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  • #2,201
  • Mar 4, 2013 3:05pm Mar 4, 2013 3:05pm
Quoting Polkm
Hi everyone,

i started not using slippage control on Stop and Limit orders, so as to ensure getting filled (Dukascopy Suisse). So have my trading friends, in our pursuit to understand if Dukas is a reliable venue.

The result, on my account, has been a slippage that has varied between 2.10 pips to 4.12 pips on both London and New York sessions (the most volatile time was 30 minutes before London close) on EU, EJ and Cable.

I don't trade market orders. It doesn't fit into my trading plan. So all those who say slippage is not a problem...
What do you guys make of this?

I saw this one the previous week.

It's a major pair; No slippage control on the order; London Session (but beyond opening, no major news); it's a tick chart; the red line was the stop order; The blue line below is where the order was filled: 4.48 pips away.

Now w/ slipage control, orders don't get filled and turn to limit orders. Without slipage control its mayhem.

.
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  • #2,202
  • Mar 4, 2013 3:58pm Mar 4, 2013 3:58pm
Quoting Polkm
What do you guys make of this?

I saw this one the previous week......
Now that merits some explanation. ....Bellieres ?
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life! https://youtu.be/ttJBdr6eBuo
  • #2,203
  • Mar 5, 2013 1:49am Mar 5, 2013 1:49am
Quoting Polkm
Now w/ slipage control, orders don't get filled and turn to limit orders.
.
My friend, if You have some idea about how orders have been executed Your phrase above is another clear evidence of Dukascopy honesty. They don't play with Your order and if there is no price at market after trigger Your order either stays in queue as limit or rejected. And nobody tells Your fair-tails about market conditions bla-bla-bla. Market order can be filled with any slippage. It's inevitable.
  • #2,204
  • Mar 5, 2013 12:50pm Mar 5, 2013 12:50pm
Quoting citikot
My friend, if You have some idea about how orders have been executed Your phrase above is another clear evidence of Dukascopy honesty. They don't play with Your order and if there is no price at market after trigger Your order either stays in queue as limit or rejected. And nobody tells Your fair-tails about market conditions bla-bla-bla. Market order can be filled with any slippage. It's inevitable.
Your sentences don't add up, so i'm assuming its not your native language.

What's that about fair-tales and bla bla? nobody tells what?

Are you stating that i'm posting fairytales?? Well fairy tales don't have facts do they?

Who said anything about honesty: we are talking about liquidity access and order processing (procedures and connectivity). I think you missed that completely...

All stop orders are market orders (why do i waist my time??...)

Any serious trader seeks the best deal with the clearer it uses to trade the markets.

Anyone who doesn't walk that path is either a complete idiot or has an interest on the broker/bank (even if not working there).


Go troll somewhere else...
  • #2,205
  • Mar 5, 2013 12:54pm Mar 5, 2013 12:54pm
Quoting Exodus
Now that merits some explanation. ....Bellieres ?
Hi Exodus,

i'm not seeking an answer from Dukas here. We've followed the proper venues. But i understand anyone would like to hear from them.


What i would like to read is the insight from other serious traders, clients or not of Dukas, not more of the absolute trolling amateurs that abund ForexFactory.
  • #2,206
  • Mar 5, 2013 1:11pm Mar 5, 2013 1:11pm
Polkm: can you post the exact time when the fill occured, at which price and ad what pair? So far i only see a jpg but no pertinent information so i can look at what other feeds quoted at that time. And what exactly do you Bellieres expect to answer without any information but a picture without any details.
  • #2,207
  • Mar 5, 2013 1:34pm Mar 5, 2013 1:34pm
Quoting shrike
Polkm: can you post the exact time when the fill occured, at which price and ad what pair? So far i only see a jpg but no pertinent information so i can look at what other feeds quoted at that time. And what exactly do you Bellieres expect to answer without any information but a picture without any details.
Hi shrike,

i can't post the specifics for 2 reasons: not my order, so i don't have now access to the trade log (it's the eurusd after NY open and before London closes...), and this is being submitted to Dukas.

I undertsand your point but the forum will have to take it as is. I don't make up things like these, but you'll have to take my "word" for it.

But the exact point wasn't to tackle the Dukas detail, but to read the insight of traders.

In that respect: do you think that slippage relates to good liquidity access?

(i didn't warrant Bellieres answer, so don't now what you are going for)

thx
  • #2,208
  • Mar 5, 2013 3:36pm Mar 5, 2013 3:36pm
Quoting shrike
Polkm: can you post the exact time when the fill occured, at which price and ad what pair? So far i only see a jpg but no pertinent information so i can look at what other feeds quoted at that time. And what exactly do you Bellieres expect to answer without any information but a picture without any details.

Hi shrike, sent you a PM.

thx
  • #2,209
  • Mar 6, 2013 1:30am Mar 6, 2013 1:30am
Quoting Polkm
Your sentences don't add up, so i'm assuming its not your native language.

What's that about fair-tales and bla bla? nobody tells what?

Are you stating that i'm posting fairytales?? Well fairy tales don't have facts do they?

Who said anything about honesty: we are talking about liquidity access and order processing (procedures and connectivity). I think you missed that completely...

All stop orders are market orders (why do i waist my time??...)

[u][b]Any serious trader seeks the best deal with the clearer it uses to trade the markets....
I think that You are impolite person with too many hang-ups. Only one thing You are right that English is not my native language. And firest of all I didn't mean any offence to Your post. But it's clear for me that You have no f..g idea about order execution. Go learn basics, my friend. And don't tell me what to do because of I'll tell You where to go.
  • #2,210
  • Edited 3:56am Mar 6, 2013 2:58am | Edited 3:56am
Quoting citikot
I think that You are impolite person with too many hang-ups. Only one thing You are right that English is not my native language. And firest of all I didn't mean any offence to Your post. But it's clear for me that You have no f..g idea about order execution. Go learn basics, my friend. And don't tell me what to do because of I'll tell You where to go.

ohhh i'm sorry, did i heart little citikot's fealings?? you stupid idiot.


(i wasn't making fun of your english: i was treading on "non-undertsanding-what-you-were-accusing-me-of-waters"... [ok:editing this one. ])

So i was chanting fairy-tales and whatnot, but you didn't mean nothing? Great, then your word means zero.

it's clear that i don't know about order execution??! You have got to be joking me. You have no ideia, but then again, here we are all profiles on algorithms....
You are the one who showed no clue what so ever, and you don't even noticed, dindn't read the older posts or don't have a clear comprehension of what's at stake.

Again go troll somewhere else.

yeah, i'm very afraid of where you are going to send me. Go (...) yourself.

Donīt bother answering. You'll be the first user to be placed on my ignore list.
  • #2,211
  • Mar 6, 2013 4:10am Mar 6, 2013 4:10am
Quoting Polkm
Hi Exodus,

i'm not seeking an answer from Dukas here. We've followed the proper venues. But i understand anyone would like to hear from them.


What i would like to read is the insight from other serious traders, clients or not of Dukas, not more of the absolute trolling amateurs that abund ForexFactory.
Ok, I understand you better now. There are readers of this thread who are rightly concerned about broker integrity. Some, like me, have witnessed and experienced unacceptable practices, and are looking for a broker who will refrain from adding to the market's behaviour. After 3 years I still believe that Dukas is among the best you can use.

Your posted screen-shot only makes sense to me if there was an amount of slippage specified. I assume that the delivered price was as shown on the chart and not as shown by the marker symbol on the image. I.E. yes you were filled at an unexpected place but the filled-price was as indicated on the chart and could be accounted by adding or subtracting slippage to your requested price. Any other explanation smells a bit of dealing desk intervention.

There is also the real possibility that an internet or server-software issue was occurring and the broker was attempting to keep services operating using back-up methods which performed in a less effective manner. There is also the possibility that a bug in the order matching software connected your order with another client who had a broader slippage specified, but without respect to the tighter slippage attached to your order.

Please let us know the outcome of any investigations, if you are able. Thx
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life! https://youtu.be/ttJBdr6eBuo
  • #2,212
  • Edited 6:42am Mar 6, 2013 4:25am | Edited 6:42am
Face it: liquidity in forex is much worse than you would like it to be.

Duka is just demonstrating you this. Their internal servers/trading system take on your trade as there is noone else, however, they take cut 4.8 pip in above example.

Fair enough !

When things get really bad it may be 30 pips, or 300. Or 3000. That can easily happen when couple of top banks decide to withdraw FX MM operations for couple of moments for whatever reason, just when you want to get out.
  • #2,213
  • Mar 7, 2013 5:06am Mar 7, 2013 5:06am
Quoting Exodus
Ok, I understand you better now. There are readers of this thread who are rightly concerned about broker integrity. Some, like me, have witnessed and experienced unacceptable practices, and are looking for a broker who will refrain from adding to the market's behaviour. After 3 years I still believe that Dukas is among the best you can use.

Your posted screen-shot only makes sense to me if there was an amount of slippage specified. I assume that the delivered price was as shown on the chart and not as shown by the marker symbol on the image. I.E....
Hi Exodus,

there was no slipage control set. And that was the choice because w/ the slipage control our orders weren't getting filled at first, but only after the order had turned into a limit one.

I suspect it is in fact slipage. I'm not saying that they are a dealing desk skimming off pips from orders. But the matter of the fact is that it is an unacceptable slippage by my standards.

And, in my opinion, that slipage can occur, albeit other reasons more obscured, either because there is poor access to the liquidity pool or because there is some latency on the processing of the order (the JForex? their own processing routes?? the bugs you mentioned? have no idea).

It could be that several orders were at the same exact level: but not every single trading day and the large majority of the trades.

At this moment i just canīt trust them to trade intraday w/ them. If these were longer time frame trades, a pip or 2 wouldn't matter because i would be counting on drawdown.

A 4 pip slipage on eurusd is a diference of 30€ per lot...x several lots: it's too much and hard to believe that it is the real liquidity available.

let's see what they say. Either way, i'm walking away from Dukascopy. Might leave a small account but no sense or parking serious money there.

thx
  • #2,214
  • Mar 7, 2013 7:17am Mar 7, 2013 7:17am
Quoting Polkm
I suspect it is in fact slipage. I'm not saying that they are a dealing desk skimming off pips from orders. But the matter of the fact is that it is an unacceptable slippage by my standards.

And, in my opinion, that slipage can occur, albeit other reasons more obscured, either because there is poor access to the liquidity pool or because there is some latency on the processing of the order (the JForex? their own processing routes?? the bugs you mentioned? have no idea).

It could be that several orders were at the same exact level: [b]but not...
You are optimist. Why would some broker provide less slippage than FX futures ?!?!? Broker may deceive you but there will be price you will pay down the track. Of course, only if you profitable.
  • #2,215
  • Mar 7, 2013 7:49am Mar 7, 2013 7:49am
Quoting Polkm
Either way, i'm walking away from Dukascopy.
I did the same, for obvious reasons. I had no "serious money" with them but some things just were not to my liking.
Their execution seemed to slow down (I traded via API) and with the slippage control I observed, that the more room I gave them the more they took. So, I kept it really tight (i.e. 0.3 pip) and subsequently got a lot of rejects. Then, at that time they suffered a lot of system breakdowns and (subsequent widening of spreads) their cost of trading (for so called scalping) is just not low enough (and I was already using m6). Enough was enough. The good news was there was no problems with the money. No tricks whatsoever.
  • #2,216
  • Mar 7, 2013 8:51am Mar 7, 2013 8:51am
Hello
Could anyone of company's representatives tell me, please, why there were gaps within intraday charts on 27th of february? I used online charts that were available on the website of Dukascopy.
I asked support about it, and received a confirmation letter. But I haven't received the reply.
Thank you.
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  • #2,217
  • Mar 13, 2013 1:50pm Mar 13, 2013 1:50pm
Still no response from Dukas?
Make your losses in demo. Earn your profits live.
  • #2,218
  • Mar 14, 2013 2:06am Mar 14, 2013 2:06am
I just today resumed trading with Dukas after about 1 year. I honestly really wanted to make them "my broker", despite some of the bad things I saw recently here regarding slippage. I was short AUD/US when Employment data came out. The market reacted against my position I had stops around the 1.0322 area and got filled at 1.0352 area. Now perhaps I am an idiot and do not understand the slippage control, which I had set at .2 pips. This whole slippage control, >>> I am not sure if i get that. You have a stop loss , to me it should get filled at the next best price period. I should have set 1 of my 3 positions with NO slippage restrictions, just to see where things settled, Anyway but to me 30 pips , this is a little off side. I should mention I also had the same position on in an FXCM account with a stop at 1.0333 and filled at 1.0337/38 area. Hey this I understand>> 30 PIPS at Dukas, wow. SO Is Dukas raping me, OR I am the idiot because i set slippage control totally wrong???
  • #2,219
  • Edited 4:19am Mar 14, 2013 3:44am | Edited 4:19am
Nice handle! You're nearly as old as me, or is that when it happened?
Quoting Bendover1960
I just today resumed trading with Dukas after about 1 year. I honestly really wanted to make them "my broker", despite some of the bad things I saw recently here regarding slippage. I was short AUD/US when Employment data came out. The market reacted against my position I had stops around the 1.0322 area and got filled at 1.0352 area. Now perhaps I am an idiot and do not understand the slippage control, which I had set at .2 pips. This whole slippage control, >>> I am not sure if i get that. You have a stop loss , to me it should get...
I would really like to see Duka answer this, but just out of interest do you have a Swiss based or 'European' based account?

edit: You should check the tick data to see what it says. I just looked at my OandA chart and the move you appear to refer to occurred in under a minute. It is not possible to go to a finer resolution because already there is too much historic data for my screen sub- one minute, and also CBA.
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life! https://youtu.be/ttJBdr6eBuo
  • #2,220
  • Mar 14, 2013 5:28am Mar 14, 2013 5:28am
check this screen shot. it looks like mr. bellieres doesn't feel in the right mood to answer
http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/543...eresonline.jpg
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