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Sam Seiden Supply & Demand no more value than technical analysis?

  • #21
  • Feb 15, 2013 7:21am Feb 15, 2013 7:21am
not trolling just don't agree with your conclusions. You only posts on ff are to complain about Sam Seiden, so it seems then you are obsessed with Sam Seiden or have some issue with him, and Im just saying you can interpret his approach in a meaningful to your trading, and not as a "hoax".

Sorry, I guess you wanted me to say how insightful you are...
  • #22
  • Feb 15, 2013 7:23am Feb 15, 2013 7:23am
btw, don't take it as personal attack. you started a thread asserting an opinion, expect to be challenged.
  • #23
  • Feb 15, 2013 7:25am Feb 15, 2013 7:25am
ok. Like I said its a range.. you know what a range is ? those are conclusions based on range of belives.

Anyway, yes I've been lurking around forum some time and now I decided to create account to post this stuff that I found.
You seem to be suspecious of me, but not of Sam Seiden S&D theory. Anyways thanks for the replys.

You can challenge all you want. but at least read what i wrote (?!) try to understand what this implies. try to understand what i am trying to say instead of being all impulsive.
"You're solid gold, see you in hell"
  • #24
  • Feb 15, 2013 7:30am Feb 15, 2013 7:30am
actually I said earlier that I have tried his stuff and it doesn't work for me. My point was that just because it doesn't help my style of trading or yours, it doesn't mean it is a hoax or he is lying. As I said, plenty of people around here have benefited from his approach to trading.

Some people use moving average crossovers, some support and resistance etc etc none are right or wrong, you find what fits best.
  • #25
  • Feb 15, 2013 8:00am Feb 15, 2013 8:00am
nice charts, but which indicators do u use to watch that areas ?? may u upload? Thanks
  • #26
  • Feb 15, 2013 8:18am Feb 15, 2013 8:18am
Quoting merluzza
nice charts, but which indicators do u use to watch that areas ?? may u upload? Thanks
you can check Sam stuff here merluzza.
http://www.fxstreet.com/search/contributors/authors/author.aspx?id=5766b88a-1a31-4102-8221-e9bf77216d2f

Thats what I used to identify and draw the levels.
"You're solid gold, see you in hell"
  • #27
  • Feb 15, 2013 8:19am Feb 15, 2013 8:19am
Hi Sugarpink, just curious, exactly how long have you been practicing and studying supply and demand to come to the conclusion that it doest work for you?
  • #28
  • Feb 15, 2013 8:24am Feb 15, 2013 8:24am
I discovered it very ealier on. but was not that much interested. Never did any extensive study on it.

Then about Octobre of 2012 I started to look at it on a more objective focus way. Some levels keep failing and stuff but I thought that I was just not good at it. and if I followed exactly the things he said I would not have good results. Becase logically you would close positions at BE since the level was pierced and there were no more orders there. Things like that.
"You're solid gold, see you in hell"
  • #29
  • Feb 15, 2013 8:37am Feb 15, 2013 8:37am
To be honest i think you could still have more practice at it, you haven't even gone with it more than a few months...
  • #30
  • Feb 15, 2013 8:39am Feb 15, 2013 8:39am
I mean have you incorporated trend at all to you zones? for example only trading when zones are formed under or over say a 200 moving average? higher timeframe breaks of lows and highs and then zooming into lower timeframe to find a lvl?
  • #31
  • Feb 15, 2013 8:44am Feb 15, 2013 8:44am
I didn't try a lot of those things no, but he also says that he doesnt care about trends, moving averanges, news, etc etc.. and all he needs its a chart.

Also I didnt want to use MA, trends, etc.. becase it was getting to look like more and more to TA. and a lot of subjectivity was being added with that.
"You're solid gold, see you in hell"
  • #32
  • Feb 15, 2013 8:55am Feb 15, 2013 8:55am
Is that level too?
Attached Image
  • #33
  • Feb 15, 2013 8:57am Feb 15, 2013 8:57am
I would only call that one a pivot high.
"You're solid gold, see you in hell"
  • #34
  • Feb 15, 2013 10:16am Feb 15, 2013 10:16am
Quoting Fudomyo
SD was part of Wyckoff's trading method nearly a hundred years ago, so it's not new. Many people have taken bits and bobs of Wyckoff's techniques and repackaged them (Tom Williams did it as well with VSA). For Wyckoff, SD wasn't a system in of itself, it was part of a much more robust technical analysis method. All learning is good, but personally I think it makes more sense to study the masters than watered down versions of their techniques. It makes no sense to me that people would hand 8K over to the Online Trading Academy for something they...
Exactly! Its uncanny how his work has really stood the test of time just to be rebadged by others. Amazing stuff alright. I have not taken the time to read the original texts but they are on my list of must reads. Trying to get through Nassim Taleb's work on randomness at present.

Just supports the view that there are few genuinely original ideas in any area of endeavour, trading included.
Audentes Fortuna Juvat
  • #35
  • Feb 15, 2013 11:38am Feb 15, 2013 11:38am
Quoting SugarPink
I have some points that made me realize recently that Supply&Demand areas of Sam Seiden have no more value then Techinical Analysis. It is actually just another facy name for Technical analysis, with exactly the same flaws, same subjectivity.

I've created these random walks.
I used a normal distribution to get the inputs for the random variables.
Markets can be modeled very realisticly using a normal distribution, although in reality they follow more a power rule distribution but in this case, its enough for what I am trying to show.

traders...
SugarPink:

You are not absolutely right. But you are not absolutely wrong either.
One thing for sure, you are brave. Finally someone is brave and curious enouth to mention that in forum.

SD has no more or no less value than Fibs, Ganns, Idiots(sorry Elliots), elipses, etc etc. (Probably less than trendlines though)

It works sometimes and it doesn't sometimes so it has not much value except the major point where
everybody notice absolutely.
All those clever marketers, they are not scammers but very clever snake oil salesmen.

This recognition you now have is just the part of the process to find what FOREX is.
Once you understand what FOREX is, you will see what is true and valuable or not.


To Fudomyo;
I absolutely agree with you about Wyckoff. I find Wyckoff as true and genuine TA scholar I respect.

Best Pip Wishes!
From the expert of my opinion.
  • #36
  • Feb 15, 2013 11:55am Feb 15, 2013 11:55am
At OTA the instructor said that Sam picked up the bottom of S&P500 back in 2009. Yes it hitted a demand zone from 1997. I asked the instructor.

"So there were sitting orders there from 1997 ?"
he said
"Well, yes and also other traders look for this areas to put their orders"

Reminds me the self fulfilling profecy of TA, where it works becase a lots of people see the same MA , the same trendline. etc etc.
Thats why I say that at very best this is no better than regular TA. (Although he likes to state that this is complety diferent, dont even compare it)
"You're solid gold, see you in hell"
  • #37
  • Feb 15, 2013 12:28pm Feb 15, 2013 12:28pm
I don't know if Sam Seiden is a hoax, but OTA surely is. Their "basic" Forex course ($3000) is nothing more than a sales pitch for their $10,000 EXP course where they allegedly teach you to trade (maybe). By being affiliated with OTA Sam reduces his credibility and leads me to think he is a hoax. I suspect he needs the money. For those interested, the OTA basic Forex course is nothing but an introduction to every common technical indicator out there and basic fundamental analysis. There is NOTHING in it that can not be found for free at nearly every Forex website. I still have the 2 spiral bound books that came with the basic Forex course. If anyone wants to buy them, just PM me.

Since OTA was such a waste of money, I have paid little attention to Sam Seiden. But my impression is that his strategy is no better and no worse than any other that depends on classically defined support and resistance.
Chance favors the prepared
  • #38
  • Feb 15, 2013 12:56pm Feb 15, 2013 12:56pm
To me anyone who teaches as a profession a subject that they no longer make their living is suspect.
It is easier to teach trading but 10000x harder to implement same concepts they are teaching into their own trading.
The clown(careless about his name because he has devout followers here) who "invented" TDI is charging lot of money to "teach" a system and claims to make money and yet he trades pennies for his trading.
Obviously it is more lucrative for these clowns selling a product to thousands of unsuspected people then risk their own money in the markets.
I only read about people who have proven in the markets.Donchian,Jesse Livermore,Gartley just a few I highly regard.
Lot of garbage out there.Filter aggressively.
In trading, you have to be defensive and aggressive at the same time
  • #39
  • Feb 15, 2013 1:03pm Feb 15, 2013 1:03pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUcfIlkWm (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUcfIlkWmLo)

look at him.. 'teaching' . Those price levels.. good job Sam. How can you not be ashame of yourself. :\
"You're solid gold, see you in hell"
  • #40
  • Feb 15, 2013 1:13pm Feb 15, 2013 1:13pm
Gentelmen,
I don't know who it's right and who is wrong.
But a smart brain coded this.Try it and you will see.
Change NOTHING to the inputs!!!!!!!!
Drop in 1H and 15Min charts , or 4H and 1H.
Whach it for a wile , and you will see.

Respects
Dan
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