on my pending long position. Excuse they are giving is that the market reacted to the news and gapped up creating slippage. There is no gap when look at the 1M charts. I have told them to refund the money or I withdraw and go elsewhere and should hear back tomorrow. Appreciate your thoughts...
I'm pretty sure unless you have a 6 figure account your threats will do you no good. Lots of brokers will not show gaps because retail traders yell and cry if they see gaps. Real and true charts DO have gaps. In fact if you don't believe me, one of the selling features of these liquidity providers is they smooth out price to prevent the crying from retail traders.
  • #2,319
  • Aug 22, 2013 3:06pm Aug 22, 2013 3:06pm
Quoting colened65
{quote} I'm pretty sure unless you have a 6 figure account your threats will do you no good. Lots of brokers will not show gaps because retail traders yell and cry if they see gaps. Real and true charts DO have gaps. In fact if you don't believe me, one of the selling features of these liquidity providers is they smooth out price to prevent the crying from retail traders.
Thanks for the feedback
  • #2,320
  • Aug 22, 2013 3:38pm Aug 22, 2013 3:38pm
Quoting meng88
does anyone know how do the withdrawals go? how much time do we need for withdraw to bank card?
I've done many CC based withdrawals (they are free) and it's always been posted to my account within a few business days. Usually takes 24 hours for Pepper to process then another two to three days for my CC company to 'post' it to the account.

Not sure if it's exactly the same for bank cards but generally Pepper is prompt at processing things on their end from my experience.
FXGears.com
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