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  • #261
  • Oct 6, 2012 9:33pm Oct 6, 2012 9:33pm



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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KnPN2BqhdM

  • #262
  • Edited 4:49am Oct 8, 2012 4:30am | Edited 4:49am
Quoting CrucialPoint
You have the right mentally and I agree. The Crucial Points are accounting for the unexpected variable changes. We live in a non-linear world. People either don't know it, doesn't pay attention to it or is simply have overlooked it.
Have you seen "Groundhog Day"? Initially it was all unnexpected, but as time went by he learnt to decipher it by approaching people in different manners. Each sentence, each word creating a different outcome. The difference between a slap and a smile was in a simple sentence.

Always infinite possibilities (the unnexpected) yet at the same time he (overtime) could create specific outcomes. Not always the same, yet overall the same.

First it was chaotic due to infinite posibilities, then it became predictable to a certain extent.

Good film!


Quoting CrucialPoint
What would happen if a driver reacts every 10 or 20 increments? more like they have smashed into an object already.
The devils in the details yes. I read an interesting article on initial conditions and how sesitivity was crucial to its outcome. The difference between a specific outcome and that which wasnt was literally in the details, the difference between 2 and 2.0001...

The other day i was talking to one of my clients, as he left and drove away in his car he halted as he nearly hit a kid on his bicycle.
I thought to myself..."what if i kept on talking to him for another 10seconds? would that of changed the outcome? would the kid simply cycle past my business with not a care in the world?" Such small difference between outcomes, seconds if not less...

Of course, the further away the prediction, the more chaotic (less predictable) it became.

Quoting CrucialPoint
Trading is like the devil who offers you lots of money each time you overtake a vehicle and break road rules. Overall, there is a lot to take from driving and incorporate it in trading.
Tell me about it. Its ingenious how it plays on peoples perceptions and fear of loss (missing opportunities).

I dont think a sniper would give up his position to take one person out when he could lay low and take 10 out without giving away his situation. Rambo never makes it out alive in war...unless its Stallone of course
  • #263
  • Oct 8, 2012 10:14am Oct 8, 2012 10:14am
For those who think that CP is tossing around a ton of complicated stuff, I am going to take it back to something he asked in the early days.

If today was the first day of trading with no history on the chart; how would you trade?

Brilliant CP just absolutely brilliant mate
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Nothing is impossible, with a willing mind!
  • #264
  • Oct 8, 2012 7:04pm Oct 8, 2012 7:04pm
Quoting Trader_V
For those who think that CP is tossing around a ton of complicated stuff, I am going to take it back to something he asked in the early days.

If today was the first day of trading with no history on the chart; how would you trade?

Brilliant CP just absolutely brilliant mate

Price above open, Long.

Price below open, Short.

  • #265
  • Oct 9, 2012 2:20pm Oct 9, 2012 2:20pm
i can only say that the original brain teaser ,is quite profound !
  • #266
  • Oct 9, 2012 9:58pm Oct 9, 2012 9:58pm
Just to get back off track for the moment.

What has pi got to do with trading?

Price is the diameter of the market.

The circumference of the market are the orders.

When price is divided by the order flow, it produces a constant.

This constant is an endless stream of digits, just like pi.
Enter Signature
  • #267
  • Edited 8:40am Oct 10, 2012 8:37am | Edited 8:40am
Quoting songbo
Price above open, Long.

Price below open, Short.

Let's say price is 1.00000 and we have no history at all.

Would you enter at

a) 1.00001 (0.1 pips)?
b) 1.0001 (1 pip)?
c) 1.0005 (5 pips)?
d) 1.0005 (reached in 1 minute)?
e) 1.0005 (reached in 2 minutes)?
f) 1.0005 (reached in 10 minutes)?

(Of course, I could have said 1-2-10 ticks as well.)

CP said a trend is a move from point A to point B, and we should follow the trend. But when does a move qualify as a trend? Especially without price history Still, from 1.00000 to 1.00001 is a move = [micro-]trend, but I doubt anyone would enter there
Even if you fall on your face, you're still moving forward.
  • #268
  • Oct 10, 2012 11:29am Oct 10, 2012 11:29am
Quoting Ralome
CP said a trend is a move from point A to point B, and we should follow the trend. But when does a move qualify as a trend? Especially without price history Still, from 1.00000 to 1.00001 is a move = [micro-]trend, but I doubt anyone would enter there
Trading without price history is a more advance concept which I did not cover. My first thread was regarding basic foundation core of trading where I emphasized following a trend. Don't confuse the two. Please quote me where I mentioned following a trend and not using price history in one sentence. You will never find one as this is a false assumption.

My own system is non reliant on price history. I stated that I will never share my system. I posted the basic foundations such as the importance of following a trend. Nobody here at FF knows how My system work because I havent and will never reveal it.

That's as clear as I can be. I dont owe anyone here anything and I will free share only what I want to share. Please dont confuse my participation here as owing people an education.
  • #269
  • Oct 10, 2012 11:45am Oct 10, 2012 11:45am
Quoting Ralome
CP said a trend is a move from point A to point B.

But when does a move qualify as a trend?
If it move from .000000 to .000001 then according to the definition that a trend is a move from point a to point b, then .000001 is a trend.

The real question is.... Does it cover the spread/cost you've paid? ..... No..... Then go find a bigger trend to exploit
  • #270
  • Oct 10, 2012 12:45pm Oct 10, 2012 12:45pm
Quoting Ralome
Would you enter at

a) 1.00001 (0.1 pips)?
b) 1.0001 (1 pip)?
c) 1.0005 (5 pips)?
d) 1.0005 (reached in 1 minute)?
e) 1.0005 (reached in 2 minutes)?
f) 1.0005 (reached in 10 minutes)?
Seeds become plants, which become trees.
No 2 trees look identical, yet they all have branches, leafs.
No 2 orange trees look identical, yet they all have branches, leafs and oranges.

If you have 3 identical seeds in your hand:

At what point do you know it will become an apple/orange/lemon tree?
  • #271
  • Oct 10, 2012 1:17pm Oct 10, 2012 1:17pm
Quoting Pipalicious
Seeds become plants, which become trees.
No 2 trees look identical, yet they all have branches, leafs.
No 2 orange trees look identical, yet they all have branches, leafs and oranges.

If you have 3 identical seeds in your hand:

At what point do you know it will become an apple/orange/lemon tree?
I love this song
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rWxdCtIJ_Ow

(Chris Slade/Manfred Mann)
In a dream it would seem
I went to those who close the open door
Turning the key, I sat and spoke to those inside of me

They answered my questions with questions
And pointed me into the night
Where the moon was a star-painted dancer
And the world was just a spectrum of light

They reached to my center of reason
And pulled on the touchstone that's there
The shock of that light had me reeling
And I fell into the depths of despair

They answered my questions with questions
And set me to stand on the brink
Where the sun and the moon were as brothers
And all that was left was to think

They answered my questions with questions
And pointed me into the night
The power that bore me had left me alone
To figure out which way was right
  • #272
  • Oct 10, 2012 1:30pm Oct 10, 2012 1:30pm
Quoting CrucialPoint
Please quote me where I mentioned following a trend and not using price history in one sentence.

(...)

Please dont confuse my participation here as owing people an education.
I didn't [want to] imply any of these, if it came out like that, I apologize
Even if you fall on your face, you're still moving forward.
  • #273
  • Oct 10, 2012 1:56pm Oct 10, 2012 1:56pm
Quoting Ralome
Let's say price is 1.00000 and we have no history at all.

Would you enter at

a) 1.00001 (0.1 pips)?
b) 1.0001 (1 pip)?
c) 1.0005 (5 pips)?
d) 1.0005 (reached in 1 minute)?
e) 1.0005 (reached in 2 minutes)?
f) 1.0005 (reached in 10 minutes)?

(Of course, I could have said 1-2-10 ticks as well.)

CP said a trend is a move from point A to point B, and we should follow the trend. But when does a move qualify as a trend? Especially without price history Still, from 1.00000 to 1.00001 is a move = [micro-]trend, but I doubt anyone would...
The question of which was to trade and when to get in are easy.. deciding how your going to exit that has any hopes of being profitable is the challenge

I'd like CP to go more indepth with such...
  • #274
  • Oct 10, 2012 4:29pm Oct 10, 2012 4:29pm
Quoting Ralome
I didn't [want to] imply any of these, if it came out like that, I apologize
No need for apologies. I just wanted to clear any confusion because I've noticed in past post that you have asked questions and there was no response.

Have you noticed that people who contribute in this thread or who follow my post with much interest doesnt bother to elaborate. Have you notice they answer the questions with questions. You've asked the question... Now ponder.

Have you notice the other replies in this thread. They will drop an idea, its up to you to go and discover it yourself. I believe the followers of this thread are deep thinkers. The philosophical approach, the epiphanies and self discoveries are a lot to express in a post and they nor I will expend that time to express it. As we are not here to convince people. We are here for self growth, self discovery and most of all to ponder.

Peace
  • #275
  • Oct 10, 2012 6:01pm Oct 10, 2012 6:01pm
Quoting CrucialPoint
No need for apologies. I just wanted to clear any confusion because I've noticed in past post that you have asked questions and there was no response.

Have you noticed that people who contribute in this thread or who follow my post with much interest doesnt bother to elaborate. Have you notice they answer the questions with questions. You've asked the question... Now ponder.

Have you notice the other replies in this thread. They will drop an idea, its up to you to go and discover it yourself. I believe the followers of this thread are deep thinkers....

Hey CP I apologize if I may have contributed to the confusion with my posts. It is just that as you know once you understand some of these concepts and seeing them and applying them to not drop nuggets to light sparks in others minds so they can ask the right questions in order to seek out the answers.

Apologies friend,
Vick
Nothing is impossible, with a willing mind!
  • #276
  • Oct 10, 2012 6:15pm Oct 10, 2012 6:15pm
Quoting Trader_V
.... seeing them and applying them to not drop nuggets to light sparks in others minds so they can ask the right questions in order to seek out the answers.
Very profound. ? Soon, you'll have everyone believing that they can't trade unless they know the right nuggets that spark fire to the mind and if the nugget hasn't lit a fire they can't ask the right questions and therefore are eternally damned because they fail to seek the right answers ?
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #277
  • Oct 10, 2012 6:30pm Oct 10, 2012 6:30pm
Quoting Slim Buffett
Very profound. ? Soon, you'll have everyone believing that they can't trade unless they know the right nuggets that spark fire to the mind and if the nugget hasn't lit a fire they can't ask the right questions and therefore are eternally damned because they fail to seek the right answers ?
If in fact this is a question then the answer is NO.

Just because a nugget lights a fire does not mean you will ask the right questions.

There are many ways to trade the market profitably.

There are better ways to trade the market more efficiently.

Experienced traders may be discover something new.

New traders may discover their path to profitability more efficiently through the truths that CP has provided.

Let us not pollute CP's thread with banter. Kindly take this kind of criticism offline.

Cheers
Nothing is impossible, with a willing mind!
  • #278
  • Oct 10, 2012 6:40pm Oct 10, 2012 6:40pm
Quoting Slim Buffett
Very profound. ? Soon, you'll have everyone believing that they can't trade unless they know the right nuggets that spark fire to the mind and if the nugget hasn't lit a fire they can't ask the right questions and therefore are eternally damned because they fail to seek the right answers ?
To each his own. I dont recall anyone here on this thread imposing their belief on another. Take what you can. Discard what you dont need. Respect others because if they dont, then I'll put them in my ignore list.

Quote this thread with any post that say "I'm right and you're not". I havent seen one yet as it has been cleaned. You can see posts that oppose opinions. They have not been removed.

I believe this is one healthy thread.
  • #279
  • Oct 10, 2012 6:54pm Oct 10, 2012 6:54pm
Quoting Trader_V

Let us not pollute CP's thread with banter. Kindly take this kind of criticism offline.

Cheers
Seemingly, you fail to understand. My intent was not to banter or pollute CP's thread. Indeed, if CP himself were to think that then he need only to ban me, which indeed he may do. There was no criticism.

On the other hand, it seems that CP would promote the thinking of ones self (and a song that I enjoyed to that effect).

Conclusion: TraderV, you must think for yourself and not merely agree with the "hierarchy" ??
Most anything can be taken as a question......

You decide.
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #280
  • Oct 10, 2012 9:32pm Oct 10, 2012 9:32pm
one cannot deduce the next number in the pi sequence through any anylysis of the pi sequence, one has to use the original equation to deduce the next number.

if pi were analogous to the market to a sufficient extent, then price history may be in the same way not useful in deducing the next sequence of the market?
Enter Signature
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